: 2000 DTS - no power



kboroweic
03-12-14, 04:31 PM
when stepping on gas pedal, rpm's struggle to go up. when i put it in gear it barely rolls forward or backward. an thinking it is in the map sensor but not sure. just for grins, as it was running, i unhooked the MAP sensor and the car died.not sure what that means,,, any help would be apprieated

Harry Yarnell
03-12-14, 05:22 PM
Plugged cat; just a thought.

kboroweic
03-12-14, 06:13 PM
would not think so, it was replaced along with some exhaust pipe sections about 6 months ago.

Submariner409
03-12-14, 07:19 PM
Pull your DTCs using the sticky post ^^^ "How to pull codes", using the proper model and year group procedures. Return to the sticky to open the link to OBD-II definitions, decipher all found codes and post it all here, including whether each found code is Current or History.

It's probably not the MAP - and if you unplugged the sensor you removed the inverse manifold vacuum signal - the engine stalled from improper airflow/vacuum input.

kboroweic
03-12-14, 07:33 PM
OK , I did what you said, then IM STUPID I accidentally cleared all the codes. Im not sure how long it will take for them to show back up. I was in the process of writing them down when i cleared them. I was doing 2 things at once ( talking to the wife on the cell phone, when i got button happy)
Im hoping the codes return pretty quick
i had 1 written down p0300 history

99Classillac
03-13-14, 06:17 AM
I think you may have a vacuum leak. That will throw a misfire code(P0300). Plus you said no power, etc... Check the Plenum. That's between the throttle body and the intake manifold. They usually rip. It allows unmetered air into the fuel/air mix. That makes the motor act all types of not right. If the plenum checks out ok, then there is a hose at the end of the intake manifold that dry rots too. I had to replace mine. I just bought some cheap fuel line from Autozone and cut it to length to replace the old dry rotted hose. Either way, your intake manifold is coming off in both repairs. Good luck. Post more codes!

Harry Yarnell
03-13-14, 09:34 AM
What's the difference between the plenum and the intake manifold?

99Classillac
03-13-14, 03:49 PM
The plenum is the connection between the throttle body and the intake manifold. It's a super short rubber "tube" thing. Look at the throttle body and how it goes into the intake manifold. You'll see the short rubber piece between them. That's the plenum.

Submariner409
03-13-14, 05:01 PM
Yep - here's both together ................ (2000 and later Northstars) ............More pictures and diagrams in my 2 albums - the Community tab, Albums, the red Seville Touring Sedan

kboroweic
03-13-14, 11:46 PM
thanx, i will be working on it this weekend, I will let u know whet i found. THANX for the advice AND the pix

kboroweic
03-18-14, 12:51 PM
just a heads up guys, I went to auto zone to get the plenum and gaskets and such, but they have to order them. I will be a few days before I can get to it. just thought i would keep you in the loop

MoistCabbage
03-18-14, 01:30 PM
None of them were Duralast parts, were they?

eldoradogary
03-18-14, 02:36 PM
Check your fuel pressure and fpr.

kboroweic
03-18-14, 06:22 PM
No, the Plenum is a Dorman and i have to check on who made the gaskets.

Oh guess what ?? I just got the manifold off and removed the Plenum... NO TEAR IN THE PLENUM. it is solid all the way around..

The parts will be here on Fri . I will replace them anyway. Plenum, the 8 SQUARE intake gaskets and the TB gasket.
Now comes my main question, what if this don't help ??
I do not have a Fuel pressure guage and what is FPR ??

----------

just found out the gaskets are made by FEL-PRO

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just found out the gaskets are made by FEL-PRO

MoistCabbage
03-18-14, 06:56 PM
You can rent a guel pressure gauge at most auto parts stores.

FPR - Fuel Pressure Regulator, under the beauty cover, on the fuel rail. It has a vacuum line running to it from the TB. Disconnect the line from the regulator while the car is idling. Any fuel present at the FPR nipple indicates a ruptured diaphragm - failed regulator.

kboroweic
03-18-14, 09:21 PM
cool, thanx, i have to wait until my parts get here. I will rent a guage and test pressure what should it be at idle, or at acceleration ??

PaleAle
03-18-14, 09:46 PM
Don't ignore post #2.
If you replaced the cat and didn't fix what caused it to fail, you might be in the same spot.

Submariner409
03-19-14, 08:57 AM
cool, thanx, i have to wait until my parts get here. I will rent a guage and test pressure what should it be at idle, or at acceleration ??

GM service manual: Fuel pressure - 41 - 47 psi, KOEO (Key On Engine Off) That's the only spec, and that pressure should build during the Key On 2-second fuel pump prime cycle. According to the GM fuel pressure diagnostic tree it may take 2 or 3 Key On cycles to develop maximum available pressure, but in any event, that max pressure should hold for a while.

kboroweic
04-13-14, 02:56 PM
Hey Guys, just want to let you know. I replaced Plenum Gasket, Intake Gaskets and Fuel injector O-rings. She runs like the proverbial striped ass ape. :) THANK YOU SO MUCH. I was able to do this in about 2 hours. taking my time and being extra careful. I DID drop one of the intake bolts and it fell down into the cavity behind the manifold. I had to remove the manifold again. I had just put in 8 of the 10 bolts, so it was not much of a problem. Was able to get it out and then put all 10 of them in. tightened everything up and she is running better than she has in years. THANX THANX THANX

kboroweic
04-14-14, 04:04 PM
Hey Guys, Just want to say THANK YOU , THANK YOU for your advice. I changed the Plenum Gasket, The Throttle Body Gasket and all 8 fuel injector O-Rings.
She runs LOTS better. There is a slight miss, but I believe it is a fouled plug or boot. I had replaced the Ignition Coils last fall, so I dont think it is that. I ran Diags from the dashboard and it just shows the P0300 error. MISFIRE. Doesn't tell me which one. I will take it to a Auto Zone and have them put their tester on it. BUT ANYWAY SHE RUNS NOW. I can take it out on the road. Something I have not able to do for months. I am very GRATEFUL for you guys . You save me $$$$$$$$$ from a STEALERSHIP

kboroweic
05-03-14, 04:23 PM
hey guys, guess what ?? she is acting up again !!! I took it to AutoZone and they put a scanner on it. It said P0301. I bought a new spark plug while I was there. I replaced it later that day.The old one was fouled bad. NOT oil soaked or wet, but was pretty black. (ALL plugs were replaced about 2000 miles ago)
After replacing the plug and reinstalling the coil pack, It still is not running right. I CLEARED codes and let it run for about 1/2 hour. SES light came back on and showed a P0341 ( Camshaft Position Sensor) Error. I removed the Anti-freeze tank and was able to reach the sensor easily. I replaced it and at the same time cleaned the cables and connectors. Started it up hoping for the best, but alas, She has NO POWER when i push on the gas pedal. NOT dying but just does NOT want to go. Codes now just say P0300 AGAIN Im getting scared Help LOL

kboroweic
05-03-14, 06:18 PM
OK I did as MoistCabbage suggested and checked the FPR. It seems to be OK. When I pulled the Vacuum line off of the Regulator that comes from the TB, there was NO fuel at the regulator and there was ALOT of Vacuum coming from the line. so I presume the diaphragm is good.
Strange thing though. The engine is running rather rough, NO power, throwing a code of P0300 ONLY. Just for SH*TS and Giggles, as the engine was running, I pulled the connector that goes to the FRONT coil pack and as expected, the engine began to die. I hurredidly (sp) reconnected it and the engine went back to what it was doing. NOW comes the strange part. When I unhooked the connector to the REAR coil pack, the engine KEPT RUNNING !!!!! NO change in idle or roughness whatsoever. I am really confused now.. How can it run, albeit, rough,without the rear 4 cylinders firing ??? and what could be causing this ??? fuse ??? maybe

MoistCabbage
05-03-14, 07:25 PM
Check the injector fuses.

kboroweic
05-04-14, 12:36 PM
Checked the Injector fuses # 16 and #21 in the underhood fuse box. They are both good. just for grins, i switched them 10 Amp same issue. could it be a bad coil pack ??

MoistCabbage
05-04-14, 12:46 PM
All 4 could in the cassette going bad at once is pretty unlikely, and a bad ICM would throw a code.

Submariner409
05-04-14, 02:29 PM
Those ICMs are replaceable. Cheap at a junkyard - and 2000 - 2003 FWD Deville/Seville/Eldorado. Two Torx or Philips screws and 2 PITA plastic snap clips.

Also - mice and squirrels simply LOVE to chew electrical wiring insulation ....................

04GrandAmGT
05-09-14, 01:48 PM
All 4 could in the cassette going bad at once is pretty unlikely, and a bad ICM would throw a code.

i had 2 coils in one cassette that went bad at the same time, weird but plausible.