: No Warranty On Vehicle



EDDIE80
04-25-13, 12:33 PM
Whats happening folks? I recently purchased a used 09 cts v. I live in MD but i purchased the car from another state. So im in the process of getting the vehicle registered. Took the car to a GM dealer that i used to take my 96 impala to to get a MD state inspection. The car passed inspection with flying colors. But the service advisor told me that they ran a global scan on the vehicle and it has been flagged. Meaning that the warranty that GM and Cadillac offers has been voided. I called the dealer where a bought the car from and they sent me a carfax that they went over with me when i went to buy the vehicle. Nothing is showing that the vehicle has been in an accident, flood damage or anything of that nature. My question is what will cause the car to lose warranty? The car is bone stock from exhaust to the original intake. It had 26,000 miles when i purchased it. Had 2 previous owners. Only thing i can think of is maybe a tune. Anybody have any ideas? The car runs great. Havent had no problems. I asked the service advisor when they ran the scan on the vehicle did GM say why the car's warranty was voided he said they didnt say why. Bout to call GM customer service to see what the reason was for this. Truth be told i will be doing mods to the car that probably will void the warranty anyway. But just want to know for peace of mind.

DavidPR
04-25-13, 01:22 PM
I bet you bought a Monticello Motor Club car. Does it say in the carfax M&M auto group? Unfortunately, there are lots of those in the market and it is a big cover up. I almost bought one from KC.

These cars are raced for 20k miles then retired. Good luck.

nynd
04-25-13, 01:22 PM
^^ What he said....

Trapspeed
04-25-13, 01:24 PM
Either way that should have been disclosed.

tinman
04-25-13, 01:43 PM
^^ What he said....

1997BlackETC
04-25-13, 02:09 PM
Ya, definately should have been disclosed, those race cars are beat to crap.

flatrockguy
04-25-13, 03:01 PM
Send me a pm with the VIN and can see what exactly is in the GM system.

DCV
04-25-13, 03:22 PM
Carfax does NOT always have the information logged in......

OldRoadDawg
04-25-13, 05:22 PM
Carfax . . . . :rofl:

tinman
04-25-13, 06:09 PM
While carfax is not the best source, we shall say, if you have nothing else to go on it at least provides some guidance.

EDDIE80
04-25-13, 06:52 PM
yup M&M auto group. I would get the car thats been beat to $**+. Anyone on here in the same situation? Bought a car that has been through the same sitaution? If so have you all had any major problems? Ive had the car for a month. been driving it everyday. No problem no rattle nothing.

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Mind you all i did drive the car from colorado to Maryland in a day and a half with no problems

pat2t2f
04-25-13, 06:53 PM
I would assume that the general Maintenance on these cars like oil changes is pretty good. They have just been driven a little harder than other cars.

thebigjimsho
04-25-13, 07:27 PM
yup M&M auto group. I would get the car thats been beat to $**+. Anyone on here in the same situation? Bought a car that has been through the same sitaution? If so have you all had any major problems? Ive had the car for a month. been driving it everyday. No problem no rattle nothing.

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Mind you all i did drive the car from colorado to Maryland in a day and a half with no problems

Look on the bright side. You get a free, unobtanium diff cooler...

dr.duct_mossburg
04-25-13, 09:07 PM
Fock that. I would make the dealer either buy it back or compensate you. If they expressed a factory warranty to you in any shape or form I would drive that one home.

Jinx
04-25-13, 09:54 PM
Engine/drivetrain mods shouldn't void warranty on interior/electronics items, but thanks to the selling dealer's misrepresentation your cheese is out in the wind. Maybe it's an honest mistake, but if there's no factory warranty I doubt you can get anyone to honor an extended warranty either.

Ask yourself, if you'd known that you had the option of buying a car from a racetrack, with all the great maintenance and ham-fisted hooning that implies, and with no warranty whatsoever -- how much cheaper would it have had to be for you to consider it?

RapidRob
04-25-13, 10:49 PM
Well, it's a 2009 - could be the warranty has expired, depending on when it was first built/purchased. My warranty expired last month for example ...

Rob

DavidPR
04-25-13, 11:15 PM
Well, it's a 2009 - could be the warranty has expired, depending on when it was first built/purchased. My warranty expired last month for example ...

Rob

No, when it is flagged by GM it means you can't get any warranty from them, not even an extended warranty, such as GMPP.

RapidRob
04-25-13, 11:24 PM
^^^ - got it - missed the flagged part ...

Rob

cdog533
04-26-13, 01:12 AM
Look at it like this: It's like finding out your girlfriend used to be a porn star.

Yes, she's been rode hard, but at least you know she has the moves, can take the punishment, and still stay lookin' good.

Trapspeed
04-26-13, 01:29 AM
^^ LMFAO Interesting parallel. And on the bright side, you are doing her now. LOL

RippyPartsDept
04-26-13, 12:06 PM
to bring the discussion back just a little bit ...

I'm pretty sure that these cars were originally sold without warranties
M&M might have got a bit of a discount because of that (plus the bulk order)

but just so it's clear ... this warranty block is not the typical block where the car is totaled so GM puts a block on it... or it was found to have major modifications
these cars were sold without the warranty and the block was added at the time of sale

...

also as mentioned earlier ... if the diff cooler is on there then you've really got something special

Boosted2000si
04-26-13, 03:54 PM
What does M&M have to do with any of this?


I am clueless someone fill me in. I am assuming they purchased a handful of CTS V's to loan out for people to drive on their track? Why would GM void the warranty, because track use?

RippyPartsDept
04-26-13, 04:07 PM
post #2, #11, & #13 are the relevant posts before mine regarding M&M

M&M Auto Group is the local dealer for the Monticello Motor Club
i'm not sure if they are involved in the ownership of the club/track
but if not they are the likely dealer for the club to purchase their track cars from

they do more than just loan them out for people to drive on their track
they offer driving courses (it's a school basically)
and GM does not warranty cars that are used for racing
sure, you as an owner can track you car and still get some coverage
but these cars were purchased without the warranty
(and probably they got some sort of discount for the bulk purchase and for not getting the warranty)

1997BlackETC
04-26-13, 04:57 PM
So O/P does the car have the diff cooler? Are you going to keep the car or take action to turn it back in since they did not disclose the history of this car and knowing sold you a former race car?

Boosted2000si
04-26-13, 06:19 PM
post #2, #11, & #13 are the relevant posts before mine regarding M&M

M&M Auto Group is the local dealer for the Monticello Motor Club
i'm not sure if they are involved in the ownership of the club/track
but if not they are the likely dealer for the club to purchase their track cars from

they do more than just loan them out for people to drive on their track
they offer driving courses (it's a school basically)
and GM does not warranty cars that are used for racing
sure, you as an owner can track you car and still get some coverage
but these cars were purchased without the warranty
(and probably they got some sort of discount for the bulk purchase and for not getting the warranty)



Thanks for the response but posts 2, 11, and 13 do not fill me in on the details of the Monticello Motor Club. I was very curious as what they buy the cars for and why it would void a warranty. Not the fact that because they owned the car it was beat to shit, a cover up or that it had a rear diff cooler.

Again thanks for more specific details though.


I bet you bought a Monticello Motor Club car. Does it say in the carfax M&M auto group? Unfortunately, there are lots of those in the market and it is a big cover up. I almost bought one from KC.

These cars are raced for 20k miles then retired. Good luck.


yup M&M auto group. I would get the car thats been beat to $**+. Anyone on here in the same situation? Bought a car that has been through the same sitaution? If so have you all had any major problems? Ive had the car for a month. been driving it everyday. No problem no rattle nothing.

----------

Mind you all i did drive the car from colorado to Maryland in a day and a half with no problems


Look on the bright side. You get a free, unobtanium diff cooler...

RippyPartsDept
04-26-13, 06:36 PM
Again thanks for more specific details though.

http://bit.ly/17nociv

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as for the diff cooler reference... GM made some accessory diff coolers for track cars and apparently the M&M cars got them and maybe some export cars to the middle east got them but beyond that the GM part became impossible to get (hence the 'unobtanium' remark)

Junior1
04-26-13, 11:43 PM
OK, now for the real answers.
As I have stated numerous times in many threads. Most of the higher mileage MMC cars were employee take home cars. It was the lower mileaged cars that were ones with track only duty.
They were all serviced regularly and had complete brake system replacements before they went back into circulation but all had warranty blocks.
There was 2 programs up there, the "experience" which was similar to a V Lab day so there isn't much abuse. And the "school" was really nothing more than a glorified DE event for most with braking exercises and hot laps.

I know a bunch of people from there including the instructors and track workers. Don't think there is much to worry about.
1 unit had blown an engine but pretty sure it went back to GM. There was another 2, 1 coupe and 1 sedan that the instructors hit on track playing around (I was in the coupe right siding). The coupe had right rear quarter damage and the sedan had left front damage.

As for the disclosure and warranty block thats up to you and the seller...

Boosted2000si
04-27-13, 03:06 PM
Junior1 - Thanks for the real answers/help I was looking for. I dont know what the other guys issue is but he is very uninformed and not helpful at all.
I appreciate you taking the time and filling me in on the MMC info.

DavidPR
04-27-13, 11:50 PM
[QUOTE=Junior1;3297232]OK, now for the real answers.
As I have stated numerous times in many threads. Most of the higher mileage MMC cars were employee take home cars. It was the lower mileaged cars that were ones with track only duty.
QUOTE]

Sorry, but that would be incorrect. I personally spoke to Monticello Motor club. Employees can't even drive the cars out of the club. Their registration forbids street use as long as the club owns them.

EDDIE80
04-27-13, 11:54 PM
After thinking it through I will be keeping the car. I had plans to mod the car anyway so warranty most likely would be void. It held up the whole
ride cross country. Just need to weigh my options on a good mechanic in the DMV! Anyone in the DC area have a mechanic in mind?

Junior1
04-29-13, 11:27 AM
Sorry, but that would be incorrect. I personally spoke to Monticello Motor club. Employees can't even drive the cars out of the club. Their registration forbids street use as long as the club owns them.

Right, you got it...
I'm sure you personally "spoke" to Monticello from Iowa and they gave you their whole business model right there over the phone.
Out here in NY we have things called "dealer plates" that you can stick on any car and drive. Registered or not.

Just for good measure, here's a picture of an actual car from the track. Look at the lower left hand corner of the windshield. That is none other than a NYS DMV Registration sticker and NYS Inspection sticker.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-TQ-ZGYLel_E/TJmcmbGHqlI/AAAAAAAAAaU/OUR4VujymA8/s800/MMC%2520V.jpg

My post from a thread back in JULY 2011:

"Just a quick FYI, because I just asked. The higher mileage cars were employee take home cars. Some guys lived up to 75 miles away. It would be mostly highway as well. The Red and Black manuals were instructor cars...
20-30k range. The really low milage cars were the actual track cars. Also they all had complete brake systems replaced as per one of the guys. Also pricewise the track was able to buy them back for about 37k, if it helps for negotiations"


I've got no need to argue. Don't care 1 way or the other.
I've been to the track, raced at the track, won at the track. I know the owners, members, instructors, workers, etc. You can believe your version and I'll believe my version...

suerogers
05-03-13, 07:27 PM
Cadillacs usually have a 4 year or 50K miles warranty and after it expires you can extend it. But if you are wondering about some of the reasons why manufacturer's warranty could have been voided here is a good article to read. http://warrantyheadquarters.com/blog/steps-to-not-void-your-car-warranty/ Also, if you search on edmunds, I think they have a list of what voids the manufacturer's warranty. :thumbsup:

elevated
05-03-13, 09:46 PM
Most of the 2009's all have expired warranties by now. I mean 2009, 2010, 2011, and 2012....and since the first year cars sold so fast, it was rare to find a leftover. Unlike now, where you could probably find a new 2012 still on a lot someplace.

Trapspeed
05-03-13, 10:23 PM
Most of the 2009's all have expired warranties by now. I mean 2009, 2010, 2011, and 2012....and since the first year cars sold so fast, it was rare to find a leftover. Unlike now, where you could probably find a new 2012 still on a lot someplace.

I've only got until December left on the power train. B2B long gone. Thank you, GMPP.

k3silk
05-09-13, 10:25 PM
Damn 37k wish someone could find me a black coupe in 6spd right now raced or not I would pay 37k.....

Chrispy
05-10-13, 12:18 PM
did you check for the diff cooler? :)

k3silk
05-12-13, 01:06 PM
OK, now for the real answers.
As I have stated numerous times in many threads. Most of the higher mileage MMC cars were employee take home cars. It was the lower mileaged cars that were ones with track only duty.
They were all serviced regularly and had complete brake system replacements before they went back into circulation but all had warranty blocks.
There was 2 programs up there, the "experience" which was similar to a V Lab day so there isn't much abuse. And the "school" was really nothing more than a glorified DE event for most with braking exercises and hot laps.

I know a bunch of people from there including the instructors and track workers. Don't think there is much to worry about.
1 unit had blown an engine but pretty sure it went back to GM. There was another 2, 1 coupe and 1 sedan that the instructors hit on track playing around (I was in the coupe right siding). The coupe had right rear quarter damage and the sedan had left front damage.

As for the disclosure and warranty block thats up to you and the seller...
Do you know who I can get in contact about buyine one of these cars. I will be voiding the warranty anyway and do not care.

DavidPR
05-13-13, 02:04 AM
Right, you got it...
I'm sure you personally "spoke" to Monticello from Iowa and they gave you their whole business model right there over the phone.
Out here in NY we have things called "dealer plates" that you can stick on any car and drive. Registered or not.

Just for good measure, here's a picture of an actual car from the track. Look at the lower left hand corner of the windshield. That is none other than a NYS DMV Registration sticker and NYS Inspection sticker.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-TQ-ZGYLel_E/TJmcmbGHqlI/AAAAAAAAAaU/OUR4VujymA8/s800/MMC%2520V.jpg

My post from a thread back in JULY 2011:

"Just a quick FYI, because I just asked. The higher mileage cars were employee take home cars. Some guys lived up to 75 miles away. It would be mostly highway as well. The Red and Black manuals were instructor cars...
20-30k range. The really low milage cars were the actual track cars. Also they all had complete brake systems replaced as per one of the guys. Also pricewise the track was able to buy them back for about 37k, if it helps for negotiations"


I've got no need to argue. Don't care 1 way or the other.
I've been to the track, raced at the track, won at the track. I know the owners, members, instructors, workers, etc. You can believe your version and I'll believe my version...

I can only told you what they told me on the phone. I asked them if what you said was true and they said no. I have no way of knowing who's right or who's wrong, and frankly, at this point, I don't care, since I ended up not buying the Monticello car.

Junior1
05-14-13, 04:46 PM
Do you know who I can get in contact about buyine one of these cars. I will be voiding the warranty anyway and do not care.

I don't have the cars. They are not mine and I don't have any affiliation with the cars or the track.
I knew about the cars because I asked for a few people on the forums while I was at the track a couple of years ago.
The track doesn't sell the cars, they are sold by a leasing company or dealer once they are given back or they end up at auctions.
The track supposedly gets new cars every 2 years so the best bet is to search on the internet or auction sites.

6104696
05-15-13, 04:08 PM
Anyone in the DC area have a mechanic in mind?

If nobody has responded to this inquiry, Lindsay Cadillac in Alexandria has built a reputation as "the" V specialists in the mid-atlantic. James, the service manager (I assume that he is still there, though I have not had any service done for a while) is or was a V owner and came to several track events.

Cheers.

Junior1
06-23-13, 02:16 AM
:canttalk:

sshu
06-23-13, 10:20 AM
What model year V's were used by the auto group? Was it only in 09? How would a potential V owner know if the car has an existing warranty or not? Where would I check?

oneman42
06-23-13, 11:52 AM
What model year V's were used by the auto group? Was it only in 09? How would a potential V owner know if the car has an existing warranty or not? Where would I check?

Regarding the warranty take your VIN number to any GM dealer and they should be able to tell you if it has a warranty block or not.
George

Junior1
06-23-13, 05:50 PM
There should be another influx of these cars, from what I hear they got rid of the whole fleet and are moving to another manufacturer.
Just do some homework, I heard they weren't maintained as well as the first batch...

YoungBlood_STSV
06-24-13, 02:21 PM
Just do some homework, I heard they weren't maintained as well as the first batch...

For real? Please enlighten us about how/why MMC would chose to not maintain these vehicles? Endangering their customers and opening themselves up to lawsuits... I'm very curious about why they would maintain the first batch, but say f*#k it to the second...:cookoo:

This thread is filled with misinformation and hearsay.

Lets stick to the facts for the benefit of everyone....
1. It is widely known that M&M registered cars were part of their V driving experience.
2. These cars were sold as a bulk order w/o warranties as a business-to-business transaction, at a discount.
3. It is 100% legal to register these vehicle's and drive them on public roads in NY, regardless of who owns them.
4. Seems more likely than not that some of them were used by members or instructors of the club as personal cars to ferry them to/from the track in addition to being part of the driving school.

5. The majority of them are being turned over by MMC and brought into the used market now. It seems that MMC is offloading them at auctions because that's easy and fast. When an unsuspecting dealer buys the car they're probably are not aware of its past and will sell it as such. It's the responsibility of the buyer to do his homework. We as a community will only help ourselves by letting potential owners know of the probable past of these cars so that the future owners don't get a sour experience days into owning their dream car.

There is nothing wrong with buying a V that did track duty. But the buyer needs to be aware of that before he enters negotiations. The warranty issue is kind of a mute point because as it's been pointed out, 09's will be out of warranty by years end. But owning a car that did 20k hard miles vs a car that did 50k commuter miles is something a buyer should know. One of them will likely have a shorter lifespan.

Cadzilla8
06-24-13, 02:27 PM
When Junior are you sure MMC has no more CTS-V's I have a gift certificate for the Cts v experience that I was going to do this summer...

tinman
06-24-13, 02:36 PM
It is officially summer. I would get on it.

Junior1
06-24-13, 04:59 PM
For real? Please enlighten us about how/why MMC would chose to not maintain these vehicles? Endangering their customers and opening themselves up to lawsuits... I'm very curious about why they would maintain the first batch, but say f*#k it to the second...:cookoo:

This thread is filled with misinformation and hearsay.

First off, re-read what I posted.
I did not say anything about them choosing NOT to maintain the vehicles.
Nor did I say that they said fcuk it to anything.
Endangering and Lawsuits were also your words.

Talk about misinformation and hearsay

There was an actual race mechanic on staff with the first fleet (race mechanic meaning from a pro Rolex/ALMS team) Apparently that was not the case with the others which is why I said they MAY not have been maintained as well. That is all...

----------


When Junior are you sure MMC has no more CTS-V's I have a gift certificate for the Cts v experience that I was going to do this summer...

I think they may already be gone.
No listing on the website either, give em a call...

Cadzilla8
06-25-13, 10:41 AM
Yeah I was planning on scheduling this week aw being a Cadillac fan I was hoping to use a Cts-v what are they using now as track cars?

Cadzilla8
06-26-13, 02:52 PM
August 10th going to Monticello. They have jaguars now a little disappointed but still super excited to be getting on a track as I'm only 17

tinman
06-26-13, 04:03 PM
Will they let you on since you are under 18? Just asking.

Cadzilla8
06-26-13, 05:35 PM
Yes they say you must be 18 but a few guys there told me I would be allowed to drive.

Junior1
06-26-13, 06:24 PM
August 10th going to Monticello. They have jaguars now a little disappointed but still super excited to be getting on a track as I'm only 17

You will like them. I've autocrossed 3-4 of them at Jag events. Paddle shift works quite well without delay.
Don't get me wrong, they aren't V's but they have a set of balls for what they are.
Even come with exhaust cut-out button in the console to make it louder...

Cadzilla8
06-26-13, 06:32 PM
I know I always loved the sound of the jaguar xk-rs. I think I'm going to opt for the xk-r over the f type I think rwd will be a lot more fun than awd. Much more involved. Junior you seem to know every thing there is to know about monticello any tips? Have you taken the only hybrid cts-v in existence there? ( half cf half aluminum )

Junior1
06-27-13, 02:10 AM
I know I always loved the sound of the jaguar xk-rs. I think I'm going to opt for the xk-r over the f type I think rwd will be a lot more fun than awd. Much more involved. Junior you seem to know every thing there is to know about monticello any tips? Have you taken the only hybrid cts-v in existence there? ( half cf half aluminum )

Haven't driven the hybrid unfortunately. I've been in plenty of cars there, (spec miata, solstice, my V, their V's, M3, F430, Riley trackday DP), I've always had a good time there. The track is nice, its got a little bit of everything and the facilities are top notch. Certain things are pricey but thats a given...

parish8
11-27-13, 07:22 PM
ultimate lurker, registered in 2007 and today is my first post. :)

bumping an old thread. i have never heard of these Monticello track cars and was getting really close top buying this car. http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=64157&endYear=2014&modelCode1=CTS&showcaseOwnerId=588330&startYear=2009&makeCode1=CAD&engineCodes=8CLDR&engineCode=8CLDR&searchRadius=0&maxPrice=36000&mmt=%5BCAD%5BCTS%5B%5D%5D%5B%5D%5D&listingId=355420949&Log=0

its an 09 with 25k miles on it for $35,900. seems like a good deal but then i found out about it being a track car.

my point of posting and i am sure this has been covered somewhere. how can it not be a law of some kind to require the dealer to disclose that it was a track car? thanks to sites like this i found out before i purchased the car.

pato
11-27-13, 07:48 PM
^^ Are you parish with the turbo silverado?

parish8
11-27-13, 08:11 PM
yes. thinking about doing an all out V.

V-Horse
11-27-13, 10:20 PM
A friend of mine bought an 09 V sedan with 19k miles on it which was used on the Monticello track a year ago. He has had zero problems with the car and it looks and drives better than some other 09 street V's I've been in (Granted it was only on the track for about 5k miles). He also got a nice deal on it so don't be too quick to judge, these cars were well maintained and most had a differential cooler. Maybe it's easier for these stout cars to live on the smooth track than on our pothole filled streets...

parish8
11-27-13, 10:29 PM
A friend of mine bought an 09 V sedan with 19k miles on it which was used on the Monticello track a year ago. He has had zero problems with the car and it looks and drives better than some other 09 street V's I've been in (Granted it was only on the track for about 5k miles). He also got a nice deal on it so don't be too quick to judge, these cars were well maintained and most had a differential cooler. Maybe it's easier for these stout cars to live on the track than on our crappy streets...

that is good to know. i would still consider the car at the right price but if they are going to be shady and not tell anyone it is a track car someone will scoop it up soon at near their asking price. there are a number of non track cars with around 50k miles at the same price. i would feel more comfortable with a 50k street car than a 25k track car.

V-Horse
11-27-13, 10:34 PM
Best of luck to you, it's an awesome car! Get one in manual ;-)

parish8
11-27-13, 11:34 PM
Get one in manual ;-)

no, i want to go fast.

V-Horse
11-27-13, 11:44 PM
Than get the manual it goes 20mph faster...

thebigjimsho
11-28-13, 02:14 AM
no, i want to go fast.

Then get a GTR. They don't have stick shifts, either. Robots galore.

parish8
11-28-13, 10:05 AM
Than get the manual it goes 20mph faster...

not when i get done with it.

thebigjimsho
11-28-13, 01:32 PM
not when i get done with it.

Too bad others had got done with theirs...

RocketSled666
11-28-13, 04:16 PM
I agree that the dealer should have known/disclosed the warranty status of the car. But this still isn't necessarily a bad deal. I used to make Hard Drives for a living, and we ran a 1000 hour long torture test to prove the reliability of each new design. The drives that survived this testing, even though they'd already been "driven hard", were the highest quality drives we could make. This car was pushed hard but under controlled conditions, and professionally maintained. If things were going to break, they'd have broken and been fixed already. IMO, you should push the dealer to give you some money back, but keep the car, you shouldn't need a warranty...