: Mercedes Benz to abadon Camshafts first?



Stoneage_Caddy
03-08-05, 02:10 PM
I thought renault was going to beat everyone to Camless engine but it looks like Benz will do it first :
http://www.thecarconnection.com/images/gallery/tmb/9283_image.jpg

This is the very first sighting of the 2008 Mercedes C-Class and although it's heavily disguised, the timing is significant - indicating the W204 (as it's known by its internal codename) is right on schedule.


The next generation C-Class will arrive in the 2007 calendar year, followed twelve months later by the wagon version. And although it's hard to tell from these pictures, the new C-Class is expected to be much sportier and no longer just a downsized S-Class, but a more modern Benz which hope to gain the attention of younger and less conservative buyers.

The rear-wheel-drive sedan will be the first powered with Benz' KDI EVT (electronic valvetrain without camshafts; supercharged and direct-injected) engines, and will incorporate other new technologies including the third-generation 4Matic all-wheel-drive system.

But as independent and modern as the new C-Class looks, it will be sharing even more component-wise with E- and S-Class models.
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=8250&sid=178&n=158

the new C

90Brougham350
03-08-05, 02:32 PM
Well if that isn't just nutty, I don't know what is! Hell, I still have trouble with engines that don't have pushrods. How does it work?

Brian

Stoneage_Caddy
03-08-05, 02:43 PM
what camless ?

Are you familiar with starters ? namely starter solenoids? Imagine a starter solenoid perched on top of a normal valve ...when you energize the solenoid it pops the valve open ...when you disconect ground it closes the valve....

this isnt 100% accurate for all applications of it but its a general working idea some makers are useing pressureized oil , and in formual one they use comrpessed air ...still controlled by a solenoid and computer but it uses the oil or air to do the work .

Its gonna make gas and diesel engine very effiecnt ...you know how honda has variable valve timing ? well its one problem is it is limited by the camshaft to how much lift and duration (how far open and how long the valve is open) , ditch the camshaft and you can give the exact timing needed to make the engine its most powerful at any RPM weather its 21,500 or 300 ...it will make the most power possible out of the engine....

You can also run very high compression engines with the system , since you can play with how long the valves stay open you can vary the "mean effective compression ratio" (what the acutal compression is as the engine is runnign with its cam timing) from a very tame 8.5:1 to a hell rasieing 12:1

the possiblites are endless ...lemme grubn up some stuff for you on it ...

sorry one of my favorite subjects

Stoneage_Caddy
03-08-05, 02:47 PM
link to a diesel , nice picture here :
http://www.mrtruck.net/camlesslaneesc.htm

90Brougham350
03-08-05, 08:03 PM
OK, this makes perfect sense now, good God, this is a fanstastic idea! This puts the finest Lunati hydraulic roller to shame! The idea of going from a 2 stroke to a 4 stroke to an 8 stroke really caught my eye. Think we'll see an American camless engine anytime in the next few years?

Brian

Stoneage_Caddy
03-08-05, 08:04 PM
the first indication when we will get this stuff is when cars go to a 48 volt system , the big restriction from what i understand is there is already such a huge load ont he 12v system that they need more pwer to run these solenoids

Vesicant
03-08-05, 08:05 PM
I have some bad feelings...when Mercedes does it atleast.



Im wondering, would this make timing harder or easier to do on an engine?

Ralph
03-08-05, 08:07 PM
Sorry to differ for a sec. from the topic, but that's the next C-Class!!?? It looks more like what the Dodge Charger should have looked like!

Stoneage_Caddy
03-08-05, 08:09 PM
I have some bad feelings...when Mercedes does it atleast.



Im wondering, would this make timing harder or easier to do on an engine?
easier ....just ensure the Crankshaft position sensor is correct ....computer will take care of the rest

i can see crane cams devloping "virtual camshafts" for cars ...thatll be awesome ....

tuning posibilites are endless

Stoneage_Caddy
03-08-05, 08:11 PM
OK, this makes perfect sense now, good God, this is a fanstastic idea! This puts the finest Lunati hydraulic roller to shame!
Brian
BTW i think the Cadillac 4.9 had hydrolic roller lifters in it ....which i belive puts it before lunati ....ill have to look into it but im pretty sure it does

Sinister Angel
03-08-05, 08:46 PM
easier ....just ensure the Crankshaft position sensor is correct ....computer will take care of the rest

i can see crane cams devloping "virtual camshafts" for cars ...thatll be awesome ....

tuning posibilites are endless


Oh well, gear heads would spend days just tweaking their "cams" on dynos and shit!


Some of the huge slow speed diesels (mitubishi makes one I think) use a pneumatically operated valve system.

Stoneage_Caddy
03-08-05, 08:52 PM
good point dude , ive heard of these type things on those diesels...

Id like to work with the huge marine diesels but i cant stand the thought of being trapped on a boat ...well that and im afraid of big boats ...thats in addition to flight , my own shadow , and most disney characters ....lol

danbuc
03-08-05, 10:10 PM
I wonder how many TSB are going to be sent out, within the first few months of sales. That is a funky looking disguise they have on that car. Kind of reminds me of like a old boxy Jetta or something, with all those square edges. I wonder how much different from the new S class it will actually look like, seeing as how it look like every other car on the road now.