: Auto Trans Appreciation Thread...



FLTRI
12-15-11, 02:49 PM
While having a 6-speed stick available in a Cadillac is an admittedly cool move by GM, I'm really diggin' my auto...

Yes, the auto weighs more, gets worse gas mileage and I had to pay twice the gas guzzler tax. Sure, it's a little slower at the top end, but you can't even run SSCC or any of the other open road races at 191 MPH, without seriously modifying the car to meet their safety specs. But, the auto is quicker 0-60, faster through the 1/4 mile, and they used an auto trans car to set the Nürburgring record.

I like having the choice of the three modes the auto offers too. And paddle shifters, are damn near as cool as that third pedal...

Edit: And we get remote start, too ;)

6-Speeders, flame away. What say you, Auto Guys???

keithsm2
12-15-11, 02:55 PM
I think this really is the drivers choice....if you bought the car to drag race....then yes...auto seems to have been proven faster.......
If you enjoy the experience the Manual brings ( as do I)... ....its well worth it......just pushing buttons to change gears doesnt do it for me....
Ive tried it in a rental and just dont get the same experience.....

Wouldnt trade my manual for an auto !

Blakester
12-15-11, 03:35 PM
Love my auto. Paddles are cool for downshifts. Had to give up stds. 20 yrs. ago, kept bumping rev. Limiter due to being hearing impairment.

SoCalCTSV
12-15-11, 04:07 PM
My manual is therapy. I drive 60 miles of lousy LA traffic and manual is the only way I don't go nuts. Even my wife drives a manual on her Mini.

GM-4-LIFE
12-15-11, 05:19 PM
I enjoy my auto everyday when I battle L.A. traffic. I like it even though it isn't as fast as the auto mag editors would like. It suits 99% of the buying public just fine.

garfin
12-15-11, 05:27 PM
There are definitely a lot of good things and features to enjoy in the automatic and I, for one, am very happy that GM chose to introduce the auto on the V2. Looks to be a smart decision, given the proliferation of autos as opposed to the number of manuals, which makes it a whole lot easier to make a business case for continued V production in the future, on whatever platform is chosen.

Everybody has their own reasons and justification for opting to get the auto... or the manual... and that's what makes the world go 'round. Again, I'm just glad we have the choice.

The question I'd ask, is if the car were only available in a manual, as the V1 was, how many people with automatics still would have bought a V2? Conversely, how many people here with a manual car would have gone for the V2 if it was only available (as some high end sport sedans are) with an auto, albeit a more sophisticated unit than the 6L90E?

Just wonderin'...

Best regards,

Elie

Houdini
12-15-11, 06:06 PM
I would have bought the v2 if it were only auto but my clear preference is the manual. So much more fun to drive IMO. I certainly respect the auto for quickness though.

Gary Wells
12-15-11, 06:53 PM
I was actually looking for a new C6Z06 when I was told that the Caddy with the big motor came with an auto. For me, it was a no-brainer. I not only would not trade my auto for a manual, I probably would not have bought the Caddy if it was a manual only. I probably would have stuck with a C6ZO6.

lowerd96
12-15-11, 07:29 PM
I do appreciate the manual being offered, and had our V Sedan been solely mine I would have opted for the stick. But being it's my wife's daily driver, and the fact that she hates manuals, she wasn't going for it, so we weren't getting one. Auto is a small sacrifice for having a car like the V, one I am willing to deal with!

DiamondWhtV
12-15-11, 07:34 PM
Wife can't drive a stick...and wife demanded to have some input in the purchase decision otherwise there would have been h$$$ to pay.

Thought about the "Better to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission" idea...but chickened out. Went with the auto and no complaints from wife (but secretively...miss the manual)

Squirlz
12-15-11, 08:15 PM
It would not have been as much as a "must-have" if it was only automatic. My wife insisted I get the manual! She loves driving it too.

Gary Wells
12-15-11, 08:47 PM
The "Better to ask for permission than beg for forgiveness" theory in marriage is of questionable value if you want to continue living and getting laid.

smackdownCTSV
12-15-11, 09:12 PM
Auto +1! Faster at the track and keeps you sane in traffic.

M5eater
12-15-11, 09:23 PM
As much as I liked rowing gears in the B5, the 6L90E in the V2 just makes more sense, and the GM auto is about as good as a torque converter automatic can be really. Sticks are becoming rather antiquated with the advent of dual clutch transmissions, and their fuel economy advantages are now dissapearing too. Most new cars that still offer manuals do so with a fuel economy hit *and* a straight line acceleration hit. Aside from this, the auto certinally works better in the 1/4, in autocross you almost are always in 2nd gear anyway, and road courses are easier to handle when you can keep both hands on the wheel mid turn and flick the paddle shifter to downshift and catch the apex. Only the most die-hard track enthusiasts can really wring out serious advantages in a stick over an auto imo.

Plus.. most CTS-V's are automatics (90%+ of production iirc?) and the ZL1's are predicted to be mostly Automatics, so that's more aftermarket for us!

srfx69
12-15-11, 10:04 PM
what 3 modes does the auto have i thought just performance which i wish was more aggressive on shifts. i have no regrets with the auto.

M5eater
12-15-11, 10:09 PM
what 3 modes does the auto have i thought just performance which i wish was more aggressive on shifts. i have no regrets with the auto.
Drive, sport, Manual.

smackdownCTSV
12-15-11, 10:15 PM
what 3 modes does the auto have i thought just performance which i wish was more aggressive on shifts. i have no regrets with the auto.

Handheld tuner. /done!

M5eater
12-15-11, 10:20 PM
Handheld tuner. /done!
The best and worst part of the 6L80/90E. Tuner's seem to be able to wake them up on stock-ish power, but they can't seem to get them right without a lot of fondiling when they're built for serious power. Which is a little depressing since the platform is 6 years old now and both are able to handle a decent amount of power stock alone. I get the feeling though that the 4L80E will remain hot-rodder's favorite for a while longer.

smackdownCTSV
12-15-11, 10:28 PM
I went from a 12.02 @ 118.8 7.82 @ 93.9 1.83 60' with just LS7 TB and Airaid CAI to 11.75 @ 120.39 7.64 @ 94.7 1.84 60' with LS7 TB, Airaid CAI, and 91 Performance Tune on Firm Shift. So I gained 1.5 mph went 3 tenths faster in the quarter and 2 tenths in the 1/8th. YTMV.

Fireverm
12-15-11, 10:53 PM
I would not have even considered the V if it had not had a manual option. Everything I own is manual shift and I'd have it no other way and even my wife is on board with this.

I bought this car because I needed a sedan, but still wanted a great driving experience. For me, an auto or DCT cannot provide that. The first thing we both do when we get in the V is turn on competition mode and switch to sport suspension mode.

(Flame time) Everytime I see a video with an auto V, a little part of me dies inside. And I'm sure if you auto guys wait long enough, we'll have cars that will steer for you too :)

Speedtrapped
12-15-11, 11:38 PM
I ended up with an auto out of impatience, I wanted a loaded blck/blck cts-v wagon, brand new, with manual....my choice after looking back in may was a couple of used or order and wait....not my nature go figure. Well after ECS tuned and modded my Vagon, they did a phenomenal job on my auto. I always drive sport. I would drive paddle more, as soon as the large paddles are ready I will.

Fireverm
12-15-11, 11:58 PM
I ended up with an auto out of impatience, I wanted a loaded blck/blck cts-v wagon, brand new, with manual....my choice after looking back in may was a couple of used or order and wait....not my nature go figure. Well after ECS tuned and modded my Vagon, they did a phenomenal job on my auto. I always drive sport. I would drive paddle more, as soon as the large paddles are ready I will.

I got mine in May as well and had to wait like 10 days as it was shipped in from out of state. I definitely didn't want to wait 4+ months for an order on a 2012. At the time, there were only 2 stick sedans in a 1000 mile radius of Vegas...one BDE and one Thunder Gray. My wife really liked the BDE so I had to settle for a Manager's demo that had some miles on it and Ultraview, which I did not want.

Still well worth it all to have the stick.

smackdownCTSV
12-16-11, 01:24 PM
(Flame time) Everytime I see a video with an auto V, a little part of me dies inside. And I'm sure if you auto guys wait long enough, we'll have cars that will steer for you too :)

There are cars now that can actually parallel park for you.
PS. Don't get all butthurt that you have to die a little inside when you have to shift in traffic and be slower than an auto.

M5eater
12-16-11, 02:25 PM
There are cars now that can actually parallel park for you.
PS. Don't get all butthurt that you have to die a little inside when you have to shift in traffic and be slower than an auto.

Google's street view cars drive themselves. I think they've racked up a few hundred miles or so by now without human intervention.

concorso
12-16-11, 02:40 PM
(Flame time) Everytime I see a video with an auto V, a little part of me dies inside. And I'm sure if you auto guys wait long enough, we'll have cars that will steer for you too :)Keep dyin'! Without auto, people like myself couldnt buy a V and drive it very much. My knee can only handle so much clutch work before I have to give up...motocross accidents have a way of screwing your life.
On top of that, Id take a 458 'auto' over a manual V any day of the week...and 3 times on wknds. I love a manual, but just because something is auto, doesnt mean you cant have an amazing driving experience.

----------


Google's street view cars drive themselves. I think they've racked up a few hundred miles or so by now without human intervention.The BMW trainer is is a self driving car, too, and I cant wait to go for a ride in something similar.

I want to see the self-driving technology adopted to a F1 car, and then pay to go for track rides in it.

thebigjimsho
12-16-11, 02:49 PM
Glad to see you 99%ers are pleased with yourselves. Us 1%ers still know where it's at...

M5eater
12-16-11, 03:34 PM
Glad to see you 99%ers are pleased with yourselves. Us 1%ers still know where it's at...
There's one advantage to beeing the 99%; there's more of us to do butt kicking ;)

tedcmiller
12-16-11, 03:51 PM
I had two V1s (2004 and 2005) for four years. Before that I had a 1966 GTO 4-speed, and, among other straight-gear trasmissions, a 1960 Chevy Impala 4-speed, and I was tired of shifting. The primary reason I went to my 2009 CTS-V V2 was the availability of an automatic. Three cheers for the automatic CTS-V.

smackdownCTSV
12-16-11, 05:07 PM
And to think, if the GT500 came available with an Auto, they'd have a lot more sales. Just look at how many petitioned Chevy, and there you have it, an auto will be available in the ZL1.

buddyg
12-16-11, 05:32 PM
Simple for me I have a 6 speed in my 911. Sometimes it is nice to just get in and drive so went with the auto in the Caddy. Both have their merits, as someone else said it is great that we get the choice!

Speedtrapped
12-16-11, 07:35 PM
whats ironic is many sports cars, at least higher end are sequential automated manuals....i have driven ferrari, lambo with these systems_insane, u can not match thier performance. the exotics want unbeatable 0-60's to brag about.....When V comes with it, I'm buying. Matter of fact I heard Subaru WRX is coming out in 12'. Some day the technology will be cheap enough.

M5eater
12-16-11, 07:42 PM
whats ironic is many sports cars, at least higher end are sequential automated manuals....i have driven ferrari, lambo with these systems_insane, u can not match thier performance. the exotics want unbeatable 0-60's to brag about.....When V comes with it, I'm buying. Matter of fact I heard Subaru WRX is coming out in 12'. Some day the technology will be cheap enough.
A hyundai veloster has a DCT... if the next CTSV is using a torque converter auto, I'm out. The 6L90E is acceptable in terms of shift time, but only when it's doing it's own thing like a regular auto should. I don't think I've seen a single review that hasen't said the manual selection is awful and you should just leave it in sport mode , which is really something this car can take adavantage of. That's really the only genuine complaint I can think of about the car; it's a very very good TC auto, but when you really want to play around it sort of dissapoints.

Speedtrapped
12-16-11, 08:27 PM
I drool for a V with sequential, they really are fantastic, bam, bam, bam with the power of our V's alone would make the wheels spin, they shift in milliseconds. Oh pleaaasssseeee GM.

JimmyH
12-16-11, 08:57 PM
A hyundai veloster has a DCT... if the next CTSV is using a torque converter auto, I'm out. The 6L90E is acceptable in terms of shift time, but only when it's doing it's own thing like a regular auto should. I don't think I've seen a single review that hasen't said the manual selection is awful and you should just leave it in sport mode , which is really something this car can take adavantage of. That's really the only genuine complaint I can think of about the car; it's a very very good TC auto, but when you really want to play around it sort of dissapoints.

a direct-shift trans will add too much cost. and they aren't reliable yet. Look at the GTR and the GTI. two direct shift units at opposite ends of the power and cost spectrums, and they have both been a PR nightmare. GM is smart to hold off on them until they mature. They need to keep highly successful hardware like the LSA and LS9 on the front burner.

----------

The fact that the V1 was manual only made it somewhat exclusive. Which was one of the things I found so endearing about it. When the V2 was confirmed to have an auto, I was disappointed. I had no illusions that it wouldn't be, and I understand and accept that it must. That doesn't mean I have to like it.

thebigjimsho
12-16-11, 11:07 PM
I'm fine with choice. Just don't pull a Gen III SHO and make it auto-only...

M5eater
12-17-11, 10:39 AM
a direct-shift trans will add too much cost. and they aren't reliable yet. Look at the GTR and the GTI. two direct shift units at opposite ends of the power and cost spectrums, and they have both been a PR nightmare. GM is smart to hold off on them until they mature. They need to keep highly successful hardware like the LSA and LS9 on the front burner.

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The fact that the V1 was manual only made it somewhat exclusive. Which was one of the things I found so endearing about it. When the V2 was confirmed to have an auto, I was disappointed. I had no illusions that it wouldn't be, and I understand and accept that it must. That doesn't mean I have to like it.

You may be right, and speaking as an enthusiast I'd rather take the 6L90E which can be built to hold power versus a DCT which can't. However, the disadvantages in shift quality are aparrent even within it's own generation, and the E63 AMG has proven you don't necessarly need a DCT to get 100ms shift times from an otherwise normal automatic. You're also not in keep with Cadillac's new technology image when you're using TC autos in your flagship performance sedan in a world of DCT's in $12K throw-away cars.
Let me put it this way too. The C7 *will* have a DCT, and the ZL1 is expected to mostly sell in 6L90E form, iirc Most C6's that sell today are 6L80E's or a good portion of them are. Clearly the vast majority of V2's are automatics for a reason, and just as Clearly, the last decade of automatics and DCT's that out-perform manuals in nearly every way give people even more reason to go slushbox. I expect GM to satisify this for the next CTS-V, mostly because if they don't, I don't think it'll be able to top it's competition like it did previously.

The ATS-V imo, should be GM's last V with an automatic OTS TC transmission which was not specificly designed for performance use.

frozenh2o
12-17-11, 11:14 AM
On those days when it's traction control off, yaw control off, audio off, and nav off, an automatic just doesn't cut it. How many of those days do you have left in you?

Wannago
12-17-11, 12:18 PM
I think this sums up my opinion:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNZ2NBmVkBs&feature=youtu.be

JimmyH
12-17-11, 06:22 PM
I think the reason low end cars like the gti and focus can have dct/dsg is because they have very little torque. They have small, marginal mechatronics that can barely handle the torque of a small 4 cylinder.

The other thing is those trans do not like heat. I am not sure if gtr and r8 trans are like that. I doubt they spend much time in traffic on 90+ days. That's one environment that is gonna kill these trans.

I am sure they will work these problems out eventually. I will wait until they do.

neuronbob
12-17-11, 10:11 PM
I think this sums up my opinion:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNZ2NBmVkBs&feature=youtu.be

ROFLMAO! Still funny as hell all these years later.

Club Malibu
12-18-11, 09:53 PM
And I'm sure if you auto guys wait long enough, we'll have cars that will steer for you too :)

Here! Here!!!

bbang
12-19-11, 11:49 PM
Auto was the way for me...bad knees and back. It's a great car either way. At least the option was there. Good decision on Cadillacs part.

SRTVIPER03
12-20-11, 03:05 PM
When I bought my VWagon in May I wanted a BD with the 6M but couldn't locate one it the US....anywhere. I "settled" for the auto and am very happy I did. As a daily driver in LA traffic I didn't realize how much work the manual was every day. When I want to shift I can drive my Viper or Challenger each with a manual. My M6 has the SMG (sequential) so that is a compromise. As a dd though, the auto in the V is the right choice for me. I wish the shifts were quicker but Im still happy with it.

M5eater
12-20-11, 03:34 PM
When I bought my VWagon in May I wanted a BD with the 6M but couldn't locate one it the US....anywhere. I "settled" for the auto and am very happy I did. As a daily driver in LA traffic I didn't realize how much work the manual was every day. When I want to shift I can drive my Viper or Challenger each with a manual. My M6 has the SMG (sequential) so that is a compromise. As a dd though, the auto in the V is the right choice for me. I wish the shifts were quicker but Im still happy with it.

Same for me. I settled for the 90E, I knew what I was in for though before hand since I had experienced the 6L80E in the G8, but I was happy with the compromise before so it was easier to make it again.

BeagleBrains
12-23-11, 07:09 PM
I bought a C6 with Z51 package which includes Transmission and Differential coolers. With the V adapting essentially a Corvette drive train, it is appalling that this is not available, neigh, even standard with a CTS V.
We chose the Manual V2 Coupe Shift setup; I like having immediate control of shift points.
Having experienced a couple of vehicles with Paddle Shift, I was swayed to buy the Automatic in my Corvette. It works well in SPORT MODE so that I readily anticipate shift points. But, having driven the C6 for a couple of years, I sorely miss "rowing my own".
Two parameters dictate my purchase choices: horsepower and manual transmission. Further more, seat accommodations must support my Tall 6'3" frame. The CTS V has influenced me to expect high standard trim choices with a technologically advanced electronics package. Since Cadillac touts its' vehicles as high end fare, make it so!

Ste_V_e
12-24-11, 01:31 AM
It's nice to just cruise on the highway and when you want just slam the pedal and drop it from 6th to 3rd and just go. don't have to anticipate shift points. In a corvette I'd want a manual, In a luxury sports car the automatic is just so damn smooth and comfortable, especially with 556hp.

neuronbob
12-24-11, 07:07 AM
When I want to shift I can drive my Viper or Challenger each with a manual. My M6 has the SMG (sequential) so that is a compromise. As a dd though, the auto in the V is the right choice for me. I wish the shifts were quicker but Im still happy with it.

a) Agree. I have my S2000 for when I want to shift (and with God's own buttery sweet shifter and 9k rpm on tap it is FUN to shift). I don't miss shifting in the V that much as a result.

b) A tune fixes the sluggish shifts. Hopefully Cadillac fixes this officially with the V3. The shifts are not THAT sluggish, though, compared to what I've driven before (e.g. non-performance luxury sedans).