: 1983 Fleetwood Brougham d'Elegance Project



Pages : [1] 2

grauhst
05-13-13, 04:16 PM
Hi,
first of all i want to introduce myself. I am Felix from germany and i just bought an '83 FB d'Elegance Sedan, loaded and in beautiful "woodland haze" paint.
I want to say sorry to you if i make mistakes writing english. It is not perfect, but i will try as good as possible. :)

4 Years ago (when i was 18) i bought my first car: a rusty and worse custom '74 Continental Mark IV. You can see my Lincoln restoration here: Link (http://american-iron.jimdo.com/restauration-2011-12/)
I restored it and now it is like new but as a daily driver (it was still my only car) it is too expensive on gas. (In germany it is something about 8$/gal)

I always loved 70s and 80s american cars. 80s Fleetwood Brougham always was one of my favourites.
So i looked for one. I had exact criteria:

- Year 80-83 (in germany there is a huge financial advantage for cars older then 30 Years, called historical license plate)
- Sedan (it is hard with these small parking spots and those huuuuge doors. I always have problems with the doors of my Lincoln.)
- Fleetwood Brougham, no Deville
- d'Elegance package with cloth seats (very important, i love these seats)
- paint shouldn't be silver or black (i don't like common colors.... today every car is silver or black)

It is hard to find a car that fits. I searched a lot worldwide but found almost nothing (and if, way too expensive)
In germany those cars are between 1.500 and 10.000€ Compared to the US-prices, they are expensive. Shipping from the US to germany is something about 2.000$.

One day i drove through a city 70 mls away and saw a '80s FB at the street side.
- Sedan :thumbsup:
- Fleetwood Brougham :thumbsup:
- d'Elegance :thumbsup:
- cloth seats :thumbsup:
- 80-83: yes, '83 :thumbsup:
- color :thumbsup:

Holy! A car like out of my dream.
Ok, it is needs TLC, but no problem.
I contact the owner, yes the car is for sale. It was inserted a while ago for 4.300€
I negotiate "a bit" and at the end i bought the car for 800€ (about 1.000$), which is a very good price here in germany for such a car.

And this is it:
(Cadillac next to my Mark IV)
http://up.picr.de/13316573vu.jpg

rear:
http://up.picr.de/12935338gm.jpg

http://up.picr.de/13316693tl.jpg

http://up.picr.de/13316729ew.jpg

http://up.picr.de/13316730mx.jpg

http://up.picr.de/13316732hd.jpg

Ok, and that is the condition:
- front bumper is bent, but chrome is ok
- rear bumper is straight, but chrome is worn
- broken bumper filler
- worn vinyl top
- worn tires
- missing emblems
- engine (HT4100) runs perfect
- transmission needs rebuilt. no movement in reverse
- brakes, suspension like new
- seats like new
- headliner hangs down locally
- some electrical things aren't working
- almost no rust (only surface. undercarriage is like new)
- car is 100% original (exept for stupid german conversions to the turn signals, parking lights, cornering lights, sidemarkers....)

I have a Carfax report and it seems that 30.000 Miles are original.

So far... in february i took the car with me. It drives like a cloud. Awesome!
It only is difficult to remember the missing reverse.... sometimes i had to push the car back on road.

Cadillac at arriving.
http://up.picr.de/13483997mp.jpg

http://up.picr.de/13483998fq.jpg

Ok. I only can put 15 images in one post so i will distribute the progress to the next posts.

Regards
Felix

grauhst
05-13-13, 05:07 PM
This is a cold start video of it a day after i got it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5m8O8ukqMlQ

The squeaky bearing is silent meanwhile.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nm_lK95x-Rg

and a warm start...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rV-BT2kx0jY

I cleaned the engine, put some new plugs in it...
http://up.picr.de/13502161pp.jpg

took out the trunk carpets and cleaned everything.... it is like new... not even surface rust...
http://up.picr.de/13668362og.jpg

look at those beautiful seats...
http://up.picr.de/13668367ov.jpg

http://up.picr.de/13668369wo.jpg

I replaced all fuses, greased everything and cleaned electical contacts.
So some of the electical stuff worked again:
- interior lighting
- illuminated entry
- outside mirrors
- level ride

I cleaned the car and polished the chrome.
http://up.picr.de/13679299wj.jpg

the ECC Control Head is broken, so i ordered a new one (still on the way to germany...)
http://up.picr.de/13865099it.jpg

repaired the back wiring harness (redone the stupid modifications)
http://up.picr.de/14118649gd.jpg

put new tires on it
http://up.picr.de/14150925lz.jpg
http://up.picr.de/14221751aw.jpg

Regards
Felix

grauhst
05-13-13, 05:19 PM
Ok and now it is time for the Transmission.
I bought 2 overhaul kits (it needs weeks until the parts are here in germany, so if i destroy a bearing or o-ring, i dont want to wait for new parts), the 82-83 Cadillac Shop Manual and a THM 200 4R transmission overhaul manual. (Haynes)

The overhaul kits:
http://up.picr.de/14030024wi.jpg

before removing the transmission
http://up.picr.de/14165114oj.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165113ry.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165119yr.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165118dc.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165117qy.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165116en.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165121qb.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165122vr.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165123sz.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165124xu.jpg

Check balls:
http://up.picr.de/14165134co.jpg

empty transmission:
http://up.picr.de/14165131qy.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14165133vr.jpg

the reason for the reverse problem: totally worn reverse clutches
http://up.picr.de/14165127mu.jpg

Regards
Felix

drmenard
05-13-13, 05:33 PM
These motors are aluminum and had problems with head gaskets.. It is good advice to flush and change anti freeze every two years. That would be the first thing I would do.. These motors always developed a rumble because of engine main bearings.. Years back when these sold used , I have a friend, used car dealer, who bought a lot of cars with this motor.. The first thing he did was put in new main bearings that were .001 undersize.. This tightened up the slop and they run like new ... He did not change the rod bearings... I am sorry to say that losing reverse in the transmission is one of the first signs it needs a rebuild. There were a few weak spots that were change through the years.. I would search the web on some upgrades and hard parts that should be changed.. The transmission you have is a TH200 4R ...

grauhst
05-13-13, 05:41 PM
broken reverse piston seal ring
http://up.picr.de/14175758it.jpg

all parts of the transmission:
http://up.picr.de/14165132ls.jpg

new clutch rings in fresh atf:
http://up.picr.de/14175756si.jpg

new reverse clutch package installed:
http://up.picr.de/14175757qw.jpg

everything installed... new valve body sealing
http://up.picr.de/14175759xe.jpg

completed:
http://up.picr.de/14175762vq.jpg

I installed the transmission to the Cadillac and.... it works!!! I haven't done something like that before.
Now it shifts smooth, makes no noises and the car rides backwards too. Awesome. :banana::banana::banana::banana:

I drove the car 1.200 miles direct after the transmission-rebuild. No problems! Everything works fine.

And here are some pics of the ride on the german Autobahn:

http://up.picr.de/14286583lh.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14286581ot.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14286582xr.jpg

It rides like a cloud. I am totally satisfied. I got 24.43 MPG on the Autobahn.

This is, how it looks right now.
I am still waiting for the ECC Control Head. If it arrives, i will post actual news.

There is one little problem. The german regulations says, i can apply for the german historical license, when the car hits (exactly) 30 years.
It was registered the first time on the 1st of July 1983....
So i have to wait until July this year to register the car.

What i have planned for the future:
- new exhaust pipe (some rust holes)
- new bumper filler set

After the registration i want to use the car as my daily driver.

That's it for now.

Best regards from germany
Felix

jayoldschool
05-13-13, 06:02 PM
Congratulations, and great work!

Germany won't let you register it on the build date? It was probably built before July.

drmenard
05-13-13, 06:06 PM
Wow you work fast.. You must have been posting those pictures when I was writing... It has been a long time , but if I remember right a problem area was the shaft came out of the pump that the torque convertor goes on, now this is the one on the outside, had a problem with the spline getting worn and damaged..

grauhst
05-13-13, 06:35 PM
These motors are aluminum and had problems with head gaskets.. It is good advice to flush and change anti freeze every two years. That would be the first thing I would do.. These motors always developed a rumble because of engine main bearings.. Years back when these sold used , I have a friend, used car dealer, who bought a lot of cars with this motor.. The first thing he did was put in new main bearings that were .001 undersize.. This tightened up the slop and they run like new ... He did not change the rod bearings... I am sorry to say that losing reverse in the transmission is one of the first signs it needs a rebuild. There were a few weak spots that were change through the years.. I would search the web on some upgrades and hard parts that should be changed.. The transmission you have is a TH200 4R ...

Thanks.
Yes, i know the HT's are very sensitive to false care.
I directly changed all fluids on that car. There were no coolant in the oil and no oil in the coolant. (first thing i checked before i bought it)
The engine runs great, haven't had any problem with it yet. It is really not very powerful (ok, i think it is not correct to connect the words "power" and "HT4100" :D:D), but it is good on mpg and it runs very smooth. I like the fuel display gimmicks.

The front oil pump shaft was good. I measured the end-play of the shafts and after the rebuild everything was good.
Btw. it took 3 days to rebuild the transmission. First day disassembling, second day rebuild and third day installing and test drive.

@ jayoldschool,
thank you.
no, i only can register it at the 30th register date. It would be more senseful, if it would be the build date, but it isn't....
I could now register it with a standart registration, but in germany car taxes are calculated by the emissions and displacement. And 4.1 Liter is a huge engine here in germany. I would probably pay ~2000€/year + insurance. Insurance would be maybe the same. With the historical license i will pay 190€/year + 120€/year insurance.
So you see, it is way better to wait 2 months and register it as a historical vehicle. (It is called "antique" in the US?)

Regards
Felix

cadillac_al
05-13-13, 07:33 PM
Nice work. I have always been scared of automatic trannys and you jump right in like nothing and it works. I'm impressed. So do you think the Caddy rides better than the Lincoln? The Lincoln looks sharp too. Cheers.

talismandave
05-13-13, 10:37 PM
Wow....you should get along fine around here!
Great work and what a great match you found to your dream car. Talk about destiny!
You have two of my favorite cars. You must have a lot of fun driving those land yachts in Germany.
Welcome and keep posting as the project continues.

lacville78
05-14-13, 01:49 AM
Impressive work!

85 FLEETWOOD COUPE
05-14-13, 03:30 AM
WOW AWSOME KEEP US UPDATED WITH YOU BUILD AND PICTURES:highfive:

1980coupe
05-14-13, 07:16 AM
Nice...

outsider
05-14-13, 09:47 AM
that transmission rebuild was amazing. For a first timer to just jump right in...I was afraid to even do my filter and fluid swap for the first time!

Great work and I love the pics.

grauhst
05-14-13, 10:36 AM
Thanks a lot to you guys.


Nice work. I have always been scared of automatic trannys and you jump right in like nothing and it works. I'm impressed. So do you think the Caddy rides better than the Lincoln? The Lincoln looks sharp too. Cheers.
Me too. It was the same with the Lincoln vinyl top. Everyone told me, i shouldnt do that myself. But hey, if i never do that myself, i wont learn how to do that. So i ever wanted to do a vinyl top to learn it. And on what car i should do it if not on my own Lincoln? I bought a top, some padding and glue and go for it. It worked well and now it looks beautiful.

With automatic transmissions i had exactly none experience when i bought the Cadillac.
I bought the service manual, the overhaul manual, 2 overhaul kits and took out the tranny without any idea whats wrong with it.

I was yelling, when it shifted into reverse the first time. That was absolutley unspectacular, but gorgeous. It just went backwards out of the garage, Haha.

Yes, the Caddy rides as smooth as the Lincoln. The Mark IV is way heavier and more powerful. The 460 engine is great.
But the Cadillac is better as a daily driver: 4 dr, huge trunk, most comfortable seats i ever sat in, loaded, and a great fuel mileage (compared to the Lincoln)

----------


Wow....you should get along fine around here!
Great work and what a great match you found to your dream car. Talk about destiny!
You have two of my favorite cars. You must have a lot of fun driving those land yachts in Germany.
Welcome and keep posting as the project continues.
Thanks, yes it is a huge fortune with this car.
Yes, it is great to drive cars like these here in germany. On the other hand it is very expensive because of the gas prices.
But i will ever own those american cars. I love them. I love the comfortable seats and suspension. Modern cars are rough with tough seats, strong steering and ugly design. Old american luxury cars are luxurious, elegant and smooth. The have a soft suspension and comfortable seats, better then any sofa.

I will post the updates soon. At the moment i am waiting for the ECC Control Head, a Hood Emblem (very important on a Cadillac :D) and a trunk lock emblem. I will renew the vinyl top, the bumper fillers, the exhaust and i will repair the paint. It has some chips and dents. But it shouldn't get a full repaint.
I want to keep the car 100% original.

Regards
Felix

csbuckn
05-14-13, 10:43 AM
Nice job. Nice job on that vinyl top on the lincoln. You plan on redoing the vinyl top on the Cadillac?

grauhst
05-14-13, 10:49 AM
Nice job. Nice job on that vinyl top on the lincoln. You plan on redoing the vinyl top on the Cadillac?Thank you.
Yes, i will. But i think i will do it next year or so. There is no rust underneith it, it is just worn.
Someone painted the vinyl. Original it was as bright as the paint.
http://up.picr.de/13316640en.jpg

Felix

csbuckn
05-14-13, 11:04 AM
Nice. You had me looking up youtube videos on how to replace a vinyl top. Doesnt seem too hard.

grauhst
05-14-13, 11:28 AM
Nice. You had me looking up youtube videos on how to replace a vinyl top. Doesnt seem too hard.
It was very hard.
There are more ways to put a vinyl top on. There are huge differences with the correct glue and the usage of it.
I took glue, where you can't move the vinyl after you contact it to the roof. That is difficult to do.

When i replace the Cadillac top, i will show it here. Maybe i will take glue which allows movement even after sticking the vinyl to the roof.
You need a padding underneith it too. The padding makes it more difficult. At the Lincoln, there were only padding on the sides of the roof, a heavy challenge for a newbie like me. :D

But as i said, i have no experience with other glue and ways to put the vinyl on. Maybe it is more easier...

Felix

Bro-Ham
05-14-13, 12:34 PM
Amazing story! I love the car and good luck with your continuing project and it is great that you will be enjoying it as a daily driver! :)

AElayyat
05-14-13, 12:49 PM
Looks good!

I must give you some serious credit on re-building the transmission!

The cloth delegance seats look sweet!

Good luck with the rest of the build.

Bro-Ham
05-14-13, 03:06 PM
Amazing story! I love the car and good luck with your continuing project and it is great that you will be enjoying it as a daily driver! :)

83 Fleetwood
05-14-13, 03:42 PM
Beautiful cars! and good job rebuilding the transmission yourself, you saved yourself a ton of money. The broken fillers are easy to come across and same with emblems/badges. Seems like its all coming together nicely.

grauhst
05-14-13, 05:28 PM
Thanks a lot,

btw, i haven't tell something about the options. This car is loaded.

- Electronic level control
- Brougham d'Elegance - cloth seating
- Electronic cruise control
- Controlled-cycle wiper system
- Rear defogger with heated outside mirrors
- Automatic door locks
- Illuminated entry system
- Memory driver's seat
- Power passenger seat recliner
- Leather-trimmed steering wheel
- Tilt/telescope steering wheel
- Power trunk lid release and pull-down
- Twilight Sentinel
- Trumpet horn
- Electric remote-control outside mirrors
- Twin lighted vanity mirrors
- Electronic-tuning seek/scan AM/FM stereo radio with cassette and CB
- Triband antenna
- Door edge guards
- Trunk mat
- Locking wire wheel covers

Regards
Felix

TopherS
05-15-13, 01:30 AM
Sorry to jump in so late here, but welcome!

I truly admire your willingness to just dive right in and tackle the big projects that many (including me) are afraid to. Well done, you!

I love the color and the cloth d'Elegance seating is beautiful. Yours is optioned nearly identical to mine. I have d'Elegance leather seating, fuel filler lock, but no CB ... otherwise, the same.

I can't wait to see how this story turns out!!!

Cheers for the updates!

grauhst
05-15-13, 11:15 AM
Sorry to jump in so late here, but welcome!

I truly admire your willingness to just dive right in and tackle the big projects that many (including me) are afraid to. Well done, you!

I love the color and the cloth d'Elegance seating is beautiful. Yours is optioned nearly identical to mine. I have d'Elegance leather seating, fuel filler lock, but no CB ... otherwise, the same.

I can't wait to see how this story turns out!!!

Cheers for the updates!Thank you for the welcome.
I have looked for a d'Elegance without leather seating, because often these seats are cracked and worn. I have inspected a '84 d'Elegance with leather and the seats were cracked, worn and very hard. The cloth seating is unbelievable soft.

Yes, unfortunately my car has no fuel filler lock. I would like to upgrade it with it. Does anybody knows, what parts I need to install the fuel filler lock afterwards?
How you can unlock the fuel filler door?


----------

The postmen just brought me a nice package with the Cadillac emblems.
The colors are faded, especially red and yellow. (as usual)
Does anybody have renewed the colors? Is there a possibility to remove the plastic shield without damaging it?

http://up.picr.de/14481330qy.jpg

Regards
Felix

outsider
05-15-13, 11:24 AM
Someone on the board had a whole topic about renewing them. Check it out here

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/rwd-19xx-1984-deville-fleetwood-1985/215368-restoring-cadillac-crest-shield.html

Cadillacboy
05-15-13, 04:15 PM
Great work and a pleasure to see such a gorgeous car in homeland to MB :D

grauhst
05-15-13, 05:37 PM
@ Cadillacboy,
thanks a lot.
Haha, but if i want to drive with a MB, i am gonna call for a taxi. :histeric: ;)

@ outsider,
thanks! That definately helps.

I was successful, taking the plastic cover apart and i scratched all paint off, except for the white ones and the chrome bars.

The next days i will try to paint it.

http://up.picr.de/14486341ao.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14486339or.jpg

Regards
Felix

grauhst
05-16-13, 02:43 PM
Ok, i painted the plastic. It was a little tricky, but I think it looks not so bad.

http://up.picr.de/14493656hm.jpg

Wheel cover emblem + trunk emblem
http://up.picr.de/14493657zt.jpg

Furthermore I installed the hood emblem. Maybe someday i will paint it too.

http://up.picr.de/14493654ea.jpg

http://up.picr.de/14493655se.jpg

Regards
Felix

outsider
05-16-13, 02:53 PM
Wow those came out really good! Nice work.

Robin Banx
05-16-13, 10:17 PM
Those emblems you have restored look great. You must be a watchmaker!! BTW your car is very nearly the twin to mine. As an aside, when I watched your startup video, I noticed that your ISP motor (Idle Speed Control) was bumping the throttle before you started cranking. The reason it does that is because it has either been replaced and the proper sequence steps have not been followed during the re-connection or someone has disconnected the original and not followed the proper steps in reconnecting it. When you turn the key to on and before you crank the engine, you should not hear a "bump, bump, bump" from the engine room. BTW, I'd like to see your engine room after you clean and detail it. It should clean up really well.

Cheers.......R.

lacville78
05-17-13, 03:57 AM
I love seeing posts like these! Thanks for joining.

1980coupe
05-17-13, 11:21 AM
there's a guy on layitlow that goes by MR.LAC and he sells them brand new and NOS and they're inserts..for those who would like to restore their emblems...

grauhst
05-17-13, 08:18 PM
Thanks alot,

@ Robin Banx,
great hint with the ISC Motor. I was wondering, what's pumping there, but you're right, it is the ISC Motor.
I made a short video to be sure.
I will set is as described in the Service Manual, but at first I need the ECC Control Module to check out for trouble codes.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UU6pnXM77k&feature=youtu.be

I also made a picture. Anybody knows, what is the upper green plug is for? It is disconnected.

http://up.picr.de/14506123oc.jpg

I have another problem. The car doesn't have enough vacuum. I take notice when braking. It is almost like without brake boost. (If I am driving a minute, brake boost is normal)
Cruise control is not able to work properly too. I take notice of a movement in the throttle pedal, but it is not strong enough to hold the speed.

So I have to look for a vacuum leak. Could it be possible, that the vacuum pump is worn? Is it common? How can I test it, if I wont find a vacuum leak?

@ Robin Banx,
great, that we own almost same cars.
Do you have some pics of yours, what are the differences? Yours is in Woodland Haze too?

Best Regards
Felix

TopherS
05-17-13, 08:28 PM
I believe the green plug is used for electrical testing, but I'm not sure what plugs into it and what it is testing. Others could tell you better. My 1987 Brougham (5.0L V8) has the same thing.

Regarding your cruise control not holding speed; I've had a couple of cars that had the same problem (1984 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme (3.8L V6), 1986 Chevrolet Caprice (5.0L V8)) and a friend's 1988 Oldsmobile Custom Cruiser (5.0L V8) also had the same problem...I recall hearing that this is a somewhat common problem with GM cruise control systems. If I remember correctly, it is a vacuum leak causing the problem. I never got mine fixed (never had the money or the know-how) and it was over 20 years ago, so I cannot remember exactly what was needed to fix the problem. Hopefully others can chime in with the solution for you.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Robin Banx
05-17-13, 09:27 PM
Felix, it looks as if your A/C compressor belt tension lock bolt and block is missing. I will snap a photo of mine and try to post it here but up to now I have never been able to post pix from "My Pictures" folder to the forum. And yes my car is the same colour as yours but is called "Light Briar Brown" as far as I know. On the firewall tag it shows 62 top and 62 bottom. I will try to send you a PM.

Cheers..........R.

Vitaqueen
05-17-13, 09:48 PM
Your cars are very beautiful. Very nice job on the tranny rebuild. I had a 1987 Brougham that I was in love with. Sweet memories! Enjoy every mile, my friend.

grauhst
05-21-13, 05:52 PM
Thanks alot to you.

I will look for either a vacuum leak, a false connected- or a worn vacuum pump.

Regards
Felix

grauhst
05-25-13, 09:58 AM
Hi,
today i looked for the vacuum system.
There is no leak and the pump is connected correctly.
The service manual says that the vacuum pump has to reach at least 29". I checked mine with a vacuum gauge and it reaches ~10", so it is totally worn.
I will repace the pump and it should be enough vacuum again.
Regards
Felix

grauhst
06-04-13, 06:01 PM
Hi, today the ECC Control Head arrived.
Now the Fuel Monitor works great. ECC too, but the blower and AC doesn't work. Could it be possible that the power module on top of the evap. core is broken too? Seems to be typical.

Trouble Codes:
27: "Open Throttle Switch Circuit"
33: "Map/Baro Sensor Correlation"
52: "ECM Memory Reset Indicator"

I haven't look for the solutions yet to repair them. Maybe anybody have ideas for them?

http://up.picr.de/14731884lb.jpg

Thanks
Felix

lacville78
06-05-13, 02:25 AM
"the 52 code will set every time the battery is disconnected. It will disappear after a number of engine starts. Disconnecting the battery is almost always a bad idea. When power is disconnected: the RAM of the computer is wiped-out and the control system reverts to the default ROM to run everything engine related. The ROM was used when everything was brand-new out of the box. The RAM is what the computer uses to 'tweak' the control systems in order to obtain the best possible performance given the less than brand-new out of the box conditions. Until the RAM is rebuilt the engine will not perform the best it can. RAM is the 'learned history' and dumping it isn't a good idea."

27: Likely the ISC motor will need to be replaced...although some have dissassembled the ISC motor and cleaned and lubed the closed throttle switch contacts with success.....

33
e33 - Open MAP Sensor Signal (make sure MAP sensor is plugged in or replace)

grauhst
06-05-13, 07:38 PM
Thanks a lot for the tips.
The battery was disconnected, because as I bought the car, there were no battery in. But now the battery is fastened in permanently.

The ISC Motor needs to be set again anyway. Maybe some has disconnected it sometimes and havent connected it the right way.

Thank you for the tip with the MAP sensor. I will replace it.

When i read out the trouble codes, the "outside temp" lamp was on too. The service manual says something with A/C cluth operation.
I made a short video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0sdDkycSUQ) of the trouble codes.

Anything I made wrong? Does it say anything else information?

Thanks
Felix

jamespowers
06-05-13, 08:22 PM
52: engine oil temperature circuit, low temperature indicated

grauhst
06-07-13, 10:29 AM
Are you sure?

I think, lacville78 is correct.
My service manual says:

"Code 52 indicates that the "long term" memory in the ECM has been reset.
This will be the case whenever power is removed from the ECM (i.e. disconnecting battery cables, disconnectin P-1 (blue) ECM connector, etc.)
This code should be "cleared" from memory after resoring the ECM's power supply."

jamespowers
06-07-13, 01:39 PM
Are you sure?

I think, lacville78 is correct.
My service manual says:

"Code 52 indicates that the "long term" memory in the ECM has been reset.
This will be the case whenever power is removed from the ECM (i.e. disconnecting battery cables, disconnectin P-1 (blue) ECM connector, etc.)
This code should be "cleared" from memory after resoring the ECM's power supply."

He is probably right. The codes differ from my year I guess. It makes more sense if it were just the ECM.

Seville fan
06-09-13, 05:46 AM
Love how you jump in a 30 year old Cadillac with worn tires, drive it home in the snow, then rebuild the transmission like it was nothing. You have a fine looking car there Felix and it is loaded compared to mine. I don't have d'Elegance, rear window defroster or memory driver's seat. Mine is a 1986 with the 307 V8. I just clicked on the link to your site. If it wasn't so late here in Los Angeles (0130) I would check out the Mark IV restoration right now. Very impressive site. You even have the interior colors and all the detail! Can't wait to enjoy it tomorrow.

Thanks for sharing all of your hard work!

lacville78
06-09-13, 07:32 AM
Love how you jump in a 30 year old Cadillac with worn tires, drive it home in the snow, then rebuild the transmission like it was nothing. You have a fine looking car there Felix and it is loaded compared to mine. I don't have d'Elegance, rear window defroster or memory driver's seat. Mine is a 1986 with the 307 V8. I just clicked on the link to your site. If it wasn't so late here in Los Angeles (0130) I would check out the Mark IV restoration right now. Very impressive site. You even have the interior colors and all the detail! Can't wait to enjoy it tomorrow.

Thanks for sharing all of your hard work!

Same here, I was amazed at the transmission rebuild too. Grauhst has a lot of skill. He should fit in well with the other top notch mechanics on these forums.

grauhst
06-10-13, 05:55 PM
A big Thanks to you! I really appreciate it.

I haven't driven the car at home without any plan. First thing I have done was to look if the correct coolant was in (and it was (http://up.picr.de/14801040hf.jpg))
I checked the brakes, oil and so on. (trans was leaky a bit)

Ok, today I made some more tests.
I made a full diagnosis. Every switch and sensor is working properly. I set the ISC Motor, it doesn't make that "bump bump" anymore.
Trouble codes are cleared too. Now it only shows Code 33. I haven't look for the MAP Sensor yet.

Looked for the blower motor too. It was dead all the time. I have seen the blower motor cable wasn't connected to the motor. After I put it on, the blower motor startet to full rpm.
I made a little video of it. While I made it, the rpm went down. It doesn't do the things, you set at the control panel. So it looks like the power module is broken too.
The blower motor has a bad bearing. Maybe I am able to repair it, but I think i will order a new one at RA.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXgASMJWYwk

Any more minds?

Regards from Germany
Felix

lacville78
06-11-13, 01:45 AM
That chime is so much nicer than the buzzers that come in the earlier ones.

Cadillacboy
06-11-13, 03:15 PM
You have also a fuel trip computer :D . As far as I am concerned , this is a rare option available in these car clads ;)

grauhst
06-11-13, 07:56 PM
@ lacville,
you're right, I like it way more than the 70's buzzers too.

@ Cadillacboy,
Fuel Data Panel is awesome! Mileage (instant and average), Range and Fuel used are great options.
But it was standard on all HT4100 models and is called Digital Fuel Injection. That's why I don't dislike this engine that much. (Is it written correctly?:hmm:)
Later models didn't have these gimmicks.

It is great to work with. I made a full diagnosis and I read out throttle angle, coolant temperature, manufold temperature, sensor pressure, vehicle speed, rpm and so on. It is quite interesting, because it is a 30 years old vehicle and the whole diagnosis is working perfect.

Regards
Felix

Seville fan
06-12-13, 02:15 AM
Felix the MPG indicator always went with the fuel injected engines like the HT4100 and the V864 because the computer could pick up the fuel usage from the injection system. In the carburetor cars that came next, with the Oldsmobile V8, they couldn't have that. Don't know if MPG display was available in the 90+ model cars as part of the digital dash. Most of those cars have the Chevy V8 with fuel injection, at least TBI.

Lorne
06-14-13, 12:01 AM
Felix,
My father had a FB d'elegance and that's what I learned to drive on. Brings back memories! Your journey with this car is truly remarkable. Very impressed with what you did with it. Enjoy!

grauhst
06-16-13, 11:56 AM
Thanks a lot.
I would like to have learned to drive in a Cadillac, but I had to do it in an ugly Audi A3 Diesel. :rolleyes:

Today I checked the power module again. Yes, I have to replace it.
http://up.picr.de/14861085ki.jpg

Blower motor and power module disassembled. I am overhauling the motor right now, a bearing is worn.
http://up.picr.de/14861090io.jpg

Power module...
http://up.picr.de/14861102rt.jpg

Furthermore I repaired the storage bag at the back of the driver seat.
http://up.picr.de/14861123zh.jpg

Regards
Felix

grauhst
07-04-13, 12:09 PM
Don't worry, I haven't forget this threat. :)
Will go forward with bigger progressing steps later this month but first I have two questions.
How I can find the MAP sensor? I read something about that it is behind the instrument cluster, isn't it? How can I go to it because I want to replace it with a new one.
Second question, I am looking for paint. It should be the original lacquer, paint code 62 (Woodland Haze). Was only used on 83-84 Cadillacs.
Can anybody help me? Would like to repair some spots in the paint and there are the bumper filler too...
Would need the paint and anything else. (correct primer and so on)

Btw 3 days ago the Cadillac celebrates it's 30th official birthday. So now I can go for a german historic registration called "H-Plate". Very advantageous to taxes and insurance fees.

http://up.picr.de/15032217nx.jpg

Regards from Germany
Felix

----------

This is a pic of the buck tag.

http://up.picr.de/15069216mo.jpg

Felix

csbuckn
07-04-13, 12:25 PM
The map sensor is under the passanger dash next to the computer.

grauhst
07-04-13, 12:32 PM
This one?

http://up.picr.de/15069415cn.jpg

csbuckn
07-04-13, 01:04 PM
Kinda hard to see but its in that area on the same metal bracket as the ecm. Should have a vacuum hose and an extra nipple on it.

grauhst
07-04-13, 01:14 PM
Thanks, I will find that and keep updated when replacing it.
I think then the last trouble code (33) should be deleted.
Maybe there is only a bad connector or whatever... I have screwed the sensor off when I checked the AC-programmer for its operating status.
I will look whats going on with it.

Anybody have ideas to the paint?

Regards
Felix

pompste
07-05-13, 07:08 AM
Wow! I`m so amazed at the talent you have repairing all what needs to be repaired on your own! Beautiful Fleetwood too!

If i may ask,where did you get all your knowledge and learn to how to do all the repairs yourself?

The chimes sound so much better than the annoying buzzer i have in my '78 Deville.

talismandave
07-05-13, 09:31 AM
.....question, I am looking for paint. It should be the original lacquer, paint code 62 (Woodland Haze). Was only used on 83-84 Cadillacs.
Can anybody help me? Would like to repair some spots in the paint and there are the bumper filler too...
Would need the paint and anything else. (correct primer and so on)

Btw 3 days ago the Cadillac celebrates it's 30th official birthday. So now I can go for a german historic registration called "H-Plate". Very advantageous to taxes and insurance fees.

http://up.picr.de/15032217nx.jpg

Hi Felix,


These are a couple of links others have posted in the past. I am not familiar with them personally but perhaps someone will advise with personal experiences with these companies.


http://www.tcpglobal.com/autocolorlibrary/
http://www.touchuppaintonline.com/


Great news that you can get it "officially" on the road!:happybday4::bday23::cheer::cheers:

grauhst
08-01-13, 03:53 PM
@ pompste
Thanks a lot. My knowledge? Well, this is all learning by doing. Had no idea how my transmission overhaul will end but I read a lot about it and it worked fine. :)

Ok, have done some progress on the Caddy again.

Put in a new blower motor and power module. Now it works great. But still don't know the AC. Have to test it while a test drive.

http://up.picr.de/15364261nz.jpg

Got 2 new Sealed Beam and replaced the cracked one. Repaired the cornering lights (someone took out the bulbs, because it was forbidden in Germany some years ago).
Took also the grille and bumper off and straighten out the bumper. It was bent due to a crash.
Took off the front fillers and one rear filler. I will replace them soon.

http://up.picr.de/15228809fv.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15228820js.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15228868uq.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15228885ys.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15228905hu.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15228906oy.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15364262mk.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15364278is.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15364282qt.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15364291mo.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15364300sv.jpg

That's it for now. I will register the car soon. I am waiting for some parts.

Bought new exhaust pipes too. I will install them soon.

http://up.picr.de/15259111xe.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

cadillac kevin
08-01-13, 03:57 PM
Interesting way of straightening the bumper. How did it turn out?

outsider
08-01-13, 04:09 PM
That's awesome! Yeah, how did the bumper turn out? Very creative way to do it.

grauhst
08-01-13, 04:18 PM
Hehe. Better than before! But not 100% straight yet. It is heavy to bent. The metal is very strong and the rope almost teared off. I have done it with my Lincoln jack and jacked it up the full length (!) The bumper went back every time. Will install it soon and I hope it looks way better than this:

http://up.picr.de/15366111uz.jpg

I will show pictures after installing. (as usual ;) )
Regards
Felix

cadillac kevin
08-01-13, 05:19 PM
Makes my bumper that is racked just enough that I cannot install one filler seem not very bad. LOL

jamespowers
08-02-13, 12:44 AM
Nice job! It will be looking new in no time. It doesn't look far from it now. :D

grauhst
08-02-13, 06:40 PM
Haha, thanks guys.

the result...
http://up.picr.de/15376269li.jpg

before clean
http://up.picr.de/15376270ug.jpg

after... took some hours to get it that far. There was a lot of dust, oil, duct tape, rust.... and I needed a lot of different cleaner
http://up.picr.de/15376271sg.jpg

well, not bad I think..
http://up.picr.de/15376272hi.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15376273sl.jpg

put it back together
http://up.picr.de/15376274fw.jpg

heavy thing. Lincoln jack is helping again. :D
http://up.picr.de/15376276ek.jpg

not a good pic but you can see, it is still bent. But better than before.
http://up.picr.de/15376277fx.jpg

refreshed the bumper guards. I will redo the white stripe later.
http://up.picr.de/15376278qt.jpg

That's it. Looks not bad, but I am not 100% happy with it. I think I will replace the bumper sometimes for a straight one.
But for now I think it is good.

Regards
Felix

cadillac kevin
08-02-13, 07:19 PM
Felix, that bumper looks great! Any tips on polishing it out?

grauhst
08-04-13, 04:01 PM
@ Kevin,
I took some towels, distilled water and some metal and chrome polish. Was a lot of work and the duct tape was heavy to remove. Sticks like hell.... had a decal and tape remover. That was good.



High beam wasn't working the last time. So I went through the service manual and it seemed, that there is something with the dimming switch.
Where is it? On top of the steering column.. :rolleyes:

Here we go.
http://up.picr.de/15395582vk.jpg

Wasn't able to reach the screws so I let down the column.
http://up.picr.de/15395585uw.jpg

There it is.
http://up.picr.de/15395590ej.jpg

uninstalled it, took the connector and.....
http://up.picr.de/15395591lm.jpg

Ok, will replace it and it should work again.

Regards
Felix

grauhst
08-06-13, 11:52 AM
ols vs. new

http://up.picr.de/15416151ix.jpg

high beam works again...

http://up.picr.de/15416152au.jpg

Regards
Felix

Vampyre
08-08-13, 02:31 PM
Wow.. this is coming along very nicely.
I love that body style and year.... :)

grauhst
08-11-13, 03:01 PM
Today I put in the grille. It was bent due to the collision. But now it looks great again. Still have to adjust the bumper.

before
http://up.picr.de/15468039gk.jpg

now
http://up.picr.de/15468065ry.jpg

cleaned up the car the first time.
http://up.picr.de/15468091ii.jpg

look for all chips in the paint.
http://up.picr.de/15468096fd.jpg

a lot of scratches on the top of the fender
http://up.picr.de/15468097tx.jpg

a lot of worn paint at the front.
http://up.picr.de/15468098gh.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15468099ql.jpg

weird stone chips on the hood
http://up.picr.de/15468100uc.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15468109hv.jpg

something leaked out and flowed down the trunk lid
http://up.picr.de/15468113xr.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15468117kp.jpg

Lot of little things but I have no problem with it. Only all rust spots I will preserve.

Regards
Felix

talismandave
08-11-13, 04:00 PM
Looks good and solid. Great basis for a repaint.

Congrats on making the forum newsletter! :highfive:
Your view count will go up significantly.
All eyes are upon you now! The pressure is on....:shark:

csbuckn
08-11-13, 08:03 PM
Forum newsletter? I didnt find one here.

talismandave
08-11-13, 11:21 PM
I get it sent to my email address.

grauhst
08-12-13, 04:39 AM
Yes, I saw it too in the Newsletter. :woohoo:

Was very surprised about. Like it. :D

Regards
Felix

csbuckn
08-12-13, 12:29 PM
I want one to my email. :(

Cadillacboy
08-12-13, 03:40 PM
I want one to my email. :(

Pm me your e-mail , I can gladly send it for you

Congrats on your cool Cadillac hitting the e-mail :D

talismandave
08-12-13, 06:04 PM
I don't know why or how I get it. I don't remember signing up for it? :noidea:

May have come because of CF android app? Either of you have that?

jamespowers
08-13-13, 03:59 AM
I don't know why or how I get it. I don't remember signing up for it? :noidea:

May have come because of CF android app? Either of you have that?Well, you are a Platinum Supporter....I dunno. :p

talismandave
08-13-13, 08:55 AM
I thought of that but grauhst isn't and he got it so I don't think it's that.

grauhst
08-13-13, 09:46 AM
Go to "Settings"
then on the left side under "My Settings" select "General Settings" and click on "Receive a monthly newsletter from Cadillac forums : Cadillac Owners Forum"

That's it.

Regards
Felix

jamespowers
08-13-13, 02:03 PM
Go to "Settings"
then on the left side under "My Settings" select "General Settings" and click on "Receive a monthly newsletter from Cadillac forums : Cadillac Owners Forum"

That's it.

Regards
Felix

I checked and I have had that checked since the beginning. Never received one yet.:hmm:

talismandave
08-13-13, 08:14 PM
Check your spam....:spam:

jamespowers
08-14-13, 12:41 PM
Check your spam....:spam:

Not there either.....:confused:

socortes
08-16-13, 05:21 PM
Ditto I wanna be one of the cool kids. I have an 82 and his posts are very inspiring



Pm me your e-mail , I can gladly send it for you

Congrats on your cool Cadillac hitting the e-mail :D

grauhst
08-28-13, 09:43 AM
Here we go again, there arrived packages of parts. A member of this forum "Robin Banks" helped me a lot with getting parts and the overall organisation. It is not easy to organize buying parts from Germany so I have to say a big thank you!

Christmas time! :D

At first I wanted to change the right rear door handle.
http://up.picr.de/15641328ta.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15641331ap.jpg

No one has ever uninstalled these trim since production in 1983.
http://up.picr.de/15641333kd.jpg

no rust down there... great!!
http://up.picr.de/15641342tp.jpg

looks very good.
http://up.picr.de/15641347cg.jpg

installed the new handle and put everything toghether again.
http://up.picr.de/15641350xq.jpg

this is it. I lubricated everything and now the door opens and closes smooth.
http://up.picr.de/15641352wp.jpg


We are going to the front of the car. Didnt like the turn signal lenses.
http://up.picr.de/15641376ho.jpg

There they are the new ones. The pair at the front is looking the best I think.
http://up.picr.de/15641385mj.jpg

installed..
http://up.picr.de/15641389ek.jpg

I like!
http://up.picr.de/15641397lo.jpg

door handle molding of driver side door was cracked and scratched.
http://up.picr.de/15641420rd.jpg

woodgrain switch panel was broken and worn too.
http://up.picr.de/15641421ul.jpg

both installed
http://up.picr.de/15641423kv.jpg

grauhst
08-28-13, 09:43 AM
battery hold down installed (original one was missed)
http://up.picr.de/15641448lo.jpg

new wiper arm (the old one was broken)
http://up.picr.de/15641464ek.jpg

new vacuum pump
http://up.picr.de/15641483dj.jpg

That's it for today. Will post more things the next days.

Wanted to replace the steering wheel too, but I am not able to remove it. How can I remove the tilt-lever?
http://up.picr.de/15647767qh.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15647768nb.jpg

Best Regards from Germany
Felix

talismandave
08-28-13, 11:01 AM
The part is threaded into the center of wheel mount. It just unscrews. It has been a couple months since I did mine but if I recall correctly I just kept moving it with lever, and remounting lever in next holes until it could be moved by hand.

If you have a pin spanner wrench to put in the two center holes it would be easier. I think I opened up a needle nose plier and put it in the holes and used it as a handle to spin it out.

You will need a wheel puller once you get all that out of the way. If you don't have one I used a piece of steel, and three bolts to do mine.
http://i1153.photobucket.com/albums/p519/davidpraedel/Cars%20Of%20My%20Life/talismandave/steeringwheelpuller.jpg (http://s1153.photobucket.com/user/davidpraedel/media/Cars%20Of%20My%20Life/talismandave/steeringwheelpuller.jpg.html)http://i1153.photobucket.com/albums/p519/davidpraedel/Cars%20Of%20My%20Life/talismandave/steeringwheelpuller2.jpg (http://s1153.photobucket.com/user/davidpraedel/media/Cars%20Of%20My%20Life/talismandave/steeringwheelpuller2.jpg.html)

Just unscrew the center bolt until it pushes the wheel off. 5/16 in. 18 threads/in. IIRC?

grauhst
08-29-13, 02:32 PM
Thanks, that worked fine!
http://up.picr.de/15661062oj.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15661067xc.jpg

installed the new one. In my opinion it looks way better.
http://up.picr.de/15661080lv.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15661081zo.jpg

comparison
http://up.picr.de/15661082la.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

outsider
08-29-13, 03:19 PM
wow very much better!

Robin Banx
08-29-13, 04:42 PM
^ And I'm pleased that the steering wheel from my car has found a good new home.

Cheers.........R.

grauhst
08-29-13, 04:45 PM
It's so great, I love it!

Thanks a lot!!!

Felix

jamespowers
08-29-13, 05:29 PM
comparison
http://up.picr.de/15661082la.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

Save that leather wrap. You never know when you might be able to use it if it is still in good shape. :D

cadillac kevin
08-29-13, 06:08 PM
Save that leather wrap. You never know when you might be able to use it if it is still in good shape. :D

This. The wheel looks to be in good shape aside from being faded. If your wood trimmed wheel cracks, you can always redye and reinstall the leather wheel.

jamespowers
08-29-13, 06:14 PM
This. The wheel looks to be in good shape aside from being faded. If your wood trimmed wheel cracks, you can always redye and reinstall the leather wheel.

One of the reasons I would keep it that is for sure. :p
You can also use it to repair small bad spots in the leather or vinyl. :D

talismandave
08-29-13, 08:25 PM
Looks great, just like new.

grauhst
08-30-13, 08:54 AM
Yes, sure I will save the leather one as a spare. Unfortunately someone has wrapped an additional layer of leather on it. It looks a bit purple.

Regards
Felix

cadillac kevin
08-30-13, 12:03 PM
Yes, sure I will save the leather one as a spare. Unfortunately someone has wrapped an additional layer of leather on it. It looks a bit purple.

Regards
Felix

That's faded. It probably used to be burgundy or brown. Both of those colors can fade to purple.

talismandave
08-30-13, 12:50 PM
If you want to have fun and experiment on your spare wheel, I fixed my cracked wheel and replaced the foil woodgrain with real wood veneer. I am not sure if your wheel still used the same system as the 74 or not but it might be worth checking out?

grauhst
08-31-13, 11:48 AM
The original wheel that I took out is an original leather wheel and someone wrapped another layer around it.
I don't know how it looks underneith but I think the leather is worn, cracked or whatever. If I need a replacement sometimes I think I would dye it brown and put it in.
It is in good shape but I like those thin wheels more.

Regards
Felix

talismandave
08-31-13, 08:28 PM
I am sure it is the same thin wheel under the leather cover. If it is the same system as on the older ones the plastic covering the fake wood grain cracks off and the foil tape starts to cut your hands. (Someone with a mid 80s may confirm or refute this.)

If so what I did was pull out the plastic and cut real wood veneer in the slot the plastic was in then applied chrome pinstripe tape on outer edges and covered it all in clear poly.

Here is a link to CadForce69's thread where he shows what is involved. http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/rwd-19xx-1984-deville-fleetwood-1985/232166-69-sedan-de-ville-official-restoration-9.html

cadillac kevin
08-31-13, 09:43 PM
The leather wheels do not have a hard plastic wheel under the skin. I asked about that a while ago, and someone showed a torn open one.
As for leather over the leather, maybe, but that would make a very fat wheel. The factory leather always looked a bit awkward where it meets the spokes.

talismandave
09-01-13, 12:24 AM
Did the photo he posted look like a leather wheel to you? I thought it looked just like the new one he put on, but with an after factory cover sewn on it.:hmm:

grauhst
09-02-13, 06:25 PM
It is an original leather one underneith the cover.

http://up.picr.de/15710388pp.jpg

Regards
Felix

talismandave
09-02-13, 06:48 PM
Ahh!...nevermind....:lol:

grauhst
09-07-13, 02:40 PM
Ok, today I took the driver side valve cover off. It was leaky and oil dropped onto the spark cable of the last cylinder.

someone took some cans of bathroom silicone and built an artwork of silicone. The whole "V" between the intake and cyl.head was filled up with silicone.
http://up.picr.de/15756782zp.jpg

everywhere silicone
http://up.picr.de/15756790ks.jpg

valve cover
http://up.picr.de/15756800cn.jpg

the silicone artwork
http://up.picr.de/15756801rw.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15756803at.jpg

new stuff
http://up.picr.de/15756805mt.jpg

before cleaning
http://up.picr.de/15756808sl.jpg

after... chrome is not perfect, but better than before.
http://up.picr.de/15756810nw.jpg

this is the reason, why I stopped it today. There is oil in the head and it doesn't flow down to the oil pan. Is it normal?? I haven't found any holes where the oil could flow downwards. Does the 4100 cylinder heads have no oil holes???
Oil is running into the cylinder. When I started the car the last time, it smoked hell like oil at the beginning. That can't be normal.
http://up.picr.de/15756813po.jpg

just a provisorium. Looks strange to the rest of the engine. :D
http://up.picr.de/15756818rk.jpg

best Regards
Felix

csbuckn
09-07-13, 02:59 PM
Interesting find on the oil in the head. It should have drainback holes in there somewhere. I wonder if this is a major reason why the 4100s have bearing issues...lack of oil at higher rpms. I'd be tempted to suck it out and find the drainback holes. I dont think I'd poke around in fear of pushing a clump of gunk down to the oil pan. Also a good catch on the silicon, that would really do a number on your oil pump also.

grauhst
09-07-13, 06:19 PM
Googled some pics and looked into the Shop Manual. Haven't found oil holes!
Here are a lot of people with HT4100, does anybody have pulled off the valve cover someday and could say something about my problem?

I think I will take off the other valve cover too. If there is no oil, I have to look for the holes.
I will took out the oil of the driver side head and look for them.

http://up.picr.de/15759560tp.jpg

Regards
Felix

----------

EDIT:

look at this... I don't see any drain holes.

Link (http://www.machineworldny.com/asp/CylinderHead.aspx?pid=1719&type=A)

Regards
Felix

----------

EDIT:

now I am on the right way....
There can't be any holes!!!
The HT doesn't have a classic "block", it has only 4 cylinder bearings and around it there is only coolant water. There is no way and space for an oil drain.
So the only way the oil can go is about the push rod holes. It should be totally normal that the oil is standing in the head.

Look at the block.... Link (http://www.ebay.com/itm/HT-4100-1986-1988-4-1L-Cadillac-Engine-Reconditioned-Cylinder-Block-1625964-/190895609877?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c7243d815&vxp=mtr)

Regards
Felix

Big_Al1911
09-07-13, 11:52 PM
As painful as this is to post (I have an '85 with HT4100): http://www.popularhotrodding.com/features/0408phr_worst_automobile_engines/
Scroll down to the second mention of the HT4100.

"The cylinder heads were fitted with very small oil drainbacks that were no larger than a pencil. This spelled disaster when teamed with excessively loose valve-stem-to-guide clearance. It was common for an HT 4100 to fill the valve covers with oil after the drain backs plugged. Then the oil would get sucked past the valve guides, creating not only excessive oil consumption, but carbon in the guide. This resulted in sticking valves."

Now I'm thinking I should check mine.


-Big Al

grauhst
09-08-13, 08:43 AM
You're correct!
Searched the Service Manual again and there they say that there are 2 little drain holes:

"Oil drains from the cylinder heads into the valve lifter compartment thru two drain holes and retrns to the oil pan through the gap between the lifter carrier and the block."

What do you think, could that be possible?

http://up.picr.de/15764956ow.jpg

Regards
Felix

jayoldschool
09-08-13, 12:22 PM
I know on my mother's 84, when I change the oil, if I pour the fresh oil in too quickly, the valve cover will fill up, and oil will leak quickly out of the back of the valve cover gasket. Pretty sure it is where the "V" in the gasket meets the intake. I'll try and run a pipe cleaner in those holes when I do the gaskets.

grauhst
09-08-13, 06:37 PM
Damn, I believe I have a bigger problem...

Found the holes and tried to make them free. There was very hard oil coal and mud in there (don't know the american words for it).
I wasn't able to make the whole hole free, because it doesn't go a straight way. It turns half way into another direction. How the hell can I clean them?
I fear, that I have to take off the intake and go from this direction....

http://up.picr.de/15774720op.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15774722ud.jpg

Aaaaargh..... :mad3:

Any ideas? Does anybody have a disassembled cylinder head and could look for the holes where they are on the intake manifold side?
Are they any chemicals that could dissolve the oil mud/coal in these holes?

Felix

csbuckn
09-08-13, 08:16 PM
Compressed air?

jayoldschool
09-08-13, 08:23 PM
Flexible bore brush. For rifles. I'm sure that they make them for engines, too.

http://www.knightrifles.com/images/D/M900104-bore-brush-kit.jpg

Bro-Ham
09-08-13, 08:51 PM
Great project thread! Great car! I love reading these stories of hard work keeping these lovely old cars going, and also looking fantastic! Keep it up! :)

Big_Al1911
09-08-13, 11:27 PM
I don't know if a bore brush is going to make it. A rifle has a straight bore--they are not designed to turn corners. But if one could come at it from both sides those wire bore brushed would be the way to go. You can get them in a diameter that would be a slight interference fit to clear the crud out.

I don't know how sharp the turn is, but perhaps a small spring could be used to fashion something similar to a drain auger, like one uses to clear a sink drain?

I must say, this does not sound like a very effective design for draining the oil.

-Big Al

talismandave
09-08-13, 11:45 PM
Two things come to mind.

Bunn coffee makers like are sold for commercial use give you a flexible spring about a 1/4in dia. for cleaning them out. It is designed to bust calcium deposits out of the copper tubing that spirals around inside of them and quite effective. We just had to go to a restaurant supply and buy one for our machine at work for a couple bucks.

The other is a 1/4 dia. drain snake. They are very similar and about $6.00. Cut the coil off the end and it may work. They do not seem as flexible as the Bunn cleaning rod.

grauhst
09-12-13, 05:45 PM
Thanks to you all for your hints.

Today I tried it with welding wires. Its hard to locate the ongoing drainhole.
http://up.picr.de/15816147pk.jpg

Took off the alternator, fan shroud, ac compressor and will clean everything. Some screws and bolts weren't installed correctly and I will make everything how it should be.
I will take off the passenger valve cover soon.
http://up.picr.de/15816172wl.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15816177wm.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15816178nq.jpg

What is this bracket for? There wasn't anything attached.
http://up.picr.de/15818273jn.jpg

If I would have an engine crane, I would have taken out the engine. But I think I will can make that this way too.

Regards
Felix

jamespowers
09-12-13, 07:56 PM
I am not sure but it looks like something to do with the generator. Maybe this might help:
143986

Robin Banx
09-12-13, 10:17 PM
Felix......That bracket is a rear alternator support bracket. Mine is still in place. It appears to engage the back of the alternator through the slotted hole. There is nothing fastened to the holes at the end of the bracket. Yours will need straightening and if your are a real stickler for detail, the colour is gloss black. I suspect that it would have been painted with the main alternator mount because that part is one of the only gloss black pieces in the entire engine room. The employee who painted those parts in 1983 probably got fired at the end of the production run when the bean-counters found out how much money he wasted painting those pieces with really nice paint.

Cheers...........R.

jamespowers
09-12-13, 10:19 PM
Felix......That bracket is a rear alternator support bracket. Mine is still in place. It appears to engage the back of the alternator through the slotted hole. There is nothing fastened to the holes at the end of the bracket. Yours will need straightening and if your are a real stickler for detail, the colour is gloss black. I suspect that it would have been painted with the main alternator mount because that part is one of the only gloss black pieces in the entire engine room. The employee who painted those parts in 1983 probably got fired at the end of the production run when the bean-counters found out how much money he wasted painting those pieces with really nice paint.

Cheers...........R.

Quite right Alternator. I was thinking of my classic cars with generators. :p Sorry about that. :doh:

grauhst
09-19-13, 02:05 PM
Thanks a lot, I will take it for the alternator.

Took off the passenger valve cover today. Good thing, there is standing no oil in the head but there is some oil coal.

http://up.picr.de/15895483ga.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15895484kv.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15895485sh.jpg

Regards
Felix

Seville fan
09-19-13, 08:32 PM
Felix you are like a German Edd China from that TV show Wheeler/Dealer. You explain things very clearly like he does and the photography is a big part of it. That's a beautiful car you have just wish it had at least the 307 V8 in it. You may get the 4100 to last forever with your skills but if not I would love to read your chronicles of an engine swap. Lots of people have done it but I have yet to see a detailed accounting of the process with pics of the quality you take. As much as I would like to see a small block Chevy V8 in there a modern Mercedes or BMW turbo diesel might be even better. I bet they could be had pretty cheaply in Germany. Solving the electrical and layout issues would be a real challenge but not for you.

Robin Banx
09-19-13, 11:40 PM
Given the amount of parts removed from the engine for the oil leak repair, now might be a good time to replace the spark plugs and wires. It should be a lot easier than to do it on a complete and running engine. Just a thought.

Cheers and keep up the good work!...........R.

grauhst
09-20-13, 07:29 AM
@ Robin Banx,
I already replaced the plugs when I bought the car in February. What a torture! :D:D
Now it is way more simple, you're correct.
But I haven't thought that it is that horrible to replace the valve cover gasket... I think the better way would be to take out the whole engine. If I had known it earlier, I would have took it out and made bothe engine and transmission at the same time.

@ Seville fan,
Thanks a lot! Well I have to say, I like the HT. Yes, I do! It is a very smooth running engine. Ok, it has no power and it is not the most reliable engine (:D:bigroll:) but I haven't bought a Cadillac to drag race it. It drives great and I love it.
I love the Fuel Monitor gimmicks too of the digital fuel injection. Another part a carbureted 307 don't have. I prefer fuel injection about carb. Way better for a daily driver. My Lincoln's 460 does have a carburetor and I wouldn't like to drive with it the whole year (beside it's fuel consumption).
I wouldn't like to put a BMW or whatever engine in it because I want the characteristics of that typical american V8.
My brother had a BMW 330i convertible with I6 engine (231 hp). Runs smooth and a lot of power but my HT has the same fuel consumption and it runs even smoother (and it's a V8)

http://up.picr.de/15901482ti.jpg

I think when the HT will brake apart sometimes I will either overhaul it or put another HT in it again. I will keep this car as original as possible because I love it how it is.

Btw if I want power I still have my 460 Lincoln: :woohoo: :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmFPMK7y3Vg

Best Regards
Felix

Jeppi94
09-20-13, 09:54 AM
Sweet work! I've got the exact same tires like you!

Seville fan
09-20-13, 03:51 PM
I forgot about your Lincoln! Nothing like the sound of a big displacement carbureted V8. You are too spoiled now to have a bigger engine in the Cadillac, the Mark will always sound better. I think those had the factory dual exhaust too.

It's true about the fuel economy with the 4100 and 307 engines, not that bad. I know what you mean about loving it the way it is. Many people have told me to change the 307 V8 I have to something more powerful but I don't want to for the reasons you mentioned.

jamespowers
09-20-13, 10:59 PM
I think when the HT will brake apart sometimes I will either overhaul it or put another HT in it again. I will keep this car as original as possible because I love it how it is.

Unplugging the drain holes and doing all the other work likely saved the HT. You will probably get quite a bit of use out of it by keeping it up and not abusing it. The more I see you working on it, the more I appreciate the HT. If you ever rebuild it, you can probably straighten out a lot of the problems that plagued the HT in the first place since we all know that Cadillac kept updating the engines with upgrades that made them last longer.

talismandave
09-20-13, 11:52 PM
I agree with you on keeping the 4100.

I had an 82 sedan deville with it. I bought it with 52,000 and ran it up to a little over 100,000. I noticed antifreeze going away but no leak. You could smell it in the exhaust.:(

I was in my 20s at the time and it was my wife's daily driver, which is to say the service and upkeep were not what I would do today. Oil light was when it would be checked and such. Not my proudest moment automobile wise.:ill:

Considering the near neglectful care it got, I was very happy with 100,000 miles on it, sold it for near retail book to a guy who took it to his mechanic.:suspect:

While we had it we did a lot of vacations and weekends and I loved it. Great MPG quiet and smooth. Wasn't a car you passed in on a two lane road, but other than that never bad off the line to merge with or enter highways. I would buy one today that was blown if clean and cheap enough and rebuild it.

Your thread and the cleaning of those drains should be required reading for all owners of HT4100's!:yup:
If one were in my driveway right now, the covers would be off before it were driven again.:thumbsup:

grauhst
09-21-13, 12:27 PM
Thanks a lot to all of you.


I forgot about your Lincoln! Nothing like the sound of a big displacement carbureted V8. You are too spoiled now to have a bigger engine in the Cadillac, the Mark will always sound better. I think those had the factory dual exhaust too.I think you are right on the button (is it correct for "hit the mark"?)
Yes, it has factory dual exhaust and it sounds great. The HT has that typical fuel injection sound and I like that too. Well, as you said nothing beats displacement, that's true.

@ jamespowers
Yes, thank you. I think that it will work further too. It was working 30 years (hey.. we should remember that, how much modern engines you think will reach 30 years?). So we could say these engines are quite reliable. It was working 30 years and I think it will work a lot of more years if I will take good care of it.

@ talismandave
Great to read about.
Your hint with the drain holes for all HT owners is right. Somewhere I read about that the drainholes were made bigger on 84 and later HT engines so that the most risky engines are the 82-83 ones.
The oil coal is caused due to the exhaust crossover in the intake manifold. Look at this (http://www.ebay.com/itm/OEM-INTAKE-MANIFOLD-82-84-DEVILLE-82-85-82-85-ELDORADO-82-85-SEVILLE-4-1L-HT4100-/321179272826?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4ac7c6c67a&vxp=mtr). On the bottom you can see that there is oil coal right at the exhaust crossover area. I think it would be way better without that exhaust crossover is going through the intake. It is required for the EGR system too.
Well, it is how it is and I think with good care and high quality oil this should be not the biggest problem.

Btw the HT is told to have a lot of problems with the intake gasket. How can I notice a gasket fail?

Best Regards from Germany
Felix

vicello93
09-21-13, 01:44 PM
Thanks a lot to all of you. I think you are right on the button (is it correct for "hit the mark"?) Yes, it has factory dual exhaust and it sounds great. The HT has that typical fuel injection sound and I like that too. Well, as you said nothing beats displacement, that's true. @ jamespowers Yes, thank you. I think that it will work further too. It was working 30 years (hey.. we should remember that, how much modern engines you think will reach 30 years?). So we could say these engines are quite reliable. It was working 30 years and I think it will work a lot of more years if I will take good care of it. @ talismandave Great to read about. Your hint with the drain holes for all HT owners is right. Somewhere I read about that the drainholes were made bigger on 84 and later HT engines so that the most risky engines are the 82-83 ones. The oil coal is caused due to the exhaust crossover in the intake manifold. Look at this (http://www.ebay.com/itm/OEM-INTAKE-MANIFOLD-82-84-DEVILLE-82-85-82-85-ELDORADO-82-85-SEVILLE-4-1L-HT4100-/321179272826?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4ac7c6c67a&vxp=mtr). On the bottom you can see that there is oil coal right at the exhaust crossover area. I think it would be way better without that exhaust crossover is going through the intake. It is required for the EGR system too. Well, it is how it is and I think with good care and high quality oil this should be not the biggest problem. Btw the HT is told to have a lot of problems with the intake gasket. How can I notice a gasket fail? Best Regards from Germany Felix
I'm having gasket problems with my 84 HT , how I noticed was the cooland bottle was bubbling when the car was running, and of course over heating but mine is the head gasket not the intake gasket. I'm surprised with my HT, it has 119000 miles and it's still running very quiet.

grauhst
09-24-13, 01:41 PM
Alright, today I installed one new rear filler.

http://up.picr.de/15950464ou.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15950389ac.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15950412op.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15950416cm.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15950426yg.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15950427as.jpg

It doesn't fit well to the tail light housing. There is a big gap. How can I make it fit better? There are no shims between bumper shock and bumper.
Felix

grauhst
09-26-13, 12:37 PM
Filler #2

http://up.picr.de/15969741oo.jpg

http://up.picr.de/15969744tc.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

outsider
09-26-13, 01:41 PM
making progress! Nice to see

kamyar cadillac
10-04-13, 05:14 PM
Very good
I enjoyed seeing topic
I hope to get better every day.

grauhst
10-14-13, 08:31 AM
Ok, this is a critical moment right now. I saw that some intake bolts were loose. I mean they were that loose that I only had to turn them out with my pure fingers. Half of all the bolts were that loose. In some bolt holes there was coolant so I decided to take out the intake.
Well that needed some days. The distributor was a hell to uninstall. No tools were avaliable to reach the distibutor nut. At the end my bicycle tool made it.
Ok the intake is off and cleaned. It looks good again and it was a good decision to take out the intake. The gasket was close to its end.

before...
http://up.picr.de/16143779hr.jpg

after...
http://up.picr.de/16158143xd.jpg

I was hoping to clean the oil drain holes after taking off the intake. I searched the holes but.... there were none. :bomb:

http://up.picr.de/16143773ng.jpg

I put some oil at the passengers side head and the oil ran out of the head bolt hole.... :banghead: :banghead:

http://up.picr.de/16143766bv.jpg

So this is the way the oil drains... (red = head bolt)

http://up.picr.de/16147685zi.jpg

I put a screwdriver in the hole to show it:

http://up.picr.de/16158019oo.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16158033ui.jpg

That's why I said this is a critical moment. I am not able to clean that hole. I tried welding wire but that doesn't work.
I really think I have to take out that one head bolt of the clogged hole. I am scared of it because I know about the threads in the block.

That's why I want to ask you:
How big is the possiblity of a failing thread when I am only take that one bolt out?
Are the threads usually all failing or is it a less possibility? (maybe 1 out of 10 or so....)
These are questions to your experience of people who have done it to an HT4100...
Another question... is it possible to renew the thread (with thread inserts) when the cylinder head is still in place??

All that questions are based on this bolt:
http://up.picr.de/16167921cf.jpg

I really don't want that but I can't see another solution to clean the drain hole.
I would be very grateful to hear your experience with the threads.

Best Regards
Felix

csbuckn
10-14-13, 10:24 AM
Tough call. If you plan on keeping the car for a long time, I'd try taking it out. Would you replace it with a new one? You should paint the intake to make it look purdy.

talismandave
10-14-13, 10:54 AM
I wonder if there is any aerosol cleaning solvent that would work and not damage anything else?

Something like choke and carb cleaner or electric contact cleaner? Maybe someone has info or opinion on this?


If not, I think I am with Sam, I would have to try removing and cleaning. I could not seal it up again until I knew it was cleaned.
I don't know if it could be done safely, but I would have to try. You cannot put a threadsert in with head in place, you have to tap a larger hole for the insert to go into.

You have a healthy 4100, I believe you have also found a very likely reason so many are not. Something would have to be done IMO.

Hope someone smarter than me can chime in.


We sell at our hardware store, music wire. It is a mildly hardened steel wire that is much smaller than welding wire.Might be stiff enough in the right diameter to do the dirty work? I comes in 1 meter/yard pieces.

csbuckn
10-14-13, 11:25 AM
I'd be tempted to take the heads off and drill out the headbolt hole from the drainback down to make it bigger. I wonder what the Casper engines did to correct the issue.

grauhst
10-20-13, 12:03 PM
Yeeeha, success!!!

Took out the head bolts today and luckily the threads are like new. Very strong and I was able to tighten them again with 90 lb ft / 120 Nm without any problems.
The oil drains are completely free again.

:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::woohoo::D

http://up.picr.de/16228500it.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16228499bm.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16228498xs.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

jamespowers
10-20-13, 06:58 PM
Nice job! You extended the life of that engine now. :D In hindsight, those engines needed that kind of care to last when they were new. The dealerships just had no idea how much maintenance they really needed. I doubt even GM did though.

grauhst
10-21-13, 06:48 PM
Thanks a lot.
I hope that all I do to the engine will be good to its future.

Today I installed the intake. The thermostat housing was a hell to do, I hope everything will be dry later.

http://abload.de/img/k-p11007887juua.jpg

Felix

jamespowers
10-21-13, 06:56 PM
Thanks a lot.
I hope that all I do to the engine will be good to its future.

Today I installed the intake. The thermostat housing was a hell to do, I hope everything will be dry later.

http://abload.de/img/k-p11007887juua.jpg



Felix

Wow! It looks clean. Pretty soon you will tell us that you have a high performance cam in there and now it REALLY moves. :p

grauhst
10-21-13, 07:38 PM
Wow! It looks clean. Pretty soon you will tell us that you have a high performance cam in there and now it REALLY moves. :p
Thanks, I like when it looks clean. Wait when I have done the whole engine bay.:)
Are there performance camshafts avaliable for this engine? Haven't found anything. (are there even stock ones?)

Regards
Felix

jamespowers
10-21-13, 08:44 PM
Thanks, I like when it looks clean. Wait when I have done the whole engine bay.:)
Are there performance camshafts avaliable for this engine? Haven't found anything. (are there even stock ones?)

Regards
Felix

Here are a couple ideas for getting more power out of the HT4100:
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/ht4100-4-1-4-5-4/32289-boosting-ht4100-performance-2.html

cadillac kevin
10-22-13, 12:46 AM
Here are a couple ideas for getting more power out of the HT4100:
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/ht4100-4-1-4-5-4/32289-boosting-ht4100-performance-2.html

I like the last couple ideas....get a different motor. LOL

jamespowers
10-22-13, 01:24 AM
I like the last couple ideas....get a different motor. LOLI knew you would but he asked what could be done with the one he has. :tisk::p He has already put enough into it to just keep it going and has an attachment to it. :D

grauhst
10-22-13, 02:59 PM
Put in the distributor today :bomb: and started with the valve train:

pushrods

http://up.picr.de/16240204ph.jpg

installed the rocker arm bar with 50 Nm and started to install the rocker arm with pivots. Everything went fine until the last (!!!) bolt:

http://up.picr.de/16240240wv.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16240284rw.jpg

Took all off again, grabbed the other bar, started installing again and all threads were good on this one.

http://up.picr.de/16240336xu.jpg

EGR valve, vacuum hoses and valve cover installed.

http://up.picr.de/16240397ic.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16240398vu.jpg

That's it for today.
Best Regards
Felix

talismandave
10-22-13, 09:25 PM
You rock Felix!:thumbsup:

jamespowers
10-23-13, 01:11 AM
I think you have done enough for one day. :p

grauhst
10-23-13, 01:43 PM
Hahaha, thanks!

Today I installed most front engine brackets, the AC compressor some more stuff. Still have to clean the AC hoses.

http://up.picr.de/16252055sa.jpg

vacuum lines. Installed the driver side vacuum line too and it was horrible. It continues at the rear of the distributor to the passenger side vacuum switch.

http://up.picr.de/16252063mm.jpg

Another day ends.
I am waiting for some more paint to go on. Furthermore I expect a rocker arm pivot delivery to install the driver side valve train.

http://up.picr.de/16252122qk.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

grauhst
10-23-13, 07:57 PM
Oh and I forget to ask.

Could anyone tell me where this ground wire has to be attached? It is screwed to the firewall (upper red circle).
Where does the other end belong to? Maybe the distributor? Maybe transmission? What else?
I prefer something I uninstalled but I really forget it.

http://up.picr.de/16256106im.jpg

Thanks
Felix

csbuckn
10-23-13, 10:09 PM
The ground strap goes to the back of the cylinder head. It grounds the engine to the body of the car. Also helps ground the wiper motor.

grauhst
10-24-13, 05:05 PM
Great, thanks. I will look for a bolt or borehole where to put a bolt in.

Interesting, I can't remember that I have uninstalled something back there. I believe, this cable was loose the whole time.

Felix

jamespowers
10-24-13, 05:32 PM
Great, thanks. I will look for a bolt or borehole where to put a bolt in.

Interesting, I can't remember that I have uninstalled something back there. I believe, this cable was loose the whole time.

Felix

You will have a lot better ground for the whole car now then. Your electrical systems should be happier too. I won't even mention how much safer the electrical systems will be. :p

grauhst
10-25-13, 02:30 PM
Hi everyone.
I repaired the rocker arm bridge with a bolt. The rocker arm will be tightened with a nut.

http://up.picr.de/16271491iv.jpg

Installed it and when tighten the first rocker arm, another thread came out.... :bomb:

http://up.picr.de/16271496cf.jpg

So I took it out again, put another bolt in and installed it again. Now 3 of 4 rocker arms are installed. I am still waiting for the last rocker arm pivot.
http://up.picr.de/16271497fs.jpg

The old pivot.
http://up.picr.de/16271532kp.jpg

Painted the AC compressor brackets and istalled them with the new belt tension lock assembly.
http://up.picr.de/16271556gz.jpg

Regards
Felix

grauhst
10-26-13, 04:07 PM
Hi.

I have another problem. The timing scale seems to be missed.
I made some pics, could you tell me where it should be attached?
Does anyone have pics of it?

http://up.picr.de/16282451me.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16282453kr.jpg

bottom view
http://up.picr.de/16282455hh.jpg


Today I installed the alternator, distributor cap, wiring harness, vacuum system and some metal support parts.

http://up.picr.de/16281737je.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16281761iy.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16281775gx.jpg

Also found this lying on the lower frame. That's why the driver side wheel housing is totally tattered. A tire exploded sometime.

http://up.picr.de/16281796xy.jpg

Could anyone tell me if there has to be attached a vacuum hose? There is a screw in.

http://up.picr.de/16282250my.jpg

Regards
Felix

----------

Ok I found it in the service manual.

http://up.picr.de/16283184zb.jpg

Have to find a used one.

Regards
Felix

carnut
10-26-13, 08:39 PM
The red circled part is the EGR solenoid and a piece of foam rubber was on that nipple as a crude air filter from the factory, so no vacuum hose to it. Remove the screw! When you finally tighten these belts, make sure the smog pump belt is tight before you tighten the alternator belt. A loose smog pump belt will cause slippage of the alt. belt! Also set the base timing to 12 degrees not 10 once you install the timing tab. The smog pump belt pictured seems a bit frayed, I see threads sticking out from the belt. Replace that belt! That braided ground strap should be attached to one of the transmission to engine bolts.

----------

Regarding the large gap at the rear filler to the taillight, install shims on the lower 2 bolts holding the bumper to the bumper shocks. That will tilt the top of the taillight in. Also there is some adjustment that can be made at the taillight housing to the face of the bumper. Loosen the taillight housing bolts and have someone push on it while you retighten those bolts.

grauhst
11-03-13, 01:50 PM
Thanks. You're right, the belts should be replaced and I will do it soon.

I have installed everything back except for the parts around the driver side valve cover.
Still waiting for the pivot. I got one but ..... it was the wrong side... :annoyed:

I hope it will arrive tomorrow or on tuesday together with a used timing scale and a set of spark wire clips (those attached to the valve cover bolts).

Have painted most of the parts but due to the wet, cold and windy weather it is not possible to paint them glossy. The paint everytime went mat. You can see it on the outer painted braces and the radiator bracket. Knowing that I just don't tried to paint the front brace and installed them rusty again.
I will paint these parts in the next summer. Some other cosmetical is planned too (decals, air cleaner, coolant recovery tank and so on...).
That's no big deal later.

http://up.picr.de/16353165xz.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16353163rf.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16353162ki.jpg

I dismantled the TPS Motor to set it. It was fully extended. Now it is like described in the service manual. There is a gap now, is it correct?

http://up.picr.de/16367446bo.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

carnut
11-03-13, 08:01 PM
That looks OK. gap should be approx. .060 inch. Best to adjust it after the car is running and up to temperature. It is retracted by constant pressure on the shaft with your thumb till it bottoms out with the engine running, then QUICKLY unplugging the harness to it. Its called the idle speed controller ( ISC) The TPS (throttle position sensor) is on the passenger side of the throttle body. If adjusted correctly, it will extend to open the throttle as you turn the ignition key from off to "run" then once the car starts it will slowly retract as the engine comes up to temperature. Sort of like a very simple fast idle to quickly warm up the cat. converter and maintain drive ability till warmed up.

grauhst
11-05-13, 08:19 AM
Yes you're correct, it is the ISC motor.
But as I understand it correct in the service manual, there should be a gap when it is unretracted. Now I set it with a gap in it's retracted position.
So it has to be unretracted and doesn't contact the throttle lever when idling?
If so it was totally set incorrectly the whole time since buying the car.
Service manual says "Do not power the ISC motor in the fully retracted position for more than 4 seconds or ECM damage may occur".
But mine was always retracted.... at least half a year :rolleyes:
I hope there is nothing wrong with my ECM.
Ok I will set it again.

Regards
Felix

Robin Banx
11-05-13, 12:31 PM
The ISC is exactly that. Idle Speed Control. Your service manual will tell you that there is no way (nor is it necessary) to set the idle speed manually by trying to set the gap between the throttle arm and the ISC motor. As you did before, with the engine running at off-idle speed (1200 - 1500 rpm held manually), manually push the ISC plunger in as far as it will go and then disconnect the electronic harness from it. Release the throttle arm and the engine idle should drop to 350 rpm or so. This is the time to look for a small gap between the plunger and the throttle arm. Then repeat the reconnect steps as shown in the service manual. When you turn the ignition on, the ISC plunger should come out prior to start up to give the engine a fast idle condition when it does start. The computer will be in complete control of the idle speed function. As the engine temperature rises, the ISC plunger should slowly retract until a normal warm-engine idle (650 - 700 rpm) is attained. And that's how I remember it. I could be wrong so read the FS Manual carefully.

Cheers...........R.

carnut
11-07-13, 07:17 PM
I agree!!!

grauhst
11-07-13, 07:33 PM
Yes I noticed this way described in the manual.

But as I did it the first time, it wasn't possible to retract the plunger far in. It was fully extended. That's why I want to set it to the fully retracted position as long as the battery is still disconnected. I hope that it is the better starting situation while setting it later to the hot engine.

For the ISC it wasn't possible to come out because it was fully out. That's why it makes that "bump bump" at the beginning.

This video shows it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UU6pnXM77k

I will let you know how this turns out when connecting the battery the first time and starting the engine.

Btw the ordered rocker arm pivot still hasn't arrived yet. This is annoying... weather is getting worse and finally I want to register it...

Regards
Felix

carnut
11-07-13, 10:24 PM
The battery must be connected as well as the wiring at the ISC to retract it! Turn the key to run, wait for the "bumping" to stop, THEN press on the extended shaft till it retracts, then QUICKLY remove harness to the ISC. Now turn in the ISC shaft (its threaded) until the throttle arm rests on the minimum idle screw on the throttle body. Continue to turn the shaft till you have .060 gap. In normal operation the ISC is always touching the throttle arm at idle.

grauhst
11-08-13, 07:27 AM
Aaah... did I understand it correct that the plunger automatically retract when I push it in? I believe this is my problem because it seems that it doesn't work. The last time when I tried to set the ISC it hasn't done anything. It was just the complete way out.

Felix

carnut
11-08-13, 01:47 PM
You must keep constant pressure on the shaft to have it retract. Again, key on, battery connected, wiring connector plugged into ISC. Once retracted, quickly remove wiring plug on the ISC or you will short out the ECM.

cadillac_al
11-10-13, 12:06 AM
You must keep constant pressure on the shaft to have it retract. Again, key on, battery connected, wiring connector plugged into ISC. Once retracted, quickly remove wiring plug on the ISC or you will short out the ECM.

Don't you have to give it some throttle to make it retract?

carnut
11-10-13, 02:30 PM
You have to open the throttle to be able to press on the shaft!

grauhst
11-14-13, 01:32 PM
Ok it seems that something is wrong there.

Today the rocker arm pivot arrived and I put everything together:

http://up.picr.de/16469192qs.jpg

valve cover and new vacuum pump
http://up.picr.de/16469193ee.jpg

water hose and air cleaner housing without cleaner element. That's if timing is too early and it fires back while starting it the first time. Don't want to burn my hood insulation.
As I said previously I will paint these parts next year in summer.
http://up.picr.de/16469210yo.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16469214ov.jpg

As I filled up the new coolant, it immediately leaked out at the thermostate housing. That was what I have expected, it was a hell to install and I thought that it maybe won't be tight. :gah:

Ok startet the engine and it fired right up. This video was taken immediately after starting it:
Don't wonder, the valve lifters are very loud but they went quiet a few moments later.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7movF2b2rk0

That's it. Can't set the timing because I am still waiting for the timing scale.
Tried to set the ISC but it is not possible.
That was before starting it the first time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlZvAm15YIU&feature=youtu.be

But it doesn't retract again....
I don't understand it, the engine runs faster and faster and it wasn't possible to set it. I pressed the plunger in but nothing happened. I think something is broken.... maybe the ISC?

Anyone have an idea?

Regards
Felix

carnut
11-14-13, 02:27 PM
You must press hard and continue pressing it till it slowly retracts. Should take 20 seconds or so to retract. You will feel it bottom, then quickly unplug its wire harness. I have the harness partially disconnected prior to retraction, in other words, the retainer clip unlatched, so it pops off quickly. I hear belt noise on the 1st video. Is the smog pump belt tight?

grauhst
11-14-13, 03:42 PM
Pressed hard and a few seconds but 20 seconds?? Haven't expect that. Will try again.

You're correct with the smog belt. :D :cheers:

Felix

carnut
11-14-13, 11:02 PM
Best to do the retraction with the engine running and up to temperature! Remember, .060 in. clearance done with a flat feeler gauge between the tip of the ISC shaft and a fully closed throttle arm. If the gap is correctly set, the car will idle very very low, like 450 to 500RPM. That's why I say to do this with the engine to normal temperature. If its not warmed up, it might stall out with the idle that low. Fix the coolant leak first! If the smog pump belt is loose, the alternator will not fully charge the battery. You must tighten the belt from under the car.

cadillac_al
11-15-13, 11:31 PM
It doesn't sound like it's idling that high in the first video; seems to run kinda rough though. The 2nd video, the ISC is opening the throttle so it seems like it is working to me. I think your getting close.

grauhst
11-18-13, 12:48 PM
I tried everything, pushed the plunger about 30 seconds very heavy but nothing happened.
Everytime when I put the key to "run" the ISC expand. Now it is fully extended again and make that "bump bump".
I think there is something broken with the ISC. It doesn't retract itself.

Look at it, it is fully extended:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBLp1kguEAo&feature=youtu.be

I think I will look for a new ISC motor. Maybe some contacts are broken or whatever.

I will uninstall the water pump to tighten the thermostate housing again. Started today:

http://up.picr.de/16509953ae.jpg

Have to take off the steering pump pulley and waiting for the special tool.

Regards
Felix

grauhst
11-20-13, 12:46 PM
pulled off the pulley
http://up.picr.de/16526701tn.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16526705qd.jpg

water tube from thermostate housing to intake
http://up.picr.de/16526719pg.jpg

thermostate housing
http://up.picr.de/16526720hr.jpg

took off the water pump
http://up.picr.de/16526725pv.jpg

installed the water pump again. took off the smog pump too because it wasn't possible to tighten it.
http://up.picr.de/16526726lb.jpg
that was the reason.. wrong direction.
http://up.picr.de/16526966fv.jpg

put in everything again. Still waiting for the timing scale. If it will arrive, I can put the water pump and crankshaft pulleys in and look if everything is tight now.
http://up.picr.de/16526799ty.jpg

Best regards
Felix

Cadillacboy
11-20-13, 01:59 PM
I admire your consistency , you never step back and nothing daunts you bringing back such a beauty back to it's pristine condition :)

talismandave
11-20-13, 07:04 PM
I admire your consistency , you never step back and nothing daunts you bringing back such a beauty back to it's pristine condition :)

I couldn't have said it better!:highfive:

You are an inspiration to all of us under-equipped, under-funded, guys working without proper garage space!:thumbsup:

.....as well as being well on the way to being an HT4100 master tech and forum guru!:worship:

Robin Banx
11-20-13, 11:20 PM
^^ all of the above and at the tender age of 24 years. Nice going Felix!!

Cheers..............R.

grauhst
11-21-13, 11:19 AM
Big words to me, I have to say a big thank you!

57eldoking
11-22-13, 05:49 PM
Nice to see another young European guy (I'm 27 from Norway) bitten by the 80s Fleetwood Brougham bug! I have an 82 that I bought in California and drove 7000 miles with in the states before shipping it home. It is now my daily driver. No problems with the 4100 so far, but I should probably check up those oil returns! Awesome work Felix, keep it up! its inspiring to follow your thread!

grauhst
11-28-13, 03:39 PM
Great to hear.
My plan is to use it as a daily driver too.


Today the last parts arrived and I put everything together.
There is no leak anymore, everything is dry, even when the engine is hot and there is full pressure on the cooling system.

I am just in the progress of registering the car in Germany.

I am so excited about that... can't wait anymore...

http://up.picr.de/16598651lw.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16598652ej.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16598655xx.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16598664go.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16598668yl.jpg

Best Regards
Felix

shrike77
11-29-13, 12:13 AM
Very nice job. Enjoy it!

Robin Banx
11-29-13, 12:54 AM
Felix.......your engine room is beginning to look pretty good. I'd bet that come spring time next year it will look like new.

Cheers ........R

Cadillacboy
11-29-13, 01:09 PM
That's divine ;)
BTW, I was about to say (saying actually lol ) you to paint the bumper fillers so as to match your lovely car's body color scheme but honestly, you can leave it as is given that your top is black

grauhst
11-29-13, 03:43 PM
Thanks a lot guys!

A little comparison. The engine as I bought the car and as it looks today. I think with a refreshed air cleaner housing and a lot more detail work (there is still a lot to do) it will look way better.

http://up.picr.de/16606574hr.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16606575kb.jpg

@ Cadillacboy
haha. yes, black fillers are better than none or broken ones. I will do the other filler soon. Btw my roof is painted dark brown. Original it is the same color like the body (Woodland Haze).

What I forgot to say...
The "Brake" light is off and the brake works perfekt again due to the new vacuum pump and all the repaired vacuum leaks.
"Service soon" and "Service now" are off too. Everything works! Only exception is the ISC but I will do that later. It works the way it is right now, I set the ISC plunger the sme way it was before. (fully extended but screwed completely in).

Next steps after registration:
- bumper filler
- exhaust
- rear shocks (level ride)

Regards
Felix

cadillac kevin
11-29-13, 04:08 PM
Felix,

For the air cleaner, I suggest using pinstripe tape and liquid mask (available at a hobby/ model car shop.) I did this with a "350 F.I. by GM for cadillac" air cleaner lid I had.
I wet sanded it with 400 grit, washed it, hit it with alcohol to remove residue, then laid a pinstripe tape (thin) against the edge of the decal, and brushed the liquid mask on over the decal. While it will keep paint from staying on the decal if you do it thin, I recommend applying it thick to make it easy to peel off after the paint cures.
I think the hardest part would be matching the black paint GM used, as it seems to be somewhere inbetween a "matte" and a "gloss" black. That being said, I did my lid in gloss black, and you cannot really tell that it is non matching.

grauhst
12-02-13, 05:06 PM
Thanks.
Planned to renew the decal because it is damaged a bit. So I think I will paint the whole part and put on the new decal afterwards.


Today I wanted do for german TÜV. (Association for Technical Inspection) So I got a pair of temporary plates and started to go. Half the way the engine shot down and wasn't able to start again. I stranded on the main road and that was not a good place to park....
Trouble code said #20... "Open fuel pump circuit"
I looked for the 10A fuse and it was blown...
Put a new one in and started the engine again... it ran 3 seconds, I heard a "click" in the foot room and the engine shut off again... fuse was blown again.
So we towed it back home.

Looked for the service manual:

http://up.picr.de/16638046rt.jpg

next one:

http://up.picr.de/16638047wi.jpg

ok... have to check circuit 120. This is it:

http://up.picr.de/16638049zo.jpg

oil pressure switch is on that fuse too.... so this was my first look because this cable is prone for damages due to the near to the exhaust manifolds.

Looked for the oil pressure switch cable and...

http://up.picr.de/16638051vt.jpg

Well.. repaired that, put a new fuse in and it works again!

Yeha!

This is a perfect example of the pro's and con's of this DFI system...
con: if something minor is defect, this car is dead! every carbed engine is able to run with almost every defect. it only needs very simple basics like a can of fuel and some spark
pro: it is very easy to find causes of problems because of that trouble code system. This is great!

Drove that car the entire evening. It feels so great.

Best Regards
Felix

jamespowers
12-02-13, 09:09 PM
Nice trouble shooting there. Wow! Those wires were really worn! Scary. Glad it worked out for you.

Cadillacboy
12-03-13, 01:22 PM
As much as I am sorry to hear that glitch on the road I am very elated to hear you fixed it and hopefully for good :highfive:
You are a handy person as well

grauhst
12-03-13, 06:24 PM
TÜV passed... Yeeeeha!! :woohoo::woohoo::woohoo::banana::banana::banana::b anana:

Everything is fine. Brakes are like new, drivetrain same... the undercarriage looks like it almost came right from the factory. Even no surface rust.
This definately proves the original 31.000 miles.
The inspector was thrilled because of the overall shape of the car. From the outside it looks way more worse than it actually is.
OK... it ran very rich so I have to look for the o2 sensors.

A little video of me trying to climb the bridge to Germany's biggest Island "Rügen". Quite interesting with the brutal power of the HT4100 power system... :D:D:D


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ0cPW81Fys

Very happy regards
Felix

Robin Banx
12-03-13, 08:05 PM
^^ Well done Felix!! Thanks for the ride.

Cheers............R.

Seville fan
12-03-13, 08:29 PM
Your Fleetwood Brougham must be quite a sight on the roads of Germany Felix! I am very interested in your opinion of the handling difference between your Cadillac and Lincoln. I've never driven one of those Marks but do remember being disappointed with the steering feel on my Dad's Mercury Cougar, a supposedly sportier car than the Mark.

When i got my '86 Brougham I expected to like the ride and comfort (and of course the styling) but the biggest surprise was how well the car handled. Feels like the engine is down low and far back in the chassis, which I know it is. My car has the cast iron Olds small block V8 and a factory rear stabilizer bar. Your car with the lighter HT4100 should feel even better in the turns.

So how would you describe the difference in handling, and steering feel, between the Cadillac and Lincoln? How about the ride, and anything else?

Congrats on passing your inspection!

jamespowers
12-03-13, 08:35 PM
TÜV passed... Yeeeeha!! :woohoo::woohoo::woohoo::banana::banana::banana::b anana:

Everything is fine. Brakes are like new, drivetrain same... the undercarriage looks like it almost came right from the factory. Even no surface rust.
This definately proves the original 31.000 miles.
The inspector was thrilled because of the overall shape of the car. From the outside it looks way more worse than it actually is.
OK... it ran very rich so I have to look for the o2 sensors.

A little video of me trying to climb the bridge to Germany's biggest Island "Rügen". Quite interesting with the brutal power of the HT4100 power system... :D:D:D


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ0cPW81Fys

Very happy regards
Felix

I see you like the temperature set the same as I have it in my car. :p
It really wasn't that slow. I mean I didn't feel like getting out and pushing. :p

grauhst
12-04-13, 11:46 AM
Thank you so much.

@ jamespowers
well it was 32°F outside. Weather forecast says on friday it will start to snow the first time this winter.

@ seville fan
the handling difference between the Lincoln and Cadillac is huge. The Cadillac has a very direct steering, tight but soft suspension, perfect brakes...
It handles better than a modern car (I am serious). You can feel that it is a low mile car.
It feels better than the Lincoln although I have done everything new to the Lincoln.
The Caddy has a great suspension. It takes rough roads way better than the Lincoln (or even modern cars, because they are way too hard)
It is exactly how a good car should be. The only thing is the engine+transmission. That is definately the weak point on that car.

Regards
Felix

jamespowers
12-04-13, 12:36 PM
Thank you so much.

@ jamespowers
well it was 32°F outside. Weather forecast says on friday it will start to snow the first time this winter.

Yes, it is the same temperature here today. It will not snow and likely will get up to 54 though. :p
This morning the Escalade was set on 90, heat seats on, heated steering wheel on and defrosters on max. :p

Cadillacboy
12-04-13, 01:56 PM
Thanks for the video Felix , good to hear you passed TUV , I knew your Cadillac would make it ;)
I reckon, you may not win any race between lights in 4100 either , but it still sounds lovely , V8 rules he he

CadillacLuke24
12-07-13, 11:02 AM
Well done Felix! You are the man! Like Dave said, an amazing inspiration to us wrenchers with no garage, no fancy tools, and no problems :D

Keep it up! The ol' Cadillac is lookin' GOOD!

grauhst
12-07-13, 11:47 AM
Thank you so much.

Yesterday we got the first snow this winter and just when I was buying groceries.

But the car handled well in the snow with it's new tires.
Unfortunately rear window defroster and outside mirror heater aren't working. The relay is ok so it should be a problem with the wiring. I will check that later... now it's cold outside.
Cruise control isn't working too...

Well.. there is still something to do but I am sure that I will find solutions for those little problems. Most important parts are the engine running and getting a registration. I am waiting for the insurance to register it.

Best Regards from cold and very windy Germany (we had a huge storm the last days)
Felix

http://up.picr.de/16670657ay.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16670658sc.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16670660ob.jpg

http://up.picr.de/16665507zr.jpg

Robin Banx
12-07-13, 01:06 PM
Do they use salt on the roads when it snows in your part of the world?? Salt is the worst enemy of old Cadillacs ever. Up to now I would say that your car has seen very little salt if any.

Cheers........R.

grauhst
12-08-13, 10:40 AM
Unfortunately they do!
I hate that but I have no other choice. My Lincoln is standing every winter so I needed another car to drive in winter. That's why I bought the Cadillac. I don't wanted a car in perfect shape because it would be a shame to use it during the winter.

Meanwhile I think it is to good for winter driving too but I only have the Lincoln and the Cadillac. No other cars... (and I don't want to own moden cars)

I will drive as less as possible when there is salt on the roads and wash it frequently.

Regards
Felix

Robin Banx
12-08-13, 01:53 PM
In that case, I would look at cleaning the underside in the spring (after all your mechanical work is done) and then brushing some flat black paint (Tremclad is good) on the bare steel (suspension and drive line parts). Then take the car to a Ziebart shop and have the entire underside, inner panels and door bottoms shot with Ziebart rust proofing. That should give you lots of years of winter driving before the body rusts out. Another bad area for rusting is the w/s posts and the sail panels. The key of course will be to not let the salt and dirt build up anywhere. The back sides of the bumpers are particularly prone to rust and will likely need the back sides media blasted before coating.

Cheers..............R.

grauhst
12-19-13, 02:26 PM
Yes!!!

Today I registerd the Cadillac. Everything went well...
Now I am able to move it legally.

http://up.picr.de/16793543mv.jpg

:woohoo::woohoo::woohoo::burn:


Best Regards
Felix

57eldoking
12-19-13, 02:29 PM
Nice, congratulations! Is the lower plate in U.S format so it fits in its normal spot? Do you have to get any special permission for this in Germany? In Norway they won't give us US sizes, so fitting the plates can be a pain...

Robin Banx
12-19-13, 02:41 PM
^^That could almost stand for a personalised plate which could be read with some poetic license as "Not Very Popular V8 Hengine"!!

Just teasing!..............R.

grauhst
12-19-13, 03:13 PM
It IS a pain to get a plate that fits. The lower one is smaller than the original plate but the only german plate that fits. I had to get an official exception approval for this (expensive...)
It was allowed because it is for the rear and there needs to be a small plate. Nothing else fits.
The big one is for the front. Unfortunately there is no way to get a small plate there...

Stupid....


"Not Very Popular V8 Hengine" :lol::rofl:

@ Robin,
NVP is the community. I live in Nordvorpommern. This is given.
Then you can select 1 or 2 letters and 1-3 numbers. 1 letter an 1 number is very rare so I am very lucky to have V8. :D
the last H stands for "Historic vehicle" (vehicles in original condition and older than 30 years)

Regards
Felix

57eldoking
12-19-13, 04:48 PM
Interesting info, thanks for sharing the German rules. This is how my plates look, they are made identical to how plates were here in 1982. I did however get the producer to reduce the border even further, the rear plate still rubs the paint when opening it fully to fuel unfortunately :(.

169714

169722

talismandave
12-20-13, 02:23 AM
Gorgeous Cadillac! I love the Reagan bumper sticker!:lol: I love period correct items like that.

Cadillacboy
12-20-13, 01:33 PM
What a cool plate this is :D
I like German precision , they even put a word in the plate to stand out for a vehicle that is older than 30 years old lol

grauhst
06-29-14, 06:35 PM
Ok, hello forum. I am still there.

After my HT4100 fiasco (http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/rwd-19xx-1984-deville-fleetwood-1985/453073-my-ht4100-hit-me.html) (btw, could an admin put all the posts into this thread to have an chronological story of my car?) I am in the progress of buying another '83 Cadillac. It is a Coupe Deville. Totally rusted but good motor and brand new trans. I can sell the transmission and have the whole car for free.
I will take out the engine and make a complete overhaul. My original HT4100 I will put in storage and maybe overhaul it later. I think as an HT4100 owner it is not the worst idea to have an engine as a spare. :D

Today I took my Fleetwood after months out of it's storage. I will prepare it for the swap and hopefully the parts car wil arrive soon.

http://up.picr.de/18774784bj.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18774786yz.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18774790rh.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18774897qo.jpg

Best Regards from Germany
Felix

larryinalabama
06-29-14, 10:37 PM
Keep it quiet..................but that's a sweet Lincoln.............I didn't say that.

Hope the Caddy is on the road soon!

talismandave
06-30-14, 12:19 AM
I love Cadillacs....but will admit to "coveting thy neighbor's Mark IV!":cloud9:

grauhst
06-30-14, 09:10 AM
Thanks guys.
Yeah, the Lincoln is great. It was a lot of work but now it is totally restored. I want to have the Cadillac in that shape too in the future.
I won a price at a local us-car-meet yesterday. 3rd place of 70 cars.

http://up.picr.de/18778359he.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18778362dn.jpg

Regards
Felix

Cadillacboy
06-30-14, 04:06 PM
Thanks for adorning the topic with your gorgeous cars' pictures :) Hopefully, you will the gets sooner than expected

grauhst
07-01-14, 04:25 PM
Took the headliner out today because the parts car is not avaliable yet.
http://up.picr.de/18792491ps.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792494uf.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792500si.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792504mr.jpg

a lot of foam....
http://up.picr.de/18792519hw.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792521mw.jpg

after the headliner removal
http://up.picr.de/18792533eh.jpg

roof looks great.
http://up.picr.de/18792534fp.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792536fw.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792537hf.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792538jn.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18792539xi.jpg

cleaned
http://up.picr.de/18792540eu.jpg

Now I am going to fix the broken edges and cracks and put new foam on it. I want to use the original headliner material again but I have to look if it is possible to reuse it.

Regards
Felix

talismandave
07-02-14, 04:21 AM
Where did it come out? Front door?
How hard is it to get out?

grauhst
07-02-14, 04:52 AM
Yes, passenger front door. Like discribed here (http://www.wlsheadliners.com/tutorials/cadillac-fleetwood/).

It was horrible, this is a very tight fit. The reinstallation will be hard too.

talismandave
07-02-14, 05:12 AM
Yes, passenger front door. Like discribed here (http://www.wlsheadliners.com/tutorials/cadillac-fleetwood/).

It was horrible, this is a very tight fit. The reinstallation will be hard too.

Wow, thanks for the link, I will need that when I do my sunroof install.

bigm57ict
07-02-14, 10:29 AM
If you can get the right color, I think it would be better to just buy new material than to try and reuse your fabric with new foam.
The headliner material comes with the foam already bonded to it.

talismandave
07-02-14, 11:39 AM
Here in the US you can buy that material by the yard in fabric stores. (As for sewing your own clothes.)
The last time I was at Jo Anns Fabrics they had 4 or five colors with foam attached.
Perhaps check your local stores of this type.

grauhst
07-02-14, 07:11 PM
Yes I checked local stores but it makes no sense. They haven't anything like this and material without foam is at least 60€/m ($90/Yard). I don't want to order the original material from the US because it would need weeks until it is here. I will order some material from ebay tomorrow 4€/m which looks good. It's worth trying.

Took out the c-pillar parts today and cleaned them.

http://up.picr.de/18802228xd.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18802231kq.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18802232bl.jpg

Regards
Felix

larryinalabama
07-02-14, 08:27 PM
I did the headliner on my 1990 when I first got the car, over 10 years ago. I couldn't get the "board" out of the car, and wound up putting the board back in place to do the job. It was a mess, and the new headliner isn't "thick" like the original. It has held up, most people don't believe that I did it my self.

Those old Lincolns were real nice cars. But the climate control and vacumn controlled head lamp covers were a nightmare.

mitch2264
07-03-14, 11:24 AM
That is a tough job! I did one on a 1988 extended cab Silverado pick up I used to own. I purchased the headliner fabric at Hancock's (a chain fabric store--not sure if national) and it had the foam backing already in place. The irony is there are several companies around metro Atlanta that come to you and do this for 100.00 bucks--I noticed that AFTER I took this project on! Next time one my GMs need a headliner I will be calling one of those guys :)

You have done outstanding work on that beautiful Cadillac!! The Lincoln is beautiful as well! I had a 1976 Thunderbird that I loved--it was like a Mark IV at the time. I find it amusing that Ford used the Frigidaire A6 AC compressors on that run of T-Birds and Lincolns. Those were good units.

Good luck!!
Mitch

grauhst
07-05-14, 08:49 AM
The new material arrived and I think it looks good. The original material seems to be brighter but it is only the wear of the years.

http://up.picr.de/18823013by.jpg

Put the c-pillar parts where it still has it's original color and I think it looks very good.

http://up.picr.de/18823014hu.jpg

Waiting for the foam and glue and then I will put everything together.

Felix

fixitman
07-05-14, 01:53 PM
nice job! i had to do that to my old wagon. i think the hardest part is putting it back in!

grauhst
07-09-14, 07:25 PM
Yesterday I removed the rear bumper and all bumper filler of that car. All good ones I will repaint (a can of "light briar brown" paint already arrived) and all bad ones I will replace and paint too. The bumper itself I will try to polish as good as possible.
http://up.picr.de/18871436nc.jpg

cleaned the headliner
http://up.picr.de/18871440zd.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18871466dc.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18871467ae.jpg

clean
http://up.picr.de/18871469zl.jpg

the new headliner material
http://up.picr.de/18871483wg.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18871487qw.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18871491ag.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18871494pc.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18871496yq.jpg

done...
http://up.picr.de/18871498rz.jpg

perfect result. I am happy!
http://up.picr.de/18871499lb.jpg

Regards
Felix

carnut
07-09-14, 08:45 PM
Make sure on the rear bumper, that you reinstall the shims between the bumper shocks and bumper facebar in the same order. Ideally the up right taillights should cover half of the filler vertical indentation. Too close and it will chip the filler paint as driven or if using the factory jack.

Cadillacboy
07-10-14, 04:50 PM
Speaking of upholstery job ,not to mention have I enjoyed every progress you have gone into so far and I think ,I know for some weird reason in originally these American cars don't come with that mat , you should also be covering the trunk lid with the materials you are using , bare metal is just too plain for these cars .Funny thing, our car is just bare metal too lol
BTW, Congrats on your thrashing crushing win over Brazil ;)

grauhst
07-10-14, 07:38 PM
Here we go.

the original velcro ripped out the roof. I will attach it with shims that it can't rip out again.
http://up.picr.de/18880183ui.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18880184ih.jpg

velcro sewed to the headliner. not original but hopefully better than original.
http://up.picr.de/18880187zx.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18880188kr.jpg

repaired edges and cracks

http://up.picr.de/18880185ui.jpg

foam glued onto the headliner

http://up.picr.de/18880189ed.jpg

and the material..
http://up.picr.de/18880200qq.jpg

cut in shape
http://up.picr.de/18880201pc.jpg

done
http://up.picr.de/18880202rv.jpg

Hard job but I am proud to finished it.
So now it is ready to go into the car again.

Regards
Felix

csbuckn
07-10-14, 09:23 PM
Holy moly, nice job. What did you do to the corners?

grauhst
07-11-14, 07:47 AM
Holy moly, nice job. What did you do to the corners?Thanks,
I repaired the damaged parts with duct tape from the upper side to be positioned. Then I put the foam and new headliner to the lower side, it is very stable again.

grauhst
07-11-14, 01:52 PM
http://up.picr.de/18885273rv.jpg

Here I will show how to get the headliner into the car.
http://up.picr.de/18885290sq.jpg

push it to the driver side b-pillar
http://up.picr.de/18885300vq.jpg

then turning
http://up.picr.de/18885301ob.jpg

now the edge has to pass the b-pillar. This is very hard because of there is a lot of tension on the headliner.
http://up.picr.de/18885304fs.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18885307iu.jpg

turn until it's completely inside.
http://up.picr.de/18885314fb.jpg

done. Installation was horrible due to the clipsed trim and the stupid way they are installed.
http://up.picr.de/18885320oc.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18885325em.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18885450rz.jpg

made some pics but because it is too bright outside it is not possible to take good pictures
http://up.picr.de/18885326tn.jpg

Regards from Germany
Felix

fixitman
07-11-14, 04:07 PM
looks great!

outsider
07-11-14, 05:15 PM
You made that look easy...Great work.

TurtleRanger
07-12-14, 12:23 AM
I've read this whole thread and I must say I'm astounded. You're an inspiration to DIY mechanics everywhere, Felix! :2thumbs:

I know this was a while ago, but I was wondering if you could say a little bit more about your repairs to the blower module in the HVAC housing? Did you find a new one or did you find a way to rebuild it? I've been unable to find one for a reasonable price and the protective coating that the circuitry is packed in has complicated my efforts to rebuild it.

Cheers again for the beautiful photographs and information. You've made my headliner repair job a lot easier. :D

talismandave
07-12-14, 01:22 AM
Felix you are a ROCK STAR!:worship:

Not only for the great looking new headliner, but also for the great pictorial of how to.

Rock on!:rockon:

Robin Banx
07-12-14, 02:42 AM
Felix, is there anything on that car that you might be afraid to tackle? Somehow, I doubt it. You're doing great so far.

Cheers............R.

grauhst
07-12-14, 03:49 PM
Thank you so much. I always like to share the progress to other people.

@ Robin Banx, no I am not. :D
The only barriere for me is what I want to pay for tools and parts. I would like to restore the whole car right now but I can't afford that.

@ TurtleRanger, I replaced the power module, I haven't found a way to repair it.

I just bought a parts car right now. A '83 Coupe Deville with good engine and brand new transmission. So I will do the engine swap and overhaul soon. Be prepared.. :D

http://up.picr.de/18895241hu.jpg

autoalfred
07-12-14, 07:52 PM
Felix you are a ROCK STAR!:worship:

Not only for the great looking new headliner, but also for the great pictorial of how to.

Rock on!:rockon:

It's really amazing what he does.

grauhst
07-18-14, 02:10 PM
Painted some bumper filler today.

http://up.picr.de/18950460al.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18950461hc.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18950462ft.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18950471gz.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18950472fy.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18950477lw.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18950478uv.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18950483fi.jpg

Cadillacboy
07-18-14, 05:04 PM
It looks nicer than it was before now :)

Robin Banx
07-19-14, 03:45 PM
Doesn't look much like colour #62, Woodland Haze. It looks more like #69 Dark Briar Brown. Are you using rattle can paint or has someone tried to mix it for you?

Cheers.......R.

grauhst
07-19-14, 05:10 PM
It is "Light Briar Brown" which is the same as "Woodland Haze".
But I think it is ok. Somewhen I will restore the whole car and it will get a complete new paintjob.

Today I started to uninstall a lot of parts to prepare the engine swap.
http://up.picr.de/18961224tp.jpg

engine and transmission wiring.... what a mess.
http://up.picr.de/18961225mp.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18961226kf.jpg

wheel well housing is broken because the tire exploded somewhen.
http://up.picr.de/18961227ru.jpg

http://up.picr.de/18961239ty.jpg

progress today. almost everything is disconnected right now.
http://up.picr.de/18961244yz.jpg

Can anyone tell me if I can take off the outer fender skin without pulling the front mask?

Felix

aaron.hudacky
07-19-14, 05:58 PM
I wish I could answer you fender question but I don't know the answer. However, I wanted to say that you are doing a great job with this car. It is obvious that you are determined and patient. Keep up the good work! I'm looking forward to watching your progress.

csbuckn
07-19-14, 08:34 PM
You can take off the fender without pulling the front clip.

cadillac kevin
07-19-14, 10:46 PM
You will need to pull the hood though, and you have to remove the inner and outer fender as one piece

grauhst
07-20-14, 11:43 AM
It is not possible just to take off the outer fender? Want to let the hood and inner fender because the car isn't sitting on a private ground.