: RSA All-Season Runflats (Observation)



NIK
02-27-06, 11:10 AM
I finally bit the bullet and, despite conflicting reports on the Goodyear RSA runflats, I decided to purchase a set at 9,800 miles to replace my F-1's. First of all, let me say that if you don't take advantage of the deal Goodyear is giving us to replace the F-1's, you're all idiots (and I mean that in a nice way!) Retail for the RSA is $271 each and I was given a credit of $200 apiece for a total credit of $800.00. If you do the math you'll find that I got a brand-new set (4 tires) for a total of $280.00 with no hassle at all. If the RSA's don't work out at least it didn't cost me a fortune.

But let me say this - the biggest surprise came when I drove the "V" for the first time with the new tires. The ride is undoubtedly much smoother and quieter than with the F-1's (and it's not my imagination.) I've noticed no difference in handling, but of course I haven't really done any agressive driving yet. But I did take it up to a couple of 100 MPH+ bursts and the car tracked straight like on rails and with absolutely no vibration. Add to the fact that it was about 17 degrees here in PA this morning, and I wasn't slipping as I usually did with the F-1's in cold weather. Moreover, I did two WOT launches yesterday from a dead stop - got wheelspin but absolutely no wheel hop! There again, I didn't dump the clutch at 6,000 RPM either, but I never do that anyway.

I know this is post is long, but I wanted to pass my experience along. In conclusion, for those of you (like myself) who use their "V" as a daily driver, don't expect to track the car, and want the security of a run-flat tire with high-performance abilities, for God's sake consider these RSA-'s!

Kadonny
02-27-06, 11:18 AM
Great post Nik! My 06 is coming in (hopefully any day now) with the RSA tires and it will be my daily driver too. I am in the Philly area and so I will see the same conditions you see.

Glad to see a positive review on the tires. Thanks!

OldRoadDawg
02-27-06, 12:26 PM
How did you come by this deal? Local Goodyear dealer or ?? Will they sell the tires outright or do you have to turn your old tires in? Still have a few thousand miles left on my F-1's and they are a pain on these cold mornings.

V-SATX
02-27-06, 12:50 PM
NIK,

I only have 2100 miles on my F1's. I was wondering how you came across this deal. Can anyone take advantage of this discount on the RSA's? I noticed the F1's are a horrible rain tire. This would be the primary reason for me to try the RSA's.

Thanks in advance for the info.

rand49er
02-27-06, 01:00 PM
How did you come by this deal? Local Goodyear dealer or ?? Will they sell the tires outright or do you have to turn your old tires in?.................Yeah, that!

veloce
02-27-06, 01:07 PM
Ok what deal and where can I get in on it? I burned up my F1s in 18000 mi and have my snows on for now. I'll need some for summer and for that price Id try a set and if I didn't like them get f1s next time. Jeff

NIK
02-27-06, 01:17 PM
How did you come by this deal? Local Goodyear dealer or ?? Will they sell the tires outright or do you have to turn your old tires in? Still have a few thousand miles left on my F-1's and they are a pain on these cold mornings.

Go to an authorized Goodyear dealer. Have him call Goodyear customer service and vent your complaint about premature tire wear on the F-1 tire. Goodyear will then give you a file number. Have your dealer measure the tread depth and report this to Goodyear, along with the file number. They will, in turn, tell the dealer how much of a discount to give you based on the tread wear. In my case, at 9,800 miles they gave me me a 74% discount per tire (based on $271.00 per tire) for a total discount of $200 per tire. And I got a file number about 2 or 3 months ago and just decided to use it. And, yes, you must turn in your old tires (mine didn't have much tread left.) I know there have been a few others on this board that have done this, so I would strike while the iron's hot. By the way, you don't have to necessarily buy Goodyear, either - I know you can instead select Dunlop's (naming one alternative).

Jschmank
02-27-06, 08:02 PM
I bought a used 05 recently, purchased an extra set of rims and mounted Dunlop runflat snows for the winter and RSA's for summer. I just put the RSA's on. They run great, but have less grip than F1's (or even than the Dunlops, so it seems). Havent really spun them yet, but noted no wheel hop on a quick 1 - 2 shift. No idea yet of wear since they are new.

Rich H
02-27-06, 10:10 PM
I agree that the RSAs are a quality tire. Absolutely no vibration at any speed after Goodyear balanced them just once - which is not typical for Goodyear tires. Also, they are perfectly neutral and track straight and true with no pull to either side -once again not typical for most Goodyears I've owned. Maybe the difference is these tires are manufactured in Germany.

Yes you can spin the tires in any of the first 3 gears pretty easily - with no wheel hop. But I don't do that every day and I don't track the car. But I do want a performance run-flat and I do want all-season capability.

For some (certainly not all) of us these tires are perfect. :bouncy:

Kidhummer
02-27-06, 11:07 PM
I have RSA's, what if they prematurely wear? Can I get a discount on a new pair or is this deal only available with the F1's?

thebigjimsho
02-27-06, 11:54 PM
Just goes to show you, get rid of some grip, get rid of some wheelhop.

Ghost-V
02-28-06, 11:42 AM
My 0.02 on these tires:

After switching to RSA's about a month ago, I agree with NIK's assessment of these tires. What I do notice, though, is opon initiation of a hard cornering maneuver, the RSA's seem to "squirm" a little bit until they "set". I attribute this to taller tread blocks and siping (of which the F1's had none).

For daily driving purposes, these tires are night and day better than the F1's in terms of tread wear, noise, comfort, wet/snow traction, and ride quality. But they are ABSOLUTELY inferior in terms of lateral/accelleration grip. It's much easier to swing the rear end out zipping around cloverleafs, but still very predictable. Also, I had the TSB bushings installed at the same time as the RSA's, and wheelhop is pretty much a non-issue at this point.

I miss certain aspects of the F1's, but the RSA's are an easy concession to live with considering their benefits.

So I guess installing the RSA's on an otherwise stock V makes it "less than stock" huh? :yup: With all the crazy modding going on here, I'm sure there's not a lot of people who can make that claim!!!

V-SATX
02-28-06, 11:50 AM
Ghost,

If you had the choice would you go with the F1's or the RSA's

Ghost-V
03-01-06, 01:40 PM
Ghost,

If you had the choice would you go with the F1's or the RSA's
Well, as I stated, I did indeed go with the RSA's mainly because it is the pregnant wife's d/d and I wanted a longer-lasting all-season runflat. If this were a "nice weather only" vehicle, I would definitely stick with the F1's and damn the pathetic wear issues.

I absolutely loved the handling characteristics of the F1's, but I am willing to sacrifice some of the performance in order to NOT replace $1400 worth of rubber every 9 months or so! And really, it is not that much of a performance drop anyway...I think the RSA's just have a bad reputation when compared directly to the super-sticky F1's.

For what it's worth, I've yet to lose an auto-x event or suffer diminished quarter mile times with these tires (probably because I don't ever take her to the track or the strip!). :rolleyes:

NIK
03-01-06, 03:17 PM
Well, as I stated, I did indeed go with the RSA's mainly because it is the pregnant wife's d/d and I wanted a longer-lasting all-season runflat. If this were a "nice weather only" vehicle, I would definitely stick with the F1's and damn the pathetic wear issues.

I absolutely loved the handling characteristics of the F1's, but I am willing to sacrifice some of the performance in order to NOT replace $1400 worth of rubber every 9 months or so! And really, it is not that much of a performance drop anyway...I think the RSA's just have a bad reputation when compared directly to the super-sticky F1's.

For what it's worth, I've yet to lose an auto-x event or suffer diminished quarter mile times with these tires (probably because I don't ever take her to the track or the strip!). :rolleyes:

In reality, having the RSA's in the colder weather improves performance! At least I'm not sliding all over the place when the temperature drops below freezing! I agree that if I lived in a warmer climate I probably would stay with the F-1's, but up here I feel so much more confident with the RSA's. They're more predictable insasmuch as they don't seem to react to every imperfection in the road - it seems like I was always tugging at the wheel, (and my alinement and tire wear pattern were perfect.) I just seem to be having a lot more fun driving now.

Ghost-V
03-01-06, 03:37 PM
In reality, having the RSA's in the colder weather improves performance!

True NIK, true!

rand49er
03-01-06, 03:49 PM
Well, NIK, I did as you said, and am waiting for Goodyear to respond back to the dealer. Funny thing, when the Goodyear dealer called them today, they said they would be "temporarily closed until 2 PM EST." :confused: Dealer tried again at about 2:30 PM, and they're still closed. :confused: :confused:

HOWEVER, I do have things in motion, presented them with the file no., they did the measuring, and things are rolling ... so to speak. I doubt I'll get as much of a discount as you; I've got 14k on the F1s, and there is some tread left, albeit not much. We'll see ... some $ towards new tires is better than no $. THANKS NIK!!! :thumbsup:

CIWS
03-01-06, 04:52 PM
I agree that if I lived in a warmer climate I probably would stay with the F-1's, but up here I feel so much more confident with the RSA's.

Even though I'm in a warmer climate (86 F here right now), my concern with the F1s is within the next few months, late Mar-late May, is generally the months with the heaviest rains. As I measured the tires this morning they were about 4/32 wear level (Quarter method), maybe a hair more tread. But I have 4K on the tires and in another 1.5 months that will most likely be another 1500-2000 miles on them. That's going to start getting close to hydroplaning territory at highway speeds. I'm kinda curious at what point Goodyear will be willing to take the tires back and trade them out for something with better water performance before I possibly end up in Skeeter's situation.

urbanski
03-01-06, 05:24 PM
CIWS....F1s are hydroplane material no matter the tread depth.
Sh!t or get off the pot regarding your new tires :) :cheers:

CIWS
03-01-06, 05:33 PM
Sh!t or get off the pot regarding your new tires :) :cheers:

Yo Momma !! ;)


I've got the cashola ready for a set of tires now, but if GY is willing to make good on the F1s wear and I can save some of that cashola and put toward other V things, that sounds like the route to take.

CIWS
03-02-06, 03:44 PM
Called G.Y. customer service and spoke with a Rep today who sent me to a local G.Y. service center to look at the tires (F1s) and call them back. I'll spare you guys the details of the local center's "discussion" with the manager, but needless to say it wasn't what I would call pleasant. In the end however the final numbers are G.Y. will replace my F1s with RSAs for 65.00 a tire. Total price to balance/mount and such is roughly 315.00 for all 4 tires. Of course they have to order them in so we'll see how it all goes in the end.

urbanski
03-02-06, 05:07 PM
cool man, i know you'll dig the RSAs :)

edit: break em in by driving down here :)

Dick's06Vee
03-02-06, 05:11 PM
In reality, having the RSA's in the colder weather improves performance! At least I'm not sliding all over the place when the temperature drops below freezing! I agree that if I lived in a warmer climate I probably would stay with the F-1's, but up here I feel so much more confident with the RSA's. They're more predictable insasmuch as they don't seem to react to every imperfection in the road - it seems like I was always tugging at the wheel, (and my alinement and tire wear pattern were perfect.) I just seem to be having a lot more fun driving now.


Hey Nik: Also agree with you on the RSA's and my guess is that I've had as much or more snow to drive on this winter as you. At any rate, when I ordered the car last Nov. I specifically ordered the OE RSA's for the reason's discussed. I've been very happy with them on the snow and ice this winter. Even more impressed with the closer weight balance over the front and rear axles. Not sure of the percentages here but the rear definately has more weight over the rear axle than some other performance cars I've owned. It really takes a fair amount of throttle to get the rears spinning. I also like the higher threshold for TC activation on this car.

Now on tires. Simple stuff here, but apparently not for everyone. One tire will not do everything! You want performance? The softer the compound, the higher the performance, the higher the wear rate. You want more mileage and better all weather traction? Different tread pattern, harder rubber compound, more mileage, and some trade-off in performance (grip) because of that.

They work fine for me. Dick

Rich H
03-02-06, 08:04 PM
No doubt about it - the RSAs have less dry traction than the F1 Supercars. But that's good for the following reasons IMO:

Easier on clutch since I don't need to slip it during launches like I did with the F1s to avoid wheel hop
Easier on the rear-end since the tires don't grab when I land after jumping the damn potholes on Colorado roads
More fun and challenging in corners to let the rear end swing out before the TC catches (if engaged)
More advertised tread life, although this is TBD per my driving habits
I like hearing the tires squeal when I spin them and the RSAs don't disappointYes, one tire doesn't do everything but I try to avoid switching out every time the season changes and these tires are the best way to avoid that and still stay with runflats - until Pirelli sells an all-season runflat in the US that fits this car.

CIWS
03-08-06, 07:17 PM
Just got back from the Goodyear Service center and now have 4 new RSA EMT tires on the V. They charged me 61.00 for each new tire based on the pro-rate of the F1s. With balance and install charges is was roughly 313.00 and I had them go ahead and add Road Hazard which was another 35.00 a tire. So grand total out the door was 462.00. So not a bad price for 4 new tires and I'll feel better driving in the coming months of rains on the RSAs. :)

V-SATX
03-08-06, 07:22 PM
How miles did you have on the F1's?

CIWS
03-08-06, 07:26 PM
4483, 4500 roughly. That put them about half gone and in another 1.5 months getting too dangerous for my taste to be doing highway speeds in heavy rain. ( < 4/32 tread )

CIWS
03-09-06, 07:24 AM
Took the car up on the highway this morning to check tire balance at speed and got into triple digits for just a few seconds. Everything felt fine and smooth so the G.Y. center did a good job rebalancing the tires and all the weights are still on the inside of the wheel. I have to say, the RSAs feel better / smoother ride for a car that's a daily driver. I can definately feel the difference from the F1s. Below is a pic of the tread state that was on the F1s at approx 4500 miles.

NIK
03-09-06, 07:46 AM
Took the car up on the highway this morning to check tire balance at speed and got into triple digits for just a few seconds. Everythingfelt fine and smooth so the G.Y. center did a good job rebalancing the tires and all the weights are still on the inside of the wheel. I have to say, the RSAs feel better / smoother ride for a car that's a daily driver. I can definately feel the difference from the F1s. Below is a pic of the tread state that was on the F1s at approx 4500 miles.

Definitely!! As I stated earlier, unless you track or race the car, the RSA appears to be the tire for this vehicle. I don't take my car out in the snow, but the other morning I purposely did just to try it out and had absolutely no problems. Now we'll see how they wear ..... by the way, glad to see so many of you heeding my advice and taking advantage of Goodyear's offer while it's on the table. Also thanks to whoever gave me the idea in an earlier post.

SEXY 64 Vette
03-14-06, 05:33 PM
I've got RSA's (Not runflat) on my Bonneville and wife on her Grand Prix. Great all-weather tire and they last a long time. I would opt for them on a V too. Save the F1's for track days.

Carnalsupply
03-14-06, 05:49 PM
:hitstick: I wish my experience with the Goodyear dealer was all good, but at least Goodyear Corporate has been good to me, handing over a $230/tire credit for my 12,500 mile F1 Runflats.
My GS-D3's are already on order, but the Goodyear dealer is making this as painful as possible. Once I get the tires I'll post the name of the dealer, but not until then, since with my luck they'd read this post and KILL me on price.
Oh yeah, the dealer says he has to "eat" the price of the tires and wait for reimbursement from Goodyear, which is why they're so reluctant to do take care of me. As I tried to calmly explain to said dealer: "my concern is the safety (or lack thereof) of driving on a set of tires with cord showing (left front) and virtually no tread on the rear, so their "wasting" time is becoming more annoying and dangerous by the day".
The situation has dragged on so much I had to get a Goodyear Corporate rep to contact them and get them moving (they did and it worked). WTF?:hitstick:

sotxmike
03-14-06, 11:55 PM
I contacted my local Goodyear dealer about speed rated RSA's (W-ZR...168 mph) and he said they were not made for our cars. So what is the speed rating that are being bought?

ctsvett
03-15-06, 12:41 AM
cars sold with RSAs from the factory have a lower speed limiter (155 I think or 150)

Reed

CIWS
03-15-06, 05:27 AM
I contacted my local Goodyear dealer about speed rated RSA's (W-ZR...168 mph) and he said they were not made for our cars. So what is the speed rating that are being bought?

The Mananger of the local G.Y. service center tried to tell me the same thing. "Uh that car is nothing but a Corvette with 4 doors on it. Those tires (RSAs) were not designed to go on a car like that" So I asked, "Then why is it they are coming standard on the 06 CTS-V and Cadillac seems to feel it's good enough for it?" Response - "Uh, let me look those tires up in our book and see"

I went through easily 30-40 minutes of this type of conversation with the guy. It was a pain, let me tell you. The bottom line is most folks don't know squat about this car, except what little bits and pieces they have heard. Mine was the first one they had ever actually seen and done anything with. The techs there wanted to hear it start and rev. They wanted me to pop the hood so they could see the engine, etc, etc. Like Reed says Cadillac has simply been lowering the max speed seting in the PCM down to about 150mph to compensate for the RSAs being put on the car.

Guess I better go get someone to lower mine now..... (cough) ;)

Dick's06Vee
03-15-06, 05:39 AM
The RSA's are V rated, which is 149MPH. My guess is that the car has been reprogramed and speed limited to 150. Seems like someone posted that their 06 hit the limiter at around 149-150, which would fit.

thebigjimsho
03-15-06, 12:49 PM
The Mananger of the local G.Y. service center tried to tell me the same thing. "Uh that car is nothing but a Corvette with 4 doors on it. Those tires (RSAs) were not designed to go on a car like that" So I asked, "Then why is it they are coming standard on the 06 CTS-V and Cadillac seems to feel it's good enough for it?" Response - "Uh, let me look those tires up in our book and see"

I went through easily 30-40 minutes of this type of conversation with the guy. It was a pain, let me tell you. The bottom line is most folks don't know squat about this car, except what little bits and pieces they have heard. Mine was the first one they had ever actually seen and done anything with. The techs there wanted to hear it start and rev. They wanted me to pop the hood so they could see the engine, etc, etc. Like Reed says Cadillac has simply been lowering the max speed seting in the PCM down to about 150mph to compensate for the RSAs being put on the car.

Guess I better go get someone to lower mine now..... (cough) ;)Well, I wouldn't totally point to that as incompetence. I'm sure when the V first came out people were wondering why a Cadillac would have F1 Supercar RFTs. Goodyear made that tire just for us. There aren't too many RS-As outthere that are RFT for all the models of cars they come stock on. GM happened to put tha same tire on the new Solstice, size and all. So now, for people who know what the V is, it is surprising to see that tire made for our car.

If this guy got schooled from a previous V owner about the serious grip the F1 Supercars put out and that they come in RFT form and are a bitch to remove and how incredible the V is, the RS-A may be the next chapter for schooling. Personally, everyone knows how down I was on the RS-As but the RFT version really seems to firm up the handling and sloppy turn-in RS-As are known for.

CIWS
03-15-06, 03:50 PM
Well, I wouldn't totally point to that as incompetence.

Believe me, if you had heard or participated in the entire conversation, odds are you would have felt the guy had some "issues", whether is was ignorance, B.S'n, or just plain lying. I simply chose not to engage him on most points and try to get through the entire ordeal as fast as possible.

Rich H
03-15-06, 06:38 PM
Don't rely on any manager at a Goodyear tire store to provide any knowledgable information on the tires they sell - particularly the high performance tires They are there for one reason only and that's sales volume. The last manager who replaced my F1s with RSAs didn't know anything about either tire's handling capabilities, speed rating, or even warranty. Most tire dealers won't (& shouldn't) recommend any tire with a speed rating less than the OEM tire.

In my case tire speed rating is not a big deal since I live at ALTITUDE and never could drive over the RSA speed limit locally - unless maybe going down Floyd Hill with no traffic. So the RSAs work great for me and likely would work fine for a majority of the other V owners who use it as a daily commuter.

dqw1
03-16-06, 06:07 PM
Put RSA's on today, non run flats versions. Didn't realize that until I seen them, damn-now I have to get a spare. Anyways after driving on them my first impressions is that they are exceptional and much quieter than the F1 EMT. The ride feels better and the guys at Big Ten tires said they drooled over my V while it was there. I hope the doubts over the RSA tire was overblown.

ctsvflorida
03-16-06, 08:14 PM
Called G.Y. customer service and spoke with a Rep today who sent me to a local G.Y. service center to look at the tires (F1s) and call them back. I'll spare you guys the details of the local center's "discussion" with the manager, but needless to say it wasn't what I would call pleasant. In the end however the final numbers are G.Y. will replace my F1s with RSAs for 65.00 a tire. Total price to balance/mount and such is roughly 315.00 for all 4 tires. Of course they have to order them in so we'll see how it all goes in the end.

HOW MANY MILES DO YOU HAVE ON YOUR CAR? I WANT TO SEE IF I AM PAYING TOO MUCH AS I ORDERED MINE A WEEK AGO AND i HAVE 10K ON MY CAR!

ctsvflorida
03-16-06, 08:17 PM
Don't rely on any manager at a Goodyear tire store to provide any knowledgable information on the tires they sell - particularly the high performance tires They are there for one reason only and that's sales volume. The last manager who replaced my F1s with RSAs didn't know anything about either tire's handling capabilities, speed rating, or even warranty. Most tire dealers won't (& shouldn't) recommend any tire with a speed rating less than the OEM tire.

In my case tire speed rating is not a big deal since I live at ALTITUDE and never could drive over the RSA speed limit locally - unless maybe going down Floyd Hill with no traffic. So the RSAs work great for me and likely would work fine for a majority of the other V owners who use it as a daily commuter.

This is a shocker! What is the rsa run flats speed limit? Please let me know asap as my tires may be in tomorrow and I will have to change those! I hope not!

CIWS
03-16-06, 08:36 PM
The RSAs are V rated tires (149mph)

ctsvflorida
03-16-06, 08:48 PM
The RSAs are V rated tires (149mph)


Thanks!

NIK
03-20-06, 01:46 PM
Don't rely on any manager at a Goodyear tire store to provide any knowledgable information on the tires they sell - particularly the high performance tires They are there for one reason only and that's sales volume. The last manager who replaced my F1s with RSAs didn't know anything about either tire's handling capabilities, speed rating, or even warranty. Most tire dealers won't (& shouldn't) recommend any tire with a speed rating less than the OEM tire.

In my case tire speed rating is not a big deal since I live at ALTITUDE and never could drive over the RSA speed limit locally - unless maybe going down Floyd Hill with no traffic. So the RSAs work great for me and likely would work fine for a majority of the other V owners who use it as a daily commuter.

The manager who replaced my F-1's insisted that my F-1's were not runflats! "Who told you they were?" he asked. I told him to not question my intelligence! Everyone knows what F-1's are, I told him. Apparently not everyone does! Until he saw the "EMT" on the sidewalls, he wasn't convinced. Thankfully I got through the ordeal ok.

Kadonny
03-20-06, 02:01 PM
More idiots in this world, huh. Its disturbing sometimes.

Dick's06Vee
03-20-06, 03:49 PM
The GY RSA runflats are V rated. That's 149 MPH.

CIWS
03-20-06, 03:55 PM
The manager who replaced my F-1's insisted that my F-1's were not runflats! "Who told you they were?" he asked. I told him to not question my intelligence! Everyone knows what F-1's are, I told him. Apparently not everyone does! Until he saw the "EMT" on the sidewalls, he wasn't convinced. Thankfully I got through the ordeal ok.

I swear the Mgr at your service center must be the same guy at mine, but running back and forth between the two states. He told me the exact same crap - "Uhh these are not run-flat tires" (me) "Then why does it have EMT on the sidewalls ?" - " Oh, these are run flat tires then "

I swear it was a tough azz 30-40 min to deal with that kind of stuff and keep my mouth shut for most of it.

KTSwanson
04-20-06, 05:01 PM
Major disappointment...after posting my initial enthusiasm with the GY RS-A EMTs in a prior post, I started noticing major "speed-wobbling" as my skateboarding sons put it, a resonance of back and forth wobbling at various speeds, particularly if the road surface isn't perfect (common in So. Calif.). I initially only put on 2 tires, replacing the (worn out) rear original F1s. The "wobble" was noticable, but disappeared when I rotated them to the front, with the F1s on the rear. About this time I had the suspension stiffened up significantly, and on replacing the remaining 2 rear F1s several months later, the "speed-wobble" and floating sensation at the rear is intolerable, the side walls are clearly the weak link, negating all the stiffening I did to the car. There is a grab-release feeling on long steady curves at speed that is very uncomfortable. They're coming off tomorrow, with Toyo Proxes T1rs going on.

CIWS
04-20-06, 06:20 PM
I've put about 3K on mine so far and haven't noticed any of that. However I'm also not driving on your roads. But I have driven a couple of hundred miles down south to Austin and up north to Oklahoma City. In my case all 4 tires were replaced at the same time. In fact it's nearing the time to rotate them.