: Wagon? Sedan? wonder to know why.



Eswat
04-14-13, 06:06 AM
I wonder to know which one would better to fit my requirements, advises are welcome.
Since 2010 I go GA Atlanta to meet friends, drove his moded V sedan(AT) and drove dealer's V sedan(MT) there for couple weeks.
But because there's no wagon possible to drive at that period then I leave US, so I never drove a V wagon so I had no idea to judge which one would be better.
V sedan is a bad ass even just stock layout, looks slightly big to my present car but handling and output are stunning beyond.
My friend told me that drive experiences of wagon are almost totally as same as sedan, no obvious different between them, even fuel consumption.

Now there are my question:
Handling is one important factor to me, so it just tiny different between sedan and wagon? They had over 150lbs weight difference.
Their fuel consumption are really close too?
Inner spaces for passengers and drivers are the same? So the different just about luggage and roof rack?
And if don't watch rear camera does wagon's rear view easy to judge while in a tight park space?
I am married with 2 small kids(under 2 yrs old), need to put 2 mid-size strollers and related stuff when we go out, and there are 2 safety seats for kids have to install.
Luggage space for my present car is completely full now, just able to take 1 passenger and sit with stuff.
I forgot to evaluate space related things when I was in US:banghead:

Wonder to know ur reason to pick sedan or wagon.

neuronbob
04-14-13, 07:53 AM
I have owned both, first a sedan and now a wagon.

The interior passenger space is exactly the same. Two child seats are a snap in this car.

The fuel economy is the same. I have a 6MT wagon and the mileage is better than the 6ATsedan I had, though.

The wagon hatch obviously allows you to carry more luggage, and I have. I bought my sedan in 2009, when my son was 2. I used a small portable stroller and it fit easily into the trunk of my sedan. You should be able to get two small strollers in with some luggage if you convince your wife to travel light. Of course, in the wagon, you can stack more vertically.

You need the rear camera for either the sedan or wagon. My 2009 sedan didn't have one and I was constantly having to judge distance because the car's butt is so big. Luckily, the ultrasonic parking aid helped. On the other hand, the wagon's rearward visibility is limited because of the slitlike rear window. It comes with, and absolutely needs, both rear view camera and ultrasonic parking aid.

Driving experience between the sedan and wagon is similar other than that in my opinion, the wagon is more balanced and neutral in the turns. I think this is because of the wagon hatch rate, the f-r weight ratio is more favorable at 52%-48%.

Sounds like with your needs, you are a wagon guy. Do it today!

pat2t2f
04-14-13, 09:01 AM
I agree with Bob. Two small children and two strollers?? Definitely get the wagon.

DavidPR
04-14-13, 09:30 AM
I have a 6MT wagon

You, sir, are very fortunate. Your car is and will be a rare classic.

1997BlackETC
04-14-13, 04:58 PM
Yep, I've had both too, a 2012 sedan last summer and a 2013 Wagon now. I actually can say I think the wagon handles better when pushing it. Same gas mileage, etc. Just the wagonis a lot more practical.

Eswat
04-15-13, 06:02 AM
It seems V wagon would fit my requirements.
Next lesson to me would be weightsaving...my goal is 3854lbs or 1750kg.
And I will try to accustomed her shape.

pat2t2f
04-15-13, 06:45 AM
I might be biased but I love the shape of the wagon.

Trapspeed
04-15-13, 06:55 AM
Love my sedan but this sounds like a case of wagon for you, sir.

Random84
04-15-13, 07:03 AM
I agree with Bob. Two small children and two strollers?? Definitely get the wagon.

+1

you'll need the cargo room (and the wagon is cooler). The only limitation of the sedan is the fact that you have a trunk (instead of a hatch).

baatar
04-15-13, 10:00 AM
Eswat: I'm in Taipei and have a 6MT V wagon, I think it's the only V on the island. PM me if you want to take a look in person. I have three kids and a big dog and the wagon is great for fitting everything in.

neuronbob
04-15-13, 10:35 AM
It seems V wagon would fit my requirements.
Next lesson to me would be weightsaving...my goal is 3854lbs or 1750kg.
And I will try to accustomed her shape.

Are you trying to build a racecar or transport your family? You won't be able to do both easily if you are planning on dropping 500-600 pounds of weight from the car. The wagon is 4396 pounds (manual) or 4425 pounds (automatic).

Eswat
04-15-13, 01:27 PM
Are you trying to build a racecar or transport your family? You won't be able to do both easily if you are planning on dropping 500-600 pounds of weight from the car. The wagon is 4396 pounds (manual) or 4425 pounds (automatic).

My principle is keep original functions and equipments as much as possible.
Shave overall weight would help increase mpg, accel/decel performance, cornering&handling,..etc, not only for racing but benefits daily usage too, that's what I think.
Of course, too much spend(money or work) for it are not necessary too.
A pair of lightweight reclining leather seat+battery+rotors+1mm custom full titanium exhaust could shave 335lbs.
Rest 200lb may need to calculate wheels, CF driveshaft, flywheel and clutch, these may shave 110lbs for reasonable rotating mass.
For daily usage, wheels, drivetrain weight shave would effect mpg,
it cause sharp accel/decel response, but shave too much rotation mass would inhibition vehicle's moving trend, usually cause lower mpg, need more consider.
And there are some other mods need to confirm or calculate weight saving still.
All items at the list now shave 508lb approx, only remove powerseats and remain all rest equipments and functions.

neuronbob
04-15-13, 03:00 PM
If you do this, do post a project thread. Should be interesting for those who are interested in weight reduction. We've got a few people on the forum who want to do this. Good luck!

Eswat
04-16-13, 09:11 AM
If you do this, do post a project thread. Should be interesting for those who are interested in weight reduction. We've got a few people on the forum who want to do this. Good luck!

If there's some easy way to do,why don't?
I've check this forum, just like what you said, very few owner do this.
A luxury car like V is easy to reduce weight, because such cars are not full racing-oriented, so there's more directions or items able to do.
Of course too much reduce would not easy and not necessary, original attributes and features of this car should keep, that's what I think.
So I won't mod fuel, chargers(may replace with light-weight one like ASA or Rotex while original charger failed), pulley, cams or related things.
Another lesson to me is "increase engine efficiency", I am curious if without fuel, charger, pulley, cam mods, how much hp&torque would increase?
As I was a application engineer formerly,
I knew a piston with low mass and ceramic heat reflection layer, full-moly coated skirt, reduced bore dimension match could save 10% fuel consuming and add 5% overall output.
Shave linear-operation parts weight and wearing also helps too, but it really costly.

Chrispy
04-16-13, 11:42 AM
6speed wagon hands down. I'm biased though...

Random84
04-16-13, 01:56 PM
If there's some easy way to do,why don't?
I've check this forum, just like what you said, very few owner do this.
A luxury car like V is easy to reduce weight, because such cars are not full racing-oriented, so there's more directions or items able to do.

....but it really costly.

You answered your own question. :)

People don't focus on weight savings, because you don't buy a cadillac unless you WANT a comfortable ride, ergonomics and a quiet interior.

Sure, you could strip out the air conditioning, the sound insulation, most of the interior, the radio/NAV and assorted odds and ends and save hundreds of pounds in weight. But you're left with an overweight, expensive track car under a Cadillac body - and that's just not much fun to daily drive.

To focus on the non-luxury items, such as carbon fiber driveshafts, carbon brakes, lightweight wheels, lightweight flywheel/clutch or converter, etc - those things are great but they're also exponentially more expensive (with less performance return) than spending a grand on a pulley swap and tune.

Simply put, for MOST people, it's just more cost effective to increase power output than it is to reduce weight; given that many of these cars still have to keep wives and children comfortable several days out of the week. :D

1997BlackETC
04-16-13, 02:15 PM
Ya, it would make no sense to buy a V and strip it apart.