: V versus Mazda RX-8 ('04 or '05)



luvmyVluvmyV
07-25-05, 05:27 AM
I had just finished washing the V, so, like most of us, I had to go for a drive in the countryside to dry it off.
I'm just relaxing in 5th gear, not pushing any corners as I drive by fields, barns and the occasional house. My sunroof and windows are open as I have Van Halen's, Van Halen playing. Out of fu$^*ng nowhere a red Mazda RX-8 blows past me doing at least 100 mph. It scared the Hell out of me and I almost put it in the ditch. To add insult to injury, the kid sticks his hand out the window and waves bye. His license plates read, "Z-ZOOM."
There was no way for me to get to him right away, but I knew we had plenty of road ahead with more than its share of straight stetches and corners.
I dropped it into 4th and got on it. He had slowed down and was doing 65-75 on the 55mph road when I got closer to him. Not a lot of cars to be aware of except for cars turning out onto the road.
I'll admit, the RX had very little lean to it in the corners. I'd say I was staying 10 cars lengths back from him. The little shit, with his hat on backwards, was slowing down and then gunning it. You could see he and his passenger kept turning their heads and looking back at me and laughing. As I'm driving, I'm trying to remember if anyone, in all my countless hours spent on cadillacforums.com, had mentioned the specifications of the RX-8. I figured that since I didn't remember anyone writing about one, I would be OK. But, it's a smaller car and it would make sense that it could, most likely, go into a a corner at a higher rate of speed than the V.
As we approach a righthand corner that opens to a straight stretch, I give him some distance, I drop down to 3rd and then to 2nd.
Halfway through the corner I nail it.
I could tell "2 fast too furious" was going for it too, but whatever he had under the hood wasn't getting it done. It was incredible how quickly I caught up to him and passed him. I could head the sound of my pipes bouncing off his car. Sounded like poetry.
I slowed down to about 70 once I distanced myself from him. He then caught back up to me and started riding my bumper. So, I gave him what he gave me. I think I did the 3rd to 4th shift about five times, leaving him in the dust each instance. After the final time, he slowed to about 60 and stayed there.
When we finally came to an intersection, they pulled up to my left. The passenger gave me a "what's up?" nod and then they turned left and slowly drove off with their tail between their legs. The V had taught them a lesson. Class dismissed!

RocketV
07-25-05, 08:37 AM
BOOYAA!! :banana:

I love you man.

No,really, I mean it! There is something very satisfying about putting our youth to shame. (At least for those of us with a few years under our belt)

"Old age and treachery will overcome youth and enthusiasm every time"

All younger V owners are exempt from this.

Dooman
07-25-05, 08:45 AM
I test drove one of those with my wife.. Quite interesting going up a ramp at 5k rpm and knowing you're only about half way to redline. They are fun to wind out.

Kadonny
07-25-05, 08:45 AM
Shame on him. The RX-8 has no chance against a V. From a stop it would have been embarassing for him. No low end torque on those cars at all.

akm2k5
07-25-05, 12:15 PM
I guess those rx8 guys think they are fast.. all 23x hp. Even if you add a turbo kit those cars are slow... I think that car was owned by itself before you gave it a smackdown.

wildwhl
07-25-05, 12:29 PM
I used to own two. They're fun, handle great, and need more power. They do sound cool at 9K rpm though...and on a twisty road are (almost) as much fun as the V. The V takes a better driver to go fast, IMHO.

Glad you fried the rice...

heavymetals
07-25-05, 01:56 PM
Don't you just hate that when you just have to go spank someone (NOT!!)?

Keep up the good work:cool:

benh
07-25-05, 08:36 PM
A buddy of mine has an 04 RX8 and he just got his turn taking the V for a spin this past weekend. Bottom line from his perspective, the V eats the RX8 on torque and endless power, he thought the brakes were even and that the edge is hard corner handling goes to the RX8. Not sure I agree about the hadling assessment . . . I've driven his RX8 and it does handle well, but I will take the torque any day over what may be a slight edge in hard corners - soft corners are dead even IMHO.

Dave's V
07-25-05, 10:20 PM
I like the RX-8 due to its rotary engine (unique) but that is also its flaw. It produces next to nothing for torque (any torque). You have to keep the engine on boil to get any power from it. Drop below 5k and the game is over. Nice way to "prove" this to an RX-8 owner.

homer403
07-25-05, 10:36 PM
Ok all, this weekend I joined the local Mazda club at Rosecroft Raceway (in Maryland right outside of DC) in the parking lot for some "official" fun auto-cross. Well, the RX-8's do have a certian advantage in a tight autocross set-up but my CTS-V held it's own. Half way thorugh the day, I offered this cute girl (she is a "hard core" autocrosser) a chance to drive my CTS-V... with helmuts on.... we strapped ourselves in... she rev's up the engine and drops it around 3,000 rpms.... since I was inside, I couldn't see that she smoked my tires for a full 300+ feet.... everyone clapped...she went through the remaining course like a woman should... screaming non - stop, and when she got her time... THANK GOD it was slower than my time. I asked why she dumped the clutch at 3,000... and she said that's what I was taught to do in the RX-8 just to get it going.

ace996
07-25-05, 10:59 PM
I instructed an older rx-8 driver at an autox school. I had MANY runs driving the car and as a passenger.

Without a doubt, drivers of equal skill will be able to go faster in the twisties in the Mazda. The cornering grip and balance are a level above what is available in the V, with stock tire sizes. Check the weight/tiresize/balance....different class of cars. On aroad-course track or most roads, the V's power advantage will be too great and faster times will be realized. But should the track be low speed or very tight with many transitions, the RX8 will be the better tool.

WW is right, more skill is required with the V. The higher power and greater front weight bias allows the rear tires to break free sooner. This creates a car that is not driven at the limit with ease. Add to this breakaway power, a real ability to hold speed (the V has remarkable handling, much better than it has any right to be), and the result is a car that takes a very mature right foot to properly drive in/out of corners. Remember....sliding is the slower way around.

Good job on the kill...sounds like they didn't know what hit them.

Dave's V
07-25-05, 11:32 PM
Low speed corners is where the RX8 would get killed by the V thanks to the hightorque of the LS6. Look at the Porshes in the Speed GT series. Porshe catches up to the V under braking, but the V pulls away at the exit of the corner.

The V is built for handling on a race course. I'm sure an equally skilled driver would hold his own driving a V against an RX-8. Get the Rx8 down into slow corners and the handling of the RX8 won't matter.

Devil_concours
07-25-05, 11:36 PM
FYI
RX8 runs similar 1/4mi times as regular 3.6l cts ;)

ace996
07-25-05, 11:47 PM
Dave,
You can't compare the race cars....look at their tires...and the weight. Tires and less weight wins the turns, power wins the straights.

Up a mountain road, the V will own. Going down is another story.

Ve good,
ace996

Dave's V
07-26-05, 12:03 AM
But you need torque to get out of the turns and back up to speed. This is where the RX8 would have problems. However, if you can keep the speed up through fast turns the RX8's weight will give it an advantage. (as will a Lotus) Drive the full race course and the V will clearly out perform the RX8.

I pass numerous cars going downhill often. With the smaller engine cars, I just wait for right after a hairpin to take them.

As someone mentioned the Rx8 has trouble making it to 60 in under 6 seconds. A Cobalt SS or SRT4 would give it enough competition.

Smokin' 04 CTS
07-26-05, 02:34 AM
FYI
RX8 runs similar 1/4mi times as regular 3.6l cts ;)
:yeah:

luvmyVluvmyV
07-26-05, 03:55 AM
His car looked good going into the corners. It had very little sway. However, I wasn't pushing mine in the corners. I'm still a novice driver with the V, so the last thing I wanted was to spin out and end up in a cow pasture, with bent or broken rims and barbed wire covering me.
It took some work to catch up with him since he had such a jump on me.
I made my move on a tighter corner where even he had to slow down.
You guys are right, his acceleration wasn't there out of the corners.
But going into them I only saw him touch his breaks a couple of times.
But when I started slowing down and speeding up, it was comical. There's nothing like an American made V8!

*******disclaimer: In the interest of fairness, he did beat me in one way. Gas mileage. I burned at least a 1/4 of a tank. $$$$$ It was worth it.

heavymetals
07-26-05, 04:01 AM
Yeah like standing out in the street lighting dollar bills on fire...:bonkers: :bonkers:


But MORE FUN!!!

thebigjimsho
07-26-05, 04:10 AM
I guess those rx8 guys think they are fast.. all 23x hp. Even if you add a turbo kit those cars are slow... I think that car was owned by itself before you gave it a smackdown.You can't add a turbo to those new rotaries.

As for handling, there is only so much that the V's neutral handling can do, even with race rubber. I was behind a 275hp, 2800lb stripped down SHO. He's a smidgen over 10lbs per 1hp. I'm slightly under 10lbs per 1hp. However, I still need to drag around and keep under control over 4,000lbs of car and driver. That on 245 width Hoosiers. The SHO had 235 width race rubber. There's only so much you can do to curb inertia.

Devil_concours
07-26-05, 08:24 AM
His car looked good going into the corners. It had very little sway. However, I wasn't pushing mine in the corners. I'm still a novice driver with the V, so the last thing I wanted was to spin out and end up in a cow pasture, with bent or broken rims and barbed wire covering me.
It took some work to catch up with him since he had such a jump on me.
I made my move on a tighter corner where even he had to slow down.
You guys are right, his acceleration wasn't there out of the corners.
But going into them I only saw him touch his breaks a couple of times.
But when I started slowing down and speeding up, it was comical. There's nothing like an American made V8!

*******disclaimer: In the interest of fairness, he did beat me in one way. Gas mileage. I burned at least a 1/4 of a tank. $$$$$ It was worth it.
he probably burnt more gas than you did. Rotary engine likes to sip on that gasoline
(rx8 is rated at 18/24)

NH-V
07-26-05, 09:55 AM
we get better MPG than an RX8.
got them on oil consumption too.

akm2k5
07-26-05, 12:24 PM
http://www.speedforceracing.com/productsmazda_rx8turbokit.php
http://www.turbo-kits.com/rx-8_turbo_kits.html

I still havent seen any rx8s put out the same power as the rx7s.


You can't add a turbo to those new rotaries.

Devil_concours
07-26-05, 07:07 PM
http://www.speedforceracing.com/productsmazda_rx8turbokit.php
http://www.turbo-kits.com/rx-8_turbo_kits.html

I still havent seen any rx8s put out the same power as the rx7s.

You can pretty much add turbo to any car. Reason they're not putting out as much is probably because the renesis engine is too new. Upcoming Mazdaspeed version should spice thing up a bit

ace996
07-26-05, 07:30 PM
Dave,
Very true about the corner exit power...:want: ...the V wails on corner exit. Since I installed the Specter Werks bushings, things have tightened up out back and the rear breaks free a little sooner, I think...:hmm: Either way, to not thread drift I'll stop here.