: Melted camshaft water pump drive pulley

01-20-14, 05:21 PM
I posted a week or so ago about a 1999 Deville I got for trading two toolboxes.... Owner said it was overheating and that was that... Its a Northstar engine, so the engine must have bad headgaskets...

Well... Things took an interesting turn today... I went out to just run the car and noticed it got up to temps quickly... As I was perusing the engine compartment to see what I was planning on doing in the future (remove engine and use studs to repair what I think/thought is a bad head gasket) I noticed that the Water pump belt was off..... Hmmm

I removed the cover and found the cam pulley partially melted away... I checked the tensioner and it was fine, then rotated the water pump pulley and found it rotated quite easily....

For whatever reason, the pulley seized... Oddly enough, I found a new hose going to the water pump (a recent replacement)...

I then started the car and the pulley on the cam moved quite normally.... hmmmm

All I can think of is that the antifreeze mixture may have frozen (possibly from prior overheat and someone added water) and held the impeller while the cam pulley burned away....(we have had a pretty cold winter so far)... Now this should have made a heck of a squeal and smoke... but who knows... I don't think that the Northstar type of water pump is well known about....

Anyway... I have included pics for other suggestions... I suppose I still could have a bad headgasket... But it would be nice if it were something as simple as a new pulley, waterpump belt and a proper mixture of Coolant...

Any thoughts?

Here are my pics



01-20-14, 06:02 PM
Plenty of advice on the water pump drive pulley - and how to replace it - in Cadillac Tech Tips. A complete power steering pulley removal kit and a proper bolt, nut, and stack of greased washers to press the new one on - hub face flush with the cam snout. Pull and install correctly or you're in the left bank intake cam replacement business.

While you're at it, replace the tensioner pulley also - simple one bolt replacement. www.rockauto.com, make, model, year, "belt drive", 3-rib pulley.

That black plastic cap in the end of the cam comes out with a Torx bit - it's nothing more that a thread protector for the cam snout internal threads used with the GM removal/install tools from Kent-Moore - $$$.$$.

01-20-14, 06:05 PM
Both forums are equally active. In the future, please don't double post.

The problem is probably a seized water pump belt tensioner pulley, not a frozen water pump.

01-20-14, 06:07 PM
Stand by to merge identical threads and responses.

Please don't shotgun posts ...............

01-20-14, 09:09 PM
A melted drive pulley is almost always the result of a frozen tensioner pulley bearing.

You just may have gotten a very good deal.

01-20-14, 11:13 PM
Owner said it was overheating and that was that... Its a Northstar engine, so the engine must have bad headgaskets...


01-21-14, 09:47 AM
U could use small saw blade and split remains of cam pulley to slide it off cam extension. But u need tool to press it on eventually.

01-21-14, 11:09 AM
Actually I think it can be reinstalled with a bolt and washers.

01-21-14, 11:49 AM
What ranger said ^ but it is metric thread pitch, idk if your local hardware store would have metric bolts or not.

01-21-14, 12:52 PM
Post #2 for the stacked washer install - drive pulley hub flush with the cam extension face.

Pictures and diagrams in my 2 albums.

Our local Ace and TrueValue hardware stores carry metric nuts and bolts in standard, grade 5 and grade 8 strengths. I believe that Lowe's and Home Depot do, also.

01-21-14, 01:42 PM
M8x1.25 is the metric bolt you want. Get a bolt marked 10.9, or 8.8 (on the head of the bolt)if you can. If there is any rust in the threads on the cam, chase that to clean it out first. Resistance is your enemy with this job.

01-21-14, 02:27 PM
Jake, I've had good luck with either NevrSeize or Permatex anti-seize when using the stacked washer/bolt/nut trick.

01-21-14, 07:18 PM
No doubt. I just use a bit of engine oil, and one of the exhaust manifold bolts (they're very hard). Never had an issue.

01-22-14, 07:06 AM
Thanks for all the replies... I have bought the Kent Moore remover and the installer (I plan on doing more of these engines in the future) The funny thing is the tensioner pulley rolls very smoothly and evenly.... Additionally I Have ordered a new drive pulley, just need to order the tensioner (might as well do it).... Just waiting for things to warm up here... it is 4 degrees outside!

Strangely enough, I was kinda disappointed because I really wanted to rebuild this engine.... Oh well, I may very well have to do it anyway.

I have already started ordering the specialty tools in anticipation for the rebuild (I have got the Kent Moore Flywheel lock, the OTC Cam Tool kit, Factory Service Manuals, the water pump Socket, the Cam pulley installer and the remover..... I am just waiting to find out what the Rear main seal installer type I need.... I already have a Snap on Techangle torque wrench, so I don't need to use a torque angle tool (even though I do have one as well)

My plan is to:

- Pressure test the cooling system

- Replace the pulley, tensioner and belt and see if overheating stops

- Do a compression test on all cylinders, check and possibly change the plugs and the wires (wires look original) and it has 115k on it.

- Change the oil and filter (note the oil does not have any coolant in it, but does have a strong smell of fuel)...

Additionally, I plan on completely flushing out all the DEX Cool and replace with regular anti-freeze.... Any comments on this?

01-22-14, 09:31 AM
No need to buy a complete tensioner ($58) if the spring and arm are in good condition. The pulley/bearing comes off with that single center bolt. $23 at a NAPA or www.rockauto.com (http://www.rockauto.com) - your car, year, model, engine "belt drive" - the 3 rib gates pulley is fine.

A complete engine rebuild is usually not necessary - but if you do, follow the service manual instructions - these engines are not intuitive projects - several special processes to follow. Study up on the new GM method of halfcase (lower cylinder bolock face) sealing using UltraGray and no silicone formed "gasket". Do not dingleball the cylinders - yours probably still has most of the original aggressive hone pattern anyway. These engines use low tension iron rings (oriented correctly - the lower compression ring is also a scraper) and there is no cylinder bore oversize recommended.

Pictures in my albums - click my username, open the profile - left column - 2 albums, 6 pages of stuff for your engine. (you have the earlier waste spark ignition setup)

Nothing wrong with DEX-COOL - exchange it every 3 years or so. Test the thermostat with a candy thermometer in a saucepan of water. It begins to open at 188 and is fully open at 206. All engine calibrations are set for that range of coolant temps. Remove and clean the ignition module (ICM), coils/bases, and make very sure the ICM ground wire is well connected. Use the plug diagram in my albums to get the proper coil-wire-plug sequence.

As long as you're in the tool ordering business, get one of these - http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/lis75500.html

01-22-14, 03:44 PM
Hey Sub , what does 'shotgun' a post mean?

01-22-14, 05:10 PM
No need to buy a complete tensioner ($58) if the spring and arm are in good condition. The pulley/bearing comes off with that single center bolt. $23 at a NAPA or www.rockauto.com (http://www.rockauto.com) - your car, year, model, engine "belt drive" - the 3 rib gates pulley is fine.

A complete engine rebuild is usually not necessary - but if you do, follow the service manual instructions - these engines are not intuitive projects - several special processes to follow. Study up on the new GM method of halfcase (lower cylinder bolock face) sealing using UltraGray and no silicone formed "gasket". Do not dingleball the cylinders - yours probably still has most of the original aggressive hone pattern anyway. These engines use low tension iron rings (oriented correctly - the lower compression ring is also a scraper) and there is no cylinder bore oversize recommended.

Pictures in my albums - click my username, open the profile - left column - 2 albums, 6 pages of stuff for your engine. (you have the earlier waste spark ignition setup)

Nothing wrong with DEX-COOL - exchange it every 3 years or so. Test the thermostat with a candy thermometer in a saucepan of water. It begins to open at 188 and is fully open at 206. All engine calibrations are set for that range of coolant temps. Remove and clean the ignition module (ICM), coils/bases, and make very sure the ICM ground wire is well connected. Use the plug diagram in my albums to get the proper coil-wire-plug sequence.

As long as you're in the tool ordering business, get one of these - http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/lis75500.html

Thanks for the info... I have a Napa distribution center less than a mile from where I work, so I will grab a new tension pulley/bearing assembly...

I have read everything I could on this site about re-building and believe with the FSM and the info you guys have provided will be able to do a rebuild if necessary.....

I have a block tester already and will give that a try as well (just got some fresh fluid off the Snap on truck about 2 months ago)


01-22-14, 05:47 PM
Hey Sub , what does 'shotgun' a post mean?

Some members mistakenly post the same question in several different forums simultaneously in the hopes that "the more posts the more answers". All it really accomplishes is to dilute - scatter - advice from the members who choose to reply.

01-23-14, 04:30 PM
thanks Submariner409

02-03-14, 10:12 PM
Sorry, no pics today... Got up to 27 degrees here in Ohio today... Felt like a heat wave... No snow and sunny skies...

I decided to tackle replacing the melted Water pump pulley and tensioner pulley issue today.

Took about an hour total (I had the Factory water pump pulley remover and installer)... It made it like child's play...

Plied the belt around the water pump pulley (the hardest part of the job) and got it everything hooked up properly (the second hardest was getting access to the 10mm stud that is closest to the firewall which held the tensioner on)

Then I started the car...

Guess what? No overheating... Maybe I dodged a bullet... While driving the highest it went up to was 233 degrees, but the fans kicked on and knocked it down to 208 in 20-30 seconds...

Drove it for 30 minutes.. No overheating, no leaking...

Need to do a tune up on it now (115k miles) and I do believe the spark plugs and wires are original... Put some fresh gas in it and drain, refill and bleed the coolant.... After that hopefully I will be good to go....

Will keep everyone informed FWIW..

02-04-14, 08:04 AM
Good to go.

Your fan sequence with no function in the HVAC that calls for A/C compressor operation: Engine runs, warms up. if you drive at 25 - 30 with few stops, fans will not run. Stop, idle, temp goes to 224, fans go to SLOW, the coolant drops to 213, cycle repeats.

With some A/C function set (DEFROST, for one) the fans run in SLOW all the time. Temp should stay around 190 - 205 all day.

Above 35 mph, cruising - fans won't run at all they aren't needed.

In serious traffic or slow traffic summer heat fans go to FAST at 236 coolant or 304 transmission fluid temps.

Further pics and info in my 2 albums. If you want to monitor any 4 of 12 engine functions in real time, take a look at www.scangauge.com (http://www.scangauge.com) - the ScanGauge-II. I watch coolant temp, intake air temp, timing advance and MAP (manifold vacuum absolute).

02-04-14, 10:24 AM
DONT ever put Dex cool back in the system if you have flushed it out, Dex cool eats aluminum, we have had blocks that were corroded so bad on the surface the customer needed a new block. stick with universal green or yellow long life.


P.S. Sub check this out - http://www.ultra-gauge.com/ultragauge/ its like the scan gauge, i bought one for my grand am, Love it.

02-04-14, 03:21 PM
DONT ever put Dex cool back in the system if you have flushed it out, Dex cool eats aluminum, we have had blocks that were corroded so bad on the surface the customer needed a new block. Stick with universal green or yellow long life.

I'll bet that Prestone, other coolant manufacturers, and most automobile manufacturers in the world would tend to disagree. Could the block (cooling system passages) condition have ANYTHING to do with improper system/coolant maintenance ? Compared to the total of all DEX-COOLed aluminum blocks ever made, what is the percentage that you, me, us, them have seen in poor condition ? Any problems with poor grounds, shorted small wiring, electrolysis ?

I've overhauled some pretty nasty green coolant aluminum and iron engines.

02-04-14, 08:47 PM
If Dex ate aluminum GM would have been out of business long ago. They would have been sued into oblivion. WAAAY too many Dex-Cooled engines still running around for that to be true.

02-04-14, 09:07 PM
It's been my experience that dexcool works great as long as it never gets mixed with air from leaks in the system that go unrepaired. Seems like that's when it turns sludgy. <shrugs>

02-04-14, 09:12 PM
I really think that is another internet myth. If that where the case I'd have a half gallon of sludge on my shelf.

02-04-14, 10:07 PM
Turns sludgy when crap gets into the coolant. The AF isn't the problem, the water added is. Cast Iron block meet mister corrosive water mix....have fun making rust, calcium build up and plugging up radiators.

Dex Cool no worse than any other AF, how could you even make a sweeping statement like that anyways?
Hey I hear BRAND X oil destroys lifters in every engine....or at least once it did.

02-05-14, 08:36 AM
Nobody's kidding anybody - coolant is a touchy subject, we see all the horror stories in here - when the engine is terminal - and I'll bet name brand dealer shops see some real Lulus. My take on the apparent DEX-COOL problem is that it is marketed as a "long life" product, most car owners never bother to read the owner's manual, most car owners never bother to do basic underhood checks ("Dear CF, Where is my oil dipstick ?), and the whole thing leads to "Out of sight, out of mind". ANY neglected coolant turns into a witch's syrup of nasty stuff. We see the end result of vehicle maintenance ignorance and we try to help recover........... just like any dealer or Mom&Pop shop.

Working behind the counter at the local Western Auto I hear problems that would make stuff in these forums seem like a warm, rosy child's fairy tale. "Jim, My Toyota has been making a grinding noise in the left front while braking - for a couple of months now. Any ideas ?" .......... Up on the lift, wheel off. Any guesses as to what the brake pads/rotor looked like after 80,000 miles of commuting ? Daily occurrence. EaRL can testify to that.

02-05-14, 08:39 PM
Yep lol

02-12-14, 07:11 PM
UPDATE for 12 FEB 2014

I went out this evening after work to try to work on the CADDY... Was 30 degrees here after work with the sun shining... Another HEAT WAVE!!

Anyway, the interior of the car was not heating up... Checked the coolant reservoir and it was almost empty... Added coolant and then it started heating up.... Drove around no issues (got nice and toasty inside), the ECT never went above 210 degrees.

Since I had no idea how old the gas was, I took it to the gas station and added 11 gallons of 93 octane...

Unfortunately I still kept getting a P0301 popping up (and flashing)... Other than that, everything seemed to run well enough...

Took it home and replaced the #1 spark plug.... took it for a run... Still the code flashed and remained.

Went back (was getting dark) and replaced 2,4,6,8 plugs and it ran a little smoother....

I still think the wires need replaced, so I will do that next... (maybe tomorrow)

I am going replace the last 3 rear plugs and then swap the coil packs and see if the problem jumps to another cylinder, if that shows no improvement, I will try to swap the injector.... After that, I will be forced to do a compression/leak down test...

Another thing that bugged me was the smell of burning oil... Pretty sure the seal on the rear valve cover gasket needs replacing... saw the evidence of oil seep.... More fun for the weekend.


02-12-14, 07:32 PM
Use the waste spark plug/wire/coil diagram in my albums to connect the proper coil tower to the proper plug.

02-13-14, 10:02 AM
everybody is entitled to there own opinion but Jake can back up on this, PS isnt there a big Hype on how dex cool is biodegradable and environmentally friendly... go water your lawn with dex and take a look at it after 2 days, Just because big manufacturers say something doesnt make it right, gm said the northstar was a revolution in quality and power, most people dont have nothing but troubles with them and half the people in the world are convinced its the worst engine ever made (thats including worse the Dodges slant six, at least those has durability.)

02-13-14, 10:19 AM
Evrett, How old (siphoned from the surge tank of my STS) would you say this 2 quarts of 60/40 DEX-COOL is ?

02-13-14, 10:19 AM
everybody is entitled to there own opinion but Jake can back up on this, PS isnt there a big Hype on how dex cool is biodegradable and environmentally friendly... go water your lawn with dex and take a look at it after 2 days, Just because big manufacturers say something doesnt make it right, gm said the northstar was a revolution in quality and power, most people dont have nothing but troubles with them and half the people in the world are convinced its the worst engine ever made (thats including worse the Dodges slant six, at least those has durability.)

Grass is biological, an engine isnt.

02-13-14, 06:58 PM
13 February 2014 Update

Switched the coils and took the car for a drive... Still the P0301 popped up...

Then went and switched Fuel injector from #1 to #2 and vice versa.... Took for a drive.... P0302!!!! YES!!!!! Bad fuel injector!!

Neighbor came over and asked me about the car and we talked for an hour til it got dark and nothing else got done, but I now know what I am dealing with... Hopefully tomorrow, a new fuel injector!


02-17-14, 04:01 PM

Went to the Pick and pull and pulled 3 fuel injectors... Cost $38.00... Went home, replaced the bad one and and wow!!! The engine was smooth and powerful (never drove one of these cars before!)... Drove over 45 minutes and no codes... Exhaust looks clear and no smoke... Coolant temperature never went above 205 degrees.

The bad... Well I added a little coolant (about 5 ounces) and noticed little flecks of metal in the coolant... STOP LEAK... ARGGHHH!!! Guess I got lied to again about the car... He said no stop leak was added. Oh well, I plan on flushing the old dexcool out anyway.

The guy who sold this to me purported to have worked as a technician for a dealership for about a year before he quit because he did not like it... I am wondering if this guy ever made it off the lube rack...

Also, I tried to get the garage door opener programmed. Spent about 10 minutes on it when I pulled it out and read the code on the garage door opener cartridge - G3480.. Which was made for Cadillacs back in the 80s to early 90's and had manually programmable DIP switches... Well, both my garage doors are newer and use digital codes, so that was not going to work... As near as I can figure, the owner before me had an old type garage door opener and had this old cartridge style ordered... I checked around and I can get the new 3 button cartridge on EBAY for around $35 ... I am kicking myself now because I could have grabbed one while I was at the pick and pull for probably $10...(which is around a 50 mile round trip drive...)... OH well, back to the pick and pull for that one....


Looking over the engine I heard a slight squeal... Looked down and saw the tensioner bouncing pretty well at idle. I don't believe there is a decoupler on the alternator... Oh well, that is not that hard to fix... Can get a new AC Delco one on Ebay for around $35 so that is on the way...

The power antenna is still working but not well. I am going to have to order a new antenna and install it... I hate those automatic styles.. They all seem to fail so easily...

I keep getting a 'Theft System Problem car may not restart'... However the car starts with no problems.. I will check for body computer codes... The only thing that I can think is that the battery is showing 12.5 at rest and a battery should never really be less than 12.6.... Really more of an annoyance than an issue.

Anyway... Still have to change the oil, 3 rear plugs, air filter and new wires.... I am sure it will purr even better with new wires...

Overall everything is coming together nicely... will try to post some pics... Starting to trust this car to go longer distances away from home...

Edit: Have B2711 PASSKey Open/Shorted Pellet After Good Key... Also, When I went out to check my codes battery was at 12.1.... So much for that battery...

02-17-14, 05:40 PM
There are a couple excellent threads on rebuilding power antennas on the forums, you can get mast and cable for around 20-25 online.

02-17-14, 08:56 PM

The power antenna is still working but not well.

Pack the gear, worm gear and cable slot with white lithium grease. That may be all it needs if it still works.

Went to the Pick and pull and pulled 3 fuel injectors... Cost $38.00..
Holy shit Batman!

02-17-14, 09:51 PM
Yes, I thought it was a bit pricey for the injectors as well, but new they were $85-$120 each.... And it was cold out and I didn't want to go to another scrapyard...

I also am going to just buy the mast (Mine is bent and sticky... I tried to lube it, to no avail).... Thanks for the link... I have re-done these on Imports before, so there should not be that much of an issue unless the motor is just plain tired...

I have been reading up on the VATS issues and the 'Theft System Problem car may not restart' and I will probably just install the resistor... I ohm tested my key, so I know what the resistance should be.... I am really not worried that much about someone stealing a 15 year old car I only have liability insurance on... If they want it that bad, they can have it....

The VATS resistor pre-made to spec for 1-15 coded B62 keys for less than $20... and I don't have to mess with solder or cut anything... Plug and play... worth it to me anyway...


Before I install the resistor on the VATS I am going to replace the battery, see if that has any effect.... While I have the battery out, I will put in the new belt pulley tensioner and new belt....

Also I have the code B2477 (current – reverse lamp relay shorted to ground) problem, so I will have to check into that... Other than those two issues, nothing else... Fairly happy now...

02-18-14, 09:48 AM
I also am going to just buy the mast (Mine is bent and sticky... I tried to lube it, to no avail)....

02-18-14, 08:05 PM


Nice sticker, eh?

Well it did not scare me off... I continued to work on the car and found this and some interesting clues left behind....

Here is my report:

Changed the last 3 spark plugs on 3,5 and 7. Ran the car for 45 minutes... Temp never went above 203 degrees. Ran pretty much the same... Nice and smooth...with the exception of a slight sqweak...

Got out the mechanic stethoscope and found the idler pulley on the serpentine belt is noisy... Will have to replace that when I replace the belt tensioner...

Checked the fuse for the backup lights and found it blown... Replaced it and then they worked fine...

Checked all lights and the only light not working was the light above the license plate... Easy replacement.

Checked PCV valve and found it in good condition.

Air conditioning is working fine and cycling....

Air Filter was in serviceable condition.

Wipers and wiper fluid pump work fine.

Turned on the driver side seat heater and burned my @$$ on one particular spot on my right derriere cheek...... (Anyone know why there is a HOT SPOT??) I figure I will have to look into this...

Battery is 12.1 volts at rest, I will get a new battery on Friday.

The two rear tires do not match the two front tires.... I plan on getting new tires anyway so no issue.

Headlights have vapor and are cloudy... I will have to replace these... $132 on Ebay for a new set....

Will need to clean out the leaves and flora and fauna trapped on the cowl and all around the car...

************************************************** ********************************
I am starting to put together my theory of the backstory behind this car... While looking though it I found several stickers from what I believe to be an auto auction... I think this car was listed/sold on or around November 27th, 2013 (I bought the car in January 2014) and the last owners of the car (the dealership) was on the car sticker.... It seems that I bought the car from a car flipper (which I have no real objection to) but he was not entirely honest in his description of the cars condition (but he may not have known)...

Here is my CSI analysis about this car.

Car had issues with a seizing up water pump pulley tensioner...

The water pump belt melted the water pump pulley and the belt came off (somehow the belt survived)... and the car started overheating..

Car started overheating and losing coolant (from pushing out the overflow).... Owner added STOP LEAK to try to stop the overheating...

The vehicle was taken to the dealership for an overheating issue.

Dealership looked over the car and told the owner about the costs that would be involved to repair the car (very expensive)

Car traded in and dealership knows it is overheating, has a Northstar engine and wants nothing to do with it.

Car was sent to auto auction... a nice looking car at a cheap price.... the guy I bought it from was trying to get a good deal and maybe fix it up...

The guy who purports to be a mechanic discovers it is a Northstar and it is overheating and reads about it and learns how much work it will take to fix the car....

Time to sell...

I come in and trade two toolboxes for this Caddy...

I received the car with only 7 miles added to the sticker mileage...

Just my theory...




02-19-14, 05:00 PM

I pulled a CARFAX report and pretty much confirmed what I thought... The car was babied by its first owner with all scheduled services and so forth...(oil was changed around every 3k miles).... Then the original owner sold the car to a dealership in June 2011 (with 110,770 miles). Found out the car got new front and rear brakes and rotors at 103,000 miles... (yeah!).... and the last oil change on record was done by the first owner was at 110,811 miles on the 15th of June 2011, which matches the oil change sticker still on the window!!!

A dealership sold the car to second owner and they owned it until 15 October 2013 (with 115,374 miles)... Second owner only put around 4500 miles on it..... Then it was sold through an auto auction where the guy I bought it from got it....

It had an interstate battery in it and I took it to the Interstate store to have it tested... Two bad cells... They couldn't warranty it, but sold me another one at dealer price ($110.00) with tax... The car started much easier, however the 'Theft System Problem - May Not Start' still was appearing, so I will do the resistor modification....

Today, I took her for a nice wash and then used my air compressor and blew out all the leaves and twigs from the cowl and the inner fender by the front doors... It really needed it.

Checked the serpentine belt and it looked almost new...

Added a gallon of windshield wiper fluid... was almost empty I believe....

Bought an AC Delco oil filter and 8 quarts of oil (will do oil change this weekend).

Checked the tire pressure and it was 8 pounds over on 3 tires, one tire was 5 pounds low.... Rode a little smoother after I ensured the tire pressure was correct.

Checked on the hot spot on the seat and ordered a new seat heating element today from Chris (RippyPartsDept).... Hopefully should have that next week... My plan is to post the pics of the repair job here... Should be fun... Also plan on doing the leather cleaning and re-dye the seat...

Plan is to hit the Pick n Pull on Friday and get The Garage door opener and other miscellaneous little parts... Also Friday my tensioner pulley will be in and I will pick up an Idler pulley (making a lot of sqeaking)...

Saturday I will change the oil and filter... Then replace the tensioner pulley and the idler pulley... That should quiet her down a bit..(although you can't really hear it with the hood down...

Next week the plug wires should be in and I will install them and do the coolant flush...

Here are some pics of the ride (unfortunately the car didn't stay clean long...) These pics really don't do it justice on how clean and nice the paint job still is... Will get some better pics after I detail this thing...


02-19-14, 08:33 PM
Another thing I really noticed today was how the rear wheel well was below the top of the tires around an inch or two... I checked the ELC fuse in the trunk and it was fine... Don't have any DTC Codes for Suspension related issue.... I wonder if the compressor is toast.... I turned the key and got in the trunk... Heard nothing from the pump and definitely nothing turned on and there was no adjustment.... Got to take a closer look at what is going on... I could see the shocks still do have air lines hooked up to them.... Maybe another part I will have to get at the pick n pull....


02-21-14, 07:42 PM
Update. No time to get to the pick and pull today... Hopefully tomorrow!

Today I got home with enough light left to install the idler pulley ($37) and tensioner ($35)...the belt was in great shape and did not need replacing.... A simple job...

- Remove the battery
- Use 13mm socket to remove tensioner pulley
- Use 15mm wrench to unbolt the idler pulley
- Unbolt the idler pulley screw and install onto new idler pulley

Reverse the procedure (torque both tensioner pulley and idler pulley to 37 Ft-lbs)... and line up the belt... Took around 20 minutes... Started her up and she purred... No more squeal...

Then changed the oil and put on a fresh AC Delco oil filter... (boy did I feel better after doing that).... Still smelling burning oil from the rear bank... I will order the gasket and do that next week (maybe, it is due to get cold again).... Saw how I have to drop the front.. 2.7 hours labor, I am going to try to combine that job with installing the new spark plug wires...

Anyway... Here are today's pics... (sorry they aren't better or more, but I was in a hurry to get this done before dark)

New Tensioner pulley (AC Delco)


Removed both tensioner pulley and idler pulley


New Idler pulley


Installing the new Tensioner pulley... Both Idler pulley and tensioner pulley get torqued to 37 Ft-Lbs....


All installed and belt back on...


02-22-14, 09:46 PM

Got up and went to the Pick n Pull today... Was an anomaly in Ohio's recent weather pattern here and we got a 56 degree day with sunshine... The only nice day we will have in the next 10 days..... Tomorrow is calling for snow and by Friday the high is expected to be 18 degrees!!!!

The pick and pull was packed... Found some good donor cars and pulled off this pile of stuff:

An Owners manual and case, the seat control cover for the drivers side (mine is broken in half)... The one I got was cracked a bit, but it is still better than being broken in half, I can fix with JB weld and clean it up.. It was the best condition one I found (seems to be an issue with this car). Also got the stock front bumper license plate holder.. The one on my car was an aftermarket version and looked like crap. Also got the cargo netting for the trunk (mine did not come with it)...

Also pulled a compressor pump for my Automatic Leveling system.... Boy was this a pain to pull... In a terrible spot with little access... I tested it and it pumps, so I am happy... As soon as we get some decent weather I will install and take pics and post.... should be fun!

Also got a bunch of fuses and relays from a 1999 in the yard (you can never have too many of these).... Expensive to buy new ones...

All Total spend $57 for these parts.

Note I could not find a garage door opener cartridge... It appears that these are the first things removed from the car.... So I ordered one on Ebay for $35.....

Unfortunately, I did not have time to do much today due to a previously scheduled engagement, so the only thing I could do is replace the front license plate holder...

Pics of the day:

The Load


Fuses and such (light bulb also to fix rear license plate light)


Old Front license plate holder


The new one installed... Looks much better than the old!



02-23-14, 07:54 PM
Another update...

It did not snow here today.. So I went back to the Pick n pull and got a power antenna for $29.99... Worked great... Tested it when I got to the parking lot.

Also bought 4 floor mats (mine only had one rear one in it) so I can clean them up and possibly re-dye them for further use.

When I got home I replaced the antenna... real easy remove 1 X 10mm ground bolt, 1 X 10mm nut, unplug the antenna wire and pull the antenna assembly downward... Then take the new antenna and simply push the antenna through the rubber mounting bushing on the exterior of the car, and bolt it back up.... Now it works perfect...

Then I replaced the light bulb for the license plate... 4 X 7mm screws behind the license plate and 2 X 7mm screws on the backside of the trunk under the carpeted area.... Lift out rear assembly and pulled the plug and replaced the bulb..

Also, checked all my fuses... Found one burned out.. The cigarette lighter... Probably never would have known that since I never use it... but I replaced the fuse anyway...

Then since it was still "relatively" warm at 40 degrees today I knocked out the Automatic Leveling Compressor...

Essentially, I disconnected the electrical plug for the compressor, then unbolted the three 8mm bolts that hold the pump onto the bracket mount... Then I used the 8mm Gear wrench to remove the three bolts which holds the bracket on... A gear wrench is a must for the one forward bolt which holds on the bracket...

Then unplugged the air line connection at the Dryer..

Then I pulled the bracket out.. I had to turn the compressor to get it lined up to remove... Even then it is a tight fit... I found myself pulling down on the muffler for the extra space to get the old one out....

Once I got it out, I noticed all the air hoses were worn and torn... Had to run to Advance Auto and pick up around 3 feet of hose (more is better just in case)...

Cut the pieces and replaced them..

Then re-installed the pump and inserted the bracket and remounted the whole setup.... Took around an hour total to do the compressor.. not a bad job, but takes some persistence and maneuvering of the bracket and pump...

************************************************** ***********************

I then checked my work and turned the key on in the car.... I heard the pump going, and going and going and going and going and going..... (over a minute).. And the level was staying the same.... Hmmmm.... Guess I figured out why the last compressor died... I had another engagement to attend so I had to stop there, but not before removing the ALC fuse in the trunk area to keep from burning this compressor out...

Hopefully tomorrow or the next day I will get down to the lines with some soapy solution and check the lines and the shocks for a leak...

Here are the pics..

Ground on the antenna


Removing the 10mm nut that holds the power antenna bracket on the car...



Removing the rear plate assembly with reverse lights




Cleaning out and testing the fuse box under the hood


Good pump assembly on left, bad one on right...


New hose



Fitting it into place...


The air hose line runs to the middle of the car and up into a nipple by the gas tank...



02-24-14, 06:57 PM
Today's update...

I received my Seat Heating Element from Chris known as (RippyPartsDept) Thanks for the speedy shipping! Looking forward to doing this and posting the pics...

Ordered New shale colored headliner material (no I don't need a new headliner, but I am going to do some surprise work... stay tuned)...

Ordered the new Valve cover gaskets as well...

My Garage door opener cartridge arrived today... Installed it in about 1 min and had it opening my garage in the next 3 minutes.... A nice feature to add to the car.

The other thing was finding where my air leak is on my Automatic Leveling system.... I jacked up the passenger side, removed the tire and then removed the air line inlet to the shock... Used my air gun to pressurize the shock and sprayed the boot area with soapy solution... Held my thumb over the air line inlet and watched for bubbles... No bubbles on passenger side...

Switched around and did the drivers side and did the same thing with the soapy solution... The problem presented itself... Soap bubbles everywhere all over the shock boot.... So now I need new shocks... Will buy two and replace at the same time... Hopefully no leaks in the air lines themselves, but either way, the shocks have to go...

Stay tuned for more!!!

The pics:

New garage door opener:


Out with the old!!!


In with the new!!!


Filling up the air shock (sorry for crappy pic), it is from my S4 phone....


The bubbles telling me it is shot!!!



02-24-14, 09:22 PM

The bubbles telling me it is shot!!!
Ya think? I'd say that's a pretty safe assumption.

02-27-14, 09:53 AM
Thats why the compressor keeps running

02-27-14, 10:26 AM

The bubbles telling me it is shot!!! I think the oily shock is a pretty good indication as well.

02-28-14, 06:40 PM
Actually the shocks in the above picture were totally dry... The wetness is from the soapy solution...

Anyway.... Got back from an out of town trip today and it was like Christmas with all the boxes... Still waiting for the Seat dye and the resistor for the VATs system but they could be here tomorrow.

Got the new Shocks, Valve cover gasket set, SEM soap for leather and a two headlight assemblies. Hopefully can install the headlights and shocks tomorrow (will get to a balmy 47 degrees here)... Then the next day we are supposed to get 4-6 inches of snow... Enough of winter already!!!!


03-04-14, 07:43 PM
Didn't get to anything this weekend... Life got in the way...

Anyway, got the last of the items I have needed (the VATS resistor and the Seat Dye) and today I also bought some gently used matching Michelin tires....getting the tires mounted and balanced two at a time by dropping them off at the Wal-Mart... The least expensive place I have found to do this work...

So, tonight I tried to install the VATS Resistor... The first thing I noticed is that the wiring from the ignition lock does go directly into a larger harness plug (not a two wire plug, like older models)... So I cut the wires from the ignition lock to the larger harness plug and guess what... It still started with the same 'Theft System Problem- Car may not restart).... Yes I cut the correct wires... Don't feel like arguing about this...

While searching around I found a thread by a guy who is having the exact same issue.... It remained unresolved so I am going to do some further exploration tomorrow...


Here is what I have noticed:

- There was absolutely no continuity or resistance on the wires coming from the ignition lock (completely open) had the key in and checked in all positions...

- I wired the resistor into where the wires that should lead to the Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC) and this had no effect at all on turning off the 'Theft System Problem - Car may not restart' ..... The car still easily restarted.

- So I have a dead line going all the way from the ignition lock at least to the wiring harness...(and possibly the IPC)

- I know I cut the correct wires and traced them back...

- There is no aftermarket stereo on this car...The stock radio is still in and works 100% fine... I doubt there is any aftermarket security system... have not seen any signs of anything aftermarket...

Since it has been suggested in the previous thread that there may have been another resistor installed behind the IPC, I am going to remove the Dash tomorrow and do some scouting around....

Here is what I think may have happened..

The ignition lock had issues....Hence the security system had issues and probably was causing the car not to start.... The Ignition lock was probably either worn out and not sending the proper ohms reading or the wires may have broken internally (more likely).... It takes a considerable amount of time (=money) to replace this.... A fast easy fix is to add a resistor to the system...

While a repair (a resistor added) could have been done under the dash (the underdash section looked all stock with no modifications) it also could have been done behind the IPC under the dash (as was suggested in the previous thread by DevilleDan and seconded by RippyPartsDept)...

I am hoping that when I pull the dash I find a resistor... maybe going bad and not providing good resistance.

That is my logic... I may be entirely off, but I cannot find any other explanation of why when the wires are cut to the ignition lock and yet it still starts the car (and starts it with the same error)....

If all else fails, I will send the IPC off to Specmo to have the theftlock cleared out...

03-04-14, 08:15 PM
Does it have factory HU still? I highly doubt there is a resistor hidden somewhere, but anything is possible.
Did you have any IPC codes?

03-04-14, 08:31 PM
As far as I know it is the factory HU... It looks completely factory and original..

I agree, it is a long shot to find a resistor back there and is a bit of logical wishful thinking...

Another thing I am now concerned with is my battery is showing 12.0 volts exact... I know it is cold, but it is a brand new battery, the last one was reading around the same range... When the vehicle is running it is charging at 13.8.... I may have to check tomorrow for a parasitic draw...

As far as codes, these are the only ones:

IPC Current - DTC B2711 PASSKey Open/Shorted Pellet After Good Key

IPC Historical - DTC U1255 Class 2 Communication Malfunction

SDM Historical - DTC U1000 Class 2 Communication Malfunction

RFA Historical - DTC U1000 Class 2 Communication Malfunction

03-04-14, 08:57 PM
It's a long shot but I had wiring A pillar area that was rubbing on metal of dash and wearing on the wires for harness going to IPC on my 98. If you're yanking the dash anyways I would check there.
I had that IPC B2711 error when key was getting worn and it didn't restart a few times until installed resistor.
Have you cleared all the codes yet through the DIC? Don't know how long that code stays current, could be a long time(can't remember the number of starts it takes oto send to histroy without FSM). Just spit balling at this point.

03-04-14, 09:05 PM
I cleared all the codes about a week ago from the cluster.... B2711 keeps coming back... It has had the B2711 error ever since I got the car... and as you can tell from previous posts, talking to the previous owner will be of no help....

I will look all around for any worn wires when I pull the dash...

Appreciate all your ideas... (even spit-balling)... Sometimes it leads to something.

I am now concerned about a parasitic draw... Sometimes weird electrical things can be related...


03-06-14, 07:59 PM
Update 6 March....

Found the problem with the "parasitic draw"... Interior light was left on... That was easy..

Got all four new tires installed.. and put the last two on today... I did two at a time... Dropping them off by hand yesterday and today and picking them up after work.... The four tires installed and balanced at the Wal-Mart for $40.66... The first two tires were done correctly with weights put on the interior of the wheels, the two I picked up today had the weights on the OUTSIDE on the Chrome wheels!!! REALLY???? WOW.... ARRGGH... I will have to take them back to have them done right....

Still have not pulled the dash to trace down the VATS issue, Car still starts with no issue, so I can delay that... I had good weather today so I wanted to get the shocks done.

Shocks were not really an issue except for the first one... All that was needed to replace the shocks is an 18mm Combination wrench, a 24 mm Impact socket w/impact gun, a 24mm Combination wrench, a T47 Socket (w/breaker bar or ratchet) and an adjustable wrench.

Problem being is that the first shock I did I could not get the T-47 to grip the upper stud correctly and it stripped out... Needed a Cutting wheel to get that nut off the stud.... Took longer than anticipated. 24mm Combination wrench to remove the nut, the T47 to hold the stud in place... The bottom bolt and nut were easy as pie... Hold the 18mm Bolt head with the box side of a combination wrench and use the 24mm Impact socket on the nut... The bolt easily removes from its position by hand..

But the second shock was easier (and I got the T47 seated well on the stud) to remove the upper bolt. That side took me about 10 minutes to remove the shock and another 5 to replace... Totally easy... The only difference between removal and installation was that the new shock had a stud that had the traditional type stud which only had two recessed sides (instead of a Torx or Hex type recess on top) to hold the stud.... I used a combination wrench to hold it while I tightened the nut...

Got both sides done in no time and was ready to move on...

Put both wheels on and lowered the car, replaced the ALC fuse and let her go.... Unfortunately the air compressor just kept running and running and running and running again...

So now I have a few possibilities....

1- Air lines have a leak somewhere...

2- Compressor is not pushing air (or is weak)

3- Purge valve is bad and air is just running right out...

Will have to figure this out this weekend (hopefully I have time....)

I will probably start with the air intake and purge line (the vacuum type lines show in the pics with the compressor)... I will jack up the car, and disconnect the rubber type 'air line' to where it breathes (showed a pic earlier about where this line attaches up by the fuel tank).... Then I will lower the car back down and then let the pump run and see if air is coming right out as soon as the compressor is pushing it (checking the purge valve).... If that is fine, then next:

I will remove the small plastic air shocks lines and remove them from some of the holders so the air lines will touch the ground or close to it.... Then lower the car and let the Compressor work and check to see if air is coming out of the lines.... If none, I will remove the air lines from the compressor and check directly from the pump... One of these WILL show a fault... just have to do it......

Here are pics from the shock removal and install...

Lower Control Arm Raised...



Hitting the top nut (and mostly the fender well) with a generous dose of PB Blaster...


Lower attachment... A 24mm Nut on 18mm Bolt...


Lower attachment bolt and nut....


Wallered out T47 at top...


Old and New


Shock removed


New shock installed


All finished on this side... Same to the next...


Cadillac Kid03
03-06-14, 08:38 PM
Good thread, I love seeing older Cadillac's being brought back to life and you sure are doing a good Job!

03-07-14, 05:05 PM
KarlInOhio - Keep a running log and pictures of the rear shock change. When it's all done I'll copy the posts to the Tech Tips forum - in a new thread - with credit to you. Nice work.

03-07-14, 06:22 PM
KarlInOhio - Keep a running log and pictures of the rear shock change. When it's all done I'll copy the posts to the Tech Tips forum - in a new thread - with credit to you. Nice work.\

I can do that...

Unfortunately I am limited on pics, but I can take more pics when I have the wheels off (I will do this in the next couple of days)...

The real problem for a DIYer would be having the tools to cut that stud/nut at the top if it gets wallered.... A cutoff wheel is so nice and can be gotten relatively cheap at a Harbor Freight.... As a matter of fact, that is where I even buy my cutoff wheels.



OK here is your latest update... Nice weather today.. Had to resist the urge to hit happy hour... Around 54 degrees and sunny here in Columbus, OH and after this winter, that feels like 85 degrees....

I did what I planned on doing and jacked up the car and pulled the air inlet/vent line for the compressor (the one that goes up by the gas tank)... It was sucking air (as it should) when the compressor was running, but barely... uh oh...

I then removed the actual air lines to the shocks and let the compressor run and felt nothing coming out of them.... Hmmmm...

Then I removed the air lines and tested them... While they are very tiny Inside Diameter, I could blow my air gun through them, but couldn't blow air using my mouth, but under pressure they were holding the air and blowing out the other side of the line... I submerged the lines in a gallon container of water and blew compressed air through them and saw no leaks....

Then was the last test.... See if the compressor is pushing out air right from the source.... But to do this, I would have to get the compressor running while I had the car in the air... To accomplish this I removed one 10mm bolt and a retaining ring on the level sensor, so I could manually move the level sensor and trip the system to work.... I then got the compressor to run and put my hand up next to it and felt where the air should be coming... NO AIR COMING OUT absolutely nothing.......

So now I know my issue... Compressor is not pushing air, but I am not throwing it out yet... I will remove the compressor motor again and then remove the dryer (perhaps it is completely clogged up) and see if it works then.... If not, I can return it to the Pick n Pull and try again....

Here are the days pics... Just a couple, not really too much to see...


Removing the arm from the level sensor (located on Drivers side)


Inspecting the air lines...O-rings still look fine..

. . ... ....

03-08-14, 04:34 PM

Removed the Dryer from the compressor and found it was completely clogged. I even tried blasting compressed air through it to no avail...

After I removed it I noticed that the passageway to the dryer on the compressor was completely blocked with white, chalky substance... I cleaned out the purge solenoid and then I checked the pump directly on the car without the dryer... Air was blowing out the purge nipple... So it means the purge valve is bad... When I took that solenoid assembly apart I quickly discovered was it a mess... Fully of white chalky substance and plenty of flaky rust... Tried cleaning out the purge valve and all other areas... Unfortunately the solenoid was all rusty so I am sure it is shot (I re-tried it on the car again after the cleaning) and it still kept blowing out the purge nipple, so I will have to return to the Pick n Pull and try again... (I have to get a cornering light anyway)... I will try one or two more, and if the ones from the pick n pull are also shot I may be forced to buy a new (or re-manufactured) pump...
.. .. .. ....

03-08-14, 04:59 PM
It's not in the manuals and few know it, but the ELC system filter/dryer is a normal maintenance item. Once the system fills with dried snot (from heat of compression and venting) it fails rapidly. You could eliminate the automatic function and compressor by running the shock lines to a T-ed Schrader valve in the trunk, but that's a real pain to keep adjusted.

The next part(s) to go bad will be the solenoid control head and the compressor itself.

Either check out the Suncore site or talk to Chris in Parts at Rippy Cadillac over there >>>>

03-08-14, 05:01 PM
Arnott has new, OEM pumps for just over $200.

03-09-14, 07:50 PM

Had to work most of the day but managed to get to the Pick and Pull late in the afternoon...

While there, I pulled another Compressor.... This one was promising since the car I removed this from had the shocks removed... I removed the Compressor and the lines and bracket... A plus side of this exercise in futility is that I can take the compressor out in about 10 minutes now... LOL

While I was there I also found a passenger side cornering light that was in decent condition... There were better ones, but previous people had broken the mounts... Oh well, at least I got one...

While I was there and the weather was pretty sunny, I pulled a dash in better condition than the one I had... It is still showing signs of peeling, but I think it might be more easily fixable than mine... I will post pics of it here... Any suggestions to hold it down would be appreciated... JB Weld with clamps on the dash till it dries comes to mind, but someone else may have some good idea.

Also while there, I pulled an Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC)... I figured I will send this one out for a re-flash, I will use a used one so my car can still run until it gets back.... All of this stuff you see (less the compressor, which was an exchange) for $62.00.... Not bad... Still well within my set budget...

So I got home and hooked up the new compressor with dryer attached, it was pushing out air on the dryer side nipples.... Then I installed it with the 'new' air lines (which I did not check)... Well... Probably should have checked the new air lines... The car is not raising still and the compressor is still running... Back to diagnostics tomorrow or the next day.... Now I know why people dislike this system so much.... Oh well.. Labor cost is cheap at least...

The pics..

All the stuff I got today...


The only peeling section... very small...


The only tools necessary to install the compressor... The 8mm ratcheting flex head wrench is a MUST! And an 8mm socket on extension...
...... To remove the compressor it helps to have pliers and a flat tip screwdriver as well...


Re-installing the compressor for the 4th time... Getting real easy to do this...


Not quite level yet, but still pretty...


.. ... .

03-09-14, 07:55 PM
I use this:

But it's about $30 a gallon, and that's the smallest amount you can buy.

Some good epoxy should do ok though.

03-10-14, 07:04 PM
OK went out and worked on the Air shocks again tonight... Still the compressor keeps pushing air and barely lifting the car... The funny thing is that when I disconnect the air lines from the shocks, The air escapes quickly (they are under pressure)... So I believe that the compressor is tired and cannot push the proper PSI at a certain point... Enough of this, I am going to install air lines to be filled from the trunk off a T... I can get this for less than $15 and not spend $220 for a new compressor... Enough is enough...


03-10-14, 07:45 PM
Boy you are having bad luck with used compressor. Many GM use th e exact same just have to swap brackets. Park Avenue etc.

03-11-14, 09:10 PM

Spent around $13 for new air lines for the rear shocks... Installed the rear shock lines through the knock out plug in the trunk under the spare tire... Sealed it up with foam and then filled the lines with air... All good now.... Suspension is at the proper level... No leakage yet... Will check tomorrow morning but all looks good for the last 3 hours.. I think this proves my theory that the compressor was weak... Since I will use this for a daily driver and will not be loading the trunk or rear passenger seats with people, I think I will be fine...

New Level...


Then I did the front headlights... Totally simple job.. Simply remove the ETorx fastener (a 6mm socket can work as well) and then removed the cornering light. 2 X 10mm nuts holding one side of the headlight assembly and 2 X 10mm bolts holding the other side... Then removed all the bulb plugs and the wire hold down clips.... To be frank, the hardest part was removing the wire harness hold down clips I ended up using a sawzall to cut the plastic on the old housing to ensure that the clip remained intact... You could not remove the hold down clip from the assembly with pliers or anything so I just cut it out...

Anyway it is all level now and has new headlights... Will have to check the aim, but I think it looks better.... More to follow.

Pics of the replacement....


The ETorx screw that must be removed to take off cornering lights




OLD and damaged cornering light


Removing two nuts


Bottom bolt


Top bolt




Removing plugs




The wire harness plug... The hardest part...


03-11-14, 09:11 PM
New Headlight assembly





Cutting out the plug...






All done


.. .... . ........

03-13-14, 09:49 PM

The cold snap hit for the last two days, so I couldn't get out and do much on the car, so tonight I set out to repair the dashboard. Using JB weld to try to re-join the parts... We'll see how it lasts tomorrow morning... Only had clamps to do one side of the vent, tomorrow morning I will do the other side... Hopefully will hold..

Also, hopefully tomorrow afternoon I will remove the dash and check the IPC for a resistor... If none, I am going to remove the current IPC and put in the junkyard IPC... If it doesn't start (which it shouldn't) since the ignition wire is cut, then I will know there is something wrong with the original IPC.

I called SPECMO today and talked with them about the issue, so I may end up shipping the IPC off on Saturday... Unfortunately it will probably be a week before it gets back, so I will be unable to drive the car during that time...

More to follow...

The pics...


.. ..... ... ..


03-14-14, 09:13 AM
How did you get into my shop to steal those orange furniture clamps ?? (They're identical to a set that Dad gave me years ago) The black plastic ones - STRONG - come in assorted sizes, 10 or 12 to the box - Lowe's Home Depot. Cheap. Handy.

03-14-14, 09:52 AM
How did you get into my shop to steal those orange furniture clamps ?? (They're identical to a set that Dad gave me years ago) The black plastic ones - STRONG - come in assorted sizes, 10 or 12 to the box - Lowe's Home Depot. Cheap. Handy.

LOL. ... The funny thing is that even I can't remember where I got them... probably a flea market...

The great thing was that they fit perfect... figure the odds...

Also, did the other side with JB weld this morning, took the clamps off and that right side vent area was held down solid as a rock... Still plan on installing this afternoon.. The real test is the test of time/how long they hold when installed...

03-14-14, 10:22 AM
The "new level" seems a little bit high for a Deville to me- the "old level" was where my Deville sat when I replaced the compressor and the shocks with new ones. Never measured but the rear wheel house of these cars look a little shorter than the front - maybe the reason for the "not leveled" look. Again, I never measured the actual ground clearance.

03-14-14, 11:02 AM
Good point... I have thought that the springs may be weak and hence why the air shocks/compressor has to work too hard..... I will look at the manual about the height, but when I look at pics of a new 1999 Deville, the height seems about right to me...but then again they may be just a tad high...

I will say this though... after getting air in the air shocks and those Michelin tires on, the car feels so smooth, like I am skating on ice... Every bit as good as my 2013 Lexus...

03-14-14, 12:52 PM
Rear tire should be tucked under just a smidge, I keep both of mine more or less even with fender lip. The FSM setting is a little low to me.

03-14-14, 02:11 PM
Ummmm, NO ! There's good and valid reason why the (4) wheel caster, camber, and toe should be set to factory specs.

The GM service manual shows ride height and how/where to measure it.

If all's well those rear tires/wheels should appear to be exactly perpendicular to the road. Top tucked in = too low a height setting.

03-14-14, 06:10 PM

Got home and removed the dash... Very simple... Pop out the four vents on the front of the dash... Used a thin feeler gauge to release the clips and pulled out the vents.... Then removed the dash defrost vent. There will be 4 X 7mm screws behind the front vents and 3 X 7mm screws holding the top of the dash under the defrost cover.

I then removed the IPC, 3 electrical plugs and 4 X 7mm screws holding it in and replaced it with the junkyard IPC... Guess what... No start, just as it should have not..... Looked all over for any signs of a resistor, but there was none...

So, I will have to send my IPC to SPECMO to stop that annoying 'Theft System Problem - Car May not restart'

In other news, my JB Welded dash is now all solid and has no curling... Unfortunately, the material has shrunk with age, so the defrost vent does not "lock in"... Thinking about how I will fix that now... Something will come to me...

Here are the pics:






Screw access holes for Dash




Top screws on dash




03-14-14, 06:15 PM
Removing screws


Pulling on dash





The three plugs



.. ...... ..... ........

Junkyard IPC... Note the mileage... The car that I got the IPC from only made it to 138,679 miles... Very sad...

Also the IPC won't let me start the car....


03-14-14, 06:29 PM
N*Caddy had a fix I used for the defroster vent rattle and loose problem. Staples heated up and inserted into the sides, do a search I'm sure it will come up. Also I used some mastic tape in a few spots to keep the bastard from rattling.

03-14-14, 08:48 PM
You need to have a GM dealer send the replacement DIC out to be reset with your car's real mileage and VIN.

03-14-14, 09:55 PM
You need to have a GM dealer send the replacement DIC out to be reset with your car's real mileage and VIN.

I have already contacted SPECMO about this and told them my situation, they told me to send them the VIN# and mileage along with the IPC (or DIC) ... I asked if this would be an issue and they said it would not... If they won't do it I will post here...

03-15-14, 06:15 AM
VERY nice pictures here - showing the locations of those darn little plastic vent clips. Thanks.

03-18-14, 10:13 PM

Latest... Sorry no car related pics... As soon as I was going to snap some pics literally, at that exact second I got called by my buddy and we talked as I was getting things ready... It was probably for the best anyway.. It would have been boring pics of my floormats...

As I may have stated before, when I bought this car, I received one floor mat with it... A rear floor mat that was on the front drivers side floor.... So when I went to the pick and pull, I grabbed the best ones I could find... (which were fairly nasty...) The rear floor mats as you can imagine are in much better shape. So today I took them to the coin-operated car wash and lined them up against the wall (had nice clips for them) and blasted them with HOT soapy water and rinsed them for about 10 minutes.... Mixed results... Rears look great, one front looks pretty good, the other.... not so great..... They are drying now and will get to them again soon...

After that, I went and scrubbed a few portions of the car's carpet with some canned carpet cleaner (the type you buy with the scrubbing bristles at the end)... to my surprise, the carpet really came nice and clean... I really think the carpet will clean up beautifully..

Noticed a small pock mark on the windshield that I want to take car of... must have been hit by a small rock... Will fix that with a windshield repair kit... Will post results here... Those kits work pretty well, but you have to follow the instructions to a "T" and fix it ASAP before the vehicle hits a bump and starts cracking the windshield....

Lastly, I packaged up the the IPC or DIC or whatever you want to call it to send it to SPECMO tomorrow....

Then I set out for some spring cleaning of my DISORGANIZED garage.... I know, I know, it is a mess, but it is a work in progress... So here is a pic for today...

.. ........ ........

03-19-14, 08:38 AM
I like the tennis sock on the vise. (My 2.5 car garage is not that bad, but close.)

The car and #1 truck are NOT that close together - weird lens distortion.

03-20-14, 06:53 AM
Talking about disorganized garages, I can't even show you my garage because it's so embarrassing. But hey, that's where I repaired my two Northstars.

03-24-14, 04:06 PM
Nothing new done to car, OLD man winter decided to return to Ohio again... Was 15 degrees this morning and calling for 1 inch of snow tomorrow... Yeah Spring!!!

Anyway, one update... Just got off the phone with SPECMO about my IPC. They are programming in the VIN, removing the theftlock and putting in the actual miles on my IPC... Total cost.... $60..... $50 for the service, $10 for shipping. Will be receiving it back this Wednesday :)


03-27-14, 09:57 PM
Update for today...

Got back in town... Was out on business... Also, picked up a RAV4 with a cracked head to fix for my Niece.... so I have not been working that hard on the Deville.

I did get the IPC back from SPECMO.... Unfortunate thing was that somehow in shipping, the side piece that holds it on broke... Shouldn't be an issue... has other bolts to hold it down...

I wired in the resistor and installed the IPC... Did the re-learn and that was that... NO MORE "Theft System Problem - Car may not restart"....

Was packaged well from SPECMO and they sent me a label to send anything else I need fixed in the future for free... That is nice... Although I don't work on many GM products..

Really going to try to get the valve cover gasket done this weekend.... OLD man winter is just not giving up around here... even had some freezing rain here today...

Here are today's pics...

... .. ... ...

Message gone... I like it better without my IPC nagging me about things..


03-28-14, 08:51 PM
Came home tonight and did the rear valve cover gasket... Not a real hard project. Didn't take long at all... Had to get it done tonight because we are expecting an inch of snow tomorrow.... Ahhhh... Springtime in Ohio...

Anyway, it was a fairly straightforward job.

Remove beauty cover, remove stiffener bar, remove plastic cover over radiator, remove coil pack and rear plug wires, disconnect EVAP connector, disconnect PCV valve, disconnect front engine dogbones, remove both cooling fans, Jack up car and support, unbolt exhaust and push away, remove small plastic splash cover under engine, then put jack under front engine cradle, remove two front engine cradle bolts, lower front section slowly, remove valve cover attachments, disconnect rear O2 sensor plug, pry the coolant pipes for room to remove two rear bolts then remove the valve cover...

It took me about 50 minutes to have everything off... All totaled about 2 hours for the job...

After that I put on the dash and replaced the knee bolster and put everything back in place on the dash (sorry, no pics of that tonight)..

Here are the pics..

Here is the engine all torn down...


Fans removed


(TIP!) Drivers side fan could not be removed unless this cooler line is removed..


View from under...


Close up... Note the coolant pipes, those are in the way of two of the bolts... Gently pry it back for room to remove them, then remove the valve cover....



Prep for install


Torquing the bolts to 89 in-lbs


Sewing up the patient..


All back together...

... ... .. .........

01-24-17, 02:20 PM
Amazing thread.
Thanks for all of the pictures and information.
Do you have any updated information about your Caddy?

01-24-17, 02:35 PM
If your question is to the OP, he hasn't signed in since 08-24-14.