: Bye Bye Bose!



Lanman
07-20-05, 10:22 PM
From day one the factory Bose system has been killing me and I finally couldn't take it any longer. I dropped the car off on Tuesday with one of my friends who owns a stereo shop and the upgrades have begun. :D

As you all know, we really can't completely eliminate the Bose system because so many of the car's features have been integrated with the factory radio but here's the breakdown on what I'm doing.

HushMatt'ing the entire car. Trunk, doors and floors!
Replacing all the factory speakers with JL Audio VR650's. Separates in the front and coaxials in the rear.
Pulling the factory sub out and installing a customized JL Audio HObp112-W3v2 sub box.
Power will be provided by an Alpine V12 MRV-F450 5 channel amplifier with a one farad capacitor for those power hungry bass notes and a JL Audio CleanSweep will be used to tap into the outputs of the Bose amp and provide an "equalized" signal into the Alpine amp.

This is definitely not my ideal setup but I think it's going to sound pretty good considering the limitations imposed on us by Cadillac and Bose.

I'll try to post pictures and updates on the progress over the next couple of days.

HDMLNIUM
07-20-05, 10:28 PM
Sounds like it is going to be a great upgrade over factory, looking forward to the pics and your impressions after the install..:coolgleam


Bill

AmesCTS-V
07-20-05, 10:33 PM
Does everyone think the Bose sucks? I don't, I must listen to too much O&A and sports radio.

Lanman
07-20-05, 10:56 PM
Day 1 : Deconstruction!

Alright, I stopped by the shop today during lunch to check out the progress. They had already finished gutting the car and had started installing the HushMatt and the wiring. Now I used to work in stereo shop back in my college days so seeing the car completely stripped and being prepped for the new system was kind of exciting to me. However, those of you with weak stomachs and fears of having your $50K V's stripped to the bone might not like these pics. It kind of looks like an episode of Overhaulin' or dare I say... Pimp My Ride. :p

AmesCTS-V
07-20-05, 11:03 PM
Yeah that is hard to look at.

GAGS-V
07-20-05, 11:34 PM
I, like Ames-V like the Bose system. I love the highs and clear sound. If you want more bass use the equil. I don't need the "thump-thump-thump". When I want a really great sound I go WOT!

J.E.T.
07-20-05, 11:43 PM
I left the Bose intact just switching out the sub for a Memphis brand with 250 watt amp. The Bose system lacks bottom but otherwise does a pretty good job. Also installed Sirius and love it over XM. Not my ideal set-up by any means but I trade every year anyway.


JET

Medicineman
07-21-05, 12:04 AM
WOW.... Those pictures are hard to look at.....
To keep weight down, I'm going to drop a amplfied 10" bazooka tube in the trunk.....I've had pretty good luck with these in other rigs. Not a ton of thump...fills in were the factory BOSE is lacking, plus they ad very little weight:D

Rikmyster
07-21-05, 12:51 AM
Ok, here's my 2 cents:

I "was" a BOSE Home Stereo dealer a few years ago. We custom designed and installed many expensive systems in homes. The technology is great, but it does not have the bass thump. No HIGHs and no LOWs, must be BOSE is very true.

I just redid my home theatre setup with the Bose ACOUSTIMASS system. The balance was impeccable, and the reproduction was intact and precise. But, I was shocked at the lack of bass thump which my cheap system had produced. I could not feel the spaceship taking off or the bullet as it just missed my head. So, I did what I did when I was designing my client's stuff, added self powered subwoofers to complete my THX System.

My opinion is that the Bose in the VEE reproduces concerts like no other. However it misses the BUMP we like to hear to cover the road noise and lack of power under the hood of most production 'sleds' today.

I think that adding more bass is the best idea. But I refuse to allow my VEE to sound ghetto and thus cheapen it.

I want people to notice the sound of my VEE's exhaust, not my subwoofers. Let them enjoy the sweet music of my VEE's engine and exhaust performance, and not the latest top 40. As I drive in a parking garage and alarms are set off, let it be the rumble of my power train that makes the other cars cry out in jealousy, not the thump of rap. I want them to notice my VEE speeding past them with all the wind noise, and not turn away because my sound is just ordinary noise.

I like hearing the sound my VEE makes while driving on the road, and not the um-pa of a speaker. Yes, I want to hear MY CAR and the Road. That is why I bought my VEE.

Saying all this, I Bought the VEE to drive, not hear music or dance. I like the total feel and sound of the VEE as it converses the highway.

I do like the system GM and Bose created. It is extensive and very advanced compared to the past radios and most today. GM spent a lot of money to get the perfect balance in sound systems for each of their cars individually.

Car sounds systems are made by fools easily but only GM can make a VEE.

(The proceeding message was brought to you by the VEE Religious Network, VRN. All donations may be sent in care of This forum or to ctsvett@verizon.net for his wonderful www.cadillacfaq.com (http://www.cadillacfaq.com/))

ntechnic
07-21-05, 04:07 AM
I do not like the Bose at all. I should prefice this by disclosing that I'm an ex-musician and currently own a multimedia production company. We have an Emmy award winning Composer/Arranger on our staff, and produce a lot of top notch music. My studio and home equipment are over the top, very few people have multiple ground isolated 20 amp circuits just to power their primary stack for their downstairs movie theater. Each of the three 20 amp circuits has it's own grounding rod (a 15 foot copper ground bar hammered into the ground outside of house.)

For my downstairs multiuse room (movies and music) I have seven 200 watt monoblock amps powering the seven main speakers (top of the line Atlantic Technology towers), three subwoofers, a top-of-line Carver Signature Sub, and two Infinity CSW10 subs making a nice triangle of subsonic sources.

My business partner brought a 24-band EQ, and all of his analysis gear. We spent a day EQing the room to flat response. When you hear a DVD or SACD in that room, you hear EXACTLY what they recorded.

So, with that out of the way, in my opinion, the Bose is far from flat and far from transparent. It has harsh, overly bright high frequencies, slow responding, muddy bass (and NO true subwoofer range at all), and the mid-range is too farward and artifical. My friend's BMW has a Harman Kardan system that is impressive, flat response curve, transparent, and fast, musical subwoofer that is clean and not "boom-boom".

Mostly I get traffic, and then listen to comedy channels, Discovery channel, the news, or just shut it off and listen to the car. Music is not a lot of fun to listen to. Lucky, the Corsa exhaust is a fine music I can listen to all day!

shanseverijn
07-21-05, 04:31 AM
dude I don't know what you guys are complaining about. The stock system is just fine. I had an escalade ext tricked out before getting my v and I damn near went deaf because of the system. I don't want to sit here and whip out my johnson and throw it on the table with all the stuff I had crammed in it but my components were MB Quart and if anybody knows sound thats crystal. But the thump thump does bug after a while I don't care who you are. Let me just say this. I had that escalade ext tricked out and modded out including supercharger and suspension sway bar kit, as well as a multimedia system. When I sold it and got my V it is by far the best vehicle I have purchased. Even better than the lade with the mods. My 2 cents. I'm out...

Dave's V
07-21-05, 04:34 AM
I'm a big fan of Bose, in the car and in the home. Excellent customer service. They gave me a RF remote free for my old home system when the old one went bad.

urbanski
07-21-05, 07:45 AM
can anybody comfirm that what I'm pointing at in this pic is the StabilTrak module?
http://img320.imageshack.us/img320/9356/front7ec.th.jpg (http://img320.imageshack.us/my.php?image=front7ec.jpg)




and, those pics stomach-churning as they are, if I had to the guts I'd sound deaden the entire floor as well

lasstss
07-21-05, 08:36 AM
I have a 2005 CTS 6 banger rental.....The stereo in this car is better than the BOZO system in the V.. not a lot better, but better. Go figure.!
As far as Im concerned, that NAV crap should have been one of the few options. I would have deleted it and used the cash for a good stereo. At the price the general can buy componentry for (usually peanuts due to the volume) you think they could instal a killer system. My equinox has a superior system as did my wife's Mazda van. They need to bag their audio man on the caddy side, he is either a single knob audio purist or cant hear.:rant2:

dqw1
07-21-05, 09:17 AM
Before I got my V I heard a bunch of rants about the Bose system and was prepared to disapointed. Actually it's pretty good but most days I turn off the music and listen to the engine.

turbojimmy
07-21-05, 10:07 AM
Ok, here's my 2 cents:

I "was" a BOSE Home Stereo dealer a few years ago. We custom designed and installed many expensive systems in homes. The technology is great, but it does not have the bass thump. No HIGHs and no LOWs, must be BOSE is very true.

I just redid my home theatre setup with the Bose ACOUSTIMASS system. The balance was impeccable, and the reproduction was intact and precise. But, I was shocked at the lack of bass thump which my cheap system had produced. I could not feel the spaceship taking off or the bullet as it just missed my head. So, I did what I did when I was designing my client's stuff, added self powered subwoofers to complete my THX System.

I told my friends the same exact thing and they thought I was crazy. Somehow they make that Acoustimass system sound awesome in the store. I bought one and after setting it up and messing with it for a couple hours I boxed it up and returned it. Weak lows and highs. I abandoned Bose completely and put together a system with a combination of Infinity and Polk loudspeakers (subs are Yamahas). In total I spent a little more than the Acoustimass system but the quality is so much better. I'm no audiophile, but it made more sense to me to have loudspeakers with multiple, separate drivers handling specific aspects of the sound than the Bose approach with the same driver multiplied by 10 (a pair for each of the 5 channels in a 5.1 system) and a weak sub. Also, having sizable speakers that can actually produce some bass in the L & R channels (even for the center and rear channels), in addition to the subs, makes a lot more sense to me than relying on a single sub to fill in the bass among a bunch of tiny speakers.

Anyhow, I wasn't surprised when the Bose system in the DTS failed to impress me.

Jim

turbojimmy
07-21-05, 10:08 AM
can anybody comfirm that what I'm pointing at in this pic is the StabilTrak module?
http://img320.imageshack.us/img320/9356/front7ec.th.jpg (http://img320.imageshack.us/my.php?image=front7ec.jpg)




and, those pics stomach-churning as they are, if I had to the guts I'd sound deaden the entire floor as well

That's the infamous 'black box' or SDM (Supplemental restraint Deployment Module).

Jim

GreenMachine
07-21-05, 10:33 AM
I've found that alot of times its not the speakers that have poor sound but the radio that feeds them. My friend had his stock radio replaced with a new one after the old one died, when he first played a CD i thought he had redone the whole system but no just a new radio/cd player in it. I like the equalizers that let me choose and move all the dials up and down, a complete graphic equalizer is what I like and find that the best sound is obtained through them.

Rikmyster
07-21-05, 11:12 AM
Music is not a lot of fun to listen to. Lucky, the Corsa exhaust is a fine music I can listen to all day!
:yeah:
That is all I am saying. There is no audio system in the world that can take you in total 100% bliss perfection in a moving automobile! The moment you start enjoying and getting into the music you will lose the feel of the road and ALL safety goes out the window.

I Bought the VEE to drive, not hear music. I like the total feel and sound of the VEE as it converses the highway. THAT is perfect music to my ears.

I like hearing MY VEE. So sue me.

akm2k5
07-21-05, 11:16 AM
I will be needing your info.. Im serving you. http://cadillacforums.com/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif



I like hearing MY VEE. So sue me.

AmesCTS-V
07-21-05, 01:40 PM
I have a 2005 CTS 6 banger rental.....The stereo in this car is better than the BOZO system in the V.. not a lot better, but better. Go figure.!
As far as Im concerned, that NAV crap should have been one of the few options. I would have deleted it and used the cash for a good stereo. At the price the general can buy componentry for (usually peanuts due to the volume) you think they could instal a killer system. My equinox has a superior system as did my wife's Mazda van. They need to bag their audio man on the caddy side, he is either a single knob audio purist or cant hear.:rant2:
I had a regular CTS last week also. It had the small orange display at the top. I can't say it was that good...

lasstss
07-21-05, 02:26 PM
I told my friends the same exact thing and they thought I was crazy. Somehow they make that Acoustimass system sound awesome in the store. I bought one and after setting it up and messing with it for a couple hours I boxed it up and returned it. Weak lows and highs. I abandoned Bose completely and put together a system with a combination of Infinity and Polk loudspeakers (subs are Yamahas). In total I spent a little more than the Acoustimass system but the quality is so much better. I'm no audiophile, but it made more sense to me to have loudspeakers with multiple, separate drivers handling specific aspects of the sound than the Bose approach with the same driver multiplied by 10 (a pair for each of the 5 channels in a 5.1 system) and a weak sub. Also, having sizable speakers that can actually produce some bass in the L & R channels (even for the center and rear channels), in addition to the subs, makes a lot more sense to me than relying on a single sub to fill in the bass among a bunch of tiny speakers.

Anyhow, I wasn't surprised when the Bose system in the DTS failed to impress me.

Jim

Bose claim to fame is spatial surround and clarity.... The problem is they left one aspect out 'BALLS'!!!!

I have 3 test CD's Boston, Heart, Steely Dan.. Bose failed. If I listened to the BSO only, it would be great.

VELOSE
07-21-05, 02:35 PM
Bose claim to fame is spatial surround and clarity.... The problem is they left one aspect out 'BALLS'!!!!

:crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby:

lasstss
07-21-05, 02:44 PM
:tease:
:crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby:

RobzBLKV
07-21-05, 03:14 PM
I am not impressed with the stereo at all. Playing with the equalizer does help a lot, but it's still . . . a bose.

On the other hand, it's better than the stock stereo was in either the M3 or the 330, so I suppose it's all good.

erp2863
07-21-05, 03:41 PM
Ok, here's my 2 cents:

I "was" a BOSE Home Stereo dealer a few years ago. We custom designed and installed many expensive systems in homes. The technology is great, but it does not have the bass thump. No HIGHs and no LOWs, must be BOSE is very true.



I'm not in the V enough to have an opinion either way on the Bose, but Bose in the home is largest waste of money you can do for a hometheater. I'll put my Paradigm/Denon setup against any Bose system and it will be like FM to AM radio.

For total bliss, find yourself a B&W speaker dealer and enjoy. You'll find out how much sound you're missing.

Eric

VELOSE
07-21-05, 03:53 PM
I just bought my first quality set of home theater speakers from B&W or, http://www.bwspeakers.com/. I opted for a full surround sound with sub and a set of outdoor speakers for the backyard pool parties. I won't hesitate to spend the money again on another set.

Anyhow, back to the car stuff. :D

wildwhl
07-21-05, 03:54 PM
:hmm: my Bose sounds OK with the added aftermarket sub below about 2K rpm...above that it gets this crazy blood curdling whine thing going on - with a loud bark and most certainly some bite! :histeric:

willsctsv
07-21-05, 06:16 PM
Rickmyster I totally agree with you. The v is a sharp looking ride, with great factory features. If I wanted the look of the CTS, and not the performance goodies in the V I could of saved some cash, and purchased a killer system and some BLING BLING wheels.
Not for me.
I love my NAV, and use it all the time. The radio does lack a bit of base, but the sound of that engine winding up and that B&B exhaust is music to my ears.
That's why I bought this car. I also set alarms off on cars:lildevil: , when close.
I usually find myself lowering the radio anyway to hear my engine and exhaust. I love that sound. Especially when passing someone on the highway, you know at 4500 rpms in 4th gear it sounds totally bad ass to anyone around.:sneaky:
The car ROARED on the dyno, I thought it was going to jump off the rollers and rip the chains out of the ground. So, I can imagine what people say when I come roaring by.
Nothing against the guys improving there sounds, I guess it's the same for me to improve my POWER :sneaky: . Headers, intake exhaust, tune. You know, were all addicted car guys!:coolgleam
2 each his own!

lawfive
07-21-05, 06:33 PM
I'm lucky not to be an audiophile. Similar to the way I can't differentiate between a $$ bottle of XO and a $$$$$$$$$ bottle of Louis XIII. The Bose sounds OK, now that I have an aftermarket sub.

And can ANYBODY tell me what makes Johnny Walker Blue so special? Tastes like Chivas to me...

turbojimmy
07-21-05, 07:58 PM
That's the infamous 'black box' or SDM (Supplemental restraint Deployment Module).

Jim

So how come those posts got edited by the mods to remove the picture of the SDM? It had to be by the mods right?

Jim

urbanski
07-21-05, 08:06 PM
hmm i still see the pics and my post...

and I'm still wondering where that damn ST module is LOL

STS 310
07-21-05, 08:06 PM
DAMN!!!!!!!! Check out akm245's avitar!!

A true classic my friend.

STS 310
07-21-05, 08:12 PM
Ok.

What we have here is a classic case of "what do you want out of your system".

Arguements can be made based on what is truly sought after to the individual listener.

Yes, with equalization, and signal processing, you can get some great sound from BOSE, but if you like high volume and SPL (pay attention to the afore mentioned) you will find that BOSE is lacking for what YOU want.

If you like throwing in your "best of Fleetwood Mac" and just crusing, then Bose is for you.

If you like throwing in "Napalm Death", or "Ludachris", well BOSE may fall short.

Taking stabs at aftermarket or BOSE based upon what YOU like or YOUR listening preferences is pointless......

turbojimmy
07-21-05, 08:14 PM
hmm i still see the pics and my post...

and I'm still wondering where that damn ST module is LOL

It's still there. I can see it from this machine. Something has gone awry with my laptop. Animated GIFs aren't working and now it's evidently choosing not to display images at random. It's really strange. There's no red x or any indication that there's a picture there at all. Both in your post and my reply. Yet all the other pics - the ads and the pics in the thread - are there.

On my DTS the Stabilitrac module is mounted behind the rear seat. There's a 'rack' of electronics with that module, Onstar, the Rear Integration Module, and some other crap.

Anyhow, I was at work today when I first saw akm245's avatar and I almost fell out of my chair. I was thinking to myself how crappy it was to put such an avatar up when he knows people are perusing the site at work. Then I looked a little harder at it and laughed. It is indeed a classic.

Jim

powerglide
07-21-05, 08:26 PM
I have 3 test CD's Boston, Heart, Steely Dan..

Steely Dan....Yes!
The audiophile's test CD d'jour

Lanman
07-21-05, 10:05 PM
Day 2 : HushMat... more HushMat... and yes, even more HushMat. :shhh:

I stopped by the shop again during lunch but there's not a lot of progress to show today. The guys are still installing HushMat and finishing up the wiring. They have started on the speakers though and unfortunately a tweeter became an early casualty when one of the speaker leads got ripped off while the installer was grinding the housing off of it. The housing needs to be removed to get them to fit into the factory tweeter locations.

Here are a couple more pictures for those of you who care. A couple of door pics, that little black box and a funny looking pie plate that kind of sounds like a sub when you hook speaker wires to it. :p

turbojimmy
07-22-05, 05:43 AM
Here are a couple more pictures for those of you who care. A couple of door pics, that little black box and a funny looking pie plate that kind of sounds like a sub when you hook speaker wires to it. :p

That's the same sub in my '01 DTS. You'd think they'd have done something bigger/better by now. I guess my tastes aren't refined enough. I like it loud and I like the sound full. The Bose system sounds 'cold' to me.

Anyhow, I apologize for my earlier paranoia about the black box pics. Woke up this morning and the laptop is now totally dead. Blue screen of death, failure to load a 'hive' - contact your system administrator. Which is me. I had to wipe it clean and start over.

Jim

Crozier
07-22-05, 05:12 PM
Bump for the avatar thread....

Lanman
07-22-05, 11:12 PM
Day 3 : It all comes together. :D

It's amazing how fast things can change. When I showed up today the car was 95% reassembled. You would have never known that just 24 hours earlier the car was still completely gutted. I got to listen to the system a little today and I'm guessing that it will probably take me about a week or two to fine tune everything the way I like it but that's pretty normal for a setup like this. So far I would say that I'm 100% satisfied with everything I've seen and I can't wait to get the V back tomorrow. I've definitely missed driving it this week. I'll post some more pics and my impressions of the system over the next couple of days.

And once again, for those of you that care... here's a few more pics.

Lanman
07-22-05, 11:22 PM
I seem to have run into a size limit on the number of attachments I can post. Do I need to start another thread to post the rest of the pics or do I have to delete some of the other pics?

:confused:

OuTLAw
07-23-05, 12:24 AM
As the owner of a Custom Home Theater Systems Integration Company, I can tell you will never see a Bose system in my showroom much less in a customer's home. Not because I believe that Bose sucks but because of the type of services we provide. We are in the business of delivering to the customer the best home theater experience possible weather you are contracting us to design, build, and install a dedicated theater or installing a simple plasma and an in wall/ceiling surround system. There are some who believe that there is nothing better than Bose, there are some who think the world of B&W, there are some who believe that M&K are the best speakers ever made and they are all right. My opinion has always been, buy what sounds good to you weather its the Bose Acoustimass 15 or a pair of Theil CS7.2's. Personally, Im not a big fan of Bose much less the system in the V but then again it's stock, what do you expect. Have you ever been truly impressed with any stock system? The trouble these days is that auto manufacturers are making it more and more difficult to retro in aftermarket systems. Would've bothered me a few years ago but now that im a little older with 3 kids all I care about is having a TV/DVD player in the car so that I can keep the kids busy and not have them ask me "are we there yet?" every 5 minutes. I can tell you that that was the single best invention ever made! Now if they only made seats with built in potties...

ctsvett
07-23-05, 03:19 AM
e-mail me the picts and I will host them on the FAQ.

Reed

MikeF
07-25-05, 12:19 AM
I don't need that thumping bass. None of the people I hang out with would appreciate it and I don't let my kid drive it.
Besides I usually listen to AM talk radio or some kind of relaxing music. I got the V to relieve stress, not exacerbate it.

ssmith100
07-26-05, 08:43 AM
We need some new pics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Shane

lawfive
07-26-05, 11:09 AM
Steely Dan....Yes!
The audiophile's test CD d'jour

I wonder what Donald ***an uses to test systems?

-- Kid Charlemagne

lawfive
07-26-05, 11:13 AM
I don't need that thumping bass. None of the people I hang out with would appreciate it and I don't let my kid drive it.
Besides I usually listen to AM talk radio or some kind of relaxing music. I got the V to relieve stress, not exacerbate it.

Ooo! +30 points for 'exacerbate'! But -10 for not taking the opportunity to lead in with 'alleviate,' 'mitigate,' or, possibly, 'ameliorate.'

tomm
07-26-05, 11:36 AM
Where's the finshed product??

blown65
07-26-05, 11:15 PM
My Acura TL-S had a Blows in it, was much worse. The CTS-V is pretty crappy too, but not as bad, at low volume, sure it sounds ok, but I like to listen to my music a tad louder than a whisper, at that volume the speakers distort and start to sound like ass.

Funny though, my GMC 2500HD also has a bose system and the highs are actually pretty loud in it. Bose for home I guess is ok, just way over priced for what you get IMO. Just look at the quality construction of the speakers in the car. Laugh.

thebigjimsho
07-27-05, 02:00 AM
Oh my goodness, how many here would lambaste a CTS owner if they came on here and discredited the V because they saw no need to have 400hp or world-stopping brakes or better handling? After all, while more enjoyable, is it imperative that we have one?

Audio systems are a subjective issue. But don't tell me that spending $$$ on better audio is a waste and not what these cars were meant to do. Please. Why haven't many of you just gone out and gotten a Vette? They're better racers aren't they? Some people need 4 doors. For me, I need better audio. As for exacerbating stress, nothing is more relaxing than good music on a good system.

I will never impose what sounds good to anyone else. But the Bose, to me, needs improvement. If you use the top DVD slot, you can at least get better signal processing. But I want more. But I also want to keep the Nav as well. Again, the DVD slot is good enough for me. But I'll need better highs and bass so when the budget allows, that will change.

At the risk of a number of pedophile jokes, I find the Michael Jackson "History" discs to be some of the most musically dynamic I know of.

Lanman
07-27-05, 07:55 AM
Hey guys, sorry I haven't posted an update but I've been really busy with work and family. Overall I'm extremely happy with the end result. :D

I don't have time to do give all the good and bad details right now but I'll try to get it done before the end of the week.

CTS-VETTE 550HP
07-27-05, 01:11 PM
Lanman, *** WARNING WARNING ***
when your project is complete be sure to check your air bag panels above the back seat left and right head rest because these panels are very delicate. I know from experience (twice) once from having my windows tinted and the second from the dealer mechanic removing my center console from the back seat and some how bump into that panel. If my memory serves me correctly these rear air bag panels cost around $ 300.00 each. These panels are held together by cheap plastic, another poor design by GM.