: bump stops



juiceE
02-28-05, 02:04 PM
i installed a pair of zq8 bump stops, in place of my old ones, which when i took them off, i noticed that they were split and cracked down the middle, no wonder when i hit a bump i got jarred so much. well since my car is lowered, these help out alot, feels like a newr car's suspension. i bet they would feel even better on a car with the regular stock springs

for $20 this was a good investment

Katshot
02-28-05, 02:16 PM
i installed a pair of zq8 bump stops, in place of my old ones, which when i took them off, i noticed that they were split and cracked down the middle, no wonder when i hit a bump i got jarred so much. well since my car is lowered, these help out alot, feels like a newr car's suspension. i bet they would feel even better on a car with the regular stock springs

for $20 this was a good investment


What are "zq8 bump stops"?
I just cut my OEM ones down a little after I lowered MY car. :confused:

Kevin Donovan
'95 Cadillac FTS
(Click the link to see my car)
http://members.cardomain.com/katshot

HotRodSaint
02-28-05, 02:22 PM
What are "zq8 bump stops"?
I just cut my OEM ones down a little after I lowered MY car. :confused:

They are from the Chevy Extreme, and are supposed to act as an absorber, not just a stop. In other words, they become progressively stiffer thus you don't 'bottom out'.

scurling
02-28-05, 06:17 PM
Do you have a part number for the zq8 bump stops, or could a dealer interpret the RPO code and come up with it?

DPGC23
02-28-05, 07:35 PM
Mann

Im Trying 2 See Ur Car Man, It Wont Let Me


Dpgc23

ocjmakaveli
02-28-05, 11:06 PM
zq8 bump stops have been around for years here's one of many good posts on this subject the part #15956547 7.99 each try www.gmpartsdirect.com (http://www.gmpartsdirect.com) for the best online price

http://www.impalassforum.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=16;t=002745

VERY EASY TO INSTALL

I would definitely recommend these for any car regardless if the car is lowered or not. They help on potholes mostly when the car wants to bottom out I haven't really bottomed out since I added these not that I used to often but I have noticed a difference when I go to chicago and drive on city streets it's not as rough.

while we're at it you guys should try out this other mod for a better ride.

http://www.impalassforum.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=16&t=002000

I'm feeling nice TODAY so I took 30 minutes of my time to find this dang post I had it somewhere but i lost it and it wasn't as easy to find cause it's Oooold this post has the best mods that every fleetwood owner should do Let me know if you like them..;)

http://impalassforum.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=000436#000000

Katshot
03-01-05, 03:08 PM
Good info.
The question would have to be asked....WHY were the mounts intentionally left out?

ocjmakaveli
03-01-05, 05:27 PM
this is as close to a reply as i could find to why they are missing.....





The body bolts go up through the lower cushion, the frame, the upper cushion, and thread into a hole in the body. When tightened down, this results in a firm mount, yet one, which helps to isolate vibration between the frame and body. Note that the lower cushion is made of rubber about 2" in diameter and includes an integral washer molded into the bottom.
There are a total of 7 of these body mounts on each side of the frame, or 14 total for the vehicle. They are numbered from the front to the rear, with the first #1 mount being located right behind and inboard of the front wheels below the cowl. Mount #2 is about 6" outboard of the first mount, and mount #3 (see note below) is a foot or so further down the frame, below the B-pillar area. Mount #4 is directly in front of the rear wheels, where the frame starts to curve inward. Mount #5 is at the top of the frame next to each rear wheel, and is unique in that there is no bolt running through it. The #5 upper cushion merely snaps into a hole in the frame, and the weight of the body holds it in place. Mount numbers 6 and 7 are along the rear part of the frame, with #7 at the far rear just in front of the bumper supports.

OK, I guess you've waited long enough. The amazing discovery I made, and the essential difference between the standard B-cars (including the Impala) and the heavy duty Caprice 9C1 models, is that for all '94-'96 B-cars EXCEPT the 9C1 models, the factory LEFT OUT the lower body mount cushions for the FRONT THREE mounts on both sides of the vehicle!!! Instead of a lower body mount with integral washer, they use the large washer alone, which is left hanging about 3/4"-1" below the frame, as the bolt bottoms out in the body with the head hanging about that distance below. This means that essentially the entire front half of the vehicle is NOT really ATTACHED to the frame, but merely RESTS on it instead. You can actually JACK UP on the body, and lift it AN INCH OFF the frame, before the washer will finally contact the frame and prevent any further separation!
This to me was astonishing, and at first I thought I was looking at a defect unique to my Impala (gee, a defect? on a Chevy? <g> ). But this was no isolated assembly-line glitch, since every single Impala I have checked since is missing the same three front lower body mounts on each side. I could also clearly see that my 9C1, and EVERY 9C1 I have checked in fact HAS these mounts, which explained to me the critical difference in their handling. You can do all you want to improve springs, shocks, swaybars, and control arms, but these upgrades don't work as well as they should if the body is not firmly attached to the frame!!
Further investigation showed that this disturbing "defect" was actually intentional, amazing as that may sound. Technical Service Bulletin (TSB) number 43-20-01, titled "Information on Body Mount" and issued on 08/18/94 has the story. Here is the text of that bulletin:
SUBJECT: BODY MOUNT ASSEMBLY DESIGN CHANGE

MODELS: 1994 CHEVROLET CAPRICE WITH RPO'S FE1, FE2, FE3, FE4 OR F41

THIS BULLETIN IS BEING ISSUED TO CLARIFY AN INTERIM BODY MOUNT ASSEMBLY DESIGN CHANGE AFFECTING CERTAIN MOUNT LOCATIONS WITH RPO FE1, FE2, FE3, FE4 OR F41 SUSPENSION LEVELS AND ASSEMBLED AFTER VIN BREAKPOINT RR 138000.

THE DESIGN CHANGE TO THE BODY MOUNT ASSEMBLY ELIMINATES THE BODY BOLT LOWER CUSHION ASSEMBLY AND REPLACES IT WITH A FLAT METALLIC RETAINER/WASHER AT THE 1, 2 AND 3 MOUNT POSITIONS.
I noted that this bulletin DOES NOT include the SEO 7B3 suspension which is standard on the Caprice 9C1, hence they still received the proper 1, 2 and 3 mounts, even though ALL of the other B-cars (including the Impala) did NOT.
So, the first thing I did after finding this out was to order the "missing" mounts and install them on my Impala. The installation is very easy as you will see, and only takes a few minutes. Upon my first drive after installing the missing mounts I could instantly feel the difference. It was amazing, the car now felt much more solid and tight. My Impala FINALLY had the same tight feel as I had experienced in my Caprice 9C1s!

evilrussian
03-01-05, 07:24 PM
I better get some of those bumpstops too, I know I'm missing one on the driver's side. Even though my Cad is not lowered and the chances of bottoming out with my KYB's are very slim, that shite is firm hehe....

I found an article on the web (googled 9C1 info) a while back about body bushings on 9C1s and couldn't beleive that Impalas didn't have them on, after all it was supposed to be a better handling car.

HotRodSaint
03-01-05, 07:48 PM
WHY were the mounts intentionally left out?

Didn't the Fleetwood receive these mounts?

adam_mcd
03-01-05, 08:17 PM
ok quick question: are there any...oh, modified versions of these bumpstops to fit, say, a 79 coupe deville? i was rootin around on that forum and heard something about taller bumpstops? and if i wanted to lower my car, would i have to trim these tpyes of bumpstops?

ocjmakaveli
03-01-05, 08:45 PM
ok quick question: are there any...oh, modified versions of these bumpstops to fit, say, a 79 coupe deville? i was rootin around on that forum and heard something about taller bumpstops? and if i wanted to lower my car, would i have to trim these tpyes of bumpstops?

occasionally you need to trim them very little about 1/8 of an inch but I doubt it's necessary most times anyway because they will help cushion the ride and the harsher ride will exist with a lowered car regardless of what people say nonetheless you WILL get used to it and you won't notice it much after a few weeks :yup:

heres a pic of the newer bump stop if the one on your vehicle is similar then you can use this one but if the bolt under it is not the same then your out of luck. I would think there aren't many type of bump stops but who knows really just remove yours and check out how it looks heres a pic of the newer and older one the foam one is the new zq8 bump stop

http://safeplexsystems.com/images/Impala/Bump/bumpc.jpg

ocjmakaveli
03-01-05, 08:47 PM
here are a few more pics btw I want to thank whomever it was who originally took these pics.

TAKE NOTE THIS IS A LOWERED CAR I BELIEVE because on my car with the newer bump stops I have about an inch maybe more of space in between.

http://safeplexsystems.com/images/Impala/Bump/bumpb.jpghttp://safeplexsystems.com/images/Impala/Bump/bumpa.jpg

N0DIH
03-01-05, 08:47 PM
I better get some of those bumpstops too, I know I'm missing one on the driver's side. Even though my Cad is not lowered and the chances of bottoming out with my KYB's are very slim, that shite is firm hehe....

I found an article on the web (googled 9C1 info) a while back about body bushings on 9C1s and couldn't beleive that Impalas didn't have them on, after all it was supposed to be a better handling car.

To think on my 80 Turbo Trans AM I removed the bump stops because the car WAS too low! (factory hieight)

If you are contacting them all the time as I was, it makes for a harsh ride.

I was around 1 inch from them at rest. So it didn't take much to contact them.

Tom

ocjmakaveli
03-01-05, 08:53 PM
Didn't the Fleetwood receive these mounts?

well first of all the fleetwood received softer mounts but it is missing a few in front area(i think) and some of the rear ones are naturally smaller than the space they are required to fill thus leaving slack in between(although this might also happen with time if you think about it)

At the least I would recommend adding the 3 missing lower mounts which leave slack and you WILL feel a slightly tighter response when turning with adding the missing mounts.

I replaced all lower mounts etc. which was very easy just took some time.

I will and would recommend replacing all bushings for a better ride.

We all know the difference between riding on 10 year old bushings and new bushings which are basically what keeps the body from hitting the frame.

ocjmakaveli
03-01-05, 08:55 PM
To think on my 80 Turbo Trans AM I removed the bump stops because the car WAS too low! (factory hieight)

If you are contacting them all the time as I was, it makes for a harsh ride.

I was around 1 inch from them at rest. So it didn't take much to contact them.

Tom

I don't think that was a good idea actually a little dangerous you don't want your suspension going so low and your suspension parts will make contact in ways they weren't meant to.

would've been better to either replace the coil springs for a slightly higher height or trimming the bump stops.

FASSTWOOD
03-01-05, 10:58 PM
You guys are talking about two different suspension mods. The body bushings are one mod and the bump stops are another mod. The caddies came with the the lower body bushings although by now they're probably shot (one of my first mods).

N0DIH
03-02-05, 12:54 AM
I don't think that was a good idea actually a little dangerous you don't want your suspension going so low and your suspension parts will make contact in ways they weren't meant to.

would've been better to either replace the coil springs for a slightly higher height or trimming the bump stops.

Actually looking at the pictures on this thread my T/A differs only in that there is a hard metal stop that is riveted (like 3/8" rivets) to the lower control arms. It was about 1/2in before arm to frame to contact. So I felt it was safe enough. The regular stops were contacted most of the time on bumps, causing rough ride and poor suspension operation.

As for new springs, the car had 30K miles on it, this is just how low those cars rode, factory. I always figured that I would cut them down to around 1in overall, but never did it.... In all my driving I never contacted the hard stop. No obvious contact with it. I did some racing with the car in Autocross and drove the car hard for cornering.

But your comments are valid. Don't remove them on the B/D body cars, mine was an exception because it still had a hard stop in place.

Tom

ocjmakaveli
03-02-05, 03:04 AM
Actually looking at the pictures on this thread my T/A differs only in that there is a hard metal stop that is riveted (like 3/8" rivets) to the lower control arms. It was about 1/2in before arm to frame to contact. So I felt it was safe enough. The regular stops were contacted most of the time on bumps, causing rough ride and poor suspension operation.

As for new springs, the car had 30K miles on it, this is just how low those cars rode, factory. I always figured that I would cut them down to around 1in overall, but never did it.... In all my driving I never contacted the hard stop. No obvious contact with it. I did some racing with the car in Autocross and drove the car hard for cornering.

But your comments are valid. Don't remove them on the B/D body cars, mine was an exception because it still had a hard stop in place.

Tom

oh ok cool I was just talking in reference to most stock cars because average cars do contact teh bump stops every once in a while.

Katshot
03-02-05, 06:50 AM
To be honest, I never noticed the missing mounts. I HAVE noticed the slack in many body mounts but IMO, that is due to the upper mount collapsing, not an incorrect OEM installation since I've only witnessed that slack in older cars. I'd still like to know (possibly from the OEM service bulletin) WHY they left out the mounts.
As for the bump-stops pictured here, they would NOT work on MY at least. I had to damn near cut the OEM stop in half to stop the harsh ride caused by near constant contact. There's no way that new mount would even come close to fitting in that spot on MY car due to the new ride height.

N0DIH
03-02-05, 02:06 PM
On the G Body, Buick left out the one on top of the frame rail going over the rear axle. Position #5. Even on the GN and GNX. It was for a softer ride. All the GP's, MonteCarslo's and Cutlasses had them.

Check out:
http://www.theherd.com/articles/bushings.html (Impala)

and

https://www.kirbanperformance.com/gnx.htm

and

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:QcV43qUw9xEJ:www.gnttype.org/techarea/suspension/Suspension.html+regal+frame+bushing&hl=en (this is the cached page, the actual site is down right now)

I guess they figured that Cadillac owners want a mushy ride....

Tom

juiceE
03-02-05, 02:13 PM
i've always been thinking of replacing the bushings... i think i even posted questions about it b4 on this forum.

i havent checked under the car yet, so does the Wood have the 3 mounts/bushings discussed?

im really not lookin for a harsher ride, im lookin for the "cushiest" ride possible. after reading all the posts on the impala boards it seams that replacing the upper bushings would make the most sense, but it seams too complicated for me to do.

who has just done the 3 front bushings? and hows the after affect?

who here has replaced all the bottom bushings on their fwb? and do u recommend?

and has any one replaced all the bushings?, i prolly wouldnt have enough money for all that any way, just asking

juiceE
03-02-05, 02:17 PM
one more question,

about the zq8 bump stops....
mine has slight contact with the frame @ rest... should i cut it down to allow for 1/8" travel b4 contact? because i was thinking that it would fully compress @ a faster rate causeing the jarring of full impact? is this whats happeneing or should i leave it as is...
like i sed b4, im trying to get as cushy as a ride as possible with the limitations im working with :yup:

juiceE
03-02-05, 02:39 PM
opps, one more

after lookin @ that picture (posted to show how the bump stop looks in position) in comparing to how mine looks i notice a difference :

the arm thats comin in from the right side an curves horizontally into another vertival bar bolted in between two black bushing looking things... well on mine, them bushings are really squished... are they easy to replace? just unscrew and replace? any specific part #'s?

thanx

scurling
03-02-05, 08:04 PM
Juice,

Those are the sway bar connector links. The are easily to replace, as they are just straight bolts. You have the original black rubber bushings installed, which tend to retain more water/moisture and eventually rust the bolt to the point of breaking. I have had one side break on two different cars. If that happens, you will hear a rattle or knock when you go over bumps. New factory links have the Neopreen bushings available.

PNs:
07243/10178646 Insulator (bushing)
07240/464167 Link

The links are sold separately and come with the bolt, bushings, and I think even a new spacer. Save your old spacer in case I am wrong about that, unless you just want to replace it for looks. I paid $13.58/each for the link and $7.84 each for the bushings at the local Chevy dealer. They are probably available at any local parts store. They came marked at Delco kit #45G0065.

If you change them, make sure the wheel assemblys are level so there will be no spring load (torque) in the sway bar. If you don't have a lift, or pit access, just put both sides on jack stands and let the rotor assemblys hang free. A floor jack may be helpful to maneuver the rotor assembly to get the new link installed. If I remember, I think the lower control arm hangs a little lower than the length of the bolt.

ocjmakaveli
03-03-05, 02:08 AM
one more question,

about the zq8 bump stops....
mine has slight contact with the frame @ rest... should i cut it down to allow for 1/8" travel b4 contact? because i was thinking that it would fully compress @ a faster rate causeing the jarring of full impact? is this whats happeneing or should i leave it as is...
like i sed b4, im trying to get as cushy as a ride as possible with the limitations im working with :yup:

in my opinion i think the ride would remain the same regardless if you cut the foam bump stops because they are compressable and they would compress to about the same height and leaving it as it was meant to be originally would probably give you the best ride overall cause it would do the most to cushion the impact.


are you sure it touches when the car is at rest on level pavement? does it touch on both sides?

how does the ride feel now?

juiceE
03-03-05, 11:55 AM
It Touches @ Rest On Level, But It Just Kisses It

It Feels Alot Better, B4 It Would Always Hit The Original, Cracked, Misaligned Bump Stop An Would Make For A Really Harsh Ride, Now Its Nice And Cushy

When I Get Sum Extra Money I Think Ill Switch Up My Springs, Right Now I Got The Impala Ss

Plus Im Very Interested In Replaceing The Bushings

WHERE IN ILL U STAY BY?

ocjmakaveli
03-03-05, 03:28 PM
romeoville close to bolingbrook and joliet.

the sway bar bushings are easy you can just go to autozone and buy a set there all you ahve to do is measure the metal part on your sway bar bushings and buy one the same size the set is about 10 per side in autozone and it will improve the turning but it will give a slightly rougher ride.

FASSTWOOD
03-04-05, 12:18 AM
To be honest, I never noticed the missing mounts. I HAVE noticed the slack in many body mounts but IMO, that is due to the upper mount collapsing, not an incorrect OEM installation since I've only witnessed that slack in older cars. I'd still like to know (possibly from the OEM service bulletin) WHY they left out the mounts.
As for the bump-stops pictured here, they would NOT work on MY at least. I had to damn near cut the OEM stop in half to stop the harsh ride caused by near constant contact. There's no way that new mount would even come close to fitting in that spot on MY car due to the new ride height.

Katshot, my car is also lowered and I thought the same thing. My opinion now after installing these in my 95, is that that they are great. They don't let the the suspension bottom out.

ocjmakaveli
03-04-05, 04:39 AM
bottom line is these foam bump stops dont stop the suspension they SLOW it down giving a better ride overall.

N0DIH
03-04-05, 08:24 PM
It Touches @ Rest On Level, But It Just Kisses It

It Feels Alot Better, B4 It Would Always Hit The Original, Cracked, Misaligned Bump Stop An Would Make For A Really Harsh Ride, Now Its Nice And Cushy

When I Get Sum Extra Money I Think Ill Switch Up My Springs, Right Now I Got The Impala Ss

Impala SS Springs too stiff or too soft?

I have V4P springs now, they seem decent, no complaints from me yet.

Tom

ocjmakaveli
03-05-05, 05:55 AM
impala ss springs are stiff gives you a sports car ride all bumpy as hell

HotRodSaint
03-05-05, 11:15 AM
impala ss springs are stiff gives you a sports car ride all bumpy as hell

Impala SS spings are soft and no where near stiff nor do they produce a bumpy ride.

In fact, not one passenger will ever notice that it's not a factory Cadillac ride, it's that comfortable.

I'm even starting to think they might be a little too soft.

HotRodSaint
03-05-05, 11:17 AM
I have V4P springs now, they seem decent, no complaints from me yet.

V4p springs? Are those from the 9C1?

If so, I think the spring rate is nearly same as the SS.

The ride height is lower with the SS springs. Some may like that, others might not.

N0DIH
10-22-05, 01:07 PM
From what a friend of mine who is a cop said, the 9C1 cars were pretty stiff. Mine (V4P) isn't what I could call stiff. It still leans a lot in corners. My T/A is stiffer, and I always wanted to put stiffer ones in it (mine was NOT WS6, it was F41).

The picture above shows the car sitting on the bumpers, the looks like a miserable ride. I thought my T/A was riding bad when there was only 1 in between the bump stops and the frame.

I might go for them, or Autozone has some energy suspension bumpers.