: Bad News - difficulty shifting into gear



jeremy107
05-17-13, 09:15 AM
This morning I went outside to start the V and drive it to work like I do everyday Friday.. I had a corvette at one point and it wouldn't let you get the keys unless the car is parked in reverse, so it's a habit to park the V that way. Ok, start it up run back inside finish somethings, come back out (had put it in neural before I went back in).

Hope in ready to go, it WILL NOT go into reverse. Then it was difficult to get it in other gears (yes clutch was in). I'm serious a 2-3 battle trying to get in reverse. Finally cut it off and tried again and it went into reverse with the car off. Left for work and now it seems rough going into other gears? Please tell me this isn't something that will cost a fortune! Thanks guys!

darkman
05-17-13, 09:34 AM
Check the clutch fluid first.

If it is not grinding when you are trying to go into any gear (engine running), it may be s a shift linkage issue.

If it is grinding when you are trying to go into any gear (engine running) it is most likely clutch drag.

The checklist in the Service Manual for Clutch Drag is as follows:
1. Pedal blocked from full travel.
2. Too much travel between pedal and clutch master cylinder or worn pedal bushings.
3. Clutch pedal mounting loose.
4. Linkage at pedal worn or damaged.
5. Clutch master cylinder is seized or binding.
6. Air in clutch hydraulic system.
7. Clutch actuator (slave) cylinder seized or binding.
8. Clutch master cylinder leaking internally.
9. Damaged clutch assembly components. This includes damaged clutch disc, hub, splines, bent clutch disc, bent drive straps, broken or warped pressure plate. [I did not find any thickness specs for the clutch disc.]
10. Excessive side loading on the release bearing.
11. Faulty pilot bearing.
12. Transmission input shaft splines are worn or damaged.
13. Tight or contaminated clutch disc splines.
14. Flywheel housing, engine block to clutch housing, or transmission front case excessively misaligned.
15. Grease or oil contamination on the clutch disc facing.
16. Loose, broken, or faulty motor mounts.

jeremy107
05-17-13, 10:34 AM
Wow..Thanks for the quick reply on how to fix this problem, That was awesome. Little more info, while driving it, just seemed a little rough getting into gears. Havent checked the fluid yet but I hope thats the only problem, so I wont have to do this huge checklist that half of it I wouldnt know where to start on half of it. :/

darkman
05-17-13, 10:40 AM
Although the clutch fluid should be periodically flushed and the system bled, the quick work around is to just remove the fluid in the reservoir with a turkey baster and replace it with fresh fluid. (Brake Fluid DOT 3 (good) or DOT 4 (better) - it does not matter what is in there now DOT 3&4 are completely compatible).

jeremy107
05-17-13, 10:49 AM
Well now that you say that Im doing the oil this weekend so might as well do that while Im at it. Dot 4. Is there anything other things I can do it that would be a normal check or change? I got allllll weekend to clean it and maintance it

darkman
05-17-13, 11:01 AM
The CTS-V is "fluid intensive." By that I mean every fluid in the car, with exception of the coolant, should be changed periodically. Both the hydraulic clutch system and the hydraulic brake system perform much better with fresh fluid (brake fluid attracts water over time). The power steering system runs hot, and the fluid should be changed if the color changes to brown (burnt) or milky (condensation water). The transmission fluid should last awhile, but can need changed as often as the oil in hot climates. The differential fluid has limited slip additives that deteriorate over time and should be changed. For instructions see the CTS-V FAQS on this website.

thebigjimsho
05-17-13, 11:30 AM
http://www.hark.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/badnews1.jpg

jeremy107
05-17-13, 11:54 AM
Ok so this weekend

1. trans fluid change (DoT 3,4)
2. Brake system flush and change (DoT 3,4)
3. Power Sterring Fluid change
4. Diff Fluid change also
5. Mobile 1 5w30 oil change

I can carry the noob title for a little while thats fine lol, I just got the V last week and want to service it just so I know it is done also can track when it will need to be done again! Post like that help a sh** ton just because I am new to the V and learning it still and its needs. Hope these chagnes fix the trans prob . Thanks again for all the help!

JDB
05-17-13, 01:02 PM
I hope trans is a typo..... or you meant the clutch. I use M1 synthetic ATF (under 4 qts.) in the trans FWIW and Redline 75w90 in the diff. Agreed with others, clutch should be flushed often, atleast suction out the reservoir and wipe out the black crud and top off again. I know when putting in RevShift motor mounts replacing ~20-25k mile old stock mounts (2nd set), it gets into 1 and R a lot smoother. I have Creative Steal trans mount FWIW.

PISNUOFF
05-17-13, 01:04 PM
**1. CLUTCH fluid

jeremy107
05-17-13, 02:07 PM
Yes sorry I meant cluth not trans Im actually at work, tryin to watch this topic and work at the same time so my mind is in turbo mod.

1. clutch fluid (DoT 3,4 or M1 Synthetic ATF 4 Quarts)
2. Brakes (DoT 3,4)
3. Power Sterring Fluid Change Synthetic Im guessing?
4. Diff Fluid change 75w90 M1
5. M1 5w30 Oil change.

Im gonna check the trans and motor mounts once i get under it. Im guessing I will see a lot of wear if it needs replacing and some play in it. Am I missing anything guys? Thanks for all the help I will now bash my face to AutoZone to spend 100$+ in fluids

odla
05-17-13, 02:44 PM
Where are you located at?

jeremy107
05-17-13, 02:52 PM
Spring Hill Tn. 10 mins from franklin. or 25 mins from nashville. (South)

darkman
05-17-13, 02:58 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgHhL3UIG-U

jeremy107
05-17-13, 04:19 PM
Im guessing the trans mount needs to be replaced it has 100k on the car, not sure if its been replaced or not but from alot of forums and posts they are known for motor and trans mount going out. Do I just shake the trans and can tell if it needs replacing or not? Just trying to narrow things out what this issue could be while im under the car, saw of some shifter issues also on the forum.

darkman
05-17-13, 04:39 PM
The OEM transmission mount collapses, which can actually occur with the passage of time as well as accumulated mileage. And guess what, one of the symptoms is problematic shifting. There aftermarket replacements as well as a less expensive-easier to install "insert" to "un-collapse" it.

The motor mounts are liquid-filled units which eventually develop leaks. The leakage leaves telltale signs of brownish liquid in the vicinity of the mounts. The motor mount failure rate varies more with how many times the driver "punches" the throttle.

jeremy107
05-17-13, 05:34 PM
Found a few online replacement trans mounts for around 100$. Signs of the motors mounts with leaky fluid that will be easy to spot ,is there any specific things to see if my trans mount is bad? (shaking left to right, popping, loose ex. ex.?) or should I just go ahead and replace it?

----------

https://www.creative-steel.com/store/index.php?l=product_detail&p=32

Good reviews at least

JDB
05-17-13, 05:39 PM
www.RevShift.com

darkman
05-17-13, 05:48 PM
Found a few online replacement trans mounts for around 100$. Signs of the motors mounts with leaky fluid that will be easy to spot ,is there any specific things to see if my trans mount is bad? (shaking left to right, popping, loose ex. ex.?) or should I just go ahead and replace it?

----------

https://www.creative-steel.com/store/index.php?l=product_detail&p=32

Good reviews at least

According to the GM Service Manual the only listed symptom related to a failing transmission mount that I can find is the inability to shift the transmission into ONE of the gears. See attached.

Revshift (add on the right side of the page) sells an insert for the OEM mount.

You should also know that all of the aftermarket transmission mount options can introduce a slight increase in felt vibration (I don't have one yet so I'll defer to others on that subject.)

amunderdog
05-17-13, 06:56 PM
http://www.hark.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/badnews1.jpg
http://livingincinema.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/contract-disputes.jpg
http://www.imcdb.org/i040377.jpg
1964 Cadillac DeVille Convertible

http://content7.flixster.com/question/21/58/11/2158117_std.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_RQGFm9IU5SI/TTH8mk21fOI/AAAAAAAAC9U/OxRllkePSKY/s1600/BNB%2B4%2B2.2.jpg
http://imcdb.org/i015286.jpg
1972 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado

That led me here
http://www.stationwagon.com/gallery/pictures/1972_Cadillac_Fleetwood_Eldorado.jpg

Hope you resolve your Bad News

trukk
05-17-13, 09:17 PM
Lets say you are trying to shift into 5th at about 135 mph. Then lets say your reverse lockout solenoid fails. It is theoretically possible to mis-shift into R. It is also highly theoretical that your reverse gear may disintegrate into dust.

At that point you will have no reverse gear.

This may or may not have happened to me at VIR.

-Chris

thebigjimsho
05-18-13, 02:43 AM
Now THAT would be bad news...

jeremy107
05-18-13, 03:05 AM
I replaced the engine oil,flushed the brakes, 4 quarts of ATF, rear diff fluid changed also.

I also have a roar coming from the rear of the car, done some searching online and found out most of the humming problems are from wheel bearings. Im not sure that I can be positive and pin point it to which side when Im pretty sure it is the passengers side. From what I can remember placing your hands at 12 and 6 o'clock or 3 and 9 o'clock and try to wiggle the tire (while lifted off the floor) it will have some play in it then it is a bad wheel bearing.. Is this correct for V's??? I really hope it is a wheel bearing and nothing coming from the diff. Trying to narrow the problem down before I just go out buying parts to replace.

My trans shifting problem has still not solved after the fluid change. It will not go into reverse, reverse lights come on but doesn't go into reverse, first gear and second gear is also rough.. Problem started this morning stating in OP. Looked at the Revshift trans block that inserts into the factory mount, is this worth getting over just replacing the entire mount? All replies are appericated guys!

HAMSTAR
05-18-13, 07:13 AM
Yes the revshift insert is worth it. Get it. also Take a pic of your mount so we can see how collapsed it is.

If you don't have motor mounts yet, get them

Cadillac Cust Svc
05-18-13, 05:14 PM
I replaced the engine oil,flushed the brakes, 4 quarts of ATF, rear diff fluid changed also.

I also have a roar coming from the rear of the car, done some searching online and found out most of the humming problems are from wheel bearings. Im not sure that I can be positive and pin point it to which side when Im pretty sure it is the passengers side. From what I can remember placing your hands at 12 and 6 o'clock or 3 and 9 o'clock and try to wiggle the tire (while lifted off the floor) it will have some play in it then it is a bad wheel bearing.. Is this correct for V's??? I really hope it is a wheel bearing and nothing coming from the diff. Trying to narrow the problem down before I just go out buying parts to replace.

My trans shifting problem has still not solved after the fluid change. It will not go into reverse, reverse lights come on but doesn't go into reverse, first gear and second gear is also rough.. Problem started this morning stating in OP. Looked at the Revshift trans block that inserts into the factory mount, is this worth getting over just replacing the entire mount? All replies are appericated guys!

Hello jeremy107,

After reading this thread I see you have been offered great advice from other members. Please keep us updated on your vehicle fix. If there are ever concerns or questions you have,feel free to private message us.

Regards,

Laura M.
Cadillac Customer Service

darkman
05-18-13, 05:34 PM
I also have a roar coming from the rear of the car, done some searching online and found out most of the humming problems are from wheel bearings. Im not sure that I can be positive and pin point it to which side when Im pretty sure it is the passengers side. From what I can remember placing your hands at 12 and 6 o'clock or 3 and 9 o'clock and try to wiggle the tire (while lifted off the floor) it will have some play in it then it is a bad wheel bearing.. Is this correct for V's??? I really hope it is a wheel bearing and nothing coming from the diff. Trying to narrow the problem down before I just go out buying parts to replace.



Although the amount of tire "wiggle" is indicative of bearing condition, the tolerance with sealed bearings is much less (i.e. 0.005 inch) than for the conventional unsealed wheel bearings. Checking requires a dial indicator - see attachment to this post:
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/2004-2007-cadillac-cts-v-general/289900-vibration-around-60-ive-tried-all.html#post3314780

darkman
05-18-13, 06:35 PM
My trans shifting problem has still not solved after the fluid change. It will not go into reverse, reverse lights come on but doesn't go into reverse, first gear and second gear is also rough.. Problem started this morning stating in OP. Looked at the Revshift trans block that inserts into the factory mount, is this worth getting over just replacing the entire mount? All replies are appericated guys!

If the original mount suffers from separation of the rubber from the metal it should be replaced. However, if the original mount merely suffers from internal "collapse" either the insert or an aftermarket replacement are attractive alternatives because the OEM mount (GM Part No. 15861893) carries a $525 MRSP, and is not cheap even at the discounted prices that I have seen.

sgtdestruction
05-19-13, 01:36 PM
Let me know if you want to change out your motor mounts. Did mine a few months back and can offer some guidance and help.

bjazz69
05-19-13, 03:19 PM
If you still can't shift in to gear either you did not bleed right or you have a bad master or slave cylinder. I would guess you need go bleed more it is a PITA to bleed the clutch especially when you have introduced air in the system.

jeremy107
05-20-13, 11:55 AM
Let me know if you want to change out your motor mounts. Did mine a few months back and can offer some guidance and help.
I'm sure I need them, any help would be awesome! Me and a friend of mine did all the fluid changes this weekend. I'm guessing the trans mount is causing the hard shifting. I'm not positive ill have the cash to buy the mount support from revshift (blue 40$ one) heard good things about it anyways and the Motor mounts at the same time. I need a freaking rear wheel bearings too (at least I hope that's what it is) rear boot isn't busted and from driving and riding sounds like a wheel bearing I just pray its not the diff. Sounds like passenger rear wheel bearing. All searches I've found just describe a humm or roar and it was the wheel bearing

----------

It is shifting into gear, just rough going into first and second and reverse. How you bleed the clutch? I'm def gonna go ahead and do that as well. I sucked all the fluid out the reservoir and cleaned it out. Filled back up with DoT3 and pumped it while my friend punched the line and a fluid coming out the line was a little dirty but nothing big time

fweasel
09-15-13, 09:56 PM
The motor mounts are liquid-filled units which eventually develop leaks. The leakage leaves telltale signs of brownish liquid in the vicinity of the mounts. The motor mount failure rate varies more with how many times the driver "punches" the throttle.I don't mean to derail this thread, but I too am a new owner and also have a reverse gear selection issue. Your description of the motor mount fluid was a light bulb moment for me. I just noticed a small spot on the garage floor the other day, rust colored, and thought nothing of it until I had the car in the air this weekend. I noticed the same, rust colored fluid stains on the bottom of the oil pan, that looked to have traveled down from above that location, along the side of the engine block.

My immediate assumption was coolant, freeze plugs maybe, but could not find any signs of leaking with a quick visual inspection. While I have revshift blue MM's to install eventually, I've been under the impression my OEM's are still good because the engine doesn't shake when I turn it off, and they don't appear to be collapsed or deformed. My past experience with liquid filled bushings have all been Nissan varieties, and they leak clear silicone. Could a dried out, rusty liquid trail from the side of the block down to the oil pan be indicative of a leaking motor mount? That could also explain my reverse gear selection issue as well. Looks like I may have found next weekend's project.

Andringa
09-17-13, 06:14 PM
Yes, the fluid filled mounts leak a brownish liquid which turns into a kind of rust brown powder when dry.

Like this:
http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee190/Z06phile/CTS-V/DSC_8645.jpg

fweasel
09-17-13, 10:31 PM
:lol: did you sneak into my garage and take that picture? That's exactly what my pan looks like. Thanks for the verification.

Andringa
09-18-13, 10:57 AM
Actually I have no idea whose car it is, found it on Google. :)

Biged412
02-01-14, 10:00 PM
According to the GM Service Manual the only listed symptom related to a failing transmission mount that I can find is the inability to shift the transmission into ONE of the gears. See attached.

Revshift (add on the right side of the page) sells an insert for the OEM mount.

You should also know that all of the aftermarket transmission mount options can introduce a slight increase in felt vibration (I don't have one yet so I'll defer to others on that subject.)

I am suffering the same . I can find reverse if I "slam" the shifter to the right , then up , but I don't want to continue that abuse. There didn't seem to be a conclusion. Any ideas ?

dkozloski
02-01-14, 10:09 PM
Checking to make sure the clutch isn't dragging is the first step in troubleshooting gear selection issues. The disc might be warped if it has been abused making lurid starts.

darkman
02-01-14, 10:23 PM
I am suffering the same . I can find reverse if I "slam" the shifter to the right , then up , but I don't want to continue that abuse. There didn't seem to be a conclusion. Any ideas ?See attached.