: Another fix from GM for clicking wheels



flatrockguy
08-29-12, 11:46 AM
There is a new TSB out yesterday for the clicking wheels. No longer replacing rotors with 2 piece, instead back to cleaning and using a different lugnut. here is the document.



#PIC5136K: Clicking Noise From Front Wheels - (Aug 28, 2012)
Subject:
Clicking Noise From Front Wheels

Models: 2009 - 2012 Cadillac CTS-V

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This PI was superseded to update recommended field. Please discard PIC5136J.
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The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom(s) described in this PI.

Condition/Concern:


A customer may comment on a clicking noise emanating from the front wheels. This condition is noticed at low speed (walking speed) during full wheel lock turns on dry clean pavement (Full lock parking lot maneuver). The clicking noise is generally noted as approximately 1 to 4 "clicks" per wheel revolution.
The CTS-V has lightweight high performance front rotors with an aluminum center. The clicking sound is caused by interaction between the wheel mounting face and wheel mounting surface on the brake rotor caused by the aluminum-to-aluminum interface.

Recommendation/Instructions:


Note: Do NOT replace the Front wheel or brake rotor for the clicking condition (The new brake rotors that were being installed previously for this condition should no longer be installed. The procedure to use now is cleaning and replacing the wheel nuts as described below.)
Procedure:
1. Remove wheel
2. Clean wheel as follows:
Use clean cloth dampened with GM Brake Parts Cleaner 12378556 or equivalent. b) Wipe the mounting surface of the wheel to remove any residual grey or black material that has accumulated on the wheel mounting surface. Be careful not to use the Brake Cleaner on the painted or clear coated surfaces of the wheel. It is also helpful to use a Scotch-Brite Cleaning Pad to aid in cleaning. Be sure NOT to use the scotch pads (Roloc disc) on the aluminum material. All cleaning MUST be done by hand, do NOT use ANY air or power tools!
3. Clean the rotor top hat as follows: a) Use clean cloth dampened with GM Brake Parts Cleaner 12378392 or equivalent. b) Clean the wheel mounting surface of the rotor (rotor top hat) to remove any residual grey or black material that has accumulated on the rotor. During the cleaning process be sure to clean the rotor near the wheel pilot at the center of the rotor. It is also helpful to use a Scotch-Brite Cleaning Pad to aid in cleaning. Be sure to NOT use scotch pads (Roloc discs) on the aluminum material. All cleaning MUST be done by hand, do NOT use ANY air or power tools!

Note: Be sure to thoroughly dry the wheel and rotor prior to installation on vehicle.
4. Reinstall wheels using replacement wheel nuts with P/N 9598179 (front wheels only, so need qty. 10 for this repair) (these can be identified with a blue color on the inboard conical portion of the nut (see pic) and torque them to 150 Nm (110 lb ft).

Note: If a car had the 2-piece rotors installed (Part number 20795300 & 20795302) prior to the release of these "blue cone" wheel nuts and has a repeat wheel click concern, perform this cleaning procedure, replace the wheel nuts with the new blue cone nuts, and torque to specs.

PeteK
08-29-12, 12:00 PM
Well, while I like the idea of the 2-piece rotors for free, as I'm hoping to get to the track soon, mine started clicking after a few hundred miles, as opposed to about 8000 on the original one-piece rotors, so I'm willing to try again.

cdog533
08-29-12, 03:26 PM
Damn, I missed the rotors!!!

Torxila
08-29-12, 05:56 PM
Just got my rotors last week...boooyah!

OldRoadDawg
08-29-12, 06:35 PM
...and torque them to 150 Nm (110 lb ft).

:hmm:... interesting, considering the specs originally called for 140 lbs and the first TSB 'attempt' increased the torque to 158 lbs.

Pphilthy
08-29-12, 07:47 PM
I have an appointment for Friday to address this issue - looks like I'm missing out on the two piece front rotors by a couple of days... As long as the issue is resolved, I'm all good...

Almondted
08-29-12, 09:25 PM
WOW, got mine just in time and no click since the rotors where replaced...

baabootoo
08-30-12, 01:12 AM
Damn, I missed the rotors!!!

Ditto brother!

1997BlackETC
08-30-12, 02:48 AM
Darn, me too, missed the new Rotors, got my car a couple months ago new and just hit 4k miles, the wheels started to click around 400 miles ago.

Trapspeed
08-30-12, 08:16 AM
I'm happy I got mine but something about this whole thing makes no sense. You mean to tell me that GM got to the point where they felt changing rotors was the solution and now we are digressing to a lug nut swap?? Hmmm.

jft69z
08-30-12, 08:32 AM
I'm happy I got mine but something about this whole thing makes no sense. You mean to tell me that GM got to the point where they felt changing rotors was the solution and now we are digressing to a lug nut swap?? Hmmm.
Yeah, something is fishy here. They must have figured out that lug nuts are a lot cheaper than new rotors.....

allinmyhead
08-30-12, 02:24 PM
I'm sure it's simply that they under estimated the number of rotors that they were going to have to replace under warranty. After the deluge of $600+ warranty fixes in the last 30 days they backed off of it.

Or they ran out of stock?

Pphilthy
08-30-12, 06:01 PM
Well, whatever they do, they need to find a long term fix... Wondering if anyone has submitted a lemon law claim for this issue or if it's even applicable...

67 mobill 442
08-30-12, 06:37 PM
Wowwww, I got my rotor's replaced about 2 weeks ago. At about 1700 miles. No more clicking. I took the TSB in and gave it to the service writer. Boy did I get lucky. Yeaaa!

cruiser68
08-30-12, 07:14 PM
Wowwww, I got my rotor's replaced about 2 weeks ago. At about 1700 miles. No more clicking. I took the TSB in and gave it to the service writer. Boy did I get lucky. Yeaaa!

+1 got mine replaced yesterday.....just in time for a track day :)

1997BlackETC
08-30-12, 09:55 PM
Why don't they just have a TSB to take an arc welder and weld the studs to the wheels? that would fix it and only cost them one welding stick per car. This way lugs will be unecessary and they won't even have to pay up for those.

pharmdc5
08-31-12, 09:12 AM
Just drove out of dealership with both, 2 piece rotors and new lug nuts...... All the way to work - no clicking! Timed It just right!

Gary Veeeee
08-31-12, 04:54 PM
Had my appointment today for rotors dealer ordered them on Monday. Went in to have them installed ,he said he just found out that the Lugnuts is the problem and had to order them. Parts are backed up one week great. Have had the car less than two weeks now. Its funny my last car was a 05 Dodge Magnum RT with a Hemi and the first two months I was running back and forth to the dealer replacing tie rod ends. However with my Magnum the problem never really did get fixed I was always replacing the a
Passenger side at least one a year. Now I am a little concerned with the Lugnuts being the problem . Todd, my service manager, said it's not an unsafe condition. I don't get it what is actually rattling if it's the Lugnuts the wheel loose ?something hitting the rotor ? All I know is I have to figure out someway to tell my wife that this is safe .She was freaking out about the rotors. And it's kind of embarrassing that my new $60,000 car is being repaired all the time. I'm okay with working out the bugs in a product ,but shouldn't the dealer have at least seen that service bulletin about the rotors when the car was on the lot? Why wouldn't they have at least replace the rotors before I took delivery when the other service bulletins were out ? Todd told me today yeah your vehicle the Vin number range for rotors , well don't they check their inventory when bulletins come out? I worked at a motorcycle dealership for many years and as soon as Honda sent out repair bulletins that was the first thing we checked . They were great clean repairs and paid by the factory. My V dealer
would've been paid by warranty. Now that I think of it before we did delivery on a bike we had to check for updates. That was part of the pre delivery check list." Whatever" I don't know this is just a little depressing right now. Oh yeah, Todd said they checked out the headlights for the for fogging problem I had on the first day I drove it he said "they were fine"....okay..,

Gary Veeeee
08-31-12, 06:26 PM
Had my appointment today for rotors dealer ordered them on Monday. Went in to have them installed ,he said he just found out that the Lugnuts is the problem and had to order them. Parts are backed up one week great. Have had the car less than two weeks now. Its funny my last car was a 05 Dodge Magnum RT with a Hemi and the first two months I was running back and forth to the dealer replacing tie rod ends. However with my Magnum the problem never really did get fixed I was always replacing the a
Passenger side at least one a year. Now I am a little concerned with the Lugnuts being the problem . Todd, my service manager, said it's not an unsafe condition. I don't get it what is actually rattling if it's the Lugnuts the wheel loose ?something hitting the rotor ? All I know is I have to figure out someway to tell my wife that this is safe .She was freaking out about the rotors. And it's kind of embarrassing that my new $60,000 car is being repaired all the time. I'm okay with working out the bugs in a product ,but shouldn't the dealer have at least seen that service bulletin about the rotors when the car was on the lot? Why wouldn't they have at least replace the rotors before I took delivery when the other service bulletins were out ? Todd told me today yeah your vehicle the Vin number range for rotors , well don't they check their inventory when bulletins come out? I worked at a motorcycle dealership for many years and as soon as Honda sent out repair bulletins that was the first thing we checked . They were great clean repairs and paid by the factory. My V dealer
would've been paid by warranty. Now that I think of it before we did delivery on a bike we had to check for updates. That was part of the pre delivery check list." Whatever" I don't know this is just a little depressing right now. Oh yeah, Todd said they checked out the headlights for the for fogging problem I had on the first day I drove it he said "they were fine"....okay..,

Great been waiting for my dealer to call to pick up car. I already knew I would have to go back next week for the Lugnuts . Today even though they didn't have the parts to repair the click, they still had to do some cosmetic work on left rear quarter small scratch and replace middle console due to scratches, these were all things I noticed during delivery. Scratch in the rear quarter was very small, I almost didn't say nothing I could rub it out myself. Due to the expense of the car and then having a body shop they said they would take care of it when they installed the consul pieces. Well, Technician rubbed too much out now has to go to body shop for paint on the rear quarter. This sucks you can never match factory paint I don't care who paints it. I'm pissed, they wanted me to keep their loaner car which is a base sedan over the weekend until the repairs were done. I told them no I want to drive my car this weekend three day weekend. Now I think he's irked because they have to stay until I get there and they are already closed. Or he doesn't want me to see the damage. I can't believe this.. I thought this was a very reputable dealer salesman was great, so far I'm not impressed with the rest. , My wife's going to kill me!!!1

Gary Veeeee
08-31-12, 08:37 PM
Oh my God, I'm going to be sick...... This car looks like a two-year-old ran the buffer over it. I thought they were just going to try to fix the scratch on the quarter panel but it looks like it got away from them,they started to feather and decided to do the whole car. I ran a buffer before and it's a fine art you have to know what you're doing especially with these types of Paint ,tri coat Tints are extremely difficult if you don't go with the flow or stay on the edges too long the paint very easily burns and will show distinctive lines from the buffer. The wheel well the rounded edge above the lip is where the scratch was .They continually went over the edge which you can see with the naked eye the discoloration and streaks going side to side like the shape of a rainbow over the rear flared quarter panel .9I almost think they tried to wet sand before using the buffer that's how deep the streaks are. Now the car goes from being red to a pinkish hue along with all the lines of the car. The buffer was obviously on too fast of speed and on the edges too long . I was wondering why the car was still in the garage when I came to pick it up .All the lights were off , Todd stated "yeah I'm not happy the way the quarter panel came out . I have to put one of my senior guys on it next week. Bring it back in when we get the wheel nuts for the clicking."When I arrived home and saw the car almost fell over with the paint in the sun. It's a complete mess on top of that there's paste all in the black seals and other areas. I don't know, the average person probably would not notice but being into cars and knowing paint finishes. This is unacceptable.

Gary Veeeee
08-31-12, 09:01 PM
I'm sorry I hit the post button too soon. Just a few more of my ranting and raving. One of the main reasons I chose to buy my CTS V Cadillac was the quality of workmanship in fit and finish on the product. Any Cadillac rep looking at this car would agree. I believe anybody in this forum would agree with what I'm talking about. The damages more noticeable from the rear the car ,hood around the beveled edges you can notice it also. this is going to be a long weekend for me I am beyond disappointed and can't believe what has happened today. This day has been a complete waste of time.I did not get my wheel clicking repaired but the car is in worse condition. to top things off it's only two weeks so I really haven't been able enjoy the Car. Lastly I just noticed looking at the car on the driver side along the roof edge ,above the center piller there are too dents right next to each other looking at an angle. The passenger side doesn't have this I noticed it because of the color difference inside the dents they are darker and again along the edge of the dents it starts to fade into a lighter shade of red . I know this car has a reinforced roll cage could this be some type of welding point? Anybody notice these dents on their car mines a 2012 and if you're looking on the driver side kind of at an angle along the roof edge above the driver that's where they are . This is the least of my worries ,I'm really sick to my stomach. This is going to drive me crazy until tuesday...thanks for listening..... any advice would be helpful..

turbol15
09-01-12, 11:12 AM
get a lawyer

Gary Veeeee
09-01-12, 11:27 AM
Okay, if anyone is reading any of this little follow-up. Last night my buddy that owns a autobody shop came over to look at the car for me . He brought some equipment to see what he can do. I don't know what he did ,but everything it's not as bad as I thought . the paint to me look for these said no it's the paint itself has a flopping feature depending how you look at it in the sun.

theamcguy
09-01-12, 11:37 AM
GM has stated the noise is caused by aluminum to aluminum contact. Then the fix (two piece rotors) still has aluminum to aluminum contact. First off the fix was expensive and did not cure the problem in 100% of the cases. Any fix via a TSB has to work 100% of the time or it is not a fix. We'll see if the lug nuts work 100% of the time. It may end up being that for a 100% fix some cars may need both. What I can't figure out is if the noise is caused by aluminum to aluminum contact why didn't they develop some kind of very tough thin gasket to go between the wheel and rotor.

Gary Veeeee
09-01-12, 11:44 AM
Okay, if anyone is reading any of this little follow-up. Last night my buddy that owns a autobody shop came over to look at the car for me . He brought some equipment to see what he can do. I don't know what he did ,but it's not as bad as I thought . the paint to me looked discolored on the edges he ,said no it's the paint itself has a flopping feature depending how you look at it in the sun.
Neil then ran his buffer with his anti-swirl type paste and was able to get the swirl marks out of the paint. So, the only thing now is the rear quarter definitely damaged from the dealer. It has to be repainted because they went through the clear coat trying to remove the scratch. My auto body guy Neil said it has to be repainted because they removed all the clear down to the paint. Looking at it now I'm definitely feeling better however, I'm still pissed still have the clicking which we hope Lugnuts will take care of and now the car has to be painted which doesn't sit with me well. I also have to check about those dents or ripples above the door on the edge of the roof. Again if anybody notice these ripples or dents on there V please post. There is nothing on the passenger side only driver side . They may have something to do with the roll cage. Possibly the weld marks, I don't know ? Have a great day guys......

turbol15
09-01-12, 12:00 PM
Gary, if they the dealer did that to the car then they need to take it back and eat it. how many miles does the car have on it? because even if they fix it it will be in your mind that they painted it.

Gary Veeeee
09-01-12, 12:26 PM
Gary, if they the dealer did that to the car then they need to take it back and eat it. how many miles does the car have on it? because even if they fix it it will be in your mind that they painted it.

Turbo, car has 608 , 150 was on it before I purchased. As I said earlier, as I said earlier, just off the lot two weeks ago . Your absolutely right because it's got me nuts. It's my mind all time. What are my options here I live in New York there's lemon policy I don't think it qualifies for that. I also really enjoyed the car. If they take it back the only other dealer is about 100 miles north of me.

turbol15
09-01-12, 07:23 PM
you want another car case closed. call the bbb.whatever it is you need to do. they scratched,burned the paint clear coat etc. they have to buy back the car from you as it is unacceptable what they have done.

Club Malibu
09-01-12, 08:21 PM
Was going to call on Tuesday to make an appointment for the new rotors........ damn!

Gary Veeeee
09-02-12, 01:13 AM
Long day, although it was better than yesterday.w

Gary Veeeee
09-02-12, 01:37 AM
[QUOTE="Gary Veeeee"]Long day, although it was better than yesterday. I was able today to call my original salesman that sold me the car. Salesman called the order in which they both agreed to meet me at the dealership in the afternoon. When I arrived the owner of dealership was looking very closely at the roof and the whole car with a disgusted look on his face. I really wanted to go crazy and start screaming up and down, thought I'd keep my composure. I explained everything and the owner with no hesitation agreed this was a serious problem. I was expecting something different for some reason. Well after we spoke , the owner gave me several options in which I have to think about. Car obviously is going back on Tuesday for paint and body work repair. After the car is done I will make my decision on what option I plan to take. I really don't want to go into specifics but they made me happy with making things right. It was actually pleasant to be understood without them being on the defensive. I really thought I was going to be basically screwed and have a long drawnout war in regards to this issue, I feel a hell of a lot better. Thanks to all who listen. Oh yeah, my wife is not going to divorce me over this. LOL

1997BlackETC
09-02-12, 01:56 AM
Glad it worked out ok for you, sounds like you have a decent dealer unlike the dealer I bought my car through (Herb Chambers) who could not give a crap about the fact the fender had been changed out on the new CTS-V I bought from them.

turbol15
09-02-12, 10:48 AM
what did they do?

1997BlackETC
09-02-12, 01:30 PM
Nothing, I have a appointment to have it lined up right Sept 4th and will have to pay myself. I was hoping they would work with me on trading it in on a new wagon (it's a sedan and not enough space inside) but they would not do that either. I would never ever deal with those clowns again at Herb Chambers Cadillac in Warwick RI. You don't expect to buy a new car with a replaced fender, heck if I'd known that was the case I would have just bought a used car. It should have been disclosed, they knew the fender had been replaced. I did not know until I was looking under the hood one day and realized it was not lined up right and took it back to them and that's when they told me it was the fender and then would not call me back. The not calling me back and ignoring me was what really bothered me, no apologies or anything. I'm going to get a sticker across the bumper on the car saying "Do not buy from Herb Chambers" for what they did to me. This whole thing is going to cost them a lot of money and hopefully eventually they will go out of business.

Anyhow, sorry to go off topic here, I am just pissed off. As far as the clicking wheels, yes my car has that too, I'm not even going to worry about that, it's the least of my worries, I've also got the Differential whine on the highway too, changed the rear end oil around 500 miles ago, made no difference, the whine still continues to get worse.

theamcguy
09-02-12, 02:05 PM
Looks like the new lug nut 9598179 is a standard GM item. It was used on Saabs, Buick Regals and the SRX. You can get them for $2.16 a piece from GM Parts Direct.

1997BlackETC
09-02-12, 02:17 PM
More than likely the clicking would come back just replacing a wheel lug, it might go away temporarily though and it least that would placate the customer for a little while till eventually they just lived with the clicking noise and accepted it.

theamcguy
09-02-12, 04:46 PM
If the nosie is caused by aluminum to aluminum contact I still don't see why a thin rubber or hard plastic (like the kind on a milk carton) gasket would not work.

theamcguy
09-02-12, 04:48 PM
Does anyone have a picture of just the new lug nut showing the blue insert at the conical end as mentioned in the new TSB. Could you please post it.

flatrockguy
09-02-12, 05:57 PM
Here is a pic of the new lugnut.96953

theamcguy
09-02-12, 06:48 PM
Thank you for the picture.

Gary Veeeee
09-02-12, 07:46 PM
Tell you what, I would never get used to that clicking. And if that's a standard GM part that should be a stock item in any parts department? I was told it was special order and will be in next week. Dealer said or I should say service manager said they were limited on the V parts and that's why they have to order everything. I really hope the factory gets this fix right this i. I will not ignore that noise on mine it is severe. I wish I got the rotors since the new TSB says to run with the replaced rotors. I'd be much happier if that was the case instead of just a $2.16 part Times 10. However, I don't care now this car is only short-term .I will have fun with it for a little while anyways. I I love the fact that three point turns are now one.

neuronbob
09-02-12, 08:44 PM
Bleh. It sounds like this is just another temp solution. The answer for me has been to switch out wheels depending on the season. I have a winter and a summer set. I am now at just under 44 k miles and haven't had the clicking for over 30k miles.

larry arizona
09-02-12, 08:55 PM
hmmmmm interesting. I have never had the dreaded wheel click. I got the car at 3500 miles and swaped out the stock rims for stock rims that were redone in black chrome PVD. Had the rims off a couple times for installing springs and still no clicking. I do know that the black chrome PVD is also on the mating side of the rim and rotor. It is not raw aluminum like the factory rim. I think there is some merit to a coating/barrier/gasket that could solve the clicking. Similar to the backing plate or grease added to the back of brake pads to prevent squeaks.....

Pphilthy
09-03-12, 05:39 PM
Dropped my car off at dealer on Friday, appointment was made two weeks ago - when I called they told me I had to wait that long because they needed to order new rotors... I called them on Thursday after learning about the new lug nuts TSB and they told me they did not hear about that and to just come down and get the new rotors... I get there first thing in Friday morning and while checking in the car I tell the service writer about the new TSB and ask him to confirm they have all parts required before I leave, he tells me the fix is new rotors.

So the whole day goes by and no call from dealer, I called them an hour before closing and ask if my car was done, well guess what, they tell me what I already told them two times already, the new fix is lug nuts and they need to order them. So basically I drove down there for nothing and now have to return again in a week...

Cadillac service really leaves a lot to be desired... I don't care what the fix is, but I want a fix.

1997BlackETC
09-03-12, 05:54 PM
wow, sounds like something the dealer I deal with would do. I'd still try to get the rotors if I were you, dunno if they will do it, but the 2 piece are suppose to be a lot better than the others.

Pphilthy
09-03-12, 06:29 PM
wow, sounds like something the dealer I deal with would do. I'd still try to get the rotors if I were you, dunno if they will do it, but the 2 piece are suppose to be a lot better than the others.

I was thinking about pushing for the two piece rotors, but I figured I would give them a chance to fix it... Ideally I would opt for a slotted two piece rotor, but while under warranty I'll give them some time to fix the problem the way they choose...

larry arizona
09-03-12, 08:00 PM
other than cosmetics the "2 piece" rotors gain you nothing in performance and does not seem to fix the clicking. SO if the clicking isnt fixed by them, why complain, if the lugs works you should be happy.

1997BlackETC
09-03-12, 08:47 PM
I like the way they look better, that's why I'd push for them, plus have brand new rotors too.

team_car
09-03-12, 09:06 PM
Mine goes in tomorrow with ~1200 miles on it. I'll let you know what they say/do.

1997BlackETC
09-03-12, 09:07 PM
Hopefully they will have the new lug nuts in stock, otherwise it will be a wasted trip.

Cadillac Cust Svc
09-04-12, 12:30 PM
Dropped my car off at dealer on Friday, appointment was made two weeks ago - when I called they told me I had to wait that long because they needed to order new rotors... I called them on Thursday after learning about the new lug nuts TSB and they told me they did not hear about that and to just come down and get the new rotors... I get there first thing in Friday morning and while checking in the car I tell the service writer about the new TSB and ask him to confirm they have all parts required before I leave, he tells me the fix is new rotors.

So the whole day goes by and no call from dealer, I called them an hour before closing and ask if my car was done, well guess what, they tell me what I already told them two times already, the new fix is lug nuts and they need to order them. So basically I drove down there for nothing and now have to return again in a week...

Pphilthy, I'm very sorry to hear that you experienced this! I realize how frustrating that must have been; please don't hesitate to email me at Katie_Lucille@gmexpert.com if you would like me to contact your dealer at any point and follow up on your behalf!

I'm available to similarly assist anyone who is having concerns regarding their clicking wheel concerns, so feel free to email or send a direct message to me anytime and I can investigate for you!

Katie
Cadillac Customer Service

team_car
09-05-12, 08:11 AM
Mine goes in tomorrow with ~1200 miles on it. I'll let you know what they say/do.

They did the lugs. Fixed for now.

Gary Veeeee
09-05-12, 08:38 AM
They did the lugs. Fixed for now.

Cool, I'm glad to hear that worked . Mine is going in today to repair paint problems and clicking. I hope at least they give me a decent loaner ,it will be there a few days.

MaximumPwr
09-07-12, 01:02 PM
GM has stated the noise is caused by aluminum to aluminum contact. Then the fix (two piece rotors) still has aluminum to aluminum contact. First off the fix was expensive and did not cure the problem in 100% of the cases. Any fix via a TSB has to work 100% of the time or it is not a fix. We'll see if the lug nuts work 100% of the time. It may end up being that for a 100% fix some cars may need both. What I can't figure out is if the noise is caused by aluminum to aluminum contact why didn't they develop some kind of very tough thin gasket to go between the wheel and rotor.

I was thinking of the gasket idea myself. My thought was to buy just a large square gasket material and cut it to to fit inside of the rim where it meets with the rotor. Clean rim and rotor and install gasket on rim, mount rim and torque; see if that works. Seems like this would be the cheapest and maybe the best fix for GM. I could be wrong though. I'm no engineer.

Zhariak
09-07-12, 01:25 PM
other than cosmetics the "2 piece" rotors gain you nothing in performance and does not seem to fix the clicking. SO if the clicking isnt fixed by them, why complain, if the lugs works you should be happy.

Actually, that's not totally accurate...

2 piece deal with heat better...

carterb
09-08-12, 11:50 PM
I was thinking of the gasket idea myself. My thought was to buy just a large square gasket material and cut it to to fit inside of the rim where it meets with the rotor. Clean rim and rotor and install gasket on rim, mount rim and torque; see if that works. Seems like this would be the cheapest and maybe the best fix for GM. I could be wrong though. I'm no engineer. I agree with the gasket idea also. Someone (if not GM) ought to make up some of these gaskets to sell and we could replace them ourselves if needed. (Similar to the spare tire by Eurotek).

RGaret
09-09-12, 01:08 AM
Cool, I'm glad to hear that worked . Mine is going in today to repair paint problems and clicking. I hope at least they give me a decent loaner ,it will be there a few days.

Two questions about the new lug nuts:

1. Do the new lugs look like the old ones or will there be a mismatch between front and rear wheels?
2. What do they do if you have wheel locks?

Gary Veeeee
09-09-12, 01:14 AM
Two questions about the new lug nuts:

1. Do the new lugs look like the old ones or will there be a mismatch between front and rear wheels?
2. What do they do if you have wheel locks?

The lugs don't look any different and they are not mismatch. As far as wheel locks I'm not sure I don't have wheellocks , that's a good question though I'd be curious to know that myself.

ClarkkentCTSV
09-09-12, 03:08 AM
I just noticed my wheels clicking today. Now I just keep listening out for it and it's annoying. I'm going to contact
the dealer on Monday see if they have the lug nuts in stock.

Gary Veeeee
09-09-12, 07:29 AM
I just noticed my wheels clicking today. Now I just keep listening out for it and it's annoying. I'm going to contact
the dealer on Monday see if they have the lug nuts in stock.

Yeah definitely call first, they ordered mine last Friday and they didn't come in until Friday morning on the following. But, you might get lucky .My dealer doesn't carry many parts for the V, but I think these are just standard I was surprised I had to wait so long.

Ross L
09-09-12, 10:27 AM
Fixed mine years ago with a thin coat of permatex. No it's not a TSB, but it worked, easy to do and no trips to the dealer(no freebee's that dont work). No, my wheels havent come off driving down the road, yes I've even drag raced it. Odd(to me) that this is even still a issue years later. Good luck either way.

Pphilthy
09-09-12, 11:03 AM
Pphilthy, I'm very sorry to hear that you experienced this! I realize how frustrating that must have been; please don't hesitate to email me at Katie_Lucille@gmexpert.com if you would like me to contact your dealer at any point and follow up on your behalf!

I'm available to similarly assist anyone who is having concerns regarding their clicking wheel concerns, so feel free to email or send a direct message to me anytime and I can investigate for you!

Katie
Cadillac Customer Service

Thanks for the response Katie - I'll let you how things go... Latest update, I called yesterday to inquire if the lug nuts to support the TSB where in stock (it has been a week since my wasted visit to the dealer) and the service guy (Gary) said no and he would get back to me next week... I do find it odd that Cadillac would issue a TSB and not have the parts available to support it but it may also just be more incompetence from this dealership...

Pphilthy
09-09-12, 11:06 AM
other than cosmetics the "2 piece" rotors gain you nothing in performance and does not seem to fix the clicking. SO if the clicking isnt fixed by them, why complain, if the lugs works you should be happy.

Not sure if your post was directed to me, but as I've stated I don't care how Cadillac chooses to address the issue, I just want it resolved.

The two piece rotors also DO offer a performance advantage but I'm not looking to get into another debate/education session on this forum, the grief isn't worth it...

I'll be happy when my car doesn't sound like I have playing cards slapping against spoked wheels - most annoying sound.

4DR_ZR1
09-09-12, 11:39 AM
Fixed mine years ago with a thin coat of permatex. No it's not a TSB, but it worked, easy to do and no trips to the dealer(no freebee's that dont work). No, my wheels havent come off driving down the road, yes I've even drag raced it. Odd(to me) that this is even still a issue years later. Good luck either way.
But... that would require an actual 'hands on' experience and I might get dirty or break a fingernail.

I'd have to jack it up, remove the wheels, clean everything, and then smear some yucky permatex on it. Then put the wheels back on and properly re-torque them. What would happen if this actually fixed it? My replacement wheels, 2 piece rotors and lugnuts.... all those lost hours at the dealership? For nothing? And how do I know that your fix will not void my warranty?

No thanks. I would prefer scheduling and taking it to my dealer.. repeatedly. Then I can complain to them and anyone else who will listen.

Besides, the car is still under warranty. I paid $70K for it. Why should I have to do anything but drive it?

King335i
09-09-12, 08:13 PM
I just wanted to chime in here. I just got my car back after it having been at my local Caddy dealership due to a failing fuel pump control module, while it was in I asked them to address the clicking that had returned. As of the 28th or so of August a new TSB was released that dictates that new lug nuts fix the problem. Three days later my car is still not clicking, so the problem has been fixed in the short term, we will see if it rears its ugly head again. Hope this helps!

hulksdaddy
09-09-12, 09:01 PM
We know cleaning fixes it short term, so I'd say you need a bunch of miles on it to really see if the lugs are a fix.

kaoz
09-11-12, 04:09 PM
Anyone know if we can still get the two piece rotors and lug nuts? I'm going to push hard for them.

Trapspeed
09-11-12, 04:33 PM
Highly unlikely but give it a shot. Once the TSB has been updated previous versions usually don't fly.

team_car
09-11-12, 04:37 PM
When my wife dropped the car in last week he said he was goin gto do the rotors. Then called and said the TSB had changed and he was doing the lug nuts. She didn't ask for rotors but got the impression it wouldn't have been an option.

ClarkkentCTSV
09-11-12, 07:17 PM
Yeah definitely call first, they ordered mine last Friday and they didn't come in until Friday morning on the following. But, you might get lucky .My dealer doesn't carry many parts for the V, but I think these are just standard I was surprised I had to wait so long.

My dealer confirmed they will have the lug nuts by tomorrow, so I will take it in Thursday. I will let you
guys know if it resolves the problem.

mother
09-17-12, 03:07 PM
Well my dealer gave be blue nuts :rolleyes: this morning, lets see how long this lasts!

(Work order actually said 'install blue nuts per bulletin')

VMoose
09-17-12, 08:31 PM
Is it worth the hassle of having the dealership do the lug nut fix? Has anyone purchased the lug nuts themselves and performed the clean and install?

The only Cadillac dealer I trust right now is about 1.5 hours away and they won't order the lug nuts ahead of time because they want a tech to confirm the noise. That would be two trips to the dealer in a week.

$ tank of gas > $ ordering 10 lug nuts

Guess I could take a chance on my local Chevy / Caddy dealer, although they don't sell or service Vs often.

ClarkkentCTSV
09-17-12, 09:20 PM
I just got the lug nuts replaced on the V. The clicking sound is gone. The service manager which also
happens to be my neighbor told me if the new lug nuts don't work he knows exactly how to fix it. He said
he is using my car as the guinie pig and if the nuts don't work he will apply a special coat of anti-seize or
permatex as mentioned previously in this thread. He told me he has done it to many other CTS-V's and it
has completely eliminated the problem. So for everyone who does not want to go to the dealer for nuts
that may or may not fix the clicking, the solution is simple clean and apply a light coat of anti-seize to the
back of the wheel which makes contact contact with the brake hub. Problem solved and it came straight
from the horses mouth.

jokerface
09-18-12, 12:54 AM
Serviced the car for clicking noise @ 4k miles. Dealer fixed N said all set, just brake dust / gunk build up. @ 6k today got new lug nuts replaced do to clicking. This better be the end of it : / 

MaximumPwr
10-01-12, 02:40 PM
Instead of going to the dealer, I just ordered the new blue cone lug nuts from gmpartshouse.com. I installed them on the front wheels this weekend. I got lazy and didn't remove the wheel to clean it before installing. To my amazement it worked, the clicking stopped, all quiet again. I still don't know why the new blue lugs stopped the clicking because they don't look much different then the OEM's. They do stick out just a little bit more than the OEM lugs though. If it starts again I'll remove the wheels and clean it like GM suggests. But I hope this does the trick.

theamcguy
10-01-12, 03:51 PM
Instead of going to the dealer, I just ordered the new blue cone lug nuts from gmpartshouse.com. I installed them on the front wheels this weekend. I got lazy and didn't remove the wheel to clean it before installing. To my amazement it worked, the clicking stopped, all quiet again. I still don't know why the new blue lugs stopped the clicking because they don't look much different then the OEM's. They do stick out just a little bit more than the OEM lugs though. If it starts again I'll remove the wheels and clean it like GM suggests. But I hope this does the trick.

I wonder if the old nuts were bottoming out inside on the stud preventing the nut from fully seating the wheel tight against the hub.

MaximumPwr
10-01-12, 05:17 PM
That is an interesting thought AMCGUY. If true I wonder if I should also order and change out the rear lugs nuts to the blue ones. Those that have had the dealer perform lug nut TSB, are they changing out just the fronts, or the rears also?

baabootoo
10-02-12, 12:06 AM
I wonder if the old nuts were bottoming out inside on the stud preventing the nut from fully seating the wheel tight against the hub.
I tried that, and mine still ad about 1/4" inside the hole. Besides, the stud would just push a dimple in the end of that metal covering. I wanted to see how big a spacer I could use.

kaoz
10-03-12, 02:04 PM
Well good news got them to put on the new rotors for me free of charge! I had to wait a week for the lug nuts now I'm sitting in the dealer waiting for the lugs to be swapped! Hopefully this is the last time i have to drive out here.

Xaqtly
10-03-12, 02:12 PM
An update on mine - Mine had clicking wheels when I got it, the dealer fixed it by cleaning the rotors and mounting surfaces, and that was 6 or 7 months ago - problem has not returned. For whatever that's worth.

kaoz
10-25-12, 01:20 PM
My clicking was never fixed. Waited a week and a half for the damn lug nuts. They called me in to swap em... Took them about 15 minutes.. They came out to send me on my way.. After I checked the TSB myself I noticed they had to clean the wheels in which they INFACT did NOT do they just swapped the lug nuts and torqued them down to normal specs not the revised torque specs..

Not to mention now my rear view camera is all glitchy, it does not keep the camera on and has a black screen with white lines moving through it. This started occurring since I left the dealership that day.. I believe it has something to down on the driver side carpet they had to replace since clips where broken by the drivers pedal..

I have a long case with Cadillac customer service and I am working directly with the regional manager in my area.

I will update you guys on the outcome..

For how much I am paying for this car, there is no excuse on Cadillac end on why I am having these issues. They of course agreed..

baabootoo
10-25-12, 02:47 PM
If anyone lives near Racine, Wisconsin, I'd love to inspect a "clicker" myself.

VMoose
10-30-12, 08:22 AM
They cleaned my front wheels only and installed all 20 lug nuts. They did not clean the rear wheels.

No more clicking for me so far.

CTexaS-V
11-01-12, 11:41 PM
Not to mention now my rear view camera is all glitchy, it does not keep the camera on and has a black screen with white lines moving through it. This started occurring since I left the dealership that day.. I believe it has something to down on the driver side carpet they had to replace since clips where broken by the drivers pedal..



Kaoz, I have been having the glitchy rear view camera issue too, but have been unable to reproduce it when I have it at the dealer. Have you found any cause/fix for this? It seems to go away whenever I restart the car.

Not trying to hijack the thread, just this is the first time someone else has mentioned this same problem.

kaoz
12-04-12, 04:11 PM
Kaoz, I have been having the glitchy rear view camera issue too, but have been unable to reproduce it when I have it at the dealer. Have you found any cause/fix for this? It seems to go away whenever I restart the car.

Not trying to hijack the thread, just this is the first time someone else has mentioned this same problem.

CTexaS-V,

I had them replace the entire screen and back camera.. Still does it.. No fix yet. I did notice however it may be due to cooler weather? I also noticed it is not just prone to the rear view camera when I start the car and the screen is already up it does it sometimes.. Good to know I am not the only one with this issue.

WHEEL CLICKING UPDATE.

I had the rotors done and new lug nuts put on after they clean them and torque them to the new specs. I am getting the clicking again more noticeably in reverse.

Anyone else had there clicking come back?

Trapspeed
12-04-12, 04:45 PM
Since the new rotors, no. Quiet as a church mouse.

kaoz
12-04-12, 05:01 PM
Since the new rotors, no. Quiet as a church mouse.

Have you attempted to reverse with wheel turned all the way each way? My 2012 has had everything done to date and still clicks.

Trapspeed
12-04-12, 05:08 PM
No. Haven't had the opportunity but I've been close to full lock.

mkiiina
12-04-12, 05:31 PM
Just had the new lugs installed on my '11 and so far no complained! My car no longer sounds like a bike with cards in its spokes.

carterb
12-04-12, 07:42 PM
Just got the TSB done today (at 10k miles) with the new front wheel lugs, and so far no clicking ...

akh
12-04-12, 08:51 PM
Do the new wheels nuts look different then the original ones the car came with ?? I thought I read something about a new style rim if the clicking was not resolved with cleaning and new nuts ???

Trapspeed
12-04-12, 11:01 PM
New wheels were on a previous iteration of the TSB that sadly I missed out on. That evolved into new rotors and then the lugs.

kaoz
12-05-12, 03:35 PM
Just got the TSB done today (at 10k miles) with the new front wheel lugs, and so far no clicking ...

It will come back. Try reversing in and locking the wheel out see if you hear it.

----------


New wheels were on a previous iteration of the TSB that sadly I missed out on. That evolved into new rotors and then the lugs.

I was able to get them to do the rotors for me as a courtesy.

Clicking is back I have had all the TSB done still nothing. I have gotten pretty far internally with GM and they are talking now to the techs responsible directly.

I remember one of the TSB showing they were working on a permanent solution by the end of this year still haven't seen anything..

I have had the screen issue also going on with white lines though it. See this thread if you have it happening to you. http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/2009-cadillac-cts-v-general-discussion/276010-back-up-camera-issue.html#post3158250

mrk4543
12-05-12, 04:18 PM
Some of these things kinda make you wonder what the engineers are doing.....I had the dreaded wheel clicking problem....dealer did the cleaning routine (per the TSB)...clicking came back and I took the dealer a copy of the TSB showing rotor replacement. They replaced the rotors....took them a copy of the lug nut replacement TSB....they replaced the lug nuts and torqued to the new spec. For some reason, the new rotors have warped...another set of new rotors at 24,000 miles. But, they won't replace the pads under warranty. I am working on that issue with Cadillac Customer Service as we speak. The other issue has been the differential...replace once and then replaced again 6 months later. Kinda makes me wonder what will happen next....life goes on!

Marty

kaoz
12-05-12, 06:23 PM
I'm sick of going to my dealership.. And the best compensation they could offer me was to pay half my car payment for the month.. She has escalated it though..

I will keep you posted she's supposed to be in contact with me tomorrow.

kaoz
03-11-13, 10:16 AM
Problems went away for about a few weeks been living with the awful clicking... Due for my first service going to bring it up yet again..

Come on Cadillac. Been to my dealer 5 times had a loaner for over 1 week on 4 occasions..

Somethings gotta give..

mkiiina
03-11-13, 05:15 PM
I had my lugs swapped a few months ago and still golden (knock on wood)!

kaoz
03-14-13, 04:33 PM
Any updates to the TSBs?

HUGN*RDS
03-14-13, 05:17 PM
I just read about this for the first time. I don't have any clicking in my wheels, that I have heard yet, but I am also in New England so I roll with the windows up for the winter months. Maybe I'll have to check for this with them down but I'm pretty sure I would have heard it already. My rotors are one piece and I have a Sedan and none of the brake TSB's have been done to my car.

----------


Any updates to the TSBs?
I would love to be provided with another update.
First: Cleaning method= didn't work
Second: Replace front brake rotors entirely = didn't work but made us happy
Third: Replace lug nuts and also clean = Definitely not a long-term fix for most people from what I have read, clicking still exists.
Fourth: ?? Long-term fix would be to sell our Cadillacs, let's hope GM get's to it before I do.

kaoz
03-14-13, 05:20 PM
What year do you have?


I just read about this for the first time. I don't have any clicking in my wheels, that I have heard yet, but I am also in New England so I roll with the windows up for the winter months. Maybe I'll have to check for this with them down but I'm pretty sure I would have heard it already. My rotors are one piece and I have a Sedan and none of the brake TSB's have been done to my car.

----------


I would love to be provided with another update.
First: Cleaning method= didn't work
Second: Replace front brake rotors entirely = didn't work but made us happy
Third: Replace lug nuts and also clean = Definitely not a long-term fix for most people from what I have read, clicking still exists.
Fourth: ?? Long-term fix would be to sell our Cadillacs, let's hope GM get's to it before I do.

HUGN*RDS
03-14-13, 06:44 PM
What year do you have?
Mine is an 09. Does the cliicking happen in all the wheels?

kaoz
03-14-13, 06:58 PM
Just the front.

Pphilthy
04-06-13, 10:56 AM
Clicking is back! Had the TSB for the lug nuts done and it resolved the clicking noise for 3k miles but now it's back and louder (and annoying) than ever... I love this car, but this clicking is just too annoying for me... Going to give caddy one last try and then I'll be ready to part with the clickmobile...

nynd
04-06-13, 11:36 AM
Clicking is back! Had the TSB for the lug nuts done and it resolved the clicking noise for 3k miles but now it's back and louder (and annoying) than ever... I love this car, but this clicking is just too annoying for me... Going to give caddy one last try and then I'll be ready to part with the clickmobile...

If the clicking is "louder" now after the lug change, then I guess it clearly shows that the issue is with the lugs. Maybe they need to try a different material or go back to the 150 lb'ft torque?

hulksdaddy
04-06-13, 12:43 PM
I think the clicking is a result of weak abs....

Jinx
04-06-13, 01:04 PM
More sit-ups then?

Mongopush
04-06-13, 01:05 PM
I think the clicking is a result of weak abs.... I agree a lot of these cars issues is from weak abs. Maybe a GM Ab-roller is in order .

Club Malibu
04-06-13, 01:26 PM
Someone on this forum tried white lithium grease between wheel and rotor and it worked for him. With his technique, I tried it on my car and it worked for me. I owe him.

Give it a try.

ctsvdallas
04-13-13, 01:12 PM
Can't thank you guys enough for posting on this topic. Just picked up used V and have that same clicking sound. Not sure why dealer didn't fix prior to delivery.

----------

Can't thank you guys enough for posting on this topic. Just picked up used V and have that same clicking sound. Not sure why dealer didn't fix prior to delivery.

RaVeNous
04-13-13, 03:38 PM
I agree a lot of these cars issues is from weak abs. Maybe a GM Ab-roller is in order .

More than likely intensified by the swollen ankles of overweight diabetic old men.

Jinx
04-13-13, 04:36 PM
Buying a Cadillac causes weight gain and diabetes?

Is there a TSB?

RaVeNous
04-13-13, 04:46 PM
Buying a Cadillac causes weight gain and diabetes?

Is there a TSB?

hahahahah I have no response to that.

Trapspeed
04-13-13, 06:36 PM
Buying a Cadillac causes weight gain and diabetes?

Is there a TSB?

No. That got upgraded to recall.

VMoose
04-14-13, 03:35 PM
The lug nut TSB fixed it for me.

venomns
04-17-13, 09:36 PM
Did the lug nut a while back. Clicking even worse after a couple of months and they are gonna work on the rocking seat once again! One day I would love these to be fixed!! Haha

surgin
06-20-13, 09:16 PM
i have an 09 daily driver with aftermarket wheels and lugs. just started getting the wheel click. will try the cleaning thing. wish me luck

Trapspeed
06-20-13, 09:20 PM
i have an 09 daily driver with aftermarket wheels and lugs. just started getting the wheel click. will try the cleaning thing. wish me luck

Even with aftermarket wheels, huh? That's the first I've heard that. Oh boy. Here I thought aftermarkets fixed that.