: Revshift Motor Mounts with Headers



Bacon V
04-01-13, 04:10 PM
I've been reading lots of threads on different MMs for the first gen V and I am leaning towards doing the Revshifts. I have the car torn apart and waiting for a header install right now and decided I should do them now while ive got the exhaust/cats out of the way. Anyone have any issues with header heat on the Revshifts? I read reviews after a few hundred miles - just wondered how they were working after 10k miles or so? Any need for the silicone heat jackets?

Can they be installed with headers in place? Kind of forgot to order them and wanted to put the car back together today so I can hear the exhaust...will i kick myself later for not doing this all at the same time?

FuzzyLogic
04-01-13, 04:31 PM
Go with the Revshifts. You need heat jackets if you're running headers. You cannot install them with the headers in place. You will kick yourself.

Bacon V
04-01-13, 04:36 PM
thanks. get that motor mount bolt of yours off yet? Hoping I dont run into a similar experience...

FuzzyLogic
04-01-13, 04:39 PM
thanks. get that motor mount bolt of yours off yet? Hoping I dont run into a similar experience...

My only advice is to support the engine with a jack at the front lip of the oil pan, where it's strongest. Also, use 6-point (hex) sockets to minimize the chances that you'll strip something. In my case, I think I just have a really, really stuck bolt and it wouldn't have mattered whether I used 6 or 12 point.

lollygagger8
04-02-13, 11:47 AM
Doesn't anybody look at these? :(

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/2004-2007-cadillac-cts-v-performance/263441-rev-shift-motor-mounts-install-writeup.html

Bacon V
04-02-13, 02:30 PM
I swear I tried searching for threads like this on both this site and LS1Tech. I found a couple, but not that specific one. Thanks for pointing it out.

What does the "juice" in the stock mounts look like? I havent taken mine out yet, but they dont *look* bad from what I can tell. They have 87k miles on them and while removing the stock manifolds/cats, i noticed what looked like rusty water "spray" under the mount and on the subframe. Cant find any rusted metal, so I was wondering if it was the prized mojo fluid in the stock mounts?

My car rocks at idle and has all the other tell tale signs of bad mounts which is why im replacing them - was just curious.

HAMSTAR
04-02-13, 02:34 PM
Go with UMI mounts and never worry about replacing them again, never worry about heat shields again.

Bacon V
04-02-13, 02:45 PM
Thanks, but i already ordered the Revshifts. My somewhat lofty goal is to someday build a stroker to put in this car at which time ill upgrade the mounts. This motor has some miles on it, but its got plenty of life left so ill run it for a while.

HAMSTAR
04-02-13, 02:48 PM
Thanks, but i already ordered the Revshifts. My somewhat lofty goal is to someday build a stroker to put in this car at which time ill upgrade the mounts. This motor has some miles on it, but its got plenty of life left so ill run it for a while.

Yeah, I'm sorta thinking of stroking my LS2 at some point too if I wind up keeping this car for a couple more years.

sssnake
04-02-13, 02:49 PM
I swear I tried searching for threads like this on both this site and LS1Tech. I found a couple, but not that specific one. Thanks for pointing it out.

What does the "juice" in the stock mounts look like? I havent taken mine out yet, but they dont *look* bad from what I can tell. They have 87k miles on them and while removing the stock manifolds/cats, i noticed what looked like rusty water "spray" under the mount and on the subframe. Cant find any rusted metal, so I was wondering if it was the prized mojo fluid in the stock mounts?

My car rocks at idle and has all the other tell tale signs of bad mounts which is why im replacing them - was just curious.

Mine looked like burned tranny fluid and stank to high heaven. You could take that two different ways and both would be probably be accurate :) Anyway with the heat shields in place it is pretty hard to see that they are damaged but they likely are.

JDB
04-02-13, 05:16 PM
Go with the Revshifts. You need heat jackets if you're running headers. You cannot install them with the headers in place. You will kick yourself.

Need?

I'm about to install Kooks 1 ⅞ and use DEI titanium wrap with lava rock technology. Still need jackets??

HAMSTAR
04-02-13, 05:36 PM
Need?

I'm about to install Kooks 1 ⅞ and use DEI titanium wrap with lava rock technology. Still need jackets??

Revshift claims the heat-related damage that could occur without jackets is cosmetic. Since you are wearing two pairs of underpants (speaking figuratively, of course), you'll probably be OK. If it were me, I wouldn't use jackets.

lollygagger8
04-02-13, 10:25 PM
If you read my writeup, I never used any sort of heat shield / wrap, and I've been good so far. (knock on wood)

Bacon V
04-02-13, 11:09 PM
When i talked to revshift they said to get the heat Shields. I'd rather spend the 40 bucks on some gas, but i really don't want to do these again anytime soon so it's cheap insurance in my mind

darkman
04-02-13, 11:18 PM
If you read my writeup, I never used any sort of heat shield / wrap, and I've been good so far. (knock on wood)

Always bareback. Figures.

lollygagger8
04-03-13, 11:43 AM
Always bareback. Figures.

Pull out!

RyRidesMotoX
04-04-13, 04:17 PM
Pull out!

Doesn't work... I have a little kid cuz of that lol

PISNUOFF
04-05-13, 07:59 AM
I also have a kid from that.

Wrap the mounts with something, header wrap works fine.

lollygagger8
04-05-13, 09:06 AM
Ok, I give......I have a kid from that too. But my daughter rocks, so I wouldn't have it any other way.




But that method did work for a really long time! lol

Bacon V
04-05-13, 11:12 PM
Ok, wtf... I have all 7 upper bolts loose (fuzzy - i had two stuck like you did. Still can't believe i got them out) and all 4 bottom bolts off/out and now i can't get the sub frame to let go of the bottom mount bracket. I jack the engine and the whole car lifts up. Any ideas? I've hit it with a hammer and tried a pry bar to no avail

FuzzyLogic
04-05-13, 11:26 PM
There are only two bottom bolts on each motor mount. The big one on the bottom (the inverse Torx stud should come out with the nut) and one on the top, facing the front of the car.

Bacon V
04-05-13, 11:29 PM
I've got both of the bottoms on both sides out. Both nuts came off without the studs, but the studs came out easily. I've got the car on ramps with wheels on - how much will the motor compress the suspension? Am i just not jacking it high enough? I don't want to collapse the oil pan by lifting too much

FuzzyLogic
04-05-13, 11:33 PM
I've got both of the bottoms on both sides out. Both nuts came off without the studs, but the studs came out easily. I've got the car on ramps with wheels on - how much will the motor compress the suspension? Am i just not jacking it high enough? I don't want to collapse the oil pan by lifting too much

A standard round jack plate will not collapse the oil pan if you place it on the rear of the oil pan, right in front of the subframe. It should easily lift off, assuming that you've removed your headers. It doesn't weigh that much.

Bacon V
04-05-13, 11:41 PM
Headers are off and I'm using a floor jack with a 2x6 on it. The car raises about 1-2 inches before i stop. Guess I'll try lifting a little more in the morning. I even hit the mount with a hammer while i had tension on them. And here i thought accessing the bolts would be the hardest part...that was the easiest part

FuzzyLogic
04-05-13, 11:49 PM
Headers are off and I'm using a floor jack with a 2x6 on it. The car raises about 1-2 inches before i stop. Guess I'll try lifting a little more in the morning. I even hit the mount with a hammer while i had tension on them. And here i thought accessing the bolts would be the hardest part...that was the easiest part

Is it possible that the engine is hitting the tower brace on top? Or do you have a hard intake manifold connection?

Bacon V
04-06-13, 12:13 AM
Strut tower is out and stock intake. I was getting frustrated with the stuck bolts so i probably didn't give it enough of a chance.

If it makes you feel better, the two bottom drivers side bolts on the upper bracket were so stuck that my 450 ft-lb impact wrench couldn't take them off. I did manage to break a 1/2" universal joint though. Ended up getting them of with a black oxide impact socket, 24" breaker bar, and an extension. Sounded like a gunshot under the car when it came loose. Thought for sure i broke the bolts, but they came out by hand after that. Must have been seized between the bolt flange and the bracket.

FuzzyLogic
04-06-13, 12:29 AM
Strut tower is out and stock intake. I was getting frustrated with the stuck bolts so i probably didn't give it enough of a chance.

If it makes you feel better, the two bottom drivers side bolts on the upper bracket were so stuck that my 450 ft-lb impact wrench couldn't take them off. I did manage to break a 1/2" universal joint though. Ended up getting them of with a black oxide impact socket, 24" breaker bar, and an extension. Sounded like a gunshot under the car when it came loose. Thought for sure i broke the bolts, but they came out by hand after that. Must have been seized between the bolt flange and the bracket.

Depending on how much time I have this weekend, I may try a nut extractor and a 1/2" drive extension on the end of a 3' breaker bar. I know for certain that I can do 250 ft-lb, and if that isn't enough, I'll weld a socket to that thing and drop a 5' pole on the end of it.

RyRidesMotoX
04-06-13, 04:50 AM
Depending on how much time I have this weekend, I may try a nut extractor and a 1/2" drive extension on the end of a 3' breaker bar. I know for certain that I can do 250 ft-lb, and if that isn't enough, I'll weld a socket to that thing and drop a 5' pole on the end of it.

If you weren't on the other side of the country I would let you borrow my 5' long pole.... bahaha. Have you guys tried applying some heat to it, perhaps that might help out. I know having an open flame near motors and such isnt the best idea but might be worth a shot.

FuzzyLogic
04-06-13, 10:26 AM
Are you saying the difference in the thermal coefficient of expansion between the aluminum block and the steel bolt would help loosen it up?

tommy compton
04-06-13, 11:44 AM
But that method did work for a really long time! lol

That you know of....

robojesus
04-06-13, 01:26 PM
you're probably hitting the bell housing off the transmission tunnel. Also, don't jack your engine up by any part of the oil pan, that is seriously one of the worst ideas i have ever heard of.

FuzzyLogic
04-06-13, 02:28 PM
Also, don't jack your engine up by any part of the oil pan, that is seriously one of the worst ideas i have ever heard of.

That's ignorance speaking.

robojesus
04-06-13, 02:41 PM
That's ignorance speaking.

you mean in your original post telling people to jack it up by soft aluminum? use a block of wood and jack it up by the damn bellhousing.

you crush that pan, there's a good chance you're buckling your pickup tube.

Bacon V
04-06-13, 02:50 PM
The pan is actually a cast aluminum piece and it is relative stout (for an oil pan). The advantage to jacking there is that its directly under the mass. If you move back to the bellhousing you are jacking behind the mass of the engine and actually adding a huge moment to the bellhousing. It a little thicker in the bellhousing, but the added stress would more than cancel that out.

For what its worth, the Cadillac service doc for replacing the mounts tells you to jack from the oil pan in step two...click here (http://www.cadillacfaq.com/faq/answers/sm/motormount/drivermmount.pdf)

robojesus
04-06-13, 02:54 PM
Wow, not sure why GM would encourage doing things half assed. For the amount of risk involved in using a hydraulic jack on an oil pan, you're more well suited to remove your intake, bolt a hoist to a valley cover hole, and hold it up that way.

FuzzyLogic
04-06-13, 03:57 PM
Wow, not sure why GM would encourage doing things half assed. For the amount of risk involved in using a hydraulic jack on an oil pan, you're more well suited to remove your intake, bolt a hoist to a valley cover hole, and hold it up that way.

Your complaint seems arbitrary. If GM and end-users have found that the pan is strong enough to handle the roughly 450 lb weight, what's the problem? That they could shave a few millimeters of material off the pan and a couple of ounces of weight? Clearance?

Bacon V
04-06-13, 10:29 PM
Just in case someone in the future has the same problem i wanted to report back. Got the brackets to separate from the frame by jacking the engine higher. Turns out the weight makes the suspension squat more than i would have thought. Also worth noting is that with the manifolds and cats off, the mount/bracket assembly can go in/out as a whole and doesn't have to be taken apart on the car. Also, loosen the two outer sub-frame to chassis bolts and it'll give you more clearance. Hopefully i can get the headers and new exhaust together tomorrow so i can test everything out. The drivers side mount looked fine, but the passenger side was split in half and had leaked out all it's fluid

lollygagger8
04-07-13, 10:20 PM
you mean in your original post telling people to jack it up by soft aluminum? use a block of wood and jack it up by the damn bellhousing.

you crush that pan, there's a good chance you're buckling your pickup tube.

Even though Fuzzy is a douche, he's right on this one.

It's not like you are taking a bottle jack and torquing it up in one little spot and poking a hole in the pan.

Just take a square piece of wood the size of the pan and distribute the weight evenly. No doiy.

I've done it more than a few times on the V and it's just fine.

FuzzyLogic
04-07-13, 11:27 PM
You don't need a piece of wood. If you're paranoid, just don't plant the jack in the center of the pan.

lollygagger8
04-08-13, 09:05 AM
Use a piece of wood.

Bacon V
04-08-13, 11:30 AM
I sharpened the top of my bottle jack down to a needle point so it wouldn't slip off the oil pan