: What will it take to get you to buy a 80mm throttle body?



eldorado1
02-04-06, 07:13 PM
Honest question. What's wrong with the current setup? Too expensive? Not enough torque (or hp) gain? Not interested? Don't like dealing with "cores"?

I'm listening.

danbuc
02-04-06, 11:01 PM
Right now for me..it's lack of funding, and time to install it if I could afford it.

Aurora40
02-05-06, 01:37 PM
Hmm, this is what I had said about a month ago:


I definitely hope you get a lot of sales, but how's it going so far? I'd love to hear feedback from folks about whether a bigger TB gains anything. If my TB was easily moddable, I'd try it out for $200. It just seems like with the Aurora and to a lesser extent the Northstar, that people talk a big game about how they'd mod this, mod that, but when someone produces a nice product at a good price, no one ponies up. :canttalk: :hide:

RSM used to have prices around $200 for their TB, plus $100 for the coupling/backing piece. Their prices have gone up and up probably due to the cost of carrying a line of stuff that almost no one purchases. It's no surprise the aftermarket is so bare for these cars.

I was sort of hoping you'd sell a few and maybe it would be a sign the performance market is turning around for these cars. I don't quite know what it is? Maybe the lack of sports/sporty cars with the motors? I wonder if GM sold crate Northstars with stand-alone controllers, and if the tuning was opened up to the aftermarket, how much that would help?

You can see how much work Mark98STS did to get his car going. When you reall break down the price and time and whatnot, he could have had some 3800-powered car doing the same for less. But imagine if he could tune the Northstar's PCM? Imagine if there were more places that were comfortable working on GM's DOHC motors? Performance would be cheaper, there'd be more motors out there, and more people would buy this kind of stuff...

To some degree the same is true of GM's other DOHC V8. The LT5 has a narrower range of performance parts, and they are very pricey. But at least in that case most owners are willing to pay to play at a higher power level. Since it's a sports car, this is more likely of the owner. Caddy and Olds don't quite have that same base with the Northstar cars. I paid over two grand to have the intake ported out on my LT5. I'm happy with it and with the ~35hp it adds. But look at what that kind of money would buy you in 3800 or LSx performance. One heck of a lot more than 35hp. The Northstar is at a somewhat similar level of cost for power, but with owners who didn't buy the car for outright performance.

So have you actually sold one TB yet? I really do wish you the best of luck! I'd love to see the performance market for these motors pick up!

eldorado1
02-05-06, 02:45 PM
Good post. I think the cadillac market in a way parallels the fiero market. We're cheap. :D



So have you actually sold one TB yet? I really do wish you the best of luck! I'd love to see the performance market for these motors pick up!

Not a one, besides the one that's on my car right now... :yup:

On a similar aftermarket/performance note, lets say I have an aftermarket computer, that is plug and play, with wiring harness, for $400. 100% tuneable, 1000% better than Megasquirt and Holley, etc, and is an original GM computer you can find in junkyards everywhere for $50 (in case it breaks or whatever). I would ask if there would be interest, but I think I'd know how that would turn out. "Yes yes yes!" and then nobody buys one. :(

01STS
02-05-06, 06:50 PM
I hate dealing with cores. I would rather keep my OE unit. Pricing vs gain is not the issue for me. I think 6hp and 10 ft/lbs for $265 plus shipping (think that is your price) is fair value. I would be willing to pay $300 if I don't have to return a core.

eldorado1
02-05-06, 07:14 PM
I hate dealing with cores. I would rather keep my OE unit. Pricing vs gain is not the issue for me. I think 6hp and 10 ft/lbs for $265 plus shipping (think that is your price) is fair value. I would be willing to pay $300 if I don't have to return a core.

Throttle body and spacer is $285 shipped currently.

Hmm... What is your issue with the cores? Is it the downtime of sending in your old one? You can get ones from the junkyard for about $50, which would save you the $100 core on the TB..

I think I need to reduce the core charges a bit though. $150 for core charges is a bit excessive if people don't want to deal with cores. But at the same time, I don't want to have to fish around in junk yards for throttle bodies. That takes too much time.

Okay,

New pricing information:
80mm throttle body: $190 (+75 core)
80mm throttle body spacer bored to match: $50 (+25 core)
Shipping for anything: $10 in the lower 48.

So, $250 shipped if you send me your parts with your check (save $35). $350 shipped if you don't (save $75). Just send me your cores back within a month or so, and I'll send you your core charge back.

Of course, 01sts, I know you probably won't be interested, since I don't have 01 throttle bodies.

MARK99STS
02-05-06, 07:36 PM
I feel your pain Eldorado1, a lot of people have said to me why not spend all that money on a sports car instead of your Cadillac, you could have gotten more power for half the cost. Well I had a sports car and now I want luxury and power. Unfortunately, even though these are fairly expensive luxury cars, it seems the owners are reluctant to mod them. They would rather spend the money on their "sports" cars. Maybe because it is less expensive for aftermarket stuff on other cars they don't have a lot of money in. It's a mystery to me. I personally would rather have something more unique than average run of the mill stuff. That's why I pursued this project. I really don't care if someone else wants to turbo their car or not as I am not out to profit from this, I just wanted a turbo on my STS.

Good luck to you!

ELDOminator
02-05-06, 08:00 PM
To be 100% honest, it's just not convenient enough for me. Yes, yes, I know I'm lazy, but I mean, all that shipping, billing, bah... I'd rather go to a store and buy it. (Which will never happen, so I might as well buy one from you anyway! :D )

01STS
02-05-06, 09:17 PM
I have attempted to get a 2000up core throttle body locally and have had no luck. There are just no wreckers around here willing to part out complete motors. Seems every Deville or Seville here is getting rebuilt.

Trench
02-06-06, 01:16 AM
I'd buy one, but my engine knocks. They SAY it's piston slap, but I am having a hard tiem swallowing that, so I'm taking it to another dealer..but... I Need to get that corrected first. :eek:

Oh yeah, I also have an 01. Bah

auroradude
02-06-06, 01:29 AM
When someone else buys one and actually proves it to gain 6 or 7hp I will buy one. That is CHEAPO compared to RSM's now (GULP!) $600 price! I had a hell of a time removing my carboned up TB on my 95 rora. Sliced up my fingers really well. Theres still red spots from blood drops next to the butterfly.

davesdeville
02-06-06, 04:08 AM
Well, for ME to buy one it would take probably a bit less than a month to get the cash together, and you'd have to have on that would fit my 95.

eldorado1
02-06-06, 11:21 AM
When someone else buys one and actually proves it to gain 6 or 7hp I will buy one.

I thought I did? :ill:

From a strictly unethical businessman's prospective, I *should* have posted the results from the lowest "before" run, and the highest "after" run. Then the gain would have been 12hp. Of course me, trying to be an honest salesman (what am I thinking?!?), took the best before and after runs. The after runs were much more consistant than the before runs. Not entirely sure why there. I guess what I'm trying to say is, this may be a 12hp bolt on part. Like I said in the other thread, I believe the "average" gain was 8hp. I guess you can consider the 6hp figure to be the minimum.

cart69
02-06-06, 01:36 PM
i am very interested in it, but the fact remains i am getting ready to drop my motor out to do a head gasket timesert job so cash is my issue now, but as far as later i plan to purchase one of these, also i would be interested in a stand alone setup for the n* as i am planning to put on in a 3rd gen camaro in the somewhat near future.

caddydaddy
02-06-06, 02:27 PM
If you start making them for the 2000-up engines, I'll be on your list to buy one!

eldorado1
02-10-06, 09:28 PM
less than 1 day left on the ebay auction... After this one expires, I will post one with a starting bid of $100.

Yes, you heard right, $100. The core will still apply, but this will be a one time event. Unfortunately, due to lack of interest, I will probably not be manufacturing these anymore. I still have 2, but they will be liquidated on ebay to the highest bidder.

The spacers will be available at the above rate, $50, or I may just include it in the auction as well and start at $120.

SO, IF you were interested, this is your second to last chance to get one, and for a good deal at that...

Sorry you guys... It's been fun... Need to recoup my losses... :crying:

AlBundy
02-10-06, 10:13 PM
Eldo1, I'm interested and I will be willing to buy the first one or second one which ever it is. My only lack of knowledge was is it worth it with a corsa exhaust. I don't have the exhaust but I'm about to buy it now(income tax). I'm just interested in the #'s. How much HP gain are we talking with the exhaust. PM me. Cheers.

Aurora40
02-10-06, 11:47 PM
Hey man, sorry to hear that. If you can afford it, though, you might just keep them on the shelf. Sell them at the price you already set ($250), if you can wait you will eventually find two buyers. At the worst, you could always liquidate them later when you just can't afford it, and probably get the same $100+ for them. Just a thought.

Sorry they didn't do better. Just based on trends I'd have guessed they'd sell poorly, but I figured you'd move a couple of them for sure.

Aurora40
02-10-06, 11:50 PM
If you start making them for the 2000-up engines, I'll be on your list to buy one!
Just FYI, when I looked into it at RSM's ~$300 boring price, it would have been close to $1,000 to have the TB, crossover, and mounting piece behind it bored if you wanted to keep your originals (like paying the core charge). The crossover is a huge piece that includes the housing for the water pump.

eldorado1
02-10-06, 11:58 PM
Hey man, sorry to hear that. If you can afford it, though, you might just keep them on the shelf. Sell them at the price you already set ($250)

I'd like to, but I'd also like to put some money into another project I'm working on for Northstars... So I'm not done yet. heh heh heh... :lildevil:

fubar569
02-11-06, 01:12 PM
Depends...i just bought a 97 deville. i could be very interested in one in 2-3 weeks if you'll still have one available or consider doing one. i can't afford the downtime so i'd have to eat the core up front but would have no problems returning mine.

eldorado1
02-11-06, 02:10 PM
That wouldn't be a problem... I can hold on to one.

So I guess this would make for 2, possibly 3 people that are interested? Maybe I can hold off on calling it quits just yet... I appreciate your support and help here guys!

fubar569
02-11-06, 03:58 PM
not a problem. i've always been interested in modifying one of these motors. i just yhave to wait till my next paycheck and i should be able to pick one up.

ELDOminator
02-11-06, 04:00 PM
I am interested and all, but I don't know if or when I would beable to buy one. I am going to do my exhaust, then audio first. But if you cancel production before I finish with those, which may be a month or more, I may not beable to get them. *Sob* But if you keep requests open, you could always do one every now and then when someone asks? That way you only have to worry about it when someone is actually buying one.

eldorado1
02-11-06, 05:19 PM
I am interested and all, but I don't know if or when I would beable to buy one.

That seems to be the general concensus. :thepan:

fubar569
02-11-06, 05:33 PM
it always works out that way...

i can't wait to start bastardizing this deville...there are some very cocky imports around here that are really pissing me off

davesdeville
02-12-06, 05:51 AM
Like I've said, if you do one that'll work on my 95 I'll buy it. I have the capability to do the spacer though so I would do that myself.

blunted
02-17-06, 11:50 AM
I'm with Dave, I'd be interested in one when it can fit my 94 Eldo.
I should probably check my FSM before anything to see if I can pull this off myself. I couldnt get my injectors up high enough to check them because of some none moving clips.. not a good sign of my mechanical ability. :shhh:

Dooman
02-17-06, 12:10 PM
I guess I missed the discussion of gains from this.
I think you'll find most of us with some extra $$ are running in to different things to spend the money on. I got half an LED out now, a quick $400 to fix. Gas guage is "goofy", shocks are coming up on replacement time.. etc. Sorry.... the money needs to go to maintenance

fubar569
02-17-06, 12:44 PM
I guess I missed the discussion of gains from this.
I think you'll find most of us with some extra $$ are running in to different things to spend the money on. I got half an LED out now, a quick $400 to fix. Gas guage is "goofy", shocks are coming up on replacement time.. etc. Sorry.... the money needs to go to maintenance

what exactly is it doing? mine seems to take a long time to respond and always wants to seem to go to 8 or 9 gallons if i throw a quick 10 bucks in it to get me by till payday...and 10 bucks sure ain't gettin me 9 gallons

i can live with the gauge though. however too much horsepower is never enough

eldorado1
02-17-06, 01:24 PM
I guess I missed the discussion of gains from this.
I think you'll find most of us with some extra $$ are running in to different things to spend the money on.

Tax return$.... :D

gains of 6hp and 10-15lb-ft all the way across the powerband.

AlBundy
02-17-06, 09:31 PM
As I told you earlier eldorado1 I will be making my trip the the yard to purchase a core. If I don't find one I will eat the core cost and buy one Sunday. Cheers.

fubar569
02-17-06, 09:47 PM
i got me this little paycheck thing today, so after i pay bills i should be ordering one...i'll know probably monday for sure...i'll have to see about finding a core or arranging transportation or next day shipping each way for mine, or possibly work out details with eldorado1 as i can't afford downtime...

eldorado1
02-18-06, 12:15 PM
Excellent you guys! Keep me posted... :highfive:

fubar569
02-19-06, 02:39 PM
post who where? did what that? lol

so far lookin good...

anyone want to by a set of 6 times used Atomic Beta Race 10.26 skis? i don't ski like a granny but these things have only seen snow 6 times and they are a proven world cup winner.

danbuc
02-19-06, 04:57 PM
What length?

fubar569
02-19-06, 09:46 PM
185's with 28.5 boots and xentrix 310 bindings

i kept them short cause i did a bit of out of bounds/mogul skiing...but i also found them optimal on the slalom course as well

danbuc
02-19-06, 11:26 PM
If only I had some money.....I need a new set of skis. Of course, being in Florida they wouldn't do me much good, but there's next season. Oh well...maybe next time. And 185 is a good length too. Not too long, not too short, but just right for when you wanna have some fun off the beaten path.


Damn, now I'm sad cause I realize this is the first year since I was 3 that I haven't been skiing. Hmmm...there's always next year.

fubar569
02-19-06, 11:35 PM
i don't want alot for them since i got a smoking deal on them. what were you thinking for a price that made you think you wouldn't have the money? lol

CadillacSTS42005
03-06-06, 12:33 AM
hey eldo i really dont wanna be without my Caddy having to send in the TB and all. I can get a TB for another earler n* (a 93 N*) and send that in would it work for my core charge (my ETC is a 97)

eldorado1
03-06-06, 11:11 AM
PM sent.

*sigh* my vendor status officially runs out in 8 days. I still have not officially completed one sale on this board, so I'm very hesitant to spring the cost to extend it another 3 months ($50).... In the previous 3 months, I was hoping to get at least 3 orders. I may need to stick to ebay.

fubar569
03-06-06, 03:59 PM
i'm sorry i couldn't follow through at the moment man, but the new cellphone and it's first month bill (370.00) kinda killed that hope for the time being. that and i'm full force into this traction control project.

maybe soon...maybe...i dunno...it depends on what my "girlfriend" wants to do here soon...i might be taking a trip to canada and should save...if she doesn't give me an answer soon i'm gonna start car modding again...

davesdeville
03-07-06, 04:23 AM
I'll still buy one if you do a 95 compatable one...

eldorado1
03-07-06, 11:42 AM
If my machinist ever finishes the jig to bore one, you'll be the first to know.

Rob S
03-07-06, 05:33 PM
I would consider one for my 99STS, is there one going on ebay, or forsale now? Also, interested in the dyno chart if you have it, along with the specs.
:stirpot:

eldorado1
03-07-06, 05:57 PM
I have one in stock, and 2 people "interested"... I'm waiting for the first person in line to get back with me. Once I figure out where he stands, and I get a couple cores I'm owed, I can place an order for a couple more.

So, as it stands, I'll just assume the one I have now is spoken for, and I'll be getting a few more in a couple weeks... The dyno sheet shows +6 hp and +10-15 torque, I'd have to search for it. It's in the other (50 million page) 80mm throttle body thread...

ah, found it...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y103/gijim/dynorun.jpg
red is before, blue is after.

cl1986
03-07-06, 07:04 PM
What is this chart showing??

270hp?
275hp?
295hp?
300hp?

engines??

And is this both the tb and the spacer??

How many total runs show an increase in power??

eldorado1
03-07-06, 07:28 PM
'96 300hp engine, with both TB and spacer. All runs showed an increase in power, ranging from 5-10hp. The two runs shown are the best "before" run and best "after" run.

Aurora40
03-10-06, 12:19 PM
I have one in stock, and 2 people "interested"... I'm waiting for the first person in line to get back with me.
Oh, I thought some of us Aurora guys stepped up and accounted for your first sales?

Just my two cents, but unless you are making a mint of a single sale, I wouldn't spend $50 for "vendor" status. If suddenly these start taking off, then do it. But again, just two cents, if that... :)

eldorado1
03-10-06, 03:55 PM
Yeah, I might take a month off or something, unless things change. And actually, I haven't received any aurora orders. A couple questions and "I'm interested, maybe by the end of the month?" type things...

96-deville-man
03-11-06, 02:19 PM
well i dont need front hubs wich saves me $275. im on a good track to be able to buy a tb and spacer.i just cant afford the core charge. not to sure if i can keep it not running for a few days may need to wait till like wed when i can get my dad to make the drive. as long as nothing comes up i should beable to buy one. hopefully coils also.

eldorado1
03-11-06, 03:03 PM
PM sent, 96-deville-man

ELDOminator
03-11-06, 03:21 PM
What exactly do you do to bore these TBs? Use a lathe, and do a pass or two around the diameter? That's all I can think of. My guess is you should do the same to the Intake Manafold? How big do you, or anyone else, think it would be without doing any structural damage to anything?

eldorado1
03-11-06, 04:57 PM
Pretty much.... I also want to make sure you're not confusing the "intake manifold" with the aluminum spacer directly behind the throttle body which I do bore as well...

The actual plastic intake manifold behind all the aluminum parts is pretty close to 80mm stock. The very bottom of the intake opening does cut into the airstream a bit though. Since I took my intake off last weekend, what I did was took a rotary rasp for a drill, and removed anything that stuck into the air flow. I had to remove some material in a couple spots. After all that I need to take the intake to the quarter carwash and power wash the grime on the inside along with the plastic shavings that got in.

If you do that, you'll probably gain some more horses. Don't know how many because I didn't test it like that. I do have a stock intake sitting here though, if you want me to take some pictures of what needs to be removed.....

cl1986
03-11-06, 06:29 PM
Well, ive thought this over, can have a guy bore mine for free, well maybe some beer, but i decided it wasnt worth the time and effort.

Plus i have the 270 hp motor so not even sure how much gain i would get...

fubar569
03-11-06, 07:32 PM
average 6hp and 10-14ft/lbs was on a 300hp motor. you should see "similar" gains. it won't be for nothing though. i'd say closer to the lower end of the averages so say 5hp and 10lt/lbs - still worth it in my opinion

eldorado1
03-11-06, 07:40 PM
remember it's not about the peak gains, it's the amount of area you gain under the torque curve. You gain 10-15 all the way to 5000rpm, then it starts tapering off. That is a massive amount of area.

I'd take your buddy up on that, for some beer. That's a dam good deal.

fubar569
03-11-06, 07:59 PM
now if we could get you to do it for beer...lol :thumbsup: :alchi:

eldorado1
03-11-06, 08:29 PM
Hey, I'll do it... It's the shipping that will kill ya though! LOL! :alchi:

fubar569
03-11-06, 09:10 PM
so 2 cases of beer plus $195 shipping? haha

Enygma
03-17-06, 04:05 PM
Eldorado!,
Would you e-mail me please? I am interested in one of your throttle bodies and would like to discuss purchase with you. I do not have enough posts to send you a PM.

Thanks and enjoy,
~Scott
enygma@hevanet.com
http://www.hevanet.com/enygma/

eldorado1
03-17-06, 05:34 PM
Done. If the interest keeps up, I might be able to get back to vender status.

:worship:

LT5
03-17-06, 08:09 PM
95 TB and spacer ready ??
IM me when you get them.

eldorado1
03-17-06, 09:47 PM
I'll let you know. I know there's a couple people looking for 93-95 TB's...

WinnipegCadillac
03-26-06, 07:22 PM
Just stumbled across this post. Do you still do the 1998 STS? How much for the TB and spacer, as well as the core charge (I will return once I change it). I am in Canada, so will need shipping there. Also, I would prefer to do this over Paypal (to afford myself some protection...got burned on ebay once for hockey equipment). Are they also fairly simple to install? Thanks for your time.

fubar569
03-26-06, 07:47 PM
a canadian got burnd on hocky equipment?
canadian buying hockey equipment?
whodathunkit? lol

sorry man i had to say it....i have a kinda sorta best friend might be fiancee that lives in canada and is head over heels for hockey

eldorado1
03-26-06, 08:01 PM
Just stumbled across this post. Do you still do the 1998 STS? How much for the TB and spacer, as well as the core charge (I will return once I change it). I am in Canada, so will need shipping there. Also, I would prefer to do this over Paypal (to afford myself some protection...got burned on ebay once for hockey equipment). Are they also fairly simple to install? Thanks for your time.

Yes, these are for 96-99 engines. Pricing information is on the first page, shipping to canada would cost about $5 more. Paypal is fine. Installation is simple and straightforward, but you do need some "special" tools... Torx bits are one of them. I can help guide you through it until I can get a picture guide together... I'm waiting for a couple more throttle bodies to get done, so there is a wait right now.


Once the next batch is done, I'll probably be able to get back to vendor status. I don't feel comfortable having this thread bumped back to the top, when I'm not an official vendor.... So I would appreciate letting this thread die until I do so.. Thanks guys,

GreenMachine
03-26-06, 11:46 PM
I think there isn't a big performance market for these cars simply because its a front wheel drive, 4 speed automatic drivetrain. I'm guessing we'll see mods for the new RWD northstar engines with the 5 and 6 speed's since they certainly lend themselves to a more performance oriented approach. The CTS has some mods on the market so I would assume now that cadillac has the V-Series of the northstar that there will be a demand from the drivers of those cars for performance parts and it will then trickle down to the guys who can't afford the elite under 5, V-Series cars.

Cost is another issue, these cars new were expensive. Where as a Mustang is 300HP for $26,000 and it carries the name with it so you know all the companies will be making products for it simply because it can be reached to a wider audiance.

davesdeville
03-27-06, 04:04 AM
I don't feel comfortable having this thread bumped back to the top, when I'm not an official vendor.... So I would appreciate letting this thread die until I do so.. Thanks guys,

Ah I wouldn't worry that much, Sal's a good guy, I'm sure he understands that this isn't a big cash cow for you, ya know? (PS it was already almost at the top so this isn't bumping it :p )

96-deville-man
03-27-06, 02:47 PM
Yes, these are for 96-99 engines. Pricing information is on the first page, shipping to canada would cost about $5 more. Paypal is fine. Installation is simple and straightforward, but you do need some "special" tools... Torx bits are one of them. I can help guide you through it until I can get a picture guide together... I'm waiting for a couple more throttle bodies to get done, so there is a wait right now.

send me an email, ryan.h (at) excite.com
(replace "(at)" with @, remove spaces)
Once the next batch is done, I'll probably be able to get back to vendor status. I don't feel comfortable having this thread bumped back to the top, when I'm not an official vendor.... So I would appreciate letting this thread die until I do so.. Thanks guys,


I got dibs on the first one!!! lol sorry still not bumping lol

codewize
09-17-06, 07:56 PM
What year TB's are we talking about here? Has the price come down at all? I have an 01 DTS

eldorado1
09-17-06, 08:44 PM
Back from the dead! :p

Don't sell TB's anymore, and never carried them for '00+'s

CadillacSTS42005
02-09-07, 11:52 AM
im rising this thread again...
Eldo i need you tehe!

99Classillac
02-10-07, 09:55 AM
I got money, got a TB? Seriously.

eldorado1
02-10-07, 12:24 PM
Don't sell TB's anymore

Sorry....

urbanski
02-10-07, 12:57 PM
Don't sell TB's anymore, and never carried them for '00+'s

guess we're done then eh?