: New virus targets on-board car computers



D148L0
02-06-05, 04:25 PM
Owners of vehicles with onboard computers should brace themselves for an onslaught by hi-tech criminals who are causing havoc by infecting the devices with viruses.

Those with systems such as satellite navigation have been warned to secure the devices, after reports last week that the on-board computers of several Lexus models in the United States had been infected via cellphones.

And security experts in South Africa believe it is only a matter of time before local vehicles are targeted.

Ian Melamed, principal consultant at Shaya Technologies in Johannesburg, said computer viruses were now so widespread, they were starting to attack new devices such as cellphones and even on-board computers in cars.
“If a device can carry data, it can carry a computer virus,” he said.

Melamed said about 150 000 cars in the US had been affected last week.

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=31&art_id=vn20050206103416386C152071

Ralph
02-06-05, 04:29 PM
We should have seen this coming! So if Onstar is not activated, are you safe??!!

D148L0
02-06-05, 04:39 PM
I would say so. It would be like not having your PC connected to the internet...

CoupeDevilleRob
02-06-05, 04:44 PM
It's stuff like this that is going to make me keep my ancient car forever. If you ask me, it's only a matter of time before something like Skynet from the Terminator movies takes over the world.

danbuc
02-06-05, 04:45 PM
It's only going to get worse when manufactures start switching to wireless diagnostic equipment using technology such as bluetooth. When it happens, and it's going to, that going to be a real pain to keep secure. Maybe car manufactures should start programming build in firewals into the onboard computers. I wonder if SmoothWall would work on a newer caddy? :p

Playdrv4me
02-07-05, 01:11 AM
Yea, I posted the Lexus story a few days ago. Im not surprised, and I pretty much was just waiting to see when it was going to happen finally. Seems Toyota is a little razzed by the whole incident. All it takes is one single software pathway between the Navigation computer/Bluetooth interface and the ECU/BCU to wreak some serious havoc...

Kev
02-07-05, 01:39 AM
Now that the conspiracy issue has emerged, I have wondered about systems such as OnStar, wether it is possible for the manufacturer or anyone else to communicate with the system even if the customer has not subscribed. It seems to me that it would be awfully convenient for control freaks.

Hypothetically;
Danbuc makes an error on his tax return and the IRS wishes to speak to him at thier earliest convenience. So, using thier governmental privilages, they access the system in his car, determine his location and at the next red light, his car dies and won't start again.

I dunno, call me paranoid if you will, but too many inventions have been introduced with the promise of improving quality of life only to be exploited by people who want to rule over their brothers.

Kev

Vesicant
02-07-05, 01:46 AM
Now that the conspiracy issue has emerged, I have wondered about systems such as OnStar, wether it is possible for the manufacturer or anyone else to communicate with the system even if the customer has not subscribed. It seems to me that it would be awfully convenient for control freaks.

Hypothetically;
Danbuc makes an error on his tax return and the IRS wishes to speak to him at thier earliest convenience. So, using thier governmental privilages, they access the system in his car, determine his location and at the next red light, his car dies and won't start again.

I dunno, call me paranoid if you will, but too many inventions have been introduced with the promise of improving quality of life only to be exploited by people who want to rule over their brothers.

Kev

I donno, wouldnt the IRS rather take him to court than stall him? They know where hes at anyways so its easy to drag him in :p

My fear is that hackers could get into your car and stall the vehicle while your say merging or at high throttle load, destroy the cars PCM or fry anything related...($$$ Repairs). not to mention controlling the cars speed or braking abillity causing fatal results.

danbuc
02-07-05, 01:49 AM
That would SUCK!. Speaking about tax returns....some one owes me some money....and I'm going to collect. :ripped: :dammit:

Kev
02-07-05, 02:04 AM
I donno, wouldnt the IRS rather take him to court than stall him? They know where hes at anyways so its easy to drag him in :p

My fear is that hackers could get into your car and stall the vehicle while your say merging or at high throttle load, destroy the cars PCM or fry anything related...($$$ Repairs). not to mention controlling the cars speed or braking abillity causing fatal results.
Either way you look at it, there could be a miriad of negative scenarios from pimply faced, adolecsent miscreants gleefully playing around with the latest little gem they've appropriated or writen to criminal to abusive governmental egomaniacs. AHHHHHH!!! :eek:

Kev

evilrussian
02-07-05, 02:07 AM
Wait, next thing will be annoying porn popups on your nav screen :histeric:

Vesicant
02-07-05, 02:09 AM
:blasted: :rofl: :histeric:

Kev
02-07-05, 02:09 AM
Wait, next thing will be annoying porn popups on your nav screen :histeric:
I don't know, Ralph might actually enjoy that? Just kidding Ralph! :bouncy:

Kev

Jesda
02-07-05, 05:13 AM
Stories like this make you want to turn a hot rod with a small block chevy into your daily driver.... nahhhh :D

Hoop
02-07-05, 11:50 AM
haha, good thing this doesnt mess with older system computers, kinda like the one in my Caddy. It does have the HT4100 though, so I guess matters couldnt get any worse..:p

D148L0
02-07-05, 12:07 PM
I donno, wouldnt the IRS rather take him to court than stall him? They know where hes at anyways so its easy to drag him in :p

My fear is that hackers could get into your car and stall the vehicle while your say merging or at high throttle load, destroy the cars PCM or fry anything related...($$$ Repairs). not to mention controlling the cars speed or braking abillity causing fatal results.
Guess what, right now a new system targets a car electronics to make it stall, supposedly it is going to be used by police officers to end high speed chases while leaving the driver the means to safely control the car to a stop.
Lemme see if I can find the link.

D148L0
02-07-05, 12:11 PM
AHA!!! Here it is:

If a Los Angeles-area scientist has his way, car chases may become as antiquated as horse-mounted cavalry.

James Tatoian, chief executive of Eureka Aerospace in Pasadena, California, is developing a system that uses microwave energy to interfere with microchips inside cars. Once the chip is overloaded with excessive current, the car ceases to function, and will gradually decelerate on its own, he said.

http://www.wired.com/news/autotech/0,2554,66473,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_4

ShadowLvr400
02-07-05, 12:50 PM
Another reason I stick to older cars. OnStar's bad enough, monitoring how I drive, andcalling if I have too much fun (wait till the govt decides to use it to write you tickets) but insurance companies are going to give discounts to people who let computer nannies ride in their cars. How long before you HAVE to put one in to get insurance? Computers in cars are getting more and more dangerous for those of us who skirt legality now and again. Now even those who are legal, can have dangers from the machines. Fun fun.

Kev
02-07-05, 02:06 PM
Another reason I stick to older cars. OnStar's bad enough, monitoring how I drive, andcalling if I have too much fun (wait till the govt decides to use it to write you tickets) but insurance companies are going to give discounts to people who let computer nannies ride in their cars. How long before you HAVE to put one in to get insurance? Computers in cars are getting more and more dangerous for those of us who skirt legality now and again. Now even those who are legal, can have dangers from the machines. Fun fun.
At the risk of turning this thread political, this smells like further indication of the existence of those who think the masses don't know whats best for them and must be relegated to the subjugation of their superiors, the intelectual - political elite.

SHHhhhh!!!!! Did you hear that?! THEY'RE COMMING FOR ME!!! OH NOOOO!! :disappoin

Kev

D148L0
02-07-05, 02:24 PM
Add me to the paranoid, tin-hat wearing list...

Kev
02-07-05, 02:35 PM
Add me to the paranoid, tin-hat wearing list...
Aluminum foil is better at keeping the bad mind rays out, but don't use Reynolds, they're in cahoots with THEM!

Kev

Playdrv4me
02-07-05, 03:53 PM
Aluminum foil is better at keeping the bad mind rays out, but don't use Reynolds, they're in cahoots with THEM!

Kev

The truth is out there...

Vesicant
02-07-05, 05:13 PM
AHA!!! Here it is:

If a Los Angeles-area scientist has his way, car chases may become as antiquated as horse-mounted cavalry.

James Tatoian, chief executive of Eureka Aerospace in Pasadena, California, is developing a system that uses microwave energy to interfere with microchips inside cars. Once the chip is overloaded with excessive current, the car ceases to function, and will gradually decelerate on its own, he said.

http://www.wired.com/news/autotech/0,2554,66473,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_4

Ahah.. see, if hackers get ahold of something like that... its alll over.

Lets all revert back to mechanically run diesel engines so not even an electromagnetic pulse from nuclear weapons can slow us down... well, except for the radiation and the blast. :coolgleam

Kev
02-07-05, 05:24 PM
Ahah.. see, if hackers get ahold of something like that... its alll over.

Lets all revert back to mechanically run diesel engines so not even an electromagnetic pulse from nuclear weapons can slow us down... well, except for the radiation and the blast. :coolgleam
Ooh! Radiation and bomb blasts, I hate those, they leave marks! :mad: :bighead: :vomit:

Kev

ShadowLvr400
02-08-05, 02:19 AM
I'm actually serious. Some auto insurance companies offer discounted rates if you volunteer to let them install an auto nanny on your car. It logs how often you drive, how hard you hit your brakes, how fast you go, avg speeds, etc. I wonder how long before that becomes a standard issue item to even be accepted for insurance. (These can be installed on any car too btw.)
OnStar knows enough of whats going on, that when it senses you MIGHT have had an accident, it calls those little people for help. It does not wait for airbag deployment, as Car and Driver found out. Auotcross testing prompted repeated calls from OnStar to check on them. And via GPS, OnStar knew where they were too.
The systems are getting in place folks, within 5 years, most insurance companies will probably begin pushing for the auto nannies in all new cars. Under the premise of "helping lower rates for responsible drivers". Systems that monitor your cars will get longer memories, and be usable against you by law enforcement in accidents. (Already happened in a few cases.) It's not conspiracy theories, it's just the reality of government and those in power. Govt and Companies both like power over the masses. It slowly happens, and always happens.

danbuc
02-08-05, 03:01 AM
Hmmmm....I think I'm going to have to invest in some shielding against elctromagnetic, or radio frequency interefence from John Q Law. I don't wan't to be driving down the street, and have my computer destroyed, just because I forgot to signal when I changed lanes. I can already imaginge all the furture law suits in my head, that are going to happen because of this kind of stuff. I guess that's the price we pay for inovation.

evilrussian
02-08-05, 03:08 AM
I guess it's good news for programmers and engineers. Opens doors for opportunities to secure automotive computer systems. If things didn't break or became vulnerable to hacking there would be no use for people who would fix them.

danbuc
02-08-05, 03:10 AM
Good Point. More job oportunities to help better the economy. :thumbsup:

Kev
02-08-05, 03:13 AM
I guess it's good news for programmers and engineers. Opens doors for opportunities to secure automotive computer systems. If things didn't break or became vulnerable to hacking there would be no use for people who would fix them.
Interesting thought..... Hmmmm..... makes you wonder if the hackers aren't on the covert payrolls of Symantec and McAfee..... Hmmm? :suspect:

Kev

CharBroiled
02-08-05, 09:48 AM
If a Los Angeles-area scientist has his way, car chases may become as antiquated as horse-mounted cavalry.

James Tatoian, chief executive of Eureka Aerospace in Pasadena, California, is developing a system that uses microwave energy to interfere with microchips inside cars. Once the chip is overloaded with excessive current, the car ceases to function, and will gradually decelerate on its own, he said.

http://www.wired.com/news/autotech/0,2554,66473,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_4

I wonder how accurate a device like that is. How would you like computer problems down the road from "near misses" and what happensd to laptop computers nearby?

CharBroiled
02-08-05, 09:53 AM
Some auto insurance companies offer discounted rates if you volunteer to let them install an auto nanny on your car. It logs how often you drive, how hard you hit your brakes, how fast you go, avg speeds, etc. I wonder how long before that becomes a standard issue item to even be accepted for insurance. (These can be installed on any car too btw.)
[...]
The systems are getting in place folks, within 5 years, most insurance companies will probably begin pushing for the auto nannies in all new cars. Under the premise of "helping lower rates for responsible drivers". Systems that monitor your cars will get longer memories, and be usable against you by law enforcement in accidents. (Already happened in a few cases.) It's not conspiracy theories, it's just the reality of government and those in power. Govt and Companies both like power over the masses. It slowly happens, and always happens.

Ive heard of this too. Even if not mandatory to have a "nanny" installed you can be sure that if you dont install it your rates will be through the roof. And black boxes that know the speed and brake position are already here in some cars.

D148L0
02-08-05, 11:38 AM
Right now there are cell-phone disablers available to the public. No cell phones in a small area immediate to the device. Expensive as hell, and so far not in USA (that I know of).

Some other people would like a similar device to turn off "boom cars", and of course, there is somebody out there trying to make one...

CharBroiled
02-10-05, 07:19 AM
Yeah they use it in movie theaters and resterants. Its just a jammer basically.