: What Other Cars Did you Cross Shop prior to buying the V?



BeanCounter
12-09-05, 02:42 PM
First Post! Been lurking a long time!

I know there are a lot of GM loyalists whose blood runs Bowtie Blue, but for those of you who cross-shopped other cars, what were they and WHY did you end up buying your V? Sport Sedans in the 55K MSRP range is my target group.

I've read a lot to understand the aftermarket is massive, pricing is damn good, and the car is a load of fun. I've driven it twice and love it! This would be my daily driver, and I think its pretty perfect for my job as I use my car a lot for driving to clients and such. Just unsure if I want another Manual trans car and I doubt I will ever mod the car but I very well may do a track day here and there.

But I'm more interested in why the V over the S4, S-Type R, S60-R, SRT8, E500 Sport, 545i & C32AMG/C55. Specifically other 4-Dr cars in the same price/performance range.

Main competitor for me is the S-Type R as they depreciate like Kia's.

Thanks!!!

Luna.
12-09-05, 02:46 PM
I primarily considered the M3, Chrysler SRT-8, C55 AMG and the Audi S4 Quattro. A few in the $30k range were considered, but not seriously.

SRT-8: The bullsh*t "MARKUP" was something that I couldn't get over...
C55AMG: Price threw this one out, as well as I like the V looks better
Audi S4: V looks too much better to me.
M3: This made the finals...Was a challenging decision, but price (as I was only considering the vert) and performance won it for the V.

Further, aftermarket mods are much more common for the V than the other models is my understanding.

Looking back, I don't regret it one bit. Joey's thread on how well the '06 differential is holding up lessens any concerns that I have about the differential issue, which is the primary concern that I have about the V.

The E55 AMG, despite that I still like the looks of the V much better & costs much more, has me *VERY* interested, as the engine is just WOW...

LV_V
12-09-05, 02:49 PM
When comparing with these other cars it is important to have a price range. A few of those cars cost almost twice what a used V costs.

The V will likely be the most fun car of the bunch if kept stock because of the power and the manual trans.

benjet
12-09-05, 03:27 PM
I spent a bunch of time in a 2004 S type R, do a search (on "Jag") for my thoughts on the compares.

NOCTS-V
12-09-05, 04:11 PM
I seriously investigated a Dodge Charger RT, Infinity G35 and BMW 3 Series. The BMW was to high $$ for the car/preformance/ability to transport 4 in comfort. The G35 is an excellent car, high reliability, high resale, fastest in its class, just did not light my fire. The Charger is an interesting car, good reviews, good value, but not the bling and excitement of the V. If the Charger had a 6 speed probably would have gone with it for the price, $30,500 for a loaded RT 350 horse Road and Track model.

Luna.
12-09-05, 05:14 PM
I seriously investigated a Dodge Charger RT, Infinity G35 and BMW 3 Series. The BMW was to high $$ for the car/preformance/ability to transport 4 in comfort. The G35 is an excellent car, high reliability, high resale, fastest in its class, just did not light my fire. The Charger is an interesting car, good reviews, good value, but not the bling and excitement of the V. If the Charger had a 6 speed probably would have gone with it for the price, $30,500 for a loaded RT 350 horse Road and Track model.

Perhaps the SRT-8 Charger? That will surely be much faster than the G35, but, of course, the price is higher.

AmesCTS-V
12-09-05, 05:18 PM
Had a GTO for fun and drove a Silvy SS every day. Just decided the V would be great to drive every day so I bought it. So I considered nothing else.

trekster
12-09-05, 05:31 PM
Before, I found out about the V I was pretty much had my eyes set on a Dodge Ram SRT-10, A used M5, and a Jaguar S-Type R. The main reason on why I got the V it's because if offers a lot for your money, Vette Engine, American, and for the 0-60 in 4.6 seconds and 13.1 1/4 mile which we all know it's true. lol

TracerHawk
12-09-05, 05:43 PM
HI Beancounter, I'm currently cross-shopping the CTS-V as well and test drove one earlier this week.

Mostly I've been cross-shopping the CTS-V with the BMW M3, Audi S4, Volvo S60-R (cheaper, but good value and quick). I'm coming from a BMW Z3, so I'm also considering the BMW Z4M that is coming out in the next few months (unlikely though), as well as a Porsche Boxster S (I'm single, no kids, so a 2 seater or coupe that is mid-sized or small is fine with me, but the Boxster is pretty unlikely really, just veering to a bigger car at the moment I think).

I never really considered the Mercedes at any point, just not a fan of their cars and their track record for quality most recently over the last 3-4 years has been going in the wrong direction.

I never really considered the 545i as I'm not looking for a cruiser luxury car, and the 5 series are really heavy cars and not nearly as quick/fast as I would want.

I briefly looked at the SRT8, but the car is just too big/long for me. Love the design though!

I also glanced at the S-Type R, but its 63k base, likely upper 60's to low 70's with options, tack on another 4K in taxes, and you're pushing 70-75k range. Overpriced in my opinion, at least for my needs. Plus the car is over 4000 lbs and its rare that I see a Jaguar driven by anyone under 55-60 years old (unless its an XK). Not the right fit personality wise for me, but might be great for others!

CTS-V is a great car, good value, lots of strong points, some weak points as well which I'm sure you've read about in these forums if you've been lurking. :)

Based on the type of cars you seem to be considering, the S60-R is one you may really want to take out and drive. Good performance, reliable, quick at 0-60 in 5.4, space for passengers, and a great value for what you get. CTS-V is definitely more of a "power machine" in my opinion and probably attracts a little more of a hard core driver. If you are cross-shopping the 545i and the Jag and the mercedes, it seem like you want a fast, luxury cruiser with good quality and a decent amount of space.

I'd consider the S4 as they are nice cars, quick, gorgeous interior, and recently redesigned (versus the CTS is coming out with their redesign in 2007), and if you wanted a little more space than an S4 but wanted to sacrifice some power/racer mentality, go for a decked out A6, which are incredible cars. 5-series are nice too, they are a heavier car too though, but nice, reliable, good quality, lots of gadgets, etc.

Lastly, you may want to at least check out the Acura RL. Nice cars, didnt really fit what I wanted, but they are sharp and high quality, strong drivers too. They run in the low 50's and are only 2" longer than the CTS-V. Not as powerful of course though, but quick enough depending on what you want (Certainly as fast or faster than some you are considering like the 545i).

Happy hunting!

TracerHawk
12-09-05, 05:45 PM
oh, and in the finals for me, its pretty much the CTS-V against the M3. The S4 is there, but definitely lurking behind those 2 by a good distance. No need for Quattro out here in Phoenix, no rain no snow, and that was only real advantage over the M3, other than a couple grand less money and a better interior. The S60-R is a http://smiley.onegreatguy.net/lurk.gif too, jury is still out though.

If only I could afford the RS-4, all my troubles would be solved!

Check out the interior of the RS-4!

http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/3430/audirs44gn.jpg

Luna.
12-09-05, 05:52 PM
I also glanced at the S-Type R, but its 63k base, likely upper 60's to low 70's with options, tack on another 4K in taxes, and you're pushing 70-75k range. Overpriced in my opinion, at least for my needs. Plus the car is over 4000 lbs and its rare I see a Jaguar driven by anyone under 55-60 years old (unless its an XK). Not the right fit personality wise for me, but might be great for others!

Funny you should say that, as that was nearly the EXACT same sentiment that went through my mind (as well as several others) when I considered the Jag. It's more for the "established" crowd was a comment I received. And price is a killer as well.


oh, and in the finals for me, its pretty much the CTS-V against the M3. The S4 is there, but definitely lurking behind those 2 by a good distance. No need for Quattro out here in Phoenix, no rain no snow, and that was only real advantage over the M3, other than a couple grand and a better interior.

I'd love to know what you finally settle on. It was down to those 2 cars for me as well. The M3, while terrific, just doesn't have the aftermarket options that the V does. Further, it seems to cost a LOT of dough to make it perform substantially better. And I don't believe that the reliability can be as good (how much more can that little 6 take?).

It's also a 2 door and I personally loath having reverse in between 1st and 2nd gear...

Brad330cic
12-09-05, 06:04 PM
I also was stuck between the V and an M3 (convertible). Tried to work my best deal on the BMW, but the 400hp and the payment of only $600/month instead of $900 was an easy choice. Love the V, no regrets....but the '07 m4 convert should be ready about the time my lease is up!

BadCad
12-09-05, 06:26 PM
Looked at the Bimmer M3 (convertible,) considered the Jag R series.... the V was just too much value for the money. Maintenance on the German and English also put me off as I usually keep my cars longer then the 4 years offered (BMW maintenance program.) Also, the Jag R had too many mechanical 'add-ons' to make it perform, leading me to have some concern on reliability and maintenance on all those "add-ons." My first choice was originally a '05 'Vette convertible but delivery was too far off, plus the premium pricing on intro, so I bought the 4-door type.

CVP33
12-09-05, 06:29 PM
GTO, G35, V60R, Q45. Once I saw the V it was over. Never even drove it. Bought it over the phone.

ahahnu
12-09-05, 06:35 PM
:lies: Doesn't want to get his third!

AznPrydeRegalRyde
12-09-05, 06:40 PM
I sold my S60R to get my plaion jane CTS 3.6L. Trust me, the S50R is a waste of time. 3 performance modes, and the softest one is fine for spirited driving and much harsher then a V in day to day driving. The hardest suspension setting is down right car-on-rails instead of rubber.

Are you interested in autoX? If so, the S60R also isn't for you, as it understeers just like a fwd. The S60R doesn't compete at all with the M3,C32/55,S-typeR, etc...

ahahnu
12-09-05, 06:44 PM
As for me I was an M3 guy for years (atleast from a far). I was going to get one till the V came out. 400 hp in a limited production car was it for me. I didn't want or need a new car, but once the grey came around that was it. I never even drove the M3 or anything comparable. I would do it again as I love this car and hope to keep it forever. Everyone can agree with me on this- during a conversation with others, and you say you own a CTS, and their reply is either V, stick, or V8 they know. It is a car for those in the know. On another note I do want to get a used STI next. I need something that can handle foul weather and still be fun. I want to keep it as "toy" like with stickers, roof rack and all that glory. Have fun, make the decision that will best suit you, as you won't enjoy it!

Koooop
12-09-05, 06:53 PM
S type R and and the new body style XJR. There were some near new Demo 2005 XJRs around for $54,000. Main reason for the V over the S type R or the XJR is I found a 6 week old, already registerd 1,400 mile V for $40,000.

TracerHawk
12-09-05, 07:16 PM
I never considered the BMW M3 convertible, only the coupe. The M3 coupe is significantly faster 0-60 than the M3 convertible (4.8 seconds vs. 5.4 seconds), so I figured if I was going to get an M3, get the coupe.

Also, Badcad, the maintenance programs on the BMW is nothing to put you off on. Its all free, you don't pay for it. This is all maintenance, not just warranty stuff. Its a huge plus IMO.

Luna: Jury is still out on the M3 vs. the CTS-V, but right now I'm leaning towards the CTS-V and keeping my fingers crossed that the 2006 differential holds up much better than the 04/05's have so far. Honestly, that is I bet 80% of the complaints (wheel-hop) that I've seen on this board. I think the CTS-V is a better value for the money overall, both have great strengths and only a few very minor negatives. Either car is an amazing car to be proud of, so if those 2 are on your short list, its a win-win either way.

Also Luna, the M3 doesnt have the aftermarket options the V does. But they've got a lot out of that engine already as is, there aren't a TON of things I would do to either car really, maybe 3 or 4 things. I will say, I believe the M3 will be more reliable than the CTS-V. The S54 engine in the M3 is so good, it won six International Engine of the Year awards. I can only imagine what the new one will be like. I also would prefer a coupe to a sedan, so being a 2door is a plus for me, not a negative. However, the backseat in the M3 is VERY small. The CTS-V you can put a couple of 6 footers back there and they'd pretty much be okay.

Also, I view both cars are pretty much "limited production cars" (I think in they'll only sell probably 4000-4500 CTS-V's and about the same for the M3.)

Right now, I'm leaning toward a Black 2006 CTS-V, with either black or gray interior (can't decide here!), and with the performance shock absorber package. Throw on some black shoes, UUC shifter, corsa exhaust, etc.

I'll tell you what a downside is that I see with both the M3 and the CTS-V. Both are being redesigned for 2007. So, you're buying a car right now (2006) that is in the last year of its production model lifecycle. Meaning new technological advances and new design are on the way in the new vehicles coming out, and of course both will depreciate all that much faster with the new model coming out next year, and essentially be an antiquated design and technology (although both are still great cars).

I personally prefer to buy a car in the 2nd or 3rd year of its lifecycle. Buying the first year of a new model just means you have to put up with all the kinks and bugs and tweaks that they are still trying to work out in the first model year, PLUS typically you pay MSRP and up for higher demand cars in their first year out. 2nd year cars typically have most of the bugs and fixes all worked out from those people who bought 1st year models and they used them as a guinea pig that first year to root out all the issues.

With that said, I'd have to wait out the 2007 model year then since its the first year, and buy in 2008. No way that's happening, I'm not sure I can go another month, much less 24! *grin* This is why the Audi S4 is still lurking around and in contention as an option for me, but definitely behind the M3 and CTS-V.

BeanCounter
12-09-05, 08:09 PM
Thanks guys!

I want a unique auto, one that doesnt need bling to set it apart from the crowd, and one that is a step-up enough for me to be satisfied for a good 4-5yrs. I'm coming from a Ford SVT Sport Sedan that I've had for 6yrs & 68K miles.

I want something that no-one else has and living in Silicon Valley that leaves me shying away from all BMW's, Lexus, MBZ, Acura and Infiniti's. I love the Q45 and it is super rare with only a little over 1000 units selling each year but in reality it is not a Sport Sedan, it is a luxury crusier and perfect for the wifey.

Why the S-Type R and CTS-V appeal to me most. Never driven an S-Type R and I love the sleeper look of both. 400HP is appealing and I love the styling cues of both cars listed above as I find both of them edgy and non cookie cutter.

In reality I'm looking to spend $35-$40K on a 1 - 2yr old Auto and both of these slot into my price range as well. S60-R isn;t a bad car but I'm not a big fan of Turbo power. Just not linear enough for me and the off/on power band kinda irks me. 5cyl and 2.5l is not a whole lot of displacement.

Finding a S60R with Navi is another feat!

My partners all drive LS430's, E350's, and RL's. RL= snooze fest!

Car will be a daily driver and while stop and go with my 5spd manual has been doable for 6yrs, I sometimes long for an automatic and enjoy driving my automatic convertible when I'm just out for a cruise.

BowenCT
12-09-05, 08:18 PM
I looked at and drove a S60r, an EVO and a STi, although I wouldn't call it cross shopped. Love the M3 and M5, but wouldn't be caught dead in a BMW, my girlfriends X5 is bad enough. You think the V has issues.....the V's reliability is like an Accord compared to that pos. The S60r......don't know what it is, but I just couldn't see myself buying a Volvo. The understeer in the STi is downright scary!!! And I am a Subaru fan. Now the EVO, no other car I have ever driven has left an impression on me like that car did. I still want one bad! If I had the space I'd buy one in a heartbeat, but the V is a permanent fixture so the EVO will have to wait till I have a 5th garage bay.

Jesda
12-09-05, 08:21 PM
GTO, G35, V60R, Q45. Once I saw the V it was over. Never even drove it. Bought it over the phone.

Q45? Strikes me as a peculiar car to cross-shop with a V.

CVP33
12-09-05, 08:24 PM
I was leaving an 2000 LHS and was looking for something semi-sporty yet refined and roomy. I've always liked the Q45, call it a personality flaw. But as I said, once I saw pictures of the CTS-V it was over.

KTSwanson
12-09-05, 09:07 PM
I was leaving an 2000 LHS and was looking for something semi-sporty yet refined and roomy. I've always liked the Q45, call it a personality flaw. But as I said, once I saw pictures of the CTS-V it was over.
I traded in my Q45 for the CTS-V; there is no comparison, one is a middle aged luxury freeway cruiser, the other a rocket that's still a delight with every shift, now 6 months later...and for those who say "I'll never mod it", I was once like that, before the !CAGS, then Volant CAI, now Corsa exhaust and UCC shifter...:excited: :excited:

Luna.
12-09-05, 09:07 PM
Also Luna, the M3 doesnt have the aftermarket options the V does. But they've got a lot out of that engine already as is, there aren't a TON of things I would do to either car really, maybe 3 or 4 things. I will say, I believe the M3 will be more reliable than the CTS-V. The S54 engine in the M3 is so good, it won six International Engine of the Year awards. I can only imagine what the new one will be like.

I agree that BMW has got a ton out of that motor already. What I was loosely referring to was a modded V motor vs. a modded M3 motor... :lildevil:
At the end of the day, the M3 motor is a smaller motor working much harder than the V motor. Does that mean it will be less reliable? Certainly not, but it is what it is.


...and for those who say "I'll never mod it", I was once like that, before the !CAGS, then Volant CAI, now Corsa exhaust and UCC shifter...

:yeah: Especially if you read this damn board! :)

TracerHawk
12-09-05, 09:34 PM
I agree that BMW has got a ton out of that motor already. What I was loosely referring to was a modded V motor vs. a modded M3 motor... :lildevil:

At the end of the day, the M3 motor is a smaller motor working much harder than the V motor. Does that mean it will be less reliable? Certainly not, but it is what it is.

I definitely agree with that Luna. A modded V motor vs a modded M3 motor is no contest, the V is way way better. :bouncy: Anyone who is going to do a ton of modding will definitely want the V over the M3, at least comparing the same year cars. Who knows what the new CTS-V and the new M3 will hold in the future, but man, I get excited just thinking about whats coming down the pipe from both of them. :worship:

Also, I still don't believe the S54 would be less reliable than the LS6 or LS2, by a long shot. Smaller vs. larger has very little bearing on reliability. Look at all the ultra reliable cars from honda and toyota that are tiny little 4bangers. The M3 S54's are incredibly well built as well. I realize that on this board most people will favor a cadillac engine, but if you took a poll of all car owners of all types across the board as well as looked at the data, you'd be hardpressed to find BMW's less reliable than Cadillac's, especially the S54 engine in the E46 01-06 M3's. Hell go visit bimmerfest.com and look at all the complaints about their car and engines and mechanics there, vs. the complaints here. There's a huge difference between the 2 communities.

Anyway like I said before though, I think both the CTS-V and M3 are amazing cars. I think the CTS-V is the better value and gives you a hell of a lot of car for the money. It's the route I'm leaning, with ALL things considered. Everyone's needs are different though, so it just depends on what is more important to you. You won't go wrong whatever choice you make though Beancounter. Most of the cars you are looking at are very very nice and I think you'll be happy with whatever decision you make. The smartest thing to do is what you're doing right now, going out, researching, learning, driving each car, talking with owners of each of the cars that are on your short-list, learning their strong points and weak points, and making an educated decision. :thumbsup:

CVP33
12-09-05, 10:00 PM
Absolutely no reason to mod the V it's already perfect. :canttalk:

Vdrenaline
12-09-05, 10:07 PM
My S4 was stolen and I was looking to buy the highest performance car that I could find that would also serve as a great daily driver. It would be my only car so it had to do everything well.
-I ordered, but declined to buy an RS6 Audi after it arrived and I drove it. It didn't shift fast enough for me with its paddle-shifting automatic. Awesome car. If only it came with a manual transmission, I would have stretched to buy that $92,000 beast.
-Also drove the V8 Audi S4. It felt slower than the older turbo S4 I was replacing.
-Drove the M5 but it wasn't as raw a performance car as I had expected and it was a more expensive used car than a new V. The fact that an M5 engine costs $40 grand to replace also gave me pause.
-Drove the M3 but it didn't have the torque I wanted. It had to be revved like crazy to go fast -not a bad thing but too tiring for a daily driver. Also its engine has a reputation for blowing! Small car too. Also after owning an S4 I liked having 4 doors and folding rear seats for utility.
-Drove the E55 Benz and that is some fast car, but its handling was not as sharp as a V and shifting with the little buttons on the back of the wheel was not easy or smooth.
Also drove the CL55. All the comments from the E55 apply to it and it also had the disadvantage to me of being a coupe whose rear seats were not easily reachable.
-The WRX Sti was a raw performance beast and I truly loved it but I knew my wife would cringe every time she walked up to it, because it didn't have sufficient snob appeal. I also was put off by the blue only seats and carpet as well as the generally cheap feel of the cabin.
The Jag just never occurred to me because its performance was not in the same league as the cars mentioned above and even though I think Jags are cool, they are driven mostly by older guy's.
I've ridden in the Volvo and its not that impressive.

Incidentally. I drove the V last, after driving all of the other cars mentioned above. I wasn't even 1/2 block out of the dealership lot and I KNEW it was the car for me. Its overall performance was simply better than the rest of them. The way it accelerated and sounded while doing so was superior. It was the most exciting car to drive. It feels alive, like it wants to go hunting for other cars to slay -and it does.
After driving it for 33,000 miles, I am not sorry that I bought this car. Every time I get in it, I smile and have a good time. The Audi was a VERY tough act to follow but I love my CTSV and would buy it again given the chance to do it over.

Luna.
12-09-05, 10:24 PM
Also, I still don't believe the S54 would be less reliable than the LS6 or LS2, by a long shot. Smaller vs. larger has very little bearing on reliability. Look at all the ultra reliable cars from honda and toyota that are tiny little 4bangers. The M3 S54's are incredibly well built as well.

:lildevil:


Drove the M3 but it didn't have the torque I wanted. It had to be revved like crazy to go fast -not a bad thing but too tiring for a daily driver. Also its engine has a reputation for blowing!


(In defense of the tiny little 4 bangers found in Hondas and Toyotas--those aren't stressed to the max like the M3 motor is. But I agree, that the M3 powerplant is one hell of a motor regardless :) )

DrivingAmericanNow
12-09-05, 10:49 PM
Popular post. :highfive: My choices were right in line with most of yours:

S-Type R better interior, a few ticks slower and didn't handle as well
X-Type R if only they hadn't cancelled this project, I just might have........
XJR near perfect interior but I didn't want to buy used, plus it's a tad too slow
C32 a little too small, and I wanted a manual shift
Audi S4 better interior, all wheel drive, too slow
BMW-M5 didn't want to buy used
Acura-TL awesome interior, way too slow
Chrysler SRT8 assenine mark-ups, and I wanted a manual

so........... I bought the V, no regrets.

If I could, I would have sublet the interior design to the guys at Jag and the cradle design and differntial to the Torsen guys at Audi. :alchi:

10secvette
12-10-05, 11:07 AM
I seriously investigated a Dodge Charger RT, Infinity G35 and BMW 3 Series. The BMW was to high $$ for the car/preformance/ability to transport 4 in comfort. The G35 is an excellent car, high reliability, high resale, fastest in its class, just did not light my fire. The Charger is an interesting car, good reviews, good value, but not the bling and excitement of the V. If the Charger had a 6 speed probably would have gone with it for the price, $30,500 for a loaded RT 350 horse Road and Track model.


same here........... the V won.

livingthedream
12-10-05, 12:59 PM
You run a business it sounds like, so run the numbers. Dollars per horsepower. Nothing beats the V, Nothing. A true new-millenium hot rod, American horses under the hood. A smile each and every time you turn the key. Even improves your health, hit triple digits three times a day and call the doctor next year!

livingthedream.

Harley Guy
12-10-05, 01:39 PM
Wasn't shopping for a car. Saw the V...drove the V...bought the V. Love at first sight.:cloud9:

racemarine
12-12-05, 12:05 AM
Hereís my story: spent the past 7 years in a 95 then a 99 540 Sport (6 spd.) and suddenly (right around my 60th B-day) had the urge to go faster, lots faster. I drove just about everything but found nothing that suited me, too many automatics and FWD cars. Hadnít even considered a US car. Looked at several late model M5s but the prices for a low miles 02-03 were in the 50K range. Too much for a used car in my estimation. While looking for a new SUV for the wife, we shopped at the local Caddy store and there was the CTS-V. I fell in love but wasnít allowed to take a test drive before dropping down some green for a deposit. Not my style so I passed. I did find that because of my height (6-3) I didnít fit under the sun roof. I shopped the internet and finally found a solid roof 05 in Wisconsin (1,200 miles from home). I bought the car over the phone, flew to WI and took my first ride in a CTS-V after I had bought it. On the 2 day drive home, I learned to dislike the car. It just didnít have the refinement of the Beemer. I lingered over my buyerís remorse for several weeks and finally decided to Ebay the Caddy. I went out to take the photos and, since the car was pretty dirty, washed it up real pretty. But then I noticed that the brake disks were rusted from sitting around and took it for one last drive to clean them up. Thatís what did it! The horsepower and the nearby on ramp finally made me realize what I bargain car I was driving. That was last May. Three weeks ago some drunk took out my right front. The car has been in the body shop since then and I miss it terribly. One thing, though, if anyone has an answer: I looked at the 06 version on-line and noticed that the sunroof appears to be standard equipment now. If so, my 05 will be my last CTS due to my altitude problem. Any other stretched out guys like myself have that problem?

CTS-V Racing
12-12-05, 09:35 AM
You can order a V with the sunroof delete option which saves you about $1K off the MSRP. Looks like you will be in V's for a while longer.

Kadonny
12-12-05, 10:02 AM
I never really considered the 545i as I'm not looking for a cruiser luxury car, and the 5 series are really heavy cars and not nearly as quick/fast as I would want.



Well the 06's are now 550s and this is what I am cross shopping against the V. The 550 is very quick and is being clocked at 5.2 0-60, not all that far off the V.

The 5 series is an amazing car with tons and tons of great gadget options, plus it has one huge option (at least for me). THE SMG! That is freaking amazing. That being said, I have driven a manual car all my life and would never get a true automatic, but there are plenty of times I just get tired of clutching either on my way home or while in traffic. The SMG is the best of both worlds, but still I wonder if one or two years down the road, will I tire of the SMG. The manual car is a know commodity, the SMG is the new kid on the block.

So what do I do? I still don't know. I will tell you the lack of 06 V cars on dealer lots is very frustrating. I have still yet to drive a V, but know how amazing they are based on reading this forum the past year, but I need to drive one before I buy one. I have 4 months left on my Audi lease, so time is running out. I need to wrap this up and get a car ordered.

So I am still torn. The 550 drives incredible and the active steering option is amazing. So many great options on the Bmw, but again I am a muscle car loving kind of guy (I own 2 Firebirds) and would probably love the V. I see a Stealth Gray in my area all the time and love the color. If I do V, that is my color for sure.

I need help in deciding and GM is not helping. They need to get these cars to the dealers.

daytripper
12-12-05, 01:17 PM
For me, I was coming out of a 540i Sport, and needed something that could haul 2 kids and haul a**, so I started out looking for a used E39 M5. Trying to find a good example at a price cheaper than a new V, with less than 50k miles on it was a waste of a year of my life...
Also cross shopped the S4 and the M3, and even the G35. Almost bought the M3, but 2 door and smaller back seat steered me away from all of these right back to the V.

I tried finding used E55s, but the latest gen cars hadn't exactly depreciated down into my price territory at that point.

By then, the SRT-8s were out, but couldn't be touched without wicked dealer premiums. That made the V a no brainer decision taking into account Cadillac's 'discount pricing' plans on the V. Even with high depreciation rates, the V should still be cheaper in the long run (say 2-3 years), even if the SRTs do hold their value better.

If Cadillac could get off its duff and make some minor improvements and correct some of the obvious flaws (mechanical weak links and interior jump out at me), I think a whole lot of others who cross shop the V to German makes would stick around and buy it.

Brian R.

MCaesar
12-12-05, 02:34 PM
I think that people vastly overrate the importance of discounts and premiums on prices. The critical factor is what are you getting for that price. Some people would rather get a discount on a mediocre car than pay a premium for the best.

not me

Give me the best and I will pay for it.

crispyrx7
12-13-05, 04:00 PM
My demographic: I'm a 37 year old, white collar, mortgate paying, 3 children, family guy. Oh and I hold an SCCA race license and already have a 400rwhp RX7 which might tell you want kind of transport I tend towards.
My self imposed requirements/constraints were:
1) I have a family of FIVE. The vehicle will not be used to
transport the 5 on a regular basis but had to if it needed. So think 4
doors or at least one that has a usable rear seat. The car will be my daily driver.
2) Should be able to tow a jetski w/trailer.
3) I want a car not a minivan, truck, or another SUV (I have an
SUV tow vehicle already)
4) Consider insurance implications - a primary reason I tend to
steer clear of BMWs
5) Price should be south of $40k. *Anything* south of $40k is
fine if it satisfies the other criteria. I'm not as affluent enough to drop $92k on an Audi as some of you ringers may be.
6) It could be new **OR** used but if used it had to be something at or around 30k miles or less and newer than 3 years old
7) I'm getting to be an old fart so crave more creature comforts for my daily driver. So heated front seats, and a decent stereo among other things
please.
8) Fuel economy should be respectable but not a deal breaker if it sucks and if the car is right
And finally:
9) I wanted a decent performer. Although it will be my daily commuter I'm not going to settle for generic Honda Accord or Toyota Camry/Avalon. No matter
how good they may actually be...they are still "boring."

What cars I considered and that were suggest by my friends -
In the used car section:
'04 Cadillac CTS-V
02' BMW M5 - ebay lists a few in the high $30k's albeit with higher
mileage (60k) than I'd like and being an '02 it'd be getting kinda old, not dated
just mechanically old. Insurance rate is still a question in my mind.
'03 BMW 540i Sport (wagon) seemed to be an option also and was considerably cheaper. These seem to be in the high $28k to low $30k range
'03/'04 Lexus GS 430 (not the 300)
'03/'04 Audi A6 4.2 Quattro. On paper a fantastic car...the reliability issues still a concern though.
'04/'05 Volvo V70 R AWD Wagon. Nice sleeper but perhaps a bit stodgy

In the new car section:
'06 Subaru Legacy. A true sleeper. Don't knock it. It is a rocket.
'06 Dodge Magnum SRT8. Kinda at the top of my list. (not so much the 300C - besides my father in law already has one)

Cars suggested but which I would not consider.
Lexus IS300 - too small
Audi A4 - again I think too small and I'm still struggling with the reliability question, warranty or not I don't want to have to visit the dealer
Mercedes - any. Simply said, not my style.
Jaguar - See Mercedes.
Mazda 6 - a little bit pedestrian for my target car.
Mazda RX8 - I'm VERY surprised NO-ONE mentioned this car! Still too small for my needs though.
STI and EVO - too small and "ricey." And I bet the insurance would be killer.
Infiniti G35 - Friend already had one ;-) The coupe I could go for but alas only 2 doors :-(
A bicycle - I know I need to get in shape but I'd rather not induce a stroke in the process!
Acura RL - Front wheel drive... bleh. The New TL is indeed VERY snazzy and I did reconsider it but looking at the above list and all are either V8, turbocharged, and rear wheel drive or AWD. The RL has none of these.
See a trend?

I narrowed my choices down to:
CTS-V
Magnum SRT-8
Lexus GS430
and possibly the Volvo V70R

I ended up buying a *used* '05 CTS-V with 1093 miles on the clock for $40k.

The Magnum SRT8 mark-up was just plain STUPID and no one on the East coast had one I could *BUY*, the Lexus (the wife wanted) was nice but "only" 300hp and slush box only, and the Volvo in the trim (used) that I wanted I simply couldn't find.

Darn, guess I'll have to buy the Caddy :D
My 2cents,
Crispy
PS anyone know if a V can tow a jetski? :D

Jon
12-13-05, 04:03 PM
I didn't look at anything else. I wanted the V.

trukk
12-15-05, 04:41 PM
already have a 400rwhp RX7 which might tell you want kind of transport I tend towards.

Welcome to the family. I saw the video of you running around VIR in your RX7. I'd love to hear your impressions of the V at VIR.

Enjoy,

Chris

lawfive
12-15-05, 04:56 PM
I drove the C32, the E55, the previous models of M3 and M5 (both used), the 300C. The M5 and 300C were the finalists: very different cars; very different prices.

Then I noticed the V.

If the SRT-8's were available when I was shopping... :hmm:

The V is the most expensive car I've owned. It broke a barrier of sorts for me. If I went shopping today, the new M5 and CLS55 would be high on the list. And if I wait until my boy is off to college and it's just me & the wife to toodle around then the Z06 will be right up there, too.

Luna.
12-15-05, 05:05 PM
And if I wait until my boy is off to college and it's just me & the wife to toodle around then the Z06 will be right up there, too.

Naaaa....

You'd have Andy build you a ~550hp Vette animal. :p

Loadtoad
12-15-05, 07:32 PM
Since I will only buy American products from American companies, there was no shopping required.:werd:

crispyrx7
12-19-05, 10:01 AM
Welcome to the family. I saw the video of you running around VIR in your RX7. I'd love to hear your impressions of the V at VIR.

Enjoy,
Chris

Say one of my videos, really? Wow. Which one if I might ask? And to think those were the days before the mods that have borught me up to the 400rwhp mark ;)

I've actually instructed a guy in V at VIR. No doubt it's quick. A little issue with the drive by wire throttle and modulation at light throttle midcorner, as in throttle was either off or on. Other than that for a big sedan it hustled along pretty smartly!
Regards,
Crispy
SP apologies for the bandwidth

wooderson
12-19-05, 10:24 PM
Shopped the '06 Vette only. They were not giving any incentives on the Vette so Caddy wins out.

DrivingAmericanNow
12-19-05, 10:35 PM
Since I will only buy American products from American companies, there was no shopping required.:werd:

I like that attitude :highfive: . That's one huge reason I couldn't plunk down cash for another Audi. When people would accuse me of driving "image-cars" or "german snob mobiles", I'd always say if a US car company made a high-end sedan with a manual shift and tremendous performance, that I'd buy it. When Caddy did it, I felt obligated.

Are you really in Italy? The V must cost a mint over there. If you really are there, can you write in about what kind of experiences you've had driving the V over there? Do people stare? Do they like it, do they hate it? Do they try to race it? (maybe that would make a good "new thread")