: 2014 CTS - 420hp TT V6



JD03Cobra
03-18-13, 01:41 PM
If the base model gets 420hp then I would expect the ATS-V to have more!!! Should be interesting.

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/03/18/cadillac-confirms-420-hp-twin-turbo-v6-for-2014-cts-w-videos/

"The 2014 CTS will break cover next week at the New York Auto Show, but Cadillac has released a few details of what we can expect to find under the car's hood. As we saw in some spy shots back in January, the biggest news for the midsize Caddy will be a twin-turbocharged V6 producing a whopping 420 horsepower and 430 pound-feet of torque.

This LF3 engine will be paired to a new eight-speed automatic transmission, which will help balance performance and fuel economy. We still don't know how much the 2014 CTS has grown in terms of size and weight, but General Motors says that new sedan will return 17 miles per gallon in the city and 25 mpg highway with the new engine to go with a 0-60 mile per hour time of 4.6 seconds that means the new CTS will have the fuel economy close to the current base model sedan and acceleration not too far from the current CTS-V. General Motors also confirmed that this twin-turbo V6 will be available in the 2014 XTS this fall."

rand49er
03-18-13, 02:18 PM
Wow, thanks Jason for that bit of intelligence.

Okay, how does this sound?

This TTV6 goes in the CTS (some sport version) and it goes in the new down-size Corvette that's being talked about (a chick car) AND they put the LT1 in the ATS-V.

Sound good?

JD03Cobra
03-18-13, 02:37 PM
LT1 would be nice but a 450hp TT V6 would be interesting! Especially with the ATS being so light.

8 speed transmission too.

"General Motors Co. said Monday it will offer a twin-turbo V-6 engine and eight-speed transmission — both firsts for the automaker — in its all-new 2014 Cadillac CTS which will be available this fall.

The new engine can achieve 420 horsepower and 430 foot-pounds of torque, and has been certified as having the highest output in a V-6 engine in General Motors' history, said Richard Bartlett, assistant chief engineer for the engine."



From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130318/AUTO0103/303180404#ixzz2NumNqyMA

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130318/AUTO0103/303180404/GM-s-2014-Cadillac-CTS-get-horsepower-upgrade?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

Avery323
03-18-13, 04:36 PM
Huge news for upcoming ATS-V. We were all bitching just last week on here that the TTV6 was rumored to be making 380HP and how horrible/uncompetitive/eetc etc this was. Well well well, look at how Cadillac stuck a stick in that lil balloon. 420hp for CTS. Even if it's the EXACT same motor, 420hp in ATS-V is really competitive, tho I'm thinking GM will bring it to the ATS-V with 430 or 440 just to give it that much more specialness -- think about how they spaced out the HP numbers between ZR1, ZL1 and CTS-V for the 6.2

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Huge news for upcoming ATS-V. We were all bitching just last week on here that the TTV6 was rumored to be making 380HP and how horrible/uncompetitive/eetc etc this was. Well well well, look at how Cadillac stuck a stick in that lil balloon. 420hp for CTS. Even if it's the EXACT same motor, 420hp in ATS-V is really competitive, tho I'm thinking GM will bring it to the ATS-V with 430 or 440 just to give it that much more specialness -- think about how they spaced out the HP numbers between ZR1, ZL1 and CTS-V for the 6.2

rand49er
03-18-13, 05:50 PM
Read through all the stuff on GMINSIDENEWS, and the motor is a whole new engine! It's NOT just a 3.6 with two turbos bolted to it. Cast aluminum oil pan, forged crank, huge valves, completely different block, 10.2:1 CR, sodium-filled exhaust valve stems, etc. The distance from the turbo to the intake valves is incredibly short, too, meaning almost NO lag.

Could they also turn up the wick a bit to, say, 450 hp and put that in the ATS-V? Just want to be sure there's some distance between it and its competition.

Sure does stir the ol' blood.

mikesul
03-18-13, 06:07 PM
I would think getting more HP would be easy with a stock boost of 12 psi. Tuners delight!!

E365
03-18-13, 06:15 PM
Here's the GM press release with tons more info. Can't wait to see this combo in both the CTS & ATS.

http://m.gm.com/newsDetail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2013/Mar/nyas/0318-lf3-engine

rand49er
03-18-13, 06:29 PM
Hey, just had a thought. If this motor is also going in the ATS-V, why wasn't that included? I mean, they said the CTS and the XTS. If it was also going in another model (i.e. ATS-V), why wouldn't that have been included, too? Makes me think it might not ... OR ... GM is playing it tight to the vest on this and has another point in time in mind to make the ATS-V announcement with this motor in it. But, why?

E365
03-18-13, 07:41 PM
My guess would be they are just not ready to announce anything about an ATS-V yet. I, like others, are just assuming the ATS-V will have this engine based on reports from the auto magazine. They certainly could be wrong though!

rand49er
03-18-13, 08:06 PM
My guess would be they are just not ready to announce anything about an ATS-V yet. ...I agree this is the leading theory, but I'm unsure of their strategy. It's like, if it is going into the ATS-V, when it's announced, everyone is going to yawn. I'm just not sure GM would do that. Gotta be more to it.

JFJr
03-18-13, 08:36 PM
I like the performance as long as it doesn't sound like a constipated insect.

Jud

krummel21
03-18-13, 09:29 PM
I am impressed by this too, think they did a real good job on it. Not sure what the 0-60 time would be if it was in an ATS but it would have to be much better than that just to compete with the M3. 4.6 seconds is in the 335i range.

Siren05
03-18-13, 10:26 PM
2013 m3 0-60 advertised at 4.8

krummel21
03-18-13, 10:35 PM
I should have stated I was referencing the 2011 and 2012 M3 based on this website:

http://www.zeroto60times.com/BMW-Bimmer-0-60-mph-Times.html

They both show around 4.4 seconds, surprised the 2013 is slower. It shows there the 2011 335i is 4.7. 4.8 would also probably put you over 13 seconds in the quarter, seems pretty slow for a performance based car.

These results are based on different magazines so this may also be why the numbers are different.

isakhanyan
03-19-13, 01:48 PM
The only sad part is the 8 speed automatic, I was really hoping they would come out with a manual transmission for the ATS-V as well. I still have hope but it is not looking to good.
For the people who want a manual this sucks.

rand49er
03-19-13, 02:01 PM
The only sad part is the 8 speed automatic, I was really hoping they would come out with a manual transmission for the ATS-V as well. I still have hope but it is not looking to good.
For the people who want a manual this sucks.This is NOT the ATS-V.

This entire announcement is about a motor that will be offered in the CTS and the XTS.

The ATS-V is still vaporware, ATs and MTs alike.

jsiddall
03-19-13, 03:00 PM
Still.... GM says the new CTS will do a "0-60 mile per hour time of 4.6 seconds" and the ATS should be faster than that with the same engine. An ATS-V would almost certainly have a higher output engine than the base CTS.

bruff1977
03-19-13, 03:04 PM
'think about how they spaced out the HP numbers between ZR1, ZL1 and CTS-V for the 6.2'

I am astounded like everyone else with these numbers... But you do realize that the TTV6, even though it sounds really potent and capable, is not considered a performance engine. If anything the LF3 will be in the CTS and XTS AWD Platinum trims. Those three cars you mentioned are the top of the line for their models. This is my logic for the Alpha chassis performance cars and the vehicle from Bowling Green:

ATS-V: Tuned LT1.
CTS-V3/ZL1-2: F/I LT1 with modest boost/tune.
ZR1-2: F/I LT1 with agressive boost/tune

jsiddall
03-19-13, 03:23 PM
It would be great to see an LT1 V8 in the ATS-V (think about the tuning headroom of that) but I for one would be surprised it if happened. I, like others, expect a higher output TT V6 making similar power to the LT1.

isakhanyan
03-19-13, 04:00 PM
This is NOT the ATS-V.

This entire announcement is about a motor that will be offered in the CTS and the XTS.

The ATS-V is still vaporware, ATs and MTs alike.

I know it is for the cts. I have just been reading rumors that the ats-v will only be offered in automatic.

rand49er
03-19-13, 09:08 PM
Stop reading rumors.

Wait. Wut?

JD03Cobra
03-21-13, 11:48 AM
I, like others, expect a higher output TT V6 making similar power to the LT1.

I agree! Tons of money has been spent on this TT V6, efficient green motor in a light car. V8 IMO is a long shot.

I don't see Ford dropping the 5.0 in the Tauraus SHO even though I would love it. ECO boost motor is their future. GM needs to compete!

Kluch
03-21-13, 11:07 PM
They REALLY need to officially announce the ATS-V and its specs. Tho I bet it is going to be this exact same motor with the same HP and torque. Still, i think we are looking at about a 4 second 0-60 time in the lighter ATS

JD03Cobra
03-22-13, 10:00 AM
I bet it is going to be this exact same motor with the same HP and torque. Still, i think we are looking at about a 4 second 0-60 time in the lighter ATS

I completely agree...I see them bumping the motor 20hp at the most. The weight difference alone is a performance jump over the base CTS.

"A 2014 Cadillac ATS-V with the twin turbo engine would not gain much front end weight over the current car with its top engine, the normally breathing 3.6 liter V6. The car would jump from about 320 horsepower up to about 420. With its approximately 3700 curb weight this rear-drive car would be one of GM’s fastest vehicles - ever. Only the Camaro ZL 1, the Corvette, and maybe the CTS-V would have a better power to weight ratio. Our own Patrick Rall wrote that the CTS with this engine would likely have a 0-60 mph time of about 4.6 seconds. That it very fast. However, an ATS-V with the same engine would be a car that could reach 60 in under 4 seconds.The technical term for that is “Stupid fast.” There would only be 3 single cars in the GM line-up that could compete with it."

http://www.torquenews.com/1083/cadillac-readies-powerful-new-2014-ats-v-twin-turbo-engine

mikesul
03-22-13, 10:02 AM
I would like to see mileage comparisons between a TTV6 vs a well tuned small block V8. With an eight speed trans geared for each motor I wouldn't expect too much difference. Also the V8 should be less costly to build.

JFJr
03-22-13, 01:22 PM
I would like to see mileage comparisons between a TTV6 vs a well tuned small block V8. With an eight speed trans geared for each motor I wouldn't expect too much difference. Also the V8 should be less costly to build.

And an LSx naturally aspirated V8 would be less complex, would sound better and might take up less space in the engine bay. Americans need to stick with what works; adjust engine mix in other models to play with mind-numbing CAFE. Too much talk about an automatic transmission, what about a manual?

Jud

rand49er
03-23-13, 04:24 PM
Found some more info about it: http://www.sae.org/mags/aei/11941

JFJr
03-23-13, 06:40 PM
Has anyone considered how a TTV6 would sound and whether it would be appropriate for a halo car like a "V"? Angry insect is pretty obnoxious.

Jud

JimmyH
03-23-13, 07:31 PM
No one cares about manuals anymore. Even the car rags prefer autos.

Some say this the golden age of automotive performance. Its looking like the dark ages to me. Stupid fast and fun to drive are two very different things.

Kluch
03-24-13, 01:37 AM
Has anyone considered how a TTV6 would sound and whether it would be appropriate for a halo car like a "V"? Angry insect is pretty obnoxious.

Jud

I agree, the car should sound mean. But it's still a cadillac and as such cabin noise will be muted. The angry insect may not be a bad thing to the designers.
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No one cares about manuals anymore. Even the car rags prefer autos.

Some say this the golden age of automotive performance. Its looking like the dark ages to me. Stupid fast and fun to drive are two very different things.

I agree. Screw the rags. I think the ATS-V will almost certainly have a manual option

mikesul
03-24-13, 10:40 AM
With ATS sales so strong right now, this wouldn't be the time for GM to announce a faster ATS. Let sales start to drop off naturally, then rekindle interest with a "V" model. I like the V6TT, but wish for a V8.
That article than JD03Cobra tagged mentions the ATS weight at 3700#, where did they get that inflated number?

JFJr
03-24-13, 12:10 PM
With ATS sales so strong right now, this wouldn't be the time for GM to announce a faster ATS. Let sales start to drop off naturally, then rekindle interest with a "V" model. I like the V6TT, but wish for a V8.
That article than JD03Cobra tagged mentions the ATS weight at 3700#, where did they get that inflated number?

That makes some sense from a sales perspective, but if they don't improve the manual transmission in the base car, that time could come sooner than later. Also, a lot of us high mileage V2 drivers may not want to wait for the V3, so we may be in the market for a proper ATS-V. Let the TTV6 add excitement to the new standard CTS, but American V8's are the best response to the German TT6's in the BMW 3's.

I want to increase my "carbon footprint," whatever that hippy doper term means, so if I can pay for what is proper in a "V," I would like the opportunity. BTW, real world mpg ratings are probably really, really optimistic for a TTV6 driven like a performance option.

Jud

nguyennhatquang
03-25-13, 01:17 AM
i don't think they fit TT V6 to ATS-V..because...
1st : it will make competition between V and regular CTS
2nd : it doesn't make point..

i guess GM will fit all V Series with V8... it can be LT1..or special version of LT1...

rand49er
03-25-13, 11:04 AM
i don't think they fit TT V6 to ATS-V..because...
1st : it will make competition between V and regular CTS ...This does have some validity especially if the weight is within a couple of hundred pounds of each other.

JD03Cobra
03-25-13, 01:57 PM
This does have some validity especially if the weight is within a couple of hundred pounds of each other.

If they bump the TT V6 to 450 hp that would solve the competition argument for the average buyer.

rand49er
03-25-13, 04:35 PM
If they bump the TT V6 to 450 hp that would solve the competition argument for the average buyer.And there's precedent for this. Look at the 2.0T in the ATS (272 hp) vs in the Verano (250 hp).




EDIT: If the ATS-V does indeed limit itself to the 3.6TT and 420 hp, that means a longer, lower, and leaner CTS-V at ~600 hp becomes the more attractive choice IMHO. Don't get me wrong, the 3.6TT is a fabulous motor, but those who crave big performance will opt for a slightly larger and only slightly heavier but much more powerful CTS-V if it comes with >> 500 hp.

JFJr
03-28-13, 01:10 PM
I don't think it makes sense to put the TTV6 in 2 different model types, standard and "V." It would look like the ATS-V is not all that special and take away from the "V" heritage that has developed. A normally aspirated LT1 would be a good choice for the ATS-V, leaving a supercharged version for the CTS-V. Don't get me wrong about the TTV6, I think it will be a success and really add to the image of the new CTS. However, the "V's" should be reserved for the enthusiasts because Cadillac needs these buyers to build excitement and talk up the brand.

Jud

rand49er
03-28-13, 05:52 PM
... A normally aspirated LT1 would be a good choice for the ATS-V, leaving a supercharged version for the CTS-V... A NA LT1 in the ATS-V would leave the door open for some sort of FI as an add on.

Cowabunga giddyup!

al pettee
03-29-13, 06:14 PM
A NA LT1 in the ATS-V would leave the door open for some sort of FI as an add on.

Leave the door open? It would be a foregone conclusion. :yup:

JFJr
03-29-13, 07:17 PM
Oh, I forgot to add, the Z06/ZR1 2-stage exhaust should be an option for enthusiasts.

Jud

ETHANOREO
03-30-13, 02:55 PM
Love the new CTS and looking forward to the reviews of the engine.

VCONVERT
04-09-13, 09:43 AM
One ATS-V please and hope it's a V-8. And listen up Cadillac - 350 - 400hp won't cut it with today's competition. Why would anybody pay a $10k premium for 30 - 80 horsepower increase? This car needs to make a statement just like the original CTS-V did. A mediocre warmed over TT V-6 won't do the job.

jsiddall
04-09-13, 10:00 AM
I cannot imagine Cadillac would produce a "real" ATS-V (i.e.: not a V sport) either V6 or V8 equipped, with less than 420 HP so I doubt you will be disappointed.

As a rule of thumb, if you keep in your head the BMW equivalent of every Caddillac and then rememember that Cadillac wants to outperform the equivalent BMW you can predict where they will end up.

In this case the ATS-V is targeting M3 which, a few years in now, already has 414 HP. You can be sure the ATS-V will have no less than that, and may well have significantly more.

JFJr
04-09-13, 09:29 PM
Well if it has to blown, I hope that it sounds like a ZR1 at the track. Music to my ears.

Jud

Siren05
04-10-13, 12:00 AM
Guys. 6 cylinder turbos have been making mega power for decades supras,skylines,Mitsubishi 3000gts.

I had an IS300 turbo with GTE BLOCK 3.0T making 620rwhp. This beast would run with sport bikes on highway pulls.

concorso
04-17-13, 06:11 PM
Guys. 6 cylinder turbos have been making mega power for decades supras,skylines,Mitsubishi 3000gts.

I had an IS300 turbo with GTE BLOCK 3.0T making 620rwhp. This beast would run with sport bikes on highway pulls.Guy. Most GM motorheads are quite familiar with a turbo6's potential. Whats your point?

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That article than JD03Cobra tagged mentions the ATS weight at 3700#, where did they get that inflated number?It doesnt seem that high. Take the 3.6L Auto ATS, add 150+lbs for engine, transmission, diff, and suspension upgrades.

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I don't think it makes sense to put the TTV6 in 2 different model types, standard and "V." It would look like the ATS-V is not all that special and take away from the "V" heritage that has developed. A normally aspirated LT1 would be a good choice for the ATS-V, leaving a supercharged version for the CTS-V. Don't get me wrong about the TTV6, I think it will be a success and really add to the image of the new CTS. However, the "V's" should be reserved for the enthusiasts because Cadillac needs these buyers to build excitement and talk up the brand.

JudThe argument can be made that your POV limits the V's potential. If the TTV6 has the power delivery that high-performance buyers want, then isnt it a suitable engine choice? The choice of engine is very important, but is it really necessary it be a V8? I would very much like a RWD/6M/V8 setup, but I would settle for AWD, for a DCT, and a V6TT if it drives as good as the previous V's have. OTOH, I can understand your point that the V engines should only be used in high-performance vehicles. It seems BMW and Mercedes protect this idea very well. This makes me wonder how high performance the CTS-VSport will be. Its weight and power should be very close to a 1st gen V. BTW, Id prefer the LS7 over the LT1. If reports are accurate, the LT1 and V6TT are within a few lbs of each other, making the LS7 a fair bit lighter.

Siren05
04-17-13, 09:55 PM
Guy. Most GM motorheads are quite familiar with a turbo6's potential. Whats your point?

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It doesnt seem that high. Take the 3.6L Auto ATS, add 150+lbs for engine, transmission, diff, and suspension upgrades.

----------

The argument can be made that your POV limits the V's potential. If the TTV6 has the power delivery that high-performance buyers want, then isnt it a suitable engine choice? The choice of engine is very important, but is it really necessary it be a V8? I would very much like a RWD/6M/V8 setup, but I would settle for AWD, for a DCT, and a V6TT if it drives as good as the previous V's have. OTOH, I can understand your point that the V engines should only be used in high-performance vehicles. It seems BMW and Mercedes protect this idea very well. This makes me wonder how high performance the CTS-VSport will be. Its weight and power should be very close to a 1st gen V. BTW, Id prefer the LS7 over the LT1. If reports are accurate, the LT1 and V6TT are within a few lbs of each other, making the LS7 a fair bit lighter.

My point was 6 cylinder turbos provide as much power as any supercharged V8. My 3.0t was making around 800 crank hp

JimmyH
04-18-13, 01:27 AM
The sc v8 sounds like an engine though. The turbo v6 sounds like a sick cat.

JFJr
04-18-13, 10:01 AM
The sc v8 sounds like an engine though. The turbo v6 sounds like a sick cat.

Yeah, it's not a power issue at all. Sound is part of the experience. And I would be more than happy with an LS7. Then we wouldn't be saddled with that sorry DOD feature. Just something else to go wrong. Imagine being stuck in 4 cylinder mode, or worse, 0 cylinders.

Jud

JimmyH
04-18-13, 02:54 PM
I don't think GM is going to put a V8 sport car out there with DOD that can't be turned off. On the Camaro, you turn off DOD by putting the transmission in Sport. Which also turns off the 2nd gear start. Which is why almost no Camaro automatic owner uses D. Hopefully they continue the trend of not even using it on manual trans cars.

rand49er
04-19-13, 11:10 AM
... If reports are accurate, the LT1 and V6TT are within a few lbs of each other, making the LS7 a fair bit lighter.The LS7 is lighter?!! Interesting ... I didn't know that.

Not to belabor the point, but unless the V6TT gets a significant bump in hp from the VSport version, I don't see how it makes sense to put it in the ATS-V.

On another note, I really like the idea of an AWD/DCT/V6TT VSport. I'm not holding my breath, though.

jsiddall
04-19-13, 03:34 PM
The LS7 is lighter?!! Interesting ... I didn't know that.

I dunno. Makes perfect sense to me. Take an engine of similar external dimensions, take out a bunch of cylinder deactivation and variable valve timing parts, replace some other parts with lightweight version, then bore out a whole bunch more cylinder metal to get it up to 7.0 L. How could it not be lighter?

JimmyH
04-19-13, 03:56 PM
Don't forget the LS7 is dry sump. So in addition to the weight of the engine you have to add the weight of an oil tank and pump.

rand49er
04-19-13, 06:03 PM
I dunno. Makes perfect sense to me. Take an engine of similar external dimensions, take out a bunch of cylinder deactivation and variable valve timing parts, replace some other parts with lightweight version, then bore out a whole bunch more cylinder metal to get it up to 7.0 L. How could it not be lighter?How could boring out the cylinders larger and filling them with bigger pistons save much weight? I dunno.

JFJr
04-20-13, 12:25 PM
I don't think GM is going to put a V8 sport car out there with DOD that can't be turned off. On the Camaro, you turn off DOD by putting the transmission in Sport. Which also turns off the 2nd gear start. Which is why almost no Camaro automatic owner uses D. Hopefully they continue the trend of not even using it on manual trans cars.I hope you're right. If GM goes the LS7 route, we won't have the added weight, bulk and complexity from DOD. Also, I'm not ready to embrace direct injection until the engineers are allowed to build in a solution to intake valve carbon buildup because no fuel passes through them.

Jud

rand49er
04-20-13, 01:17 PM
... I'm not ready to embrace direct injection until the engineers are allowed to build in a solution to intake valve carbon buildup because no fuel passes through them.

JudBut, it helps increase compression ratio. :D

Jinx
04-20-13, 02:25 PM
The LS7 is at the end of its life. They're not going to put that in the ATS-V. The LT1 is a better fit -- plenty of power, less stressed, better fuel economy, probably cheaper given production volume, and it'll be built for the life of the first-gen ATS platform.

As for the fear of direct injection -- y'all know the other ATS engines use it, right?
As for the fear of cylinder cutoff -- the Corvette has a five-position mode switch, and there's no cylinder cutoff in the sportier modes. They'll do something similar for the ATS-V if it gets the Corvette engine.

.Jinx

JFJr
04-20-13, 02:43 PM
You're probably right about the LT1, but just having the DOD function built in makes me a little nervous. I still remember the 8-6-4-0 Cadillac V8 from the 80's. Ha haa! And how many mpg does DOD really gain? As for direct injection, the 3.6 V6 uses it too. The following is an interesting article: http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2012/12/should-you-buy-a-car-with-direct-injection.html

Jud

Jinx
04-20-13, 03:25 PM
The 8-6-4 was thirty-four years ago.
GM has a decade of experience with direct injection. Most of the Internet grief over direct injection comes from early VW and Audi motors.

JFJr
04-20-13, 06:48 PM
The 8-6-4 was thirty-four years ago.
GM has a decade of experience with direct injection. Most of the Internet grief over direct injection comes from early VW and Audi motors.

Ha haa! That was a tongue-in-cheek comment. But 10 years experience with DI in gasoline engines? What other engines? Hmm! I think it might be more of a cost issue. Hopefully, GM will find a fairly inexpensive, simple cure and even y'all (a/k/a Bubba) will be happy.

Jud :lildevil:

Jinx
04-20-13, 07:35 PM
Ecotec Z22YH in 2003 Opels.
US experience started in earnest in 2006 with the LNF turbo four and in 2007 with the LLT 3.6L V6 in the CTS, and since then it's spread like a virus across GM's product line.

JFJr
04-20-13, 07:59 PM
Ecotec Z22YH in 2003 Opels.
US experience started in earnest in 2006 with the LNF turbo four and in 2007 with the LLT 3.6L V6 in the CTS, and since then it's spread like a virus across GM's product line.

Well, Bubba considers 4 cylinders half an engine and 6 cylinders 3/4th of an engine anyway, so that dog wouldn't hunt down here.

Jud

Macvicar24
04-20-13, 08:14 PM
So I was on Hennessey's website and he lists future upgrades to he 2014 ATS-V with TT V6. Think he knows something we don't know.

http://www.hennesseyperformance.com/cadillacatsv.html

JFJr
04-20-13, 08:31 PM
So I was on Hennessey's website and he lists future upgrades to he 2014 ATS-V with TT V6. Think he knows something we don't know.

http://www.hennesseyperformance.com/cadillacatsv.html

Hopefully, we don't have do deal with an over-sexed bubble bee.

Jud

Jinx
04-20-13, 10:17 PM
Well, Bubba considers 4 cylinders half an engine and 6 cylinders 3/4th of an engine anyway, so that dog wouldn't hunt down here.

That has nothing to do with direct injection.

JFJr
04-20-13, 10:54 PM
That has nothing to do with direct injection.

GM will have to deal with Bubba as well as Eurosnobs to market the car.

Jud

jsiddall
04-20-13, 11:47 PM
How could boring out the cylinders larger and filling them with bigger pistons save much weight? I dunno.

The pistons are relatively small compared to the cylinders so slight weight addition to the piston is more than offset by the large reduction in cylinder wall weight. Remember the Aurora L47 4.0 Northstar? The smaller bore increased the weight enough that they had to design a lightweight manifold and simplify the fuel injection system to compensate, so the weight gain must have been significant.

http://www.carrollcustomcadillac.com/Pages/NorthstarInfospecs.aspx

Jinx
04-21-13, 12:58 AM
GM will have to deal with Bubba as well as Eurosnobs to market the car.

Are you just making random statements that have no connection to each other? If you have a point it's lost.

JFJr
04-21-13, 07:39 PM
Are you just making random statements that have no connection to each other? If you have a point it's lost.

Lost to you; I made it a few posts ago.

Jinx
04-21-13, 09:42 PM
What, that you're afraid of DoD and direct injection?

JFJr
04-21-13, 09:53 PM
What, that you're afraid of DoD and direct injection?

A conversation with you is never ending. Go ahead and get the last word, I need to disengage.

Jinx
04-21-13, 10:19 PM
Wouldn't have to be if you made sense and didn't keep deflecting. But your non-answer is enough to draw a conclusion.

boycer11
04-22-13, 12:49 AM
Would most of you be happy with 420 hp in the v?

JFJr
04-22-13, 08:57 AM
Would most of you be happy with 420 hp in the v?

No, the next M3 will probably have more than that. Clear superiority done the American way should be the goal.

Jud

Jinx
04-23-13, 04:15 AM
Clear superiority done the American way should be the goal.

Amen to that.

wilmo
04-23-13, 09:04 AM
It would probably drive fine but really, it needs considerably more power than its competitors if it s going to draw off customers.. Just like the CTSV did.. 450-500 would be appropriate.

JFJr
04-23-13, 12:20 PM
It would probably drive fine but really, it needs considerably more power than its competitors if it s going to draw off customers.. Just like the CTSV did.. 450-500 would be appropriate.Agreed, and sound the part like other V's. We don't need any piped in engine noise from the stereo.

JimmyH
04-23-13, 05:20 PM
how about piped-in sauerkraut odors?

JFJr
04-23-13, 07:06 PM
how about piped-in sauerkraut odors?

Top or bottom source? Not sure the Eurosnobs would go for it. But give me garlic and I would be happy to drive your Ferrari or Maserati.

Jud :lildevil:

JimmyH
04-23-13, 08:12 PM
lulz

mikesul
04-24-13, 10:31 AM
I have never understood automakers piping in exhaust sound. Maybe a Ferrari sounding exhaust for my ATS would change my mind. :)

Jinx
04-24-13, 12:24 PM
High-performance cars never had good enough sound insulation before. It's the convergence of desire for a real sports car in a luxury car body and soundproofing that's so good you can't hear the engine frequencies that say "sports car."

I find it interesting because I personally prefer the mechanical sounds of the engine itself over the explosive sounds of the exhaust. A little induction whine isn't always a bad thing either :)

.Jinx

rand49er
04-24-13, 10:15 PM
This reminds me of one of those sound machines where you can choose a sound ... rain, crickets chirping ... now, V exhaust. :rolleyes:

JFJr
04-24-13, 10:31 PM
I love the sound starting my car, especially in the underground garage where it resonates on nearby cars. That's what needs to continue.

Jud

JFJr
04-27-13, 11:21 AM
Do you think that the exhaust note of a higher performance version of the TTV6 can be tuned to sound like a V8, or will it sound like an insect no matter what is done? That exhaust tuning might bring in a few V8 guys to the ATS-V that otherwise would pass on it.

Jud

mikesul
04-27-13, 02:19 PM
I think Magnaflow makes some deep sounding mufflers that could bring it close. Wait to see what they come up with when the car is released.

Jinx
04-27-13, 06:16 PM
It'll never sound the same. But it can surely be given enough low frequency rumble and midrange bark and high end howl to clearly indicate machismo. Cadillac will err on the side of caution and deliver something serious but civilized, and the aftermarket will gladly add whatever degree of boisterousness you can stand.

But if you're looking for this specific kind of sound, I don't see it happening:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib48qj1shwA

rand49er
04-27-13, 09:10 PM
... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib48qj1shwANot bad for OEM exhaust.

JFJr
04-28-13, 03:19 PM
Not bad for OEM exhaust.Now that sounds like a high performance car and not a beehive. We need that mill in the ATS-V (with a little torque bump, of course, and paired with the TR6070).

But if the ATS-V is not available before 12/15/13, I'm going back to Corvettes (C7 TR6070) for a while. They are fantastic sports cars and closely related (where it counts) to the current Cadillac V's; it's all in the GM family.

Jud

M5eater
05-05-13, 01:21 PM
Do you think that the exhaust note of a higher performance version of the TTV6 can be tuned to sound like a V8, or will it sound like an insect no matter what is done? That exhaust tuning might bring in a few V8 guys to the ATS-V that otherwise would pass on it.

Jud

It will sound pretty close to this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i01pg7E6OcU

IMO, some good induction noise is nearly as good as the high-pitched exotic symphony that an LS puts out.


But if the ATS-V is not available before 12/15,
you mean 2015? I would expect the ATS-V to be avalible for order no later than the beginning of 2014, possibly even very late this year. The F80 M3 is planning a launch early next year similarly. 2015 is probably a year to look forward to a CTS-V but not an ATS-V.