: 1998 Deville Northstar - ready to get my hands dirty



KidCavanna
02-17-13, 11:03 AM
Hello everyone. New to the forums and just purchased a 98 deville. Absolute beauty with blown head gaskets. So I will be asking a lot of questions. Thanks in advance for the support.

Submariner409
02-17-13, 11:21 AM
Hiya ............. Welcome Aboard !!! :yup:

Get your feet wet, first. Go way up in the top black bar and read - study - the entire Cadillac Technical Archive. Then go down to Discussions, Item Specific: Cadillac Tech Tips and wade through the pages for threads of interest. Then read all the sticky posts at the top of Engines, Northstar Performance. Then read the stickys at the top of the Deville forum page. There is necessary info in every one of these reading assignments - the knowledge will put you way ahead in the "How do I ...... ?" category.

You said "Get my hands dirty" - on care, repair and maintenance only because there are literally NO "performance upgrades" for the car or engine. Get a GM service manual (NOT Chilton or Haynes) from either ebay or www.helminc.com (http://www.helminc.com). Consider looking into www.alldatadiy.com (http://www.alldatadiy.com).

Update your profile to show your car, year, model, mileage.

Ranger
02-17-13, 09:57 PM
:welcome: and :yeah:

CadillacLuke24
02-17-13, 10:13 PM
Bought one with headgasket issues? Sounds like a good project :D You'll get all kinds of help here, especially with fixing the HG issues. Good luck and welcome!

talismandave
02-18-13, 09:45 AM
Welcome and thank you for rescuing a great Cadillac from the inevitable crushing it would have suffered. My kind of Cadillac guy!:thumbsup:

You are surely going to feel at home here!

KidCavanna
02-18-13, 11:31 PM
Thank you everyone. A few questions. I am as of now waiting on parts, organizing the garage, and stocking up on the necessary tools. As far as drilling and taping kits go...... Which is the best? Time sert? Any other suggestions? While I am replacing the HG is there any other service I should perform at this time since the engine is out? Again thanks in advance. You guys are always all over this.

vincentm
02-18-13, 11:42 PM
Stud the engine, look up northstar performance.com or carroll custom cadillac. Reseal it too

CadillacLuke24
02-19-13, 05:07 PM
Thank you everyone. A few questions. I am as of now waiting on parts, organizing the garage, and stocking up on the necessary tools. As far as drilling and taping kits go...... Which is the best? Time sert? Any other suggestions? While I am replacing the HG is there any other service I should perform at this time since the engine is out? Again thanks in advance. You guys are always all over this.

NO time serts. They suck. Many people have had them fail. Norm serts or studs from N* performance or Carroll Custom Cadillac. Both are tried and true.

Bottom ends on the Northstar are very reliable, so unless you want to overhaul the engine or have had issues with the bottom end, worry only about the top end. From what I've seen, it'd be a fantastic idea to check up on the timing chain guides, and replace as necessary. If your trans has current problems, service it NOW while it's easy to get at.

Hey Sub, what was the trick you're supposed to do with the dremel and the y-pipe? That would be a good idea.

Lastly, anything else that needs servicing is best done when you have the engine out. All kinds of room. Check the coolant pipes that run behind the engine. Check the motor mounts. Stuff like that.

Good luck! Once you get it done you will have one heck of a Cadillac, and compliments to yourself! :thumbsup:

77CDV
02-19-13, 10:57 PM
:welcome: Good luck with your new project!

KidCavanna
02-20-13, 03:18 AM
I have read about that y pipe as well. It was an assembly welded part with some residual pipe blocking the flow from my understanding. I will keep my eye out for that.

I've only driven this car about 1 mile. I know the HG are shot but as far as the trans....? The car has 144K miles, straight as an arrow and is super clean! As long as I keep an eye on the coolant and temperature is it safe to push her a lil bit to test everything? I just don't want to make any more work for myself than I have to.

MrHolland
02-20-13, 07:43 AM
I wouldn't drive or even start a car with blown head gaskets. It might not damage it but why take the chance....

02603sec
02-20-13, 09:29 PM
Good luck with the new project. And congrats on the caddy acquisiton! Plenty of info here. Not every northstar has blown hg's. btw!

talismandave
02-20-13, 10:22 PM
Good luck with the new project. And congrats on the caddy acquisiton! Plenty of info here. Not every northstar has blown hg's YET. btw!

Fixed.:D

CadillacLuke24
02-21-13, 12:28 AM
fixed.:D

HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR :nono:

KidCavanna
02-28-13, 05:11 PM
My engine is the 275 hp vin Y. Are the vin#9 cams plug and play for the vin Y??

Submariner409
02-28-13, 05:18 PM
No. For starters - PCM calibration, transmission calibration, different final drive ratios, and on and on.

The 9 and Y engines operate in different rpm ranges - there's more than a (difficult mechanical) cam and cam follower swap.

KidCavanna
03-19-13, 02:20 PM
Can I replace a 1998 northstar with a 2000 northstar without any hang ups? Both vin y of course.

CadillacLuke24
03-19-13, 07:41 PM
No. There are a number of differences. It would be preferable to find another '98, or I believe a 96 or 97 will swap in. There is a thread in the Northstar forum that discusses interchangeability.

KidCavanna
03-20-13, 11:15 AM
What about interchangeable parts? I'm doing a 98 N* rebuild and came across a steal on a 2000 N*. Couldn't pass it up. I haven't tore into the 98 yet but I'm preparing myself for the worse. Seems i live my life by murphy's law lately. It would just be nice to use a part here and there if needed.

Ranger
03-20-13, 11:28 AM
I'm sure there are a lot of interchangeable parts.

CadillacLuke24
03-20-13, 01:19 PM
A direct swap, no. Interchangeable parts? Yes. I'd agree with Ranger, there likely are many.

Submariner409
03-20-13, 01:30 PM
Different: The entire block (all 3 pieces), heads, cams, cam followers, intake system, throttlebody, MAF, all sensors, all wiring, coil arrangement, ignition system, etc., etc. The 2000 and later Northstars are VERY different from 1999 and earlier. Even the spark plugs are different due to the combustion chamber re-design and lowered compression, and the PCM's are different.

This entire thread belongs in Northstar performance. Moved and titled "1998 Deville Northstar - Ready to get my hands dirty".

bigtone
03-20-13, 07:40 PM
I've used both Norms inserts and timeserts, and although I prefer Norms, there is really nothing wrong with timeserts. Many engines have been fixed with timeserts. Also, my own opinion is that installing studs in a car that has 144k on the clock is overkill. Norms inserts will probably still be fine long after some other expensive failure cause the car to finally be junked.

daveyhouse
03-21-13, 12:01 AM
All I can say is welcome to the MADNESS!!!

KidCavanna
03-21-13, 02:00 PM
Madness indeed. I got the studs from CCC. Tim is a great guy and his enthusiasm is contagious. I'm just trying to be as prepared as I can. Once I yank this monster I want to fix it and get it back in ASAP before I forget what goes where. Plus I'm looking forward to burning some $4 a gallon gas.

daveyhouse
03-24-13, 12:29 PM
Madness indeed. I got the studs from CCC. Tim is a great guy and his enthusiasm is contagious. I'm just trying to be as prepared as I can. Once I yank this monster I want to fix it and get it back in ASAP before I forget what goes where. Plus I'm looking forward to burning some $4 a gallon gas.

That is who I went with. Great guy.

Take lots of pics of everything before you start that is what I did. It helps tremendously for us noobs on reassemble.

Oh and lots of pics of the work being performed WE like those.

I have some extra new parts I bought by accident I will sell you for what I paid + 6.00 shipping priority mail. They are timing components and they are wear items. You will see when you open your timing cover.
Part #12559387 You need 2 and I have them both.
Part #12559388 You need 2 and I have 1, so you will need one more.

They are Genuine GM parts from Chris at Rippy Cadillac. Another great guy. You can find him under Rippy Cadillac in Authorized Cadillac Vendors.

----------

Oh and make sure to check your bucket lifters under cams especially the exhaust cam for any that may scuffed. If they are make sure your cam is not damaged, and starting to wear from the bad buckets.

KidCavanna
03-24-13, 04:53 PM
Daveyhouse that would be great. Ill pick up any extra parts you have that I will need. There will be a lot of pics don't worry. As soon as this cold weather breaks that pig is coming out. Just have to squeeze time in there to fix it between tee times....

daveyhouse
03-24-13, 06:00 PM
Where are you located?

KidCavanna
03-24-13, 06:20 PM
Reading Pennsylvania.

daveyhouse
03-24-13, 06:27 PM
Oh wow, you are only an hour away. I'll be going back to work in a couple weeks, and the first month or two, they will have me working in Allentown. So it can be a driveby :D
Maybe I'll even lend some special tools needed. As long as I get them back.

daveyhouse
03-26-13, 09:56 AM
You mentioned that you were going to drop the cradle out the bottom. Bill Buttermore did the same with his and is well documented here http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/northstar-performance-technical-discussion/257508-diy-northstar-head-gasket-crankcase-leak.html

KidCavanna
04-23-13, 12:37 AM
Finally the stars and planets are aligned...and thanks to Daveyhouse all is in order. I am going to try to do an out and in....in one day. Last chance for input for things to check and or replace. Please don't hold back....

maeng9981
04-23-13, 04:16 AM
Good luck. This thread was enough to get up on my feet and go continue working on my Deville! No night is too late for me.

daveyhouse
04-24-13, 04:28 AM
If you only got the headgasket kit you will probably need a timing cover gasket and a front main seal. If you need any tools, torque wrenches, etc. Let me know. The head bolts take a 10mm hex bit, and there are 3 small bolts at the front of the head take a 10mm socket. Don't forget to tape off the decks real good before drilling.

KidCavanna
07-14-13, 11:28 PM
Well today was the day. Now at the point of no return. The motor is dropped out the bottom with only one wire connecting it to the car. Have to take out the glove box to get to the harness. Not too many snags only broke the nipple off of the coolant reserve tank.

Submariner409
07-15-13, 08:50 AM
Your statement "out and in in one day" ............ You might want to plan on AT LEAST 10 days, intense work. Do the studs perfectly and seal every block hole or you'll pay dearly in a ruined engine: aluminum chips are going to fly everywhere.

If you go into the lower end, be ready to replace all the bearings and the connecting rod end cap bolts. There is a new, special technique for sealing the halfcase and oil pan flanges - it involves the use of UltraGray RTV sealant.

You'll NEED a GM service manual for reference to all the special procedures and torque values needed - Do you speak oil pump drive sleeve and harmonic balancer torque settings - so you don't lose oil pressure ??? How about timing those 3 chains and 4 cams ??

New coolant surge tank from Amazon - about $58, shipped.

KidCavanna
07-15-13, 10:20 AM
Out and in in a day was more like a dream. Did get it out in a day tho. Got the GM manuals. Plus I've got Daveyhouse my knight in shining armor to take all of my million calls and questions. Just doing the head gaskets and whatever I come across that needs replacing. All hoses and some vacuum lines.

maeng9981
07-15-13, 10:21 AM
Good luck! I remember that wire, instead of messing with the glove box I just decided to undo it from the engine side when it's jacked up enough.

04GrandAmGT
07-15-13, 03:57 PM
Good luck with the Build from us here at Northstar Performance. if you have any questions please feel free to reply to this post.

Submariner409
07-15-13, 04:26 PM
Nice to see a class act. ^^^

CadillacLuke24
07-16-13, 12:51 AM
Good luck with the Build from us here at Northstar Performance. if you have any questions please feel free to reply to this post.

Thanks for checking in Everett and Jake :thumbsup: Good customer service.

KidCavanna
07-22-13, 10:56 PM
Engine on ground. Wire still connected. I'm 1500 miles away. Hopefully the Cadillac gods will come down and bless me with a completed N* job on my return.

maeng9981
07-22-13, 11:00 PM
By the time when you finish, you definitely will be tired, but a properly working Northstar is such a reward. That feeling when you first start it and it fires up.

04GrandAmGT
07-23-13, 09:30 AM
may i mention one thing, if you want the longest lasting seal out there, we use ACDelco Sealant from GM, it is a half decent price and it works amazing! and also if you are looking for the oil manifold plate we got them for $85 + shipping

stoveguyy
07-25-13, 10:16 AM
You did not mention splitting block to reseal so I assume you do not have any major block oil seepage? Pulling motor and than heads is hard enough.

Sberry
07-29-13, 08:05 AM
I have one I would like to fix, do not care about a reman. How much does it cost for parts to do gaskets?

Submariner409
07-29-13, 08:50 AM
I have one I would like to fix, do not care about a reman. How much does it cost for parts to do gaskets?

Impossible question - depends on how deep you want to go. You MUST use new head bolts with inserts or substitute studs; new connecting rod bolts are mandatory. New bearings, maybe piston rings, maybe valve stem seals, timing chain guides and tensioners, oddball parts - crank end seals, ..... and so on. You might want to study the sticky posts just above this thread. Lots of engine info. Your engine has roller cam followers, so no lifter or flat tappet follower problems there.

Best start on "parts" - A real GM/Helm service manual from eBay or www.helminc.com (http://www.helminc.com). So many special procedures needed that you'll be totally lost without the proper service manual.

To see what you're up against, for a tiny peek at the work, look through my albums - the Community tab, Albums, the red Seville. 2 albums, 6 pages of 2000 - 2004 Northstar stuff.