: Head And Cam Question



TXSilverV
08-05-05, 08:12 PM
Taking the V next week to get a head and Cam package done. I have been told the RWHP will increase 80-120 HP depending on which set up to go with. Here is my problem, I know nothing about engines. I drive the car every day but I do drive it hard. Does anybody have any ideas on the setup i should do? These guys have done a lot of my friends Z06's and have done a great job. I go in tommorow to do the before dyno and will post if anybody is interested.

urbanski
08-05-05, 08:22 PM
where are you taking it to?

TXSilverV
08-05-05, 08:26 PM
A place called RPM. www.real-performace-motorsports.com I tried to do a link but I forgot how.

Luna.
08-05-05, 08:35 PM
Not at all a question about your decision, I'm just curious is all...


Why did you decide on going the heads/cam route rather then the supercharger route?

Like I said, I'm definitely not saying it's wrong, I'm just curious what the thought process was. :)

TXSilverV
08-05-05, 08:38 PM
They gave me a price of 3,495 out the door versus 5,995 for the supercharger. Can't I still add the supercharger later? I want to get 600 RWHP if the rear end can take it.

Luna.
08-05-05, 08:53 PM
They gave me a price of 3,495 out the door versus 5,995 for the supercharger. Can't I still add the supercharger later? I want to get 600 RWHP if the rear end can take it.

Thanks for the reply. Aye, I can see why you went that route now!! :D

urbanski
08-05-05, 09:00 PM
well here's what MTI in Houston do for our car.
http://www.motorsporttech.com/cts-v_engine01.asp
The gentleman there I've talked to recommends the Stealth II cam.
I was thinking of the G1. Stealth II is pretty mild and you won't lose your daily driver manners, but i think it's too tame.
You could also ask the gang at LGM
http://www.lgmotorsports.com/
who really are kicking ass on C6 applications. They run about 2 grand more than MTI.
You really should read up on cams, what the numbers mean, and where the line is between manners and lumpy sh!tty running thing you hate.

Then....they using AFR heads? How about the price, does it include headers? Exhaust? You'll need a tune, too. It really never ends :D

TXSilverV
08-05-05, 09:07 PM
Does not include headers or exhaust. I would only need the headers though as I already have a custom exhaust. I''m going to send the PCM to Stealth once they do the work.

urbanski
08-05-05, 09:10 PM
Dallas eh?
The gang at LGM talked all about the quality of the products they use, like pushrods and springs. They almost implied that "others" use crap. Maybe call them, compare the specifics of RPMs job to theirs. Lou at LG races and they're respected over at CorvetteForum. For my money, I'd trust them with my car. (but they are pricier than or equal to a maggie)

Parker
08-05-05, 10:17 PM
Why would you send the PCM off when you can get It tuned locally?

thebigjimsho
08-05-05, 10:48 PM
Good choice on the head and cam package. Hopefully I'll be following you in a few months. I'll be looking to track the V a lot and wanted a N/A power boost instead. Although, I'm expecting more like 45-65hp with the combo and about 500 crank hp when all is said and done.

Parker
08-06-05, 02:26 AM
Hey Davin,
I finally got my H/C done. You should come check it out sometime next week.
-Parker

HDMLNIUM
08-06-05, 02:39 AM
TXSilverV,
Sounds like she is going to fly... Good luck with it and I would love to see the before and after dyno runs...:yup:

Bill

TXSilverV
08-06-05, 10:21 AM
Parker What is your number? send it to davin_bouchillon@yahoo.com or try PM but not sure if that will work. Who does the PCM around here? I have heard so many good things about Stealth that was why I was sending it out. I go this morning for the Dyno in Lewisville if you want to stop by.

StealthV
08-06-05, 11:06 AM
Since you've cracked the engine open, it now has unique performance properties compared to what left the factory. The unique engine dynamics requires a unique tune. The Stealth tunes offered today cover stock head/cam engines and the popular bolt-on modifications such as CAI, exhausts, headers and Maggies; head/cam packages haven't been done yet as I simply haven't had access to a V with those mods.

My recommendation, find a good shop locally and have it WOT and part-throttle tuned. If you want the little drivability things in a Stealth tune, send me your PCM after your first go 'round of tuning and I'll polish it up for a reasonable fee. Or bring your car to me and I'll dial it in from scratch to performance & drivability perfection. :cheers:

Parker
08-06-05, 12:32 PM
Hey, I emailed you my number. Make sure you give me a call. By the way Rick, it seems like your the MAN! Keep doing the badass work everyone praises.:worship:

Texan V
08-06-05, 06:00 PM
Parker :

What are the specs on your cam and did you go with ported and polished stock heads or aftermarket heads like AFR, Patriot, etc?

I'm planning to go with a set of "as cast" AFR 205's, and let MTI port, polish, assemble and install them. For the cam, I'm thinking of going with a Thunder Racing TR224 but on a 114 LSA so it's not so lopey. I'm hoping to gain somewhere around 60 hp with that setup.

Parker
08-06-05, 08:42 PM
I chose the run of the mill AFR 205s, with a 224 cam on a 115. The cam isnt to lopey at all and doesnt affect drivability whatsoever. Ill let everyone know what I gained as of next week.

willsctsv
08-06-05, 08:57 PM
Parker, I have read good things about those AFR heads from the LS1 Tech forum. I will guess with the heads and cam you will see easy 75 HP.
Does anyone know the duration and lift on the stock cam? The stock cam is not too shabby. I think the heads will make more of a difference. I am thinking of the same mods, but like you I don't want to sound like a 10 second camaro at a light. Shaking my coffee out of my hand as I'm idling. I would like that power though!!!

urbanski
08-06-05, 09:06 PM
i've heard the opposite, that the LS6 heads are great, but a cam swap can get you alot of HP
LOL

StealthV
08-06-05, 09:17 PM
Does anyone know the duration and lift on the stock cam?

LS6 Camshaft Specifications

Part Number: 12565308
Manufacturer: GM Performance Parts
Advertised Duration Int.: 270
Advertised Duration Exh.: 282
Duration @ 0.050" (I/E): 204/218
Lift (I/E): 0.551"/0.541"
Lobe Separation: 117.5
RPM Range: 2000 - 6200
Cam Type: Hydraulic Roller

willsctsv
08-06-05, 09:42 PM
Great stuff Rick, You are the CTS V GURU!
What an expedious answer.
I would rather a cam with a curve from 3000 -7000RPM, any suggestions?

StealthV
08-06-05, 09:49 PM
It isn't hard to copy and paste - I was just looking for a cam myself the other night and had the specs in a spreadsheet for comparison. ;)

StealthV
08-06-05, 09:54 PM
http://www.sdpc2000.com/catalog/3876/SDPC-LS1-Custom-Camshafts.htm

http://www.sdpc2000.com/catalog/2115/Comp-Cams-LS1-Camshafts.htm

http://www.sdpc2000.com/catalog/1791/Lunati-LS1-Camshafts.htm

http://www.sdpc2000.com/catalog/1981/GM-Performance-Parts-LS1-LS6-Camshafts.htm

http://www.katechengines.com/street_performance/engine_parts_detail.php?id=3

http://www.lingenfelter.com/store/c32.html

http://www.lingenfelter.com/store/c31.html

drmustang
08-06-05, 10:53 PM
The LS6 heads are considered to be pretty good as is. Would a cam only change give you much more HP?

StealthV
08-06-05, 11:18 PM
The Katech Stage 1 has a nice stump pulling bump in torque; hp isn't bad but not quite the increase I'm looking for up top.

Here's Flyboy's dyno with that cam
http://www.katechengines.com/street_performance/images/links/CTS-V%20Testing-KAT-4074%20Cam.pdf

Personally, I'm a big lope fan and am thinking about K's Stage 2 along with a few other little bolt on tweaks. ;)

drmustang
08-07-05, 08:55 AM
The Katech Stage 1 has a nice stump pulling bump in torque; hp isn't bad but not quite the increase I'm looking for up top.

Here's Flyboy's dyno with that cam
http://www.katechengines.com/street_performance/images/links/CTS-V%20Testing-KAT-4074%20Cam.pdf

Personally, I'm a big lope fan and am thinking about K's Stage 2 along with a few other little bolt on tweaks. ;)I looked on Katech's web site and couldn't find any specs. etc. on that stage II cam. Do you have anything on them. A good cam, the appropriate bolt ons and a well tuned PCM(You could tune for this?) sounds like a great plan for me. Would their stage II compare to the Comp 224 114LSA that many guys are using in the Corvettes? Thanks.

StealthV
08-07-05, 11:58 AM
Since I don't have a Katech cam in the calibration portfolio yet, a tune done today would be better than running the stock tune but not optimized to the nth degree. For a new mod, I need a car to calibrate with for a least a day or two and several hundred miles of development.

To date, new calibration work was done on customer XYZ's car with its new mod or the mods were replicated mods on my V. To date, the standard bolt-ons are covered. If there were a bunch of people all getting the same cam and wanted a tune for it; I'd invest in that cam for calibration R&D.

TXSilverV
08-07-05, 12:08 PM
Update! I had the Dyno done yesterday and I had a few problems. The car was only at 302 RWHP but it was running very bad. They went ahead and tuned the car while they had it since I get the head and Cam next week. After they did the tune we got 323 RWHP. The car was hot since it was only 102 outside, the car was at 223 degres. I was told there dyno is always about 15 less than other places because they put the car up in the air and some other reasons as well. I have to take it back on Monday because at WOT it makes that sound like it has cheap gas. Now the good thing! They had a ZO6 at the shop and it has headers, Borla exhaust, head and cam package, Induction, thermostat. It was making 467 RWHP! They let me drive the car and man what a beast it was. It also has a 150HP shot on it but I did not spray while I drove it. Heck I don't think I could have kept the car stable if I did. I will be doing the same set up as him, but not the borla. The shop was having a hard time finding headers! what kind should I get? I told them to copy the ZO6 even the NOS! Does everyone think I should be close in the numbers of the ZO6? Is 323 with no mods ok?

TXSilverV
08-07-05, 12:56 PM
I also have the specs for the cam. .238/.244 .586/.612 114+4 LSA. They also said they do the heads angeled vs. straight. So what do you think will I get the 110RWHP as avertised?

Parker
08-07-05, 06:13 PM
Thats a big ass cam! Is that with 1.6 rockers? I see 440rwhp possible with this setup.

TXSilverV
08-07-05, 08:12 PM
yes it's 1.6 rockers! Parker I'll call you one day this week so we can meet up soon.

Katech
08-14-05, 09:47 PM
For the specs on the stage 1 Torquer cam, take the LS6, tighten the centers to 112 and advance the intake lobe position about, ohhhhh, 12 degrees!!!! :D

lawfive
08-15-05, 03:42 AM
Eek!

"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."
"I shan't crack the engine open."

Shit, it's not working...

CaddyGeek
08-16-05, 08:21 PM
I told them to copy the ZO6 even the NOS!

You guys are great. I love this forum... speed junkies