: There are some success stories, and then there are some...



Ishminder
12-08-05, 04:14 AM
I have been doing my fair share of posting on this forum and it has it been great hearing everyones response and ideas on various issues. Recently, there has been discussion on Southern California Dealerships. I agree with everyone that claims that Southern California dealerships do not know how to work on a V and personally I do not think I will ever buy a car from GM again. Read on why if you are curious...

On Tuesday Morning, I go to Penske Cadillac and meet Reed for the first time, who is in there to get his car fixed that doesnt go from nuetral to first and is jerking a lot. I drive 1+hours each way in traffic and another 2 hours at the dealership. In any case, this is my third trip to Penske Cadillac in Torrance and this time I was in there for the whine in the rear of the car(which started after I left the dealership last time with my new wheel hop bushings and new rear cradle bushings) and difficulty putting my car in 1,2,3,4th gears(has gotten worse in the past few months). After talking to Reed and the service manager for a bit, we decide to get a technician out on a test drive with me. So all 4 of us get into the car and go for a little ride so I can pinpoint them my problems. I immediately take the car upto 47mph because I wanted to point out the whining noise...and behold there was a whine. The service manager, the service technician, Reed, and I all heard it and the tech stated that the car will need a new differential put in. I am glad one problem is handled. Next, I show the tech the difficulty I have in going into gear. He notices the problem and claims that there is definitely something wrong with the tranny. We get back to the dealership and the service manager claims that he will take care of everything and he knows that there is a problem with both those things and he will take care of them for me.:cool:

The same day the GM REP comes to the dealership to take a look at the tranny and the noise. I call the dealership at 4:30 and talk to my service advisor who stated they have ordered a new differential but are looking at the tranny and will know later. I also get told I will have to spend 1400 on brakes(pads, rotors, and fluid) that were 45% left when I came in 1500 miles ago for an oil change. Anyways, I tell him I'll let him know in a little bit if I want to go ahead with it(I thought they were honest so they may be right.)

This is where the trouble begins. Half an hour later, the service manager calls me and states that they will not be replacing my differential because there is no whine heard anymore! (I guess what we all heard in the morning was made up sounds in our head). I called Cadillac, and they had a different story...saying the GM rep heard a whine, but the rep had a 2004CTS-V when it came out and since his made the same whine in the rear, it is considered to be "normal" characteristic of the car. At this point, I call Reed who is also confused on why they are calling this normal when I even left them a reciept where someone got their differential replaced for a rear whine (and mine is loud)! They cancelled the whole order and told me I could basically come and pick up my car if I wanted now.

As for the transmission, they claimed my tranny fluid was low and they filled it up. I found this real funny. The day before I went to them, I also went to AAMCO thinking they would deny the case. I got it inspected and on the paperwork it states..."Transmission fluid NORMAL. Fluid is contaminated with metal. Possible synchro damage and may need replacement. Customer denies repair." But I guess Cadillac is always correct and the whole reason i could not shift into gears was because of my transmission fluid, which they forgot to check 200 miles ago when I brought it into them for the same reason!

Currently my car is in the shop and I have been promised to see the GM Rep on Friday. I called again today to confirm, but got no response from anyone as to when the rep will be coming and when I can talk to him, rather the manager stated I should pick up my car tomorrow and come back Friday when the appointment is finalized. By the way, Reed has been promised to see the rep Friday.

I understand when you say you love your car, and honestly, I think the V was a smart move! I love the design of the car and its capabilities, but the flaws just make me sick...dealers being the biggest flaw.

Now some may state I should take it into another dealership. I would like to point out I took it to Renick first for difficulty shifting from nuetral to first. They ended up doing a reverse lockout tsb on the car. The problem still not being fixed, rather getting worse, I took it to Tustin Cadillac...which claimed I needed a new clutch and a new transmission (all when i pulled into the lot before even being written up!). Oh they also said I have to pay for both the things. I left the place cursing. I then took the car to Coast Cadillac as GM suggested. There I thought I had hope since GM was now involved. Basically, Coast denied everything and said the GM rep came out, drove it, and everything was normal. The next day GM calls me and stated, "sorry the rep could not make it yesterday, he will try to come by today." Hmmm...I request GM to have the area rep come to Penske and they say OK after hearing that last comment. Above was Penske. So I have tried numerous places which all claim there is a problem with the transmission, but don't know what to do or something.

Some might say to sell the car, which I also tried. Last week I had a buyer come to test drive the vehicle, and after hearing that whine, which was louder than ever that day, and seeing how difficult it shifted, he never called me again or even offered to buy my car for super cheap.

Oh, some might say try to tell GM to buy it back or consider it a lemon. Tried that, but since the area rep claimed everything to be normal, it will not bought back and repairs will not be tried.

I have tried the dealers, I have tried the managers, and I have tried GM. I have no mods to my car, not even the cags skip shift eliminator...nothing! I am stuck with a car that I paid 50000 for with my hard earned money thinking it would be a car that I could enjoy and rely on for years to come. Instead, I am being denied repair on things that people have had fixed numerous times already! I use this car for daily use including business, and its funny how what they call normal or unhearable, my friends, family, and clients call..."Its the airplane taking off again". I stand at lights not being able to shift properly and have cars honking at me many times. I almost got in a wreck one time when the car wouldnt go into first even after reving the engine, going from 3,2,1 and trying the clutch trick by letting it out once and trying it again. After 30 seconds of trying and almost getting hit by a driver who thought I was going to take off immediately while he came 40 behind me, I decided to just take off in 2nd! Yet, this is all "normal" characteristics of the car!

I am really friekin frustrated, and I think Reed is getting there as well. The dealerships and the reps in Southern California need training with a better knowledge on customer satisfaction. Some of you may have had excellent customer treatment, and I know Lindsay Cadillac has some good comments, but here in Southern California..this is my story...my 50K car that became a nightmare.

Wow that was long!

naiculnila
12-08-05, 07:41 AM
California isn't the only place my friend! East coast dealers aren't much better.

Seems they diagnose the problem and deny whatever needs to be done before you even go in and present the problem!

If the problems persist with your shifting...just pull over call roadside and have them tow it to the dealer. I read this from another thred which seems like an awesome idea. Everytime it gives you a problem where drivability is an issue get it towed in AT the cost of the dealer....soon enough they will either get mad or just fix the damn thing!

I'm not one for giving up! i don't have how stupid they are!

MacOSR
12-08-05, 08:19 AM
How short-sighted can a company be?

I have purchased $205,000 worth of vehicles the past 10 months and not a penny was spent at GM. I will never spend another hard earned $ on a GM vehicle. I have had enought of... we can't duplicate, that is normal, etc.

I believe this is the PRIMARY reason GM's sales are declining so rapidly. Anyone in business knows that you need to take care of the customer...the customer isn't always right but you should always want to do what is right for the customer.

urbanski
12-08-05, 08:34 AM
brakes/rotors are warranty covered....Lindsay has the info. they are RIPPING you off.

Staxxin
12-08-05, 09:15 AM
brakes/rotors are warranty covered....Lindsay has the info. they are RIPPING you off.

brakes/rotors are warranty?

urbanski
12-08-05, 09:32 AM
i can't recall the e-mail
but i think GM suggested covering them for first 12mo/12K miles or something. Seriously, PM James. He got my $100 back :)

Barak
12-08-05, 11:49 AM
Ishminder,

Your situation is far worse than mine was. I can't imagine the frustration you're going through. Anything I can do to help, just let me know. We have to raise some serious hell.

Ishminder
12-08-05, 05:11 PM
After spending 5 hours at Penske Cadillac I finally figured out some solutions to many of our problems in Southern Cali. I hate to say this too, but the fault is not in the dealer, rather it is someone else. I went into Penske and they showed me how they had a new diff. ordered waiting to be put in...problem was with the GM rep...Larry Something. He works at Massey, Tustin, Renick, Coast, Penske, among many others. We all hate these dealerships and now I know why. See, dealerships want to do repairs and put in new parts...they simply get re-imbursed. It is the GM rep that is confused about our car. He drove the V for 3 month, after getting this info from a reliable source and had a whine in his rear car as well. His transmission was also very sloppy and he had difficulty shifting. He thinks CTS-V is made that way. The service tech at Penske is one great guy...he went way out of his way to do whatever possible to try to solve my problems. I was denied a diff. so he did a fluid exchange, changed bushings, tightened everything, etc...spent 3 hrs while I waited. Do i still have a whine...yes...but I will go back to Penske! I want to find this GM rep though and have a heart to heart with him! Tomorrow...hopefully he will be there tomorrow and we can chat! Try to come whoever can!

Barak
12-08-05, 05:21 PM
What time is the meeting?

Rey
12-08-05, 05:44 PM
I will chime in here. It certainly appears that your roadblock is the GM factory rep who has disapproved the warranty claim.
I am assuming that GM representatives will read this post also.
It is vitally important that you document every step you take to resolve this dispute. Documentation can take the form of writings of course, but they also can take the form of oral recordings and eye witnesses.
You should have a firm time certain appointment with the GM factory rep. Don't accept a statement that he cannot determine with certainty when he will show up. He won't show up then.
Make sure the Penske service representative sits in on your conversation. It would be good to have a friend also be their as a witness. You can record the conversation so long as you advise everyone of your intent. If a person refuses a recorded conversation ask why:and what would they say differently were the conversation not recorded. If they still decline, note that in your documentation and continue.
Ask the GM representative if the warranty denial is made on the basis of his personal business opinion or is it based upon a directive from higher levels. If he says it is his personal opinion, query him as to the basis of his opinion. Ask him to please reconsider based upon the facts you are presenting at this meeting.
If he says that the policy has been handed down to him, ask who so directed him. Ask if the policy was in writing, and then ask for a copy of the writing. If he says the writing is confidential, then ask him for the date of the writing.
If the meeting concludes unfavorably to you, so state this and ask to speak to his supervisor. Work your way up GM's chain of command documenting every step of the way. Always err on the side of too much documentation. Provide copies of your documents to GM, but never let go of your originals.

1fstkde
12-08-05, 08:09 PM
I will chime in here. It certainly appears that your roadblock is the GM factory rep who has disapproved the warranty claim.
I am assuming that GM representatives will read this post also.
It is vitally important that you document every step you take to resolve this dispute. Documentation can take the form of writings of course, but they also can take the form of oral recordings and eye witnesses.
You should have a firm time certain appointment with the GM factory rep. Don't accept a statement that he cannot determine with certainty when he will show up. He won't show up then.
Make sure the Penske service representative sits in on your conversation. It would be good to have a friend also be their as a witness. You can record the conversation so long as you advise everyone of your intent. If a person refuses a recorded conversation ask why:and what would they say differently were the conversation not recorded. If they still decline, note that in your documentation and continue.
Ask the GM representative if the warranty denial is made on the basis of his personal business opinion or is it based upon a directive from higher levels. If he says it is his personal opinion, query him as to the basis of his opinion. Ask him to please reconsider based upon the facts you are presenting at this meeting.
If he says that the policy has been handed down to him, ask who so directed him. Ask if the policy was in writing, and then ask for a copy of the writing. If he says the writing is confidential, then ask him for the date of the writing.
If the meeting concludes unfavorably to you, so state this and ask to speak to his supervisor. Work your way up GM's chain of command documenting every step of the way. Always err on the side of too much documentation. Provide copies of your documents to GM, but never let go of your originals. I AGREE!!!! DEALERS NEED THE BUSINESS, HAS TO BE THE REGIONAL REP FROM GM!!!:tisk: