: Any computer folks here?



Night Wolf
01-19-06, 10:24 PM
I have never seen this before, and it is really annoying...

First, I just did a fresh dirty install of XP Pro on my Western Digital, after having problems for about 2 weeks....

This past week while trying to solve the problem, I dusted off my old Maxtor and put XP Pro on that (it was empty) so I was able to use my computer atleast.

It would restart at random times, or atleast what I thought where random....

but now the WD with the fresh install is doing it too, it ever did this.

I then realized when it does it, and it is the most bizzare thing...

Anytime a dialog box pops up, like when I go to the forums and I get a PM, the box comes up... or when I go to save something and the box comes up saying "are you sure you want to over wright" etc... any pop up dialog box (but not pop up ads)

Causes my whole system to reboot right there. The PC speaker will beep just as the dialog popes up for a split second, then it'll restart.

Anyway ever deal with this? how can I fix it? Its the most anoying thing, I have been loosing so much open work, not to mention it isn't good for the HDD to keep restarting incorrectly.

illumina
01-19-06, 10:38 PM
On the old hdd, you said it was wiped clear before you installed XP, am I getting that right?

Try this: open your case up and find the reset button wiring if your PC is so equipped. Disconnect it and see if your machine restarts itself again...The wiring on any standard ATX case is generally the same in relation to the motherboard, so the reset switch wire will be right next to the power and hdd LED connectors.

If that doesn't solve the problem, we'll work on it from there...

Night Wolf
01-19-06, 11:02 PM
the old Maxtor?

Yeah, that had a quick format with NTFS and XP Pro was loaded on it.... all fresh

and it did that.

My PC is equiped with the reset feature :) I built the machine, so I am a little familer with it :)

good idea tho.. I'll give it a try....

slk230mb
01-19-06, 11:20 PM
Is the case clean? I have seen where stray pieces of dust and lint ground the motherboard in most unusual places and cause the board to short out and randomly restart. I'd also check that all case and cpu fans are working correctly.

illumina
01-19-06, 11:23 PM
Was the XP Pro a ligit CD, or is it a copy from an internet source? You don't have to say if you don't want to, but it might be that the XP that you have might be corrupted if it was downloaded from the net.

For instance, if the XP Pro was downloaded from Kazza, Bit Torrent, or a like source, a bug might have been encrypted into the program somewhere, and once installed onto a hard drive and the XP begins to run, the bug will be released at some point...Just a thought you might want to keep an eye on.

JimHare
01-19-06, 11:24 PM
The opening of a dialog box (a "child window process" in Windows terms) is a function partly of the video subsystem. It's been my experience that about 85% of all Windows problems are, if not caused by, at least cured by, changing out the video system. Go buy a $100 video card somewhere and put it in either system - if that solves the problem, you're golden. If not, report back and we'll go to phase II....

illumina
01-19-06, 11:25 PM
Is the case clean? I have seen where stray pieces of dust and lint ground the motherboard in most unusual places and cause the board to short out and randomly restart. I'd also check that all case and cpu fans are working correctly.

I tried telling my friend that he needs to keep the damn case together, but he always takes the side of the case off. The next thing you know, dust and other foul debris gets into his case and something wierd always happens.

illumina
01-19-06, 11:30 PM
The opening of a dialog box (a "child window process" in Windows terms) is a function partly of the video subsystem. It's been my experience that about 85% of all Windows problems are, if not caused by, at least cured by, changing out the video system. Go buy a $100 video card somewhere and put it in either system - if that solves the problem, you're golden. If not, report back and we'll go to phase II....

That's funny, I haven't had any video issues as of late, but with my Linux machine, the screen usually goes to black when I place a new monitor onto the system. I haven't had any Windoze system do that to me though.

Kev
01-20-06, 12:04 AM
My guess would be incompatible drivers or competition for resources.
Make sure you have the latest drivers for your chip set (start here) and check on your other peripherals as well.

Night Wolf
01-20-06, 12:10 AM
The case is pretty clean, not new car clean, but clean enough.


Was the XP Pro a ligit CD, or is it a copy from an internet source? You don't have to say if you don't want to, but it might be that the XP that you have might be corrupted if it was downloaded from the net.

For instance, if the XP Pro was downloaded from Kazza, Bit Torrent, or a like source, a bug might have been encrypted into the program somewhere, and once installed onto a hard drive and the XP begins to run, the bug will be released at some point...Just a thought you might want to keep an eye on.

well, I BOUGHT XP Home, FULL.... $200!

and I can't find the friggin thing! it isn't here or back in NY... well, it has to be back in NY, but I went thru EVERY singler box in my apartment... nothing.

So this copy?

its from Hawaii :)

my friend from Hawaii copied it and sent it to me... he got it from some kid in his class who got it from something... yeah, not the best story eh?

The CD key is neat... you use it, but it never wants you to activate windows or anything... put it on as many as you would like....

I wish I had *MY* real copy tho.

My firend hasn't put this CD on any of his computers yet....

Ugh... this sucks.. it has been fine for about 2.5 hours now, but I haven't been doing anything i know will bring a dialog box up.

My graphics card is a nVida GeForce FX5200 256mb DDR, I bought it new and never had a problem with it (other then DVI output not working... nVida knows and refuses to do anything aobut it... go nVida :mad2: ) but I dunno... it just dosn't seem like a graphics card problem... I don't have my old cards here either (back in NY) to try it...

Night Wolf
01-20-06, 12:11 AM
My guess would be incompatible drivers or competition for resources.
Make sure you have the latest drivers for your chip set (start here) and check on your other peripherals as well.

True, I havn't installed a single thing yet.... just let XP find everything to get started... I have no sound or anything etc....

should I just go to device manager click drivers > update drivers and let Windows search the 'net?

slk230mb
01-20-06, 12:15 AM
True, I havn't installed a single thing yet.... just let XP find everything to get started... I have no sound or anything etc....
should I just go to device manager click drivers > update drivers and let Windows search the 'net?

I'd go to Nvidia's website and download their latest drivers directly. As for not needing activation, it's probably a corporate copy (but XP Home?), or a severly hacked version of XP.

illumina
01-20-06, 12:30 AM
Having a copy from 6 degrees of friends might not be the best thing. Your version most certainly is hacked, and there are quite a few shady places to get that kind of thing. Your friend may not even know there is a bug in it if that's the case. If you have any anti-virus software, update it and run your Windoze in "safe mode" then run the AV software.

As for the chipset drivers, you're using your old hdd that was original on this machine, right? If so, then I can't really see that connection. If there is a problem with the chipset, then go to the MB website and get it updated. That's normally SOP even of you aren't installing anything new. The only issues I can see with any chipset drivers is hdd size allowance. In other words, an unusually large hdd on an older mainboard might not register all of the hard drive space until it is updated. And if I recall correctly, you told me that your MB is pretty new, and it should therefore be able to have just about any size hdd on it without an update...I would still do an update anyways.

davesdeville
01-20-06, 02:27 AM
I tried telling my friend that he needs to keep the damn case together, but he always takes the side of the case off. The next thing you know, dust and other foul debris gets into his case and something wierd always happens.

I've had my case open for about 4 years. It's in a desk compartment, but the back and front are open so it is full of dust. Haven't had a problem yet. (Don't really care if I do I've been meaning to upgrade the MB and CPU anyway.)

ewill3rd
01-20-06, 07:10 AM
Lord knows what will happen with a hacked copy of XP.
I jsut wanted to relate an experience I recently had.
I did all kinds of things because my computer kept rebooting, I discovered that my USB hub was doing something everytime I tried to print or use certain devices off of it my computer would reboot.
I can't remember if I decided it was my old HP D series or if it was the hub itself, I have them both disconnected.

terrible one
01-20-06, 08:12 AM
Rick, have you turned off the Automatically Restart On Error option?

START>SETTINGS>CONTROL PANEL
Double left click SYSTEM
Left click the ADVANCED tab
In the STARTUP AND RECOVERY section, left click the SETTINGS button.
In the SYSTEM FAILURE section, unchceck AUTOMATICALLY RESTART.
Left click OK
Left click APPLY
Left click OK

With this, you will get a BSOD instead of a restart. This doesn't solve the problem, but if you copy down the error code on the BSOD that you get, I can tell you what's wrong.

Kev
01-20-06, 11:39 AM
As for the chipset drivers, you're using your old hdd that was original on this machine, right? If so, then I can't really see that connection. If there is a problem with the chipset, then go to the MB website and get it updated. That's normally SOP even of you aren't installing anything new. The only issues I can see with any chipset drivers is hdd size allowance. In other words, an unusually large hdd on an older mainboard might not register all of the hard drive space until it is updated. And if I recall correctly, you told me that your MB is pretty new, and it should therefore be able to have just about any size hdd on it without an update...I would still do an update anyways.I thought he said that he wiped the drives clean and did a fresh install. If that be the case then the operating system would need to have the updated drivers installed unless you want to trust Microsoft for your drivers.... :suspense:

With some chipsets, Via in particular, I've had issues where it was necessary to update the system drivers before proceeding with any other peripheral updates on a fresh install. Before doing that I would experience crashes and shut downs.

tru504187211
01-20-06, 11:55 AM
Do the event logs give a narrower idea of possible reasons for a reboot?

DBA-One
01-20-06, 11:55 AM
I have a server that is rebooting it's self constantly. It just started to happen. It's a legit Windows Server 2000, dual Pentium III 1ghz chips, etc. It's shutting down every 10-30 minutes. There is nothing in the event log pointing to a particular problem or a trend of any sort. Only entries that the system shutdown was unexpected. No shit! I've seen where bad memory can cause stuff like this so I'm going to try changing that out first.

DBA-One
01-20-06, 12:34 PM
I personally think you are having a hardware problem. I bet if you installed Linux on the machine in question the same would happen. It's also been my experience that bad video drivers do not cause the machine to suddenly shutdown. I've always seen the BSOD due to that. I'd focus on 4 areas:

bad motherboard
bad memory
unseated cards in PCI, VESA slots
power supply on it way out

illumina
01-20-06, 03:43 PM
I thought he said that he wiped the drives clean and did a fresh install. If that be the case then the operating system would need to have the updated drivers installed unless you want to trust Microsoft for your drivers.... :suspense:

With some chipsets, Via in particular, I've had issues where it was necessary to update the system drivers before proceeding with any other peripheral updates on a fresh install. Before doing that I would experience crashes and shut downs.

I believe he said that he did a dirty install on one and a clean on the other. If there was a clean install, then yes, you might need to install the chipset drivers. I still have my CD that came with my Biostar MB and have had to do this before. That dirty install that he did is also the reason I figured the he either has a bad/corrupted Windoze CD (which has been hacked and copied) or something in the hardware department.

As for the comment on the bad PSU, I suggested that in a PM. I just had to replace the PSU on my Linux machine about two weeks ago. Man was that thing chewed the Hell up! :banghead:


I've had my case open for about 4 years. It's in a desk compartment, but the back and front are open so it is full of dust. Haven't had a problem yet. (Don't really care if I do I've been meaning to upgrade the MB and CPU anyway.)

You should see the inside of my friends PC case :eek: Not only is it covered in about three inches of dust, but he smokes on top of that and ashes and all sorts of foul debris gets inside of that poor thing. He has even spilled beer in that damned thing! That's why I'm pretty much done helping him with his machines...

DBA-One
01-20-06, 05:05 PM
I just opened the case to my server. Swapped around the cards and memory after cleaning the contacts with rubbing alcohol. The computer has not shut down since.

terrible one
01-20-06, 06:02 PM
If he turns the restart on error off and gives the BSOD code then we can determine whats wrong. I'm thinking it's RAM

DBA-One
01-20-06, 06:09 PM
This is hardware. You can tell Windows to log all you want but if the hardware tells the machine to reboot right now there is nothing for Windows to write to event logs. This is a useless effort. Read what I wrote about my server and see what you get. I've only been doing this for 10 years but what do I know.

terrible one
01-20-06, 06:19 PM
This is hardware. You can tell Windows to log all you want but if the hardware tells the machine to reboot right now there is nothing for Windows to write to event logs. This is a useless effort. Read what I wrote about my server and see what you get. I've only been doing this for 10 years but what do I know.

You never know until you try. I've had BSODs tell me about bad RAM more than once

DBA-One
01-20-06, 06:27 PM
I've had that tell me many things as well but I can tell you this - when the event log writes records that read the system shutdown was unexpected you will get no BSOD, no event log to indicate the problem, etc. A blue screen will happen regardless of your system settings if there are certain problems. What is happening here is some hardware error telling the BIOS to recycle the machine.

Night Wolf
01-20-06, 11:39 PM
Well...

it restarted before I left to go out for a bit...

I came back and downloaded drivers for my main board... wanted me to restart, so I did...

was a little while, I was surfing the net, on another car club I had a couple PM's so the box poped up...... and stayed there... no reboot... I was shocked... so I went back to Word Pad and clicked save as on something when it would normally restart..... nope, it was stable...

so then I downloaded AIM again, figured it'll HAVE to restart on this (as it was) well, got it going... sent a couple IM's out... nothing. Its working perfect, no re-boots or anything at all!

So I guess I just had to install the MB drivers, or atleast updated versions... who knows, but its working :)

terrible one
01-21-06, 01:26 AM
lol good 'ol drivers

Kev
01-21-06, 12:28 PM
Well...

it restarted before I left to go out for a bit...

I came back and downloaded drivers for my main board... wanted me to restart, so I did...

was a little while, I was surfing the net, on another car club I had a couple PM's so the box poped up...... and stayed there... no reboot... I was shocked... so I went back to Word Pad and clicked save as on something when it would normally restart..... nope, it was stable...

so then I downloaded AIM again, figured it'll HAVE to restart on this (as it was) well, got it going... sent a couple IM's out... nothing. Its working perfect, no re-boots or anything at all!

So I guess I just had to install the MB drivers, or atleast updated versions... who knows, but its working :);)

illumina
01-21-06, 02:09 PM
Yeah Kev called it...I'll get my vengence my friend...Mwahahahaha :lildevil:

Good call man :thumbsup:

tru504187211
01-21-06, 06:40 PM
Maybe try a Memtest 86? http://www.memtest86.com/