: Car not starting



cadillaceldo93
09-30-11, 11:42 AM
i have a 1993 cadillac eldorado 4.9. i was driving down the road the other day and my car just stopped running. all my lights were still on so i know its not because of the battery. but i checked the battery anyways and it tested good. all signs pointed to the fuel pump. so i changed the fuel pump yesterday and my car still wont start. it turns over sounds like its about to start but never does. ive changed the spark plugs and wires, egr valve, all my air hoses around the TB.
im at work right now so im in a hurry with this message. let me know if ive left something out or if you need more information. ive ran the trouble codes and nothing has came up.

cadillaceldo93
09-30-11, 11:47 AM
the only thing ive fixed since this problem happened is the fuel pump. all the other things i changed i have done with in the last year. hope that clears up my message

dennis93coupe
09-30-11, 01:17 PM
I assume you changed the fuel filter when you changed the pump. Did you throw a gauge on it after the pump change to see what you have for pressure on the fuel rail? If everything checks out there, check for spark. It could be electrical problem.

carnut
10-02-11, 05:38 PM
If I recall this car had issues with the crank and cam position sensors. Early designs were prone to failure. the parts you've replaced would have paid for a proper diagnosis

Sevillian273
10-02-11, 06:06 PM
Ignition module. It's under the distributor cap.

No crank sensor on the 4.9, and it will start and run with a bad cam sensor.

Spray some starting fluid in the throttle body and try to start. If it does not fire, it's a spark issue.

cadillaceldo93
10-05-11, 12:54 PM
ive replace the ignition control module before. its not having the signs of that going bad. i believe. my problem might be my distrubtor its self. i took the spark wire off the distributor cap and tried to start it and didnt see any kind of spark going from the distributor to the wire. ive tried putting gas or carb fluid in the throttle body and it still wont start.

Sevillian273
10-05-11, 04:03 PM
my car just stopped running.


its not having the signs of that going bad.

^^That IS a sign of a bad ignition module! I had an aftermarket piece from autozone and it lasted less than a year. Also check if you have 12v at the B+ terminal on the coil while the ignition is on. Be aware that if the module is bad, the computer wont fire the injectors - this could mislead you into thinking it's a fuel problem when it's likely a no-spark problem.

ehall
10-06-11, 09:44 AM
the engine just turning off while driving is the exact symptom of a failing ignition module

they get REALLY hot and will burn themselves out, so you need to be very liberal with the thermal compound during installation

cadillaceldo93
10-07-11, 11:51 AM
yeah i remember it going out in 2007 and it would get hot and the car wouldnt start. and it got progessivly worse but would start as soon as the chip cooled off. and it never just died while i was driving just when i turned it off and tried starting it again would the problem occur. this symtom happened last winter so i changed the part thinking that it was the control module but it wasnt. it was the spark plugs and wires. but there is a possibility that i didnt put enough of that "stuff" down so the chip may have burnt up again. the "stuff" im talking about is the gooey stuff that you put on the chip. i remember being in a hurry changing it. the only reason i didnt think of the control module being the problem is because it died while i was driving. im going to go home when i get off work and look at the chip. is there anyway just by looking to see if the module is bad? like burnt looking?

ehall
10-07-11, 03:19 PM
smell it maybe, I don't know if there's any simple tests

cadillaceldo93
10-08-11, 09:13 AM
i changed the module out lastnight. its still not starting

ehall
10-08-11, 09:34 AM
coil maybe... check for ground continuity on the coil body and the block, then check for voltages

cadillaceldo93
10-12-11, 08:46 AM
ok. and ive been talking to a mechanic that lives down the road. he thinks that since its a cadillac when i installed my fuel pump i have to enter in a code or something to get my car to recognize the fuel pump. is that true at all? i figured my manuel would have said something or the fuel pump directions would have said something about it?

carnut
10-12-11, 09:35 AM
Urban legend. No truth to that statement Have you verified fuel pressure with a gauge?

dennis93coupe
10-12-11, 10:56 AM
ok. and ive been talking to a mechanic that lives down the road. he thinks that since its a cadillac when i installed my fuel pump i have to enter in a code or something to get my car to recognize the fuel pump.
:hmm:.... Stay away from that mechanic, he doesn't know anything about Cadillac.... Do you have a FSM, your year and model there are 2 books. At times like these, it is invaluable.You will never get the injectors to work until you get spark. Speed sensor is in the distributor, AKA hall effect switch..

cadillaceldo93
10-12-11, 02:02 PM
the manual i got came straight from a cadillac dealership. it says 1992 but as far as i know its pretty much the same thing. my old neighbor worked at the dealership and gave me the manual.

dennis93coupe
10-12-11, 02:25 PM
I don't know what's different from 92 to 93, but they are different books...http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1993-Cadillac-Seville-Eldorado-Service-Manual-Set-/230675087519?pt=Motors_Manuals_Literature&hash=item35b54e809f

Never heard of needing to program in the fuel pump. You might try the Eldorado forums.

carnut
10-12-11, 06:01 PM
An engine needs 4 things to run. fuel, spark, proper timing and compression. Have we ruled out a failed timing chain? Not knowing mileage is why I ask. Go back to basics and verify that when TDC is in line on the pulley, that the #1 cylinder is truly at TDC. We are all assuming electrical when in fact it could be mechanical.

cadillaceldo93
10-13-11, 09:03 AM
i have 237,000 miles on my car. how do i check the timing? what does TDC mean?

carnut
10-13-11, 11:06 AM
TDC (top dead center) How to set the timing is in that book you have. At that mileage the timing chain or cam gear could have easily failed. This is not an interference engine meaning the valves are not damaged when the gear or chain fail unlike most overhead cam motors. Thats the good news!

cadillaceldo93
10-13-11, 12:19 PM
ok im at work right now i can do the timing at home by myself fairly easily? and on my way home im going to buy a coil i guess and see if it starts my car. if not ill just take it back. ill also set the timiing and see if it starts. i havent been able to check the fuel pressure or check the voltage on my coil i dont really have the tools to do that i guess i could borrow them from orielly's to check those things. thanks for all the help hopefully i get my car started soon

cadillac_al
10-13-11, 04:29 PM
The easy way to diagnose your Cadillac is to read the codes and check the fuel pressure and check the spark. That will tell you a lot. The mileage is pretty high imo so everything is about at the end of its life. If you have no spark, I think it's easier to buy a new/rebuilt distributor than to buy the individual parts. The instructions for reading the codes is at the top of this section of the forum.

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/ht4100-4-1-4-5-4/21558-obd-i-codes-4-x-engines.html

cadillaceldo93
10-14-11, 08:24 AM
theres are no current codes. i replaces the coil lastnight and my car started. but its acting really weird. it idles at 2500. but the car does start now. i tried running through the codes again an still no current codes.

dennis93coupe
10-14-11, 09:00 AM
theres are no current codes. i replaces the coil lastnight and my car started. but its acting really weird. it idles at 2500. but the car does start now. i tried running through the codes again an still no current codes.
It sounds like you are having a problem with your ISC (idle solenoid control) and possibly the TPS (throttle position sensor). Go to the section in the service manual and read up on how to do the idle learn procedure. You might have a bad ISC, not uncommon for these to go bad.

cadillaceldo93
10-14-11, 09:53 AM
ok i will when i get off work. one thing i may have forgot to mention cuz i feel like an idiot for letting it happen. but my car got towed by a moron and the tow rope got wrapped around the front of my car, like around the radiator lol so the metal got bent back towards the engine the only thing i can see visually that got messed up from this tow is the radiator fan is pushed back a little. so it rubs on the part that actually holds the fan on to the radiator maybe i can take a picture later and show you guys. but i wouldnt think that would have anything to do with my car having a high idle but who knows. ill look in my manual later and see what i can figure out and post again thanks for all the help.

dennis93coupe
10-14-11, 10:38 AM
but my car got towed by a moron and the tow rope got wrapped around the front of my car, like around the radiator lol so the metal got bent back towards the engine the only thing i can see visually that got messed up from this tow is the radiator fan is pushed back a little. .
Is it on top or bottom? Does it look like it can be removed with bolts, nuts? I don't recall what there is up there that could have gotten bent. I'd say that was the tow truck drivers fault, they should know where to hook up without damage.

cadillaceldo93
10-14-11, 10:58 AM
it got towed by my gf cousin hes an idiot lets leave it at that. the part that got bent back is like where the car hood latches next to the sway bar or whatever its called( the bar that holds the engine in place and the fan is right under that so when it got pushed back in bent the plastic bars that hold the fan and the fan blades are rubbing up on the plastic bars holding on the fan