: C&D say the 3series is dethroned...



M5eater
05-28-13, 11:57 AM
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/habemus-papem-2013-bmw-335i-m-sport-vs-2013-cadillac-ats-36-2014-lexus-is350-f-sport-comparison-test


But after we cycled through the cars on our Hill Country loop, the question on everybody’s mind was one vocalized by technical editor K.C. Colwell: “Is it possible that the BMW has the worst steering here?” With the F30, BMW wavered. This is the first 3-series that feels less thoroughly engineered than its competition. It’s competent, it’s spacious, it’s comfortable; but in comparison with other cars in its segment, the 3-series is undercooked.

what irks me is that the ATS is constantly berraged for lack of rear seat room, and yet the E46 is widely upheld as the best of-all 3 series. Which guess what--- has no rear seatroom!

flycaster
05-28-13, 12:24 PM
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/habemus-papem-2013-bmw-335i-m-sport-vs-2013-cadillac-ats-36-2014-lexus-is350-f-sport-comparison-test
what irks me is that the ATS is constantly berraged for lack of rear seat room, and yet the E46 is widely upheld as the best of-all 3 series. Which guess what--- has no rear seatroom!

I'll agree with you on those two points: The E46 was the best of the lot (and still is); and yes, its back seat was small...but never a problem; and similarly so for the ATS - no problem. However, I do have to admit, that some of the older folks may have to think things out before entering/exiting the back seat. Nonetheless, because these cars do give me a great deal of "driver's pleasure," I'm not all that concerned about the back seat comfort (as most trips are rather short and can be easily handled).

M5eater
05-28-13, 12:44 PM
However, I do have to admit, that some of the older folks may have to think things out before entering/exiting the back seat. Nonetheless, because these cars do give me a great deal of "driver's pleasure," I'm not all that concerned about the back seat comfort (as most trips are rather short and can be easily handled).

Thats the problem i have with back-seat comparisons in sports sedans. They're there for ocassional, almost emergency use. Not full-time 4 adult hauler duty. That's what a freaking mid-sized car is for.

It's hypocritical to both critize the car for lack of seating for 4 and then focus soley on it's capacity to provide enjoyment to a single occupant-- the driver.

BNRacing
05-28-13, 01:08 PM
It annoys me to see them complain about the transmission being junk when in reality its a great trans, just the software behind it is junk. If the test car would have had a tune from us on it it would have been the last thing they complained about. Cadillac needs to step up their game on the software side of things if they really want to impress people.

73JPS
05-28-13, 05:49 PM
That's the problem i have with back-seat comparisons in sports sedans. They're there for occassional, almost emergency use. Not full-time 4 adult hauler duty. That's what a freaking mid-sized car is for.

It's hypocritical to both criticize the car for lack of seating for 4 and then focus solely on it's capacity to provide enjoyment to a single occupant-- the driver.


Now this is an interesting argument: I wouldn't discount the importance of rear seat room quite so much. If I want a car solely for the enjoyment of the driver, I will buy a sports car. I have an ATS because I need the practicality that having a rear seat brings, while still desiring sports car like handling. Having carried two cars and their related expenses on my own for most of my adult life, I am tired of having the costs of an extra car for driving fun in a separate package, especially when I am driving it less than 1000 miles per year; thus, the extra car is going, and I am making a compromise with the ATS. While for me driving dynamics are more important than rear seat room, others might not feel the same way, so criticizing a lack of rear seat room is still a valid thing to do, IMHO.

mrstecks
05-28-13, 07:49 PM
Before I bought my ATS last November, I decided to see how the back seat felt.
I got back there, and so did the Sales Associate. We sat there in silence for a few seconds and then he said: "Yeah, it's a bit cramped back here."
He sounded very apologetic.
I just shrugged and said, "I don't care. I don't have to sit back here." hahahahaha.....

My elderly father wasn't able to bend himself into the front seat, never mind the back.
So he's not a fan of my car. :)

Fraggy
05-29-13, 11:28 AM
It annoys me to see them complain about the transmission being junk when in reality its a great trans, just the software behind it is junk. If the test car would have had a tune from us on it it would have been the last thing they complained about. Cadillac needs to step up their game on the software side of things if they really want to impress people.

Please tell me more about your tune and how it improves the transmissions software. I ask cause to me thats the weak point of the car.

thebigjimsho
05-30-13, 11:32 AM
Now this is an interesting argument: I wouldn't discount the importance of rear seat room quite so much. If I want a car solely for the enjoyment of the driver, I will buy a sports car. I have an ATS because I need the practicality that having a rear seat brings, while still desiring sports car like handling. Having carried two cars and their related expenses on my own for most of my adult life, I am tired of having the costs of an extra car for driving fun in a separate package, especially when I am driving it less than 1000 miles per year; thus, the extra car is going, and I am making a compromise with the ATS. While for me driving dynamics are more important than rear seat room, others might not feel the same way, so criticizing a lack of rear seat room is still a valid thing to do, IMHO.

It's not that it shouldn't be criticized. But, it should be a much smaller factor than if comparing mid or full sized sedans...

DavidL
05-30-13, 01:32 PM
I agree with all the above... yes, the back seat is not spacious; if you want that feature, you need to get another car. I also have 'issues' with Car & Driver's comment about the CUE system (as well as Consumer's Report); like any new system, it takes time to adjust and understand it; I personally love it; found it, after a couple of weeks and experimenting with it while parked, that it becomes very intuitive to use (I am a 72 year old male); I remember all the uproar over daytime running lights, when they were first introduced....

thebigjimsho
05-30-13, 02:45 PM
Well, DRLs do suck...

stevenzoz
05-31-13, 01:55 AM
Well, DRLs do suck...

unless they are LEDs :D

Stevo Supremo
05-31-13, 04:52 PM
while I still dont agree with the LEXUS winning, I'm still glad they FINALLY kicked the 3 series aside

I think the manual trans is just brilliant by the way

73JPS
05-31-13, 05:23 PM
I think the manual trans is just brilliant by the way

The fact that the ATS has one is brilliant; it turns out it pretty good, too.

Stevo Supremo
05-31-13, 07:36 PM
The fact that the ATS has one is brilliant; it turns out it pretty good, too.

yeah some people say its notchy, I thought so to at the start, but now its loosened up and its damn precise, I love it!

oh and after looking at that lexus more its butt f***'n ugly!

Fraggy
06-02-13, 12:17 PM
It annoys me to see them complain about the transmission being junk when in reality its a great trans, just the software behind it is junk. If the test car would have had a tune from us on it it would have been the last thing they complained about. Cadillac needs to step up their game on the software side of things if they really want to impress people.




Please tell me more about your tune and how it improves the transmissions software. I ask cause to me thats the weak point of the car.

Still hoping for an answer to my question.

bluecrayon
06-02-13, 10:13 PM
As far as size, yes it's not incredibly large, but that's not what this car was intended for. I went somewhere today with my daughter in a carseat, my mom and my dad who's 6 feet, 275 lbs.....needless to say it was fairly cramped bit that's ok, only on about 1% of my driving is it anyone other than myself.