: Airaid before and after Dyno results



WINspeed
03-10-13, 01:19 AM
The Airaid CIA works as good if not better than advertised. The install could be made easier, seems to be a lot of assembly that could be eliminated by building a one piece unit. But hey, It will give you something to do if you are board, and once assembled it fits nice. At places in the curve it was up over 30hp! 33 to be exact, and the conditions were much warmer today than the last time I dynoed the car. Over 500 at the wheels with only a Magnaflow exhaust and an Airaid CIA, no tune, bone stock otherwise! I'm planning on trying a ported throttle body next then a HX and a tune. I'm curious as to how far it will go without turning up the blower. Is 550 possible?
104947
104948

6speeder
03-10-13, 10:42 AM
What was your A/F stock and with the airaid? I'm betting you are running leaner to make that much from a filter. Check your LTFT's. You will get a CEL if they are way off.


Also, it's best to show SAE corrected graphs, that pretty much eliminated the weather changes, gives a better "apples to apples" comparison.

WINspeed
03-10-13, 03:08 PM
What was your A/F stock and with the airaid? I'm betting you are running leaner to make that much from a filter. Check your LTFT's. You will get a CEL if they are way off.




Also, it's best to show SAE corrected graphs, that pretty much eliminated the weather changes, gives a better "apples to apples" comparison.

My Dyno has the sniffer for the exhaust but with all the Cats on this thing it's not accurate. I've been driving it 80+ miles a day all week, and no CEL.

I don't agree with the SAE correction factor's. I've dynoed a few vehicles early morning before races, then Dynoed them on a buddies Mobile Dynojet at the track when it was 30 degrees warmer out, and SAE said they lost 40hp. but for some reason they ran within .05 and 1mph hour of their best. The uncorrected graphs are real close to a HP calculator's prediction for the track. Corrected SAE they are unpredictable, at least on my Dyno.

But I did look at it corrected, primarily because I knew somebody would say something, and the gain was 36hp. Which again, seems unrealistic. lol

6speeder
03-11-13, 11:10 AM
Even with the cats if your A/F was changed by the CAI you'd see the change. What are your LTFT's?

wait4me
03-11-13, 11:42 AM
How many miles on the vehicle?


The only time I see gains like this is, when the car has been using the stock airfilter and it was Dirty. Then you put on a Clean filter and get your horsepower gain you see. A true test is showing brand new stock filter vs the other...

silvergs
03-12-13, 01:33 AM
did you d/c the battery? i'm installing my airaid and ported tb this week and hope to have similar gains. how does it feel on the road? how would you rate the effect on the car?

WINspeed
03-12-13, 06:54 PM
Even with the cats if your A/F was changed by the CAI you'd see the change. What are your LTFT's?

The AFR's may have changed but I didn't put the sniffer in the exhaust. I tried the sniffer when I baselined it stock and it said it was real lean, like 15:1 so I didn't bother this time. I don't have a way to tune it anyway. I'm kinda new to this, What is the LTFT's?


How many miles on the vehicle?


The only time I see gains like this is, when the car has been using the stock airfilter and it was Dirty. Then you put on a Clean filter and get your horsepower gain you see. A true test is showing brand new stock filter vs the other...

The car has 61k on it. It was bought at a Cadillac dealer and figured they would have changed it, They had just done a 60k service, but I didn't look at it when I installed the CIA. I just pulled the box out. That's a good question, I'll look at it.


did you d/c the battery? i'm installing my airaid and ported tb this week and hope to have similar gains. how does it feel on the road? how would you rate the effect on the car?

Yes I disconnected the battery. It feels great, definitely a seat of the pants gain. It's as quiet as stock until you get on it, then the blower is a lot louder than stock. I like it, a great bang for the buck.

Luna.
03-12-13, 08:07 PM
I don't agree with the SAE correction factor's. I've dynoed a few vehicles early morning before races, then Dynoed them on a buddies Mobile Dynojet at the track when it was 30 degrees warmer out, and SAE said they lost 40hp. but for some reason they ran within .05 and 1mph hour of their best. The uncorrected graphs are real close to a HP calculator's prediction for the track. Corrected SAE they are unpredictable, at least on my Dyno


I'm not sure that's an error with the SAE correction factors vs. a different dyno issue.

andrewzpsu
03-13-13, 12:36 PM
I did the before and after on my own dyno. I own a shop which shall not be named since I'm not a sponsor here. Went from 475 rwhp to 503 rwhp with no tuning. Airaid is the real deal.

wait4me
03-13-13, 01:03 PM
You guys are silly.

You cant gain more than what the restriction was...

Dirty filter would cause a restriction though, as that would cause more of a gain but really was not a gain with clean filter..

If you TAKE OFF THE WHOLE BOX ASSEMBLY AND HAVE NO AIR BOX AT ALL is going to be the best possible amount of horsepower that ANY airbox could EVER make.... As it would show the least amount of restriction.. On the airbox side of things, the less restricted it is, the more it will make, but have you ever looked inside that thing? They squeeze down the tube so it is smaller than stock.. lol.

6speeder
03-14-13, 03:16 PM
You guys are silly.

You cant gain more than what the restriction was...

Dirty filter would cause a restriction though, as that would cause more of a gain but really was not a gain with clean filter..

If you TAKE OFF THE WHOLE BOX ASSEMBLY AND HAVE NO AIR BOX AT ALL is going to be the best possible amount of horsepower that ANY airbox could EVER make.... As it would show the least amount of restriction.. On the airbox side of things, the less restricted it is, the more it will make, but have you ever looked inside that thing? They squeeze down the tube so it is smaller than stock.. lol.

That's true UNLESS the Airaid changed the A/F by misreading the air being fed into the engine. If it lets the engine run leaner at WOT it wil make more power.

Winspeed: long term fuel trims. If the airaid is misreading the amount of air the ltft's will get big as the computer (via the O2 sensors) adds fuel while cruising in closed loop to get the A/F back to 14.7:1. If the ltft's go too far from zero it'll set the CEL.

the godfaja
03-27-13, 04:30 PM
WINSpeed were you using the dry filter or oiled filter?

-Cody

USAFRET
03-27-13, 08:11 PM
Did you drive the car about 50 miles prior to the dyno run? I understand it takes that long for the ECM to make adjustments to the higher air flow. I saw this frequently over on the Corvette Forum.

1997BlackETC
03-28-13, 12:23 AM
So maybe the best bet is just take out the stock filter when drag racing and run nothing and then when done at the track put it back in.

Crystal Red CTS-V
03-28-13, 10:26 AM
Just by looking at the convoluted shape of the stock airbox compared to the Airaid, I would think the Airaid would have to make more power - sure "feels" that way!

BlownV
03-29-13, 10:32 AM
Alright so I am new the CTS-V forum but I have been on the STS-V one for a few years now and we went through the same 'he said' 'she said' arguing over HP numbers from just doing intake work that seems to pop up on every forum. Some people say that just changing the intake can offer big gains (5-10%) and others say that it is just a simple pressure differential relationship (restriction amount) so the only real benefit is a clean filter vs. a dirty one and if you can truly increase the cross sectional area of the intake. Both can be true depending on the car and the actual answer is very complicated.

I do CFD (computational fluid dynamics) analysis for my company and when it comes to mass flow rate through a pipe there are a variety of factors that have an influence on the overall effciency (pressure, boundary layer formation, Re number, vorticity, resonance, cross sectional pressure distribution, etc). The specific application and conditions determine whether these factors are negligible or not and since we are NOT dealing with a smooth single pipe in the stock intake design I can firmly state that without doing the flow analysis or bench testing it is impossible to approximate the efficiency of the stock intake by simply defining its' pressure restriction. I do find it interesting that the ZL1 camaro which is making almost 30 more hp features a 'dual-inlet' airbox design to remove the need for any resonator plumbing in the intake. I recognize that the ZL1 also has a different exhaust and the power steering is electric which help as well...but I can't help but think that the GM engineers changed the whole intake design for a reason.

All that aside, I can run CFD analysis to show the efficiency of the stock intake system at delivering air to the throttle body compared to any other aftermarket design and estimate the improvements in mass flow if there are any. Does anyone know if existing CAD models are available for the stock design (some companies will upload CAD models which are available to the public but I haven't found any for the LSA)? Or if any of the aftermarkey companies are willing to provide their CAD models? I can run the analysis relatively quickly but getting accurate measurements on the plumbing/airbox is the difficult part.

HUGN*RDS
03-30-13, 11:44 AM
^ it all comes down to the throttle body diameter, right?

BlownV
03-30-13, 06:31 PM
Your intake system is always going to be most influenced by the 'choke' point in the plumbing....whether that be tb or intake pipe or filter or intake manifold. However, that said, the velocity and pressure profile distribution across the cross sectional area of the throttle body will determine whether that is our choke point on a v with an intake. I don't know how uniform the flow is going into our tb so I can't really answer that question. In aerodynamic terms it comes down to how dirty or clean the airflow is at this location. I'll do some example cfd runs this weekend and post some pics to try to explain.

RaVeNous
04-02-13, 05:39 PM
This thread really just got interesting ^^^^

topend22
04-03-13, 09:24 AM
Wow, there is a lot to air flow I didn't know but very interesting. I would like to see air flow bench tests for every CAI on the market for our cars. I settled on the New Era because of the ram air part of it. Made more HP then the air raid for my car anyways.