: Dream Muscle Car



RealmCenter
12-21-04, 08:29 PM
Just sitting here daydreaming.
1969 Dodge Charger 426 Hemi 4-speed black on black (no vinyl top) loaded (power windows, locks, a/c etc...) R/T stripe delete (medallion on grille only) Black 5-spoke alloys 18" (modern) slightly lowered with coil overs (torsion bar setup replaced) of course a rack & pinion to replace the sloppy gearbox, giant 4-wheel discs. OK I'm done know, sorry! Anyone else??

illumina
12-21-04, 08:49 PM
'72 chevelle SS. nuff' said :lildevil:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6164&item=4513249932&rd=1

something like that......^

evilrussian
12-21-04, 08:55 PM
Just some I thought of at the moment:
'62 Bubbletop w/409
'66 GTO w/6pack
'70 Chevelle SS/454 (this ownz all of the above)
'69 Vette w/427 (some dispute if thats muscle)

Ralph
12-21-04, 09:04 PM
Here is my '69 Charger from HS. It had a 383.

My dream car is my Dad's '71 Olds 442 W-30 with 12,000 original miles!! We are trying to get it back from the current owner. According to a 1971 Motor Trend I have back home, the W30 was "King of the road" that year, and that's why my Dad special ordered it in June that year. 455 factory balanced and blueprinted, whatever the hell that means.

daacon
12-21-04, 09:05 PM
70 Challenger - or really any of these :thumbsup: 50 Fastest (http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclecars/general/musclecars-50fast.shtml)

illumina
12-21-04, 09:12 PM
ralph, that would be awesome if you could get that 442 back. it's nice to know she is still around.

my mother had a red '72 chevelle years ago (non-SS) when i was about 6-7 years old, but alas, i think she and her x-husband traded it in for a new dodge colt and dodge omni... :helpless:

Ralph
12-21-04, 09:19 PM
ralph, that would be awesome if you could get that 442 back. it's nice to know she is still around.


It would be a dream.

I think the nicest Charger is the 1968. I love the 4 little round taillights and that was the only year they had them. I remember a crappy green 1968 Charger (non R/T) going for $2500 on the next block in 1990! Would have been a fun project car for some.

daacon
12-21-04, 09:22 PM
My dream car is my Dad's '71 Olds 442 W-30 with 12,000 original miles!! We are trying to get it back from the current owner. According to a 1971 Motor Trend I have back home, the W30 was "King of the hill" that year, and that's why my Dad special ordered it in June that year.

Wow did you sell it to a collector ? Are there still 12,000 miles ? That would be sweet - I have some wonderful High School memories in an Olds 442 ......as well as '75 Torino 427 Cobra Jet - not mine - but I probably should not have lived though some of our "benchmark testing" - Kind of stories you tell your Kids when they are 40 :hide:

Ralph
12-21-04, 09:28 PM
Wow did you sell it to a collector ? Are there still 12,000 miles ? That would be sweet - I have some wonderful High School memories in an Olds 442 ......as well as '75 Torino 427 Cobra Jet - not mine - but I probably should not have lived though some of our "benchmark testing" - Kind of stories you tell your Kids when they are 40 :hide:

I don't want to hogg this thread or anything but I shot those pics in 1987 and it still has less than 20,000 miles according to the owner. In 1977 Dad sold it to a collector of Mopars and he got rid of a couple of them to make room for the 442. It's still here locally, with the original Firestone tires intact. I love the styling of the Chrysler E body (Challenger) but it has to be white like Kowalski's. ;) If I have time later I'll scan the original option sheet for you.

Merry Christmas everyone!!

danbuc
12-21-04, 09:47 PM
1958 Plymouth Fury. If I can't have that, I'll take either a 1969 Boss 429 or a 1965 Selby GT350 R. I want that plymouth more than anything though. It was in the movie Christine. That one was painted red though. :D

davesdeville
12-21-04, 11:12 PM
If it's gotta be stock... probably a 70 Plymouth Superbird, just cause they look redonkulus.
http://www.showyourauto.com/am/listings/images/24_10.jpg

Modified I'd go for a 67 Eldorado, converted to RWD with 500" of Cadillac power.
http://www.cardesignnews.com/news/2003/030609eod-mitchell/images/67cad-eldorado01s.jpg

Sandy
12-22-04, 12:39 AM
2002 Avanti III Convertible in Corvette's Torch Red
with Tan leather & roof, with Vortech Supercharge
I lmow it's NOT from the 70s; but it's "THE" one !!!!

http://www.bobsclassics.com/02a.htm

Stoneage_Caddy
12-22-04, 01:00 AM
69 AMX in big bad green
69 Camaro Z28 (the 302 engine)
AAR Cuda (or Challanger T/A)
70 AMC Javelin , done in Donohue/Penske Colors
like the other guy , superbirds rule
maybe a 62 plymouth savoy with the 413 for that sleeper look
63 Catailina 421 SD

Katshot
12-22-04, 05:59 AM
Just sitting here daydreaming.
1969 Dodge Charger 426 Hemi 4-speed black on black (no vinyl top) loaded (power windows, locks, a/c etc...) R/T stripe delete (medallion on grille only) Black 5-spoke alloys 18" (modern) slightly lowered with coil overs (torsion bar setup replaced) of course a rack & pinion to replace the sloppy gearbox, giant 4-wheel discs. OK I'm done know, sorry! Anyone else??

Don't tell me, you just watched one of the "Blade" movies.

Katshot
12-22-04, 06:04 AM
I wouldn't mind getting MY first car back. A '70 'Cuda. Loved those cars!

RealmCenter
12-22-04, 07:26 AM
Don't tell me, you just watched one of the "Blade" movies.
Heh, that was a '68, but yea almost exactly like that, except in a '69 model year. I like the long rectangular tail lamps and front grille divide. I wonder where that car from "Blade" is, does the studio still have it or did they sell it to a private owner?

Stag
12-22-04, 08:29 AM
I would love a 65 GTO with tri-power. I just love old Ponchos

haymaker
12-23-04, 12:15 AM
This was the eighth car in a long line of cars that I have owned but it was the first new one. I dreamed about owning this car from the first moment I knew it was going to be built. I know the picture is bad maybe because itís 35 years old and scanned from a Polaroid but do any of you know what it is?

RealmCenter
12-23-04, 01:08 AM
that's not a '67 Z-28 302ci is it?

haymaker
12-23-04, 01:41 AM
that's not a '67 Z-28 302ci is it?
No. Try again. Best est. only 500 were produced.

Playdrv4me
12-23-04, 02:53 AM
I wish banks knew the value of a classic, because If I had my choice, I would spend 30,000.00 on ANY of the classic Muscle above over ANY of the new vehicles Im looking at.

DaveSmed
12-23-04, 03:19 AM
I would have to agree, classic all the way! Mine is tons more reliable, powerful and comfortable than pretty much all of my friends cars.

Anyway, I've always had a thing for Oldsmobiles, and in addition to Ralph's ex-71 (favorite year, favorite color, AND favorite package!) a 1970 Toronado GT (AKA W-34) The speedometer alone makes it worth it! Toronados have always looked cool too.

Fleet
12-28-04, 09:39 PM
I see some very good choices!
I love Cadillacs and U.S. muscle cars. Here are some of my favorites:

- '69 Dodge Coronet R/T 440 (or Hemi), 3.55 gears... a 6-passenger car (or 5 with buckets) that could easily run low 14-sec. 1/4 miles. Tough, rugged engines. (See photo.)

- '69 Dodge Charger R/T 440 (or Hemi), 3.55 gears (440); 3.23 gears (Hemi)... with the Hemi, easy 13-sec. 1/4 miles and second gear is good for up to 107 mph.! With the 440, easy low 14/high 13 sec. 1/4 miles (even with A/C).

- '69 Dodge Coronet Super Bee 440-6 Pack, 4.10 gears... this car was made for one purpose only- drag racing. Could run low 13 to high 12 1/4 miles off the showroom floor.

- '69 Dodge Dart GTS 340, 3.91 gears... plain looking but could run 14.4/99 mph 1/4 miles. The 340 is another Mopar engine which is tough and reliable.

- '69 Dodge Charger Daytona 426-Hemi, 3.23 gears... Top speed of at least 180 mph.

- '70 Plymouth Hemicuda, 4.10 gears... another Mopar which could run easy 13-sec. 1/4 miles. Just looking at the gas pedal made the rear wheels spin (well, almost).

- '70 Chevrolet Chevelle SS 454 LS6, 3.70 gears... 450 hp. to play with! Could run in the 13s without even trying.

- '70 Buick GS 455 Stage 1, 3.64 gears... brain-damaging (510 ft/lbs) torque and mid-13-second 1/4 miles!

- '70 Dodge Challenger T/A 340 6-Pack, 3.55 gears... Good handling and acceleration. Can run low 14 sec. 1/4 miles (at 99 mph).

- '70 Plymouth Duster 340, 3.91 gears... another plain-looking Mopar which Motor Trend ran a 14.2 sec/99 mph 1/4 mile. You can laugh while you're pulling away from the Lexus next to you.

- '57 Chrysler 300-C, 392-Hemi, 3.36 gears... big, roomy, comfortable, fins, lots of chrome and a 140+ mph. top speed.

RealmCenter
12-29-04, 09:14 PM
Man, I love it, all these Mopar fans on the Caddy forums! And I thought I was the only one :thumbsup:

haymaker
12-30-04, 12:36 AM
I see some very good choices!
I love Cadillacs and U.S. muscle cars. Here are some of my favorites:

- '69 Dodge Coronet R/T 440 (or Hemi), 3.55 gears... a 6-passenger car (or 5 with buckets) that could easily run low 14-sec. 1/4 miles. Tough, rugged engines. (See photo.)

- '69 Dodge Charger R/T 440 (or Hemi), 3.55 gears (440); 3.23 gears (Hemi)... with the Hemi, easy 13-sec. 1/4 miles and second gear is good for up to 107 mph.! With the 440, easy low 14/high 13 sec. 1/4 miles (even with A/C).

- '69 Dodge Coronet Super Bee 440-6 Pack, 4.10 gears... this car was made for one purpose only- drag racing. Could run low 13 to high 12 1/4 miles off the showroom floor.

- '69 Dodge Dart GTS 340, 3.91 gears... plain looking but could run 14.4/99 mph 1/4 miles. The 340 is another Mopar engine which is tough and reliable.

- '69 Dodge Charger Daytona 426-Hemi, 3.23 gears... Top speed of at least 180 mph.

- '70 Plymouth Hemicuda, 4.10 gears... another Mopar which could run easy 13-sec. 1/4 miles. Just looking at the gas pedal made the rear wheels spin (well, almost).

- '70 Chevrolet Chevelle SS 454 LS6, 3.70 gears... 450 hp. to play with! Could run in the 13s without even trying.

- '70 Buick GS 455 Stage 1, 3.64 gears... brain-damaging (510 ft/lbs) torque and mid-13-second 1/4 miles!

- '70 Dodge Challenger T/A 340 6-Pack, 3.55 gears... Good handling and acceleration. Can run low 14 sec. 1/4 miles (at 99 mph).

- '70 Plymouth Duster 340, 3.91 gears... another plain-looking Mopar which Motor Trend ran a 14.2 sec/99 mph 1/4 mile. You can laugh while you're pulling away from the Lexus next to you.

- '57 Chrysler 300-C, 392-Hemi, 3.36 gears... big, roomy, comfortable, fins, lots of chrome and a 140+ mph. top speed.
Fleet.
In their hay day I had street raced against most of the cars in your list. I have also test driven some on your list when they were new. Now if one were to believe the magazines testing results, they were all fast? Although they were capable of being quick with some work, most were not so quick right off the showroom floor. Lets just say if you found me on the street test-driving a 70 Chevelle 454-450hp with 410 gears and you wanted to try me from traffic light to traffic light in any of the cars you have listed, your best shot would be the Super Bee 440-6 Pack 410 gears. No I have never owned a LS6 Chevelle but I have driven and street raced against them same with the 440-6 Pack Coronet. My street racer of that day was pictured in my post #18 of this thread.
BTW anyone street racing from light to light in the cars you listed would be surprised to learn just how close the 57-8-9 Corvette 283-270hp 4-spd with 456 gears and yes the Cadillac STS, ETS and DTS would be to your door at the next light. I expect some of the older Hemi owners will express exception as to the king of the street but off the show room the street Hemi just didnít run that well.

Sandy
12-30-04, 11:24 AM
I had every last one for a Demo, except for the Chevelle, the Chrysler 300C and the Buick. I did, however own my own Buick, a 1967 Skylark Gran Sport 400 Convertible

Rolex
12-30-04, 03:02 PM
Haymaker...1968 Camaro L89??? Or maybe COPO Camaro?
My pics:
1970 Chevelle SS
1969 Camaro SS
1967 Vette convertible 427
1965 Mustang fastback

chuckles_100
12-30-04, 03:20 PM
Just a stab in the dark but is it a '67 camero RS/SS?
Dave :suspect:

chuckles_100
12-30-04, 03:23 PM
Just a stab in the dark but is it a '67 camaro RS/SS
Dave

Ralph
12-30-04, 03:36 PM
I'm going to say a COPO because RS/SS's didn't have a cowl hood like that I believe.

Also, the COPO came with crappy little dog dish hubcaps because it was stripped and all about the 427 under the hood.

1969 COPO?

haymaker
12-30-04, 06:09 PM
I'm going to say a COPO because RS/SS's didn't have a cowl hood like that I believe.

Also, the COPO came with crappy little dog dish hubcaps because it was stripped and all about the 427 under the hood.

1969 COPO?
That would be it Ralph. 1969 427-425hp M22-4 spd with 410 rear gears. The car had about 3000 miles on the clock as pictured.
The only thing missing was the front air dam (it would drag on the parking lot divider curbs so I removed and gave it to a friend). The car was priced about $400.00 cheaper than a Z28 and except for the hood scoop, wider wheels, tires and spoilers looked just like the six-cylinder car.

evilrussian
12-30-04, 06:23 PM
That would be it Ralph. 1969 427-425hp M22-4 spd with 410 rear gears. The car had about 3000 miles on the clock as pictured.
The only thing missing was the front air dam (it would drag on the parking lot divider curbs so I removed and gave it to a friend). The car was priced about $400.00 cheaper than a Z28 and except for the hood scoop, wider wheels, tires and spoilers looked just like the six-cylinder car.
Hell yea! That IS the ultimate sleeper! :worship: Unlike Ralph I love dog dish hubcaps, makes the car look innocent, IMO... And that motor is what makes the car, not the flashy accents.

Ralph
12-30-04, 06:55 PM
That would be it Ralph. 1969 427-425hp M22-4 spd with 410 rear gears. The car had about 3000 miles on the clock as pictured.
The only thing missing was the front air dam (it would drag on the parking lot divider curbs so I removed and gave it to a friend). The car was priced about $400.00 cheaper than a Z28 and except for the hood scoop, wider wheels, tires and spoilers looked just like the six-cylinder car.

I'll see if I can find my old car mag article on those. If I recall they were 500 hp GROSS! That would put it even higher that the well known LS6 SS Chevelle! Not to mention the Camaro's lighter weight and you had a killer except the only limiting factor would be getting traction much like my old Charger.

Central Office Production Order? (COPO) or something like that?

Stoneage_Caddy
12-30-04, 07:01 PM
copo novas were interesting too , tho i hear all of them sold in the US became yenkos , canada got 3 from what was said on speed channel

Ralph
12-30-04, 07:10 PM
Novas never did anything for me in the excitment department, of course a 427 would help. :D

Here is a little article and they mention COPO's but I can't find the good one.

Stoneage_Caddy
12-30-04, 07:52 PM
copo nova were 350s . 360hp 350s

85Biarritz
12-31-04, 12:36 AM
My dream muscle car is in the other side of the garage:

http://home.fuse.net/corvette/tbob-ncm.jpg

A side by side picture and article was in the Cincinnati Enquirer Newspaper:

http://www.enquirer.com/columns/wheels/columns/070304_what.html

Life is Good!

haymaker
12-31-04, 01:02 AM
I had every last one for a Demo, except for the Chevelle, the Chrysler 300C and the Buick. I did, however own my own Buick, a 1967 Skylark Gran Sport 400 Convertible
Sandy.
I used to test drive a different HiPo car just about every weekend. The dealerships were full of new models. I was like a kid in a candy shop horsepower ruled, even if most of the numbers were inflated. I expect some reading this post may think me a little strange as per referring to street racing as acceptable but that is just the way it was. Traffic was much less dense in the late 60s. A clear path from stoplight to stop light was much more the rule rather than todayís exception. All the American auto manufactures produced fast iron, even American Motors. To go to a drive-in on Friday or Saturday Night Park get the window tray with food and watch the continual stream of HiPo cars circling the drive-inís parking lot and back onto the street, sizing up the competition. Then the cruising on the streets looking for the match-up you had been looking for. That was so much fun!

My brother-in-law owned the 57 300C and it was fast from the roll (say 70mph on).
I do remember the 67 Grand Sport 400, rare on the street at the time.

haymaker
12-31-04, 01:38 AM
Haymaker...1968 Camaro L89??? Or maybe COPO Camaro?
My pics:
1970 Chevelle SS
1969 Camaro SS
1967 Vette convertible 427
1965 Mustang fastback
Rolex.

I owned a 1966 427-425hp 4spd convertible Corvette. It was a chic magnet. My 1971 Vega GT (My own modification LT1 350ci 360 hp 373 rear posi-gears) was much quicker on the street and 25 mph to boot. My 1971 Camaro Z28-RS was better through the corners.
I street raced the HiPo small block Mustangs of the mid 60ís when they were new.
I was driving a 1955 Chevy 2 dr ht 283ci 220+hp 3 spd with Hurst shifter 390-locked (welded Spyder) rear end. That was a good race. If the Mustang had a good driver the race was very close, if not my Chevy won.

haymaker
12-31-04, 01:44 AM
Just a stab in the dark but is it a '67 camaro RS/SS
Dave
Sorry Dave, must have been my bad picture but it truly is a factory 69 427-425hp Camaro.

haymaker
12-31-04, 02:03 AM
I'll see if I can find my old car mag article on those. If I recall they were 500 hp GROSS! That would put it even higher that the well known LS6 SS Chevelle! Not to mention the Camaro's lighter weight and you had a killer except the only limiting factor would be getting traction much like my old Charger.

Central Office Production Order? (COPO) or something like that?
500hp would be a real stretch for the production cars, maybe 350-400hp in street trim my guess would be closer to 375hp in my car. Sorry Ralph but the LS6 Chevelle was a faster street car as delivered from the show room. A year later L88 installed with headers and free exhaust system and this was a killer streetcar. 500hp was now at the ready by way of the right foot.

Ralph
12-31-04, 02:06 AM
500hp would be a real stretch for the production cars, maybe 350-400hp in street trim my guess would be closer to 375hp in my car. Sorry Ralph but the LS6 Chevelle was a faster street car as delivered from the show room. A year later L88 installed with headers and free exhaust system and this was a killer streetcar. 500hp was now at the ready by way of the right foot.

One mag I have somewhere mentioned that magical number. I think you are probably right but it would be nice to believe, wouldn't it? ;) That 500 hp would be gross, of course. Different story when you get exhaust, mufflers, fanbelts, etc. on there.

According to other stuff I read, my Dad's W30 was rated at 360 hp GROSS for 1971. Net was actually closer to 300 hp in todays ratings. When I told him this he was suprised because that's the hp of his 2003 DTS! I know that in 1971 they cut the compression ratio a little.

Interesting stuff.

Hp numbers get thrown around so much by different sources it's suprising we even have accurate numbers but it was a much different rating system back then. Consider the article I posted, Yenko used 450 hp, COPO 425 hp, so who knows. LS6 was GROSS rated at 450 hp I believe. It's been stated that manufacturers underrated numbers also to get them passed for the street. The 426 hemi was a lowly 425 hp rating, I read in one article that it could be upwards of 600 GROSS! Supposedly another underrated car was the 1987 GNX. Who knows what the net on that COPO really is. I still say lite is right for a drag race and would put the Camaro against yourself in the LS6 for a good race. ;) I always thought the COPO 427 was secretly the king of all Musclecar engines including the LS6.

I also think that the high GROSS ratings helped bring about the end of Musclecars through insurance ratings because it scared too many of them.

Here are some formulas from BBob:


"The definition of power is the force times the distance divided by the time or

POWER = FORCE X DISTANCE / TIME = FD/T

We can now figure these items out for the imaginary dyno setup.....

The FORCE (F) is the load that the scale is measuring in pounds

The DISTANCE that the force is being appied over is the circumference of the rotor that the caliper is clamping onto...the circumference is given by the formula Pi X diameter....and the diameter is twice the radius of the rotor...so the DISTANCE wanted is = Pi 2 r

The RPM is known of the engine. The RPM is important as it defines the time factor since we want to calculate the "work" done over one revolution of the flywheel at the rate of the RPM....

Since the POWER in this case is desired to be BHP (brake horse power) and we are assuming that 33000 LBS/foot/min that can be plugged in....


So... F X 2 Pi r X RPM
----------------------- = BHP
33000

From the above realize that the F measured at the scale times the radius of the flywheel/rotor r is the torque of the engine ...so...the equation can be simplified to

Torque X 2 Pi X RPM
------------------------- = BHP
33000

Pi is universally known as 3.1416 (the ratio of the diameter (or radius X 2 ) of a circle to the circumference).....so....plug in 3.1416 and crunch the numbers.....

Torque X RPM
-------------- = BHP
5252



This is a really really simplified analysis that assumes everything is in pounds, minutes, feet, etc.... so that all the terms match and a lot of steps are skipped but hopefully you get the idea...."

Rolex
12-31-04, 04:04 PM
Rolex.

I owned a 1966 427-425hp 4spd convertible Corvette. It was a chic magnet. My 1971 Vega GT (My own modification LT1 350ci 360 hp 373 rear posi-gears) was much quicker on the street and 25 mph to boot. My 1971 Camaro Z28-RS was better through the corners.
I street raced the HiPo small block Mustangs of the mid 60ís when they were new.
I was driving a 1955 Chevy 2 dr ht 283ci 220+hp 3 spd with Hurst shifter 390-locked (welded Spyder) rear end. That was a good race. If the Mustang had a good driver the race was very close, if not my Chevy won.

I am drueling now. :eek: :p