: KW Variant 3 - Spring Rates?



FuzzyLogic
03-26-13, 08:52 PM
Just bought a set of KW Variant 3's.

Question is, how many of you guys have replaced the stock springs, and what brand/length/rate did you go with?

OneFast V
03-26-13, 11:49 PM
Just bought a set of KW Variant 3's.

Question is, how many of you guys have replaced the stock springs, and what brand/length/rate did you go with?

I thought you were getting the LG motorsports? Either way the kws are roughly 574f/514r

AAIIIC
03-27-13, 08:28 AM
I replaced the rears with H&R springs to match the front spring rate. I want to say they're 250mm long? I'm sure the info is in the KW install thread that's around here somewhere.

OK, found it. (Thank you, cadillacforums.com, for archiving threads that are more than about 6 months old. We wouldn't want people to be able to easily find information here!) Here's the thread (http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/2004-2007-cadillac-cts-v-performance/176595-got-k-dubs-installed-today.html). I confirmed that my rear springs are 100N/mm (to match the front rate) and 250mm long; I got them from www.allsprings.com (go to the Online Store, and then all the way down at the bottom you can select race springs). At the end of that thread, garrettg said he was about to install 110N/mm springs, so if he doesn't chime into this thread, you might want to shoot him a PM to see how that has worked out for him.

FuzzyLogic
03-27-13, 09:26 AM
Thanks, guys. I've actually had the original, "K-Dub" thread bookmarked for a very long time, and wanted to check in and see whether you changed your setups. I ordered Eibach SPACER60-250 (60mm to 2.5"" spring perch adapters so that I can use my library of 2.5" Eibach springs. I'll give the stock springs a try, but I have a very low tolerance for body movement due to my lowered stance and might wind up using springs in the 650-750 in-lb range again.

Have you tweaked your compression and rebound settings since you originally posted?

garrettg
03-27-13, 12:31 PM
I run 629lbs/in on the back with stock 575lbs/in front and the 60mm rears are a very tight fit on the upper and lower retainers. I can still adjust the upper perch height with weight off the wheel and without disconnecting the shock but its very tight. The actual ID on the kw rear springs is 61-62mm. I would be curious to know how loose a 2.5" would fit off the shelf and if you have to mill anything off your conversion kit or perch to get it installed. With a 2.5" spring your choices of length and spring rates is far greater than 60mm offerings.

H&R Springs - ID Race Springs (RF250110)
60mm I.D. Race Spring
Free Length : 250mm
Rate (lbs/in) : 629
Rate (N/mm) : 110
Spring Denotation : 250-110

FuzzyLogic
03-27-13, 02:43 PM
I'll let you know as soon as I am able. I'll also shed some light on the American branch of KW and how to easily purchase the set for under $2000.

Now I need to take a crash course on compression and rebound tuning.

AAIIIC
03-27-13, 05:59 PM
Some good stuff here (http://www.bimmerhaus.com/tech/shocktuningTN.html), including Koni's advice on how to tune double adjustable dampers.

JDB
03-30-13, 07:41 PM
I'll also shed some light on the American branch of KW and how to easily purchase the set for under $2000.

Why do we need a secret handshake?

FuzzyLogic
03-30-13, 07:56 PM
Why do we need a secret handshake?

We don't. I just didn't want to spend the time right then.

Belltech is the American branch of KW and they sell KW Variant 3's under the part number 21060 (everything inside the box says KW--it's literally just a differently-marked cardboard box). Retails for $1950, which implies that you might be able to wheel and deal it for around $1800-1850 if you're a good talker.

This is especially important, because the MSRP on the KW branded KW Variant 3 for the CTS-V just went up by $200 to $2599. Apparently, they aren't changing the price they charge distributors, because I bought mine for $1950 (including tax and shipping) after a brief conversation with the salesman.

FWIW, I actually effed up and forgot to cancel a $1875 eBay offer to "txautoplex" on a Belltech 21060 (which was accepted) after I purchased my KW Variant 3 from a more reputable speed shop. I may have to take an unpaid item strike, unless I can convince them to cancel it. If someone wants it, let me know.

UnsafeAtAnySpd
03-30-13, 08:31 PM
Damn, the prices on those keep going up. Didn't they used to be in the $1600 range? They're going to cost the same as the LG coilovers soon enough.

heavymetals
04-01-13, 12:43 AM
Try to snag a set of spherical RSM's.

AAIIIC
04-01-13, 01:32 AM
Belltech is the American branch of KW and they sell KW Variant 3's under the part number 21060 (everything inside the box says KW--it's literally just a differently-marked cardboard box).
How did you figure that out? I just went browsing on Belltech's website and I see the coilovers by KW, but when I put in the model years for the V1 the only Cadillac they list is the Escalade. I tried looking up a couple of other applications that I know KW offers stuff for and it came up with nothing for those models.

Anyway, that's a great find! Just wish I had figured that out a couple years ago. :)

FuzzyLogic
04-01-13, 04:05 AM
How did you figure that out? I just went browsing on Belltech's website and I see the coilovers by KW, but when I put in the model years for the V1 the only Cadillac they list is the Escalade. I tried looking up a couple of other applications that I know KW offers stuff for and it came up with nothing for those models.

Anyway, that's a great find! Just wish I had figured that out a couple years ago. :)

For starters, I've seen photos of Belltech boxes with KW manuals/hardware inside. Then I did some research and came up with the rest.

For verification, check out the Belltech catalog PDF (below). Search for 21060. You'll note that the CTS-V part falls under the Variant 3 category, which has the exact same features as the "normal" KW Variant 3:

http://industry.kw-suspension.com/Catalogs_Pricing_Guides/Belltech-Full-App-Guide-2011.pdf

mackey
05-01-13, 12:35 AM
Bump (was researching KW V3 setup/baseline)

Just ordered a set of the belltech from the seller fuzzy listed

Give them an offer on ebay. They took mine.

If anyone needs pics to verify if they are indeed rebranded KW's, I can snap a couple.

philistine
05-01-13, 02:47 PM
Bump (was researching KW V3 setup/baseline)

Just ordered a set of the belltech from the seller fuzzy listed

Give them an offer on ebay. They took mine.

If anyone needs pics to verify if they are indeed rebranded KW's, I can snap a couple.

Belltech coilovers are identical to KWs. I have a contact there at KW and they verified...identical.

Iceman_jd
05-02-13, 08:45 PM
Link:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Belltech-Coilover-Kit-for-2003-2007-Cadillac-CTS-and-CTS-V-21060-/300893476702?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item460ea6175e&vxp=mtr

mackey
05-03-13, 02:40 PM
FYI if you order from the ebayer listed above, they will have it shipped directly from fresno/sanger where KW is located which works out great for me since i'm in norcal (approx 1.5-2hr drive)

and whadayaknow, belltech box, KW inside

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v22/stingray/CTS-V/CA4397C9-9C48-41C8-8F0F-619C54E2C84F-1063-00000040B09E4847.jpg