: 2010 SRX Stalled While Driving - Scary Moment!



Caddy SRX Owner
09-16-11, 09:48 PM
I was wondering if this happend to any fellow 2nd Gen SRX owners. The car basically stalled (good thing I was at work already) and it would have a hard time cranking up to turn on again. I managed to get it to fire up but felt like it was on limp mode where the engine would stutter and would barely move. I caused traffic on the parking deck but good thing this happend here instead of the highway.

With having own multiple cars before, I suspect something small like a spark plug or ignition coil. The car is now at the dealership where I plan to call them tomorrow and complain about this almost deadly situation.

I was wondering if anyone else had this happen to them. Any suggestions with how I should go about handling this with the dealership.

Please let me know. I am open to hear suggestions and comments.

Thanks in advance folks!

sube5186
09-17-11, 11:51 AM
I was wondering if anyone else had this happen to them. Any suggestions with how I should go about handling this with the dealership.

Nope, never had that happen. I would suggest you always deal with the Service Manager for anything other than routine maintenance. He/she needs to know everything that's going on within their dept. I always follow up a phone call with a detailed email. That way you're sure nothing's been left out. In the past whenever I'd just call, right after I'd hang up I'd always remember something else I forgot to mention. Having it in writing produces a far more accurate record. You don't have to rely on their memory. It even makes it easier for your Service Manager. Having an email, they can simply copy and paste it to the work order.



Sube

kariann11
09-19-11, 03:05 PM
This is the same exact thing that happened to us on Sept. 15th, luckly we were able to get the car home, called cadillac road side the next morning and had them tow it to the dealer, because the check engine light was on, and I was afraid to drive it the hour drive to the dealership. They are supposed to be looking at it today, hoping its nothing major! Cadillac is paying for my rental car, so thats a plus, but I agreed with you, its very scary to have your car stall while driving, we were on the ramp to I-95 when it happened to us! Good luck, and post when you find out what the problem is.

Caddy SRX Owner
09-21-11, 09:50 PM
Here is an update.

Supposedly it was bad gas that was in the vehicle (i don't buy it). The explanation given to me is that there was a mix of water and gas and when the car stalled. Since it is not the same density the water and gas did not mix and when the car stopped this is when the water was in line to be used. I was told that they are getting a gas sample where they are analyzing it and they are now dropping the gas tank and looking into it further.

Like I said, I don't really buy that story but I will wait for the outcome and really grill them with questions.

I'll keep you all posted on this.

cadigirlchicago2
09-21-11, 10:16 PM
What brand of gas was it? My SRX has been running "rough" lately. The RPM guage flutters back/forth slightly over the 500 RPM mark when I'm stopped in traffic and then the vehicle feels like it's shaking. It's gotten really bad at times where it feels like it wants to conk out - thankfully it hasn't yet. I have it in the service department as we speak. They also asked me about gas and said that Shell or BP is the best. They didn't like it when I said I use citgo from time to time. My last fill up was at BP and it's still doing the flutter so I'm not really putting much weight into the gas thing just yet either.

Had you noticed yours running "rough" like I'm describing prior to this happening?

Caddy SRX Owner
09-21-11, 10:39 PM
What brand of gas was it? My SRX has been running "rough" lately. The RPM guage flutters back/forth slightly over the 500 RPM mark when I'm stopped in traffic and then the vehicle feels like it's shaking. It's gotten really bad at times where it feels like it wants to conk out - thankfully it hasn't yet. I have it in the service department as we speak. They also asked me about gas and said that Shell or BP is the best. They didn't like it when I said I use citgo from time to time. My last fill up was at BP and it's still doing the flutter so I'm not really putting much weight into the gas thing just yet either.

Had you noticed yours running "rough" like I'm describing prior to this happening?


No specific brand of choice really. I've used several different gas stations since we've owned the vehicle for a year. The night before this happened it was normal, I've never experineced the car to run rough at all.

Caddy SRX Owner
09-28-11, 10:49 PM
Here is an update.

It is supposedly bad gas. They had to change all 4 o2 sensors. The bill came up to be $1100 where we had the insurance pay for it minus out deductable.

One question for the forum members, can I bring the receipt to the last gas station that we purchased gas from and ask them to pay for the bill? Any suggestions on the situation?

Thanks in advance guys!

dctex99
09-29-11, 02:44 AM
No chance that "bad gas" ruined 4 sensors; I would call Cadillac and discuss !! Otherwise just consider that your dealer is hard up enough for business that he will screw your warranty company out of $1000, and you the deductible!! So sorry!

sube5186
09-29-11, 11:29 AM
Here is an update.

It is supposedly bad gas. They had to change all 4 o2 sensors. The bill came up to be $1100 where we had the insurance pay for it minus out deductible.

One question for the forum members, can I bring the receipt to the last gas station that we purchased gas from and ask them to pay for the bill? Any suggestions on the situation?

Thanks in advance guys!

This sounds suspicious to me. How did they pinpoint the problem to the gas? Do they have a chemist on staff who analyzed the gasoline? Of course not. This sounds like they're trying to pass off the repair costs to you. A reputable dealer would have simply made the repair and billed GM for the warranty work. For whatever reason, they're trying to minimize what they bill GM. Maybe there's pressure at this dealership to do this.

Once you've gotten your insurance company involved, it's probably too late. A claim should have never been filed with them, forcing you to pay the deductible. This is NOT an insurance issue. Exactly what does the service invoice say relative to "bad gas"? If that truly was the cause, you'll never get a gas station to reimburse you for this without a prolonged court battle. That would involve subpoenaing the service tech to testify. Even then, it'll be your word against theirs that you didn't get gas somewhere else in the interim. Do you have the sales receipt from that gas purchase? Did they save a sample of the gasoline taken from your tank? Probably not. I'm sure you can see how complex this would get. I won't say it's impossible for you to get the gas station to reimburse you. It would just be a challenge. Every product you purchase has an "implied warranty". That would include gasoline as well. You would just have to prove that the gasoline was in fact bad.

There was someone else on the forum who had a cracked windshield. Their dealer tried to get them to file an insurance claim. There was no accident. There was no impact to the windshield at all, e.g. stone, debris, etc. Turned out it was a stress fracture. The windshield just cracked on its own overnight while parked in the garage. The dealer finally acknowledged this and replaced it under warranty.

In the future don't be afraid to stand your ground. Just because they can't positively determine the cause don't let them place the blame on you. And since they can't definitively prove it was the gas, they should swallow the cost of repairs. There's one thing we know for sure. Whatever went wrong, it definitely wasn't YOUR fault, so why should you have to pay anything!

I would take dctex99's advice and contact GM. Try to get reimbursement through them.


Sube

PJ1520
09-29-11, 12:46 PM
Water in the gas is possible but not very probable today. But it still happens. In the State in which I live, all of the gas stations were required the Department of Environmental Protection to replace their inground tanks beyond a certain age to prevent groundwater contamination. The theory was these older tanks could leak gas into the ground (and take on water).

More likely, if it was bad gas, you got crud-contaminated gas. This happens when a station's tank is running low, and contamination from crud sitting at the bottom of the station's tank makes its way into your vehicle's gas tank. If you ever pull into a gas station when a gasoline tanker truck is refilling or just refilled the station's tanks, drive away and find yourself another station. During the station's refill process, they move 10,000 gallons in a hurry. The crud at the bottom of the service station's tanks gets stirred up. And if there is water and/or crud in the station's tanks, water and crud are heavier than the gasoline and are sitting at the bottom of the station's tanks.

Related to that, pure gas stations and those with a repair business that are having difficulty making a go of it financially are more likely to wait until they are empty or nearly empty before making the call to their supplier. Gasoline suppliers take no prisoners when it comes to getting paid promptly and have all of the leverage. It follows that you and I are more likely to get crud-contaminated gas from these establishments. The suppliers: "Wire tranfer, please. No check's accepted. Thank you very much." That may explain why gas stations are very quick to increase their gasoline prices when the cost of a barrel of oil goes up and so slow to bring those prices back down when the oil futures go down.

I think Sube is right if I interpret his post correctly. I did a search on such suspected gas contamination (with water) cases and the question of just who is liable for damages. What I found is that the complaining party better show up in civil court with some conclusive evidence: the dated receipt, the mechanic's dated diagnosis and repair, and the analyzed gas from the damaged vehicle confirming the diagnosis. Sube mentioned the mechanic as a witness. The anlysis part is expensive ($300 I read). It is unlikely this analysis can be done outside a professional lab that does this stuff for the oil industry. And these labs aren't too interested in testing your/mine gallon jug.......

Where does that leave you/us? In a bad position and one in which the time, effort, and money required to prove one's case, in small claims civil court if necessary, may not be worth it. The gas station will certainly show up in court because the burden of proof is on you. The mechanic meanwhile has all of the evidence of what he found and how he mitigated the issue.

What would I do? While all of this certainly was not your fault and you should not be the party holding the bag (paying your deductible), I might be tempted to take a walk on this one without any further discussion. The insurance company took the major hit, and they seem to think all was well just paying your claim, feeling that fighting it (you) would be both too expensive and risky

PJ

smiley47
09-29-11, 08:27 PM
I doubt the dealer could have performed the fuel analysis that quickly. Personally I'm not sure I would have a very high level of trust with them going forward.

sube5186
09-29-11, 08:39 PM
More likely, if it was bad gas, you got crud-contaminated gas. This happens when a station's tank is running low, and contamination from crud sitting at the bottom of the station's tank makes its way into your vehicle's gas tank. If you ever pull into a gas station when a gasoline tanker truck is refilling or just refilled the station's tanks, drive away and find yourself another station. During the station's refill process, they move 10,000 gallons in a hurry. The crud at the bottom of the service station's tanks gets stirred up. And if there is water and/or crud in the station's tanks, water and crud are heavier than the gasoline and are sitting at the bottom of the station's tanks.

I could see water maybe entering the tank under this scenario. But wouldn't the vehicle's fuel filter prevent the crud from entering the system?


While all of this certainly was not your fault and you should not be the party holding the bag (paying your deductible), I might be tempted to take a walk on this one without any further discussion. The insurance company took the major hit, and they seem to think all was well just paying your claim, feeling that fighting it (you) would be both too expensive and risky

The down side of this is it sets a dangerous precedent. Knowing they got away with this once, they're more likely to try this approach again, especially with the same customer. There's no way of undoing the damage now. It's already a done deal.


Sube

algiorda
09-30-11, 08:12 AM
I can't believe in this day and age, Gas stations do not have filters and evaporators installed on their pumps and underground tanks to prevent the intake of and dispensing of pollutants to the fuel. I would think they would have evaporators that would strip the fuel of any water from the gas as it's being pumped. Am I THAT Naive?

Jake2010
09-30-11, 08:47 AM
I can't believe in this day and age, Gas stations do not have filters and evaporators installed on their pumps and underground tanks to prevent the intake of and dispensing of pollutants to the fuel. I would think they would have evaporators that would strip the fuel of any water from the gas as it's being pumped. Am I THAT Naive?

They do. At least I know they have a filter at each pump nozzle. They look like big oil filters and are usually concealed under the pump front cover. I spent some time working for Sunoco. Hopefully all stations are using filters, not just Sunoco.

PJ1520
09-30-11, 11:42 AM
From a practical matter, you guys are right. The fuel coming out of the pump is supposed to be filtered, and then there is the vehicle's fuel filter. Wonder how many of the gas stations take the time to maintain these filters, before there is a problem. Doesn't take much to negatively alter the accuracy and precision of a vehicle's fuel injection delivery. Also consider that the fuel line from the vehicle's gas tank to the engine sits very low in the tank.

We get a lot of road chemicals, sanding, and cindering on our New England roads during the Winter months. The fuel filler door is not sealed when closed. I find myself during the Winter months regularly wiping out the area around the filler pipe where this stuff has a tendency to accumulate.

Sube......when considering what this warranty insurance company should or should not do when handling claims, think about what insurance companies usually do NOT do, like our auto insurance comanies. They don't find fault or blame except in cases of low lying fruit or the biggest ticket items.

When we get into a traffic accident that is clearly the other guy's fault what happens? If there are no injuries, the cars are driveable, and they are not obstructing traffic too much, the (overburdened) police refuse to show up to review the physical evidence and report it. Rather they want the drivers to exchange info, take care of matters by themselves, and if you want, drive to the police station to file a report with the other guy's/my version of events. Now it is my word against the other driver's, with no witnesses.

Each carrier (for each driver) then gets the (biased?) scoop second hand from their own insured person and from the "other" guy. Each of these "opposing" carriers determines the % of fault for their own customer and that of the other driver. They rely solely on these accounts and the adjusters' photos of the damages to make the determination of fault, and by how much. If both drivers are covered by the same carrier, then that carrier takes one of the drivers to the "financial" woodshed. Otherwise, nothing.

My carrier doesn't fight the other driver's carrier for "justice" or for financial liability for the repairs an a case by case basis. They don't even fight for a reasonable percentage of guilt. They just take care of their own and write a check (to me or my body shop) and move on.

Why? The carriers say it is cheaper for THEM to do business this way than get into a protracted dispute. IT IS CHEAPER FOR THEM, BUT YOU/I ARE PAYING FOR IT WITH INCREASED PREMIUMS AND/OR WARRANTY PRICES. The carrier or warranty company wins and I lose.

Meanwhile, the at-fault party is not held adequately accountable for the damages. And somewhere in the mix, ALL of our insurance premiums go up, somehow or some way, sooner or later. In short, we subsidize negligence through our insurance premiums (and warranties). We are subsidizing bad drivers and bad behaviors.

EXAMPLE, and I have a few.

My wife got t-boned on the drivers' side rear quarter panel, driving straight at the posted 35MPH on a busy two lane through street with no trafffic signal for her. She had an an undeniable 100% right of way for cars entering the/her roadway from side streets and parking lots and driveways. A guy had stopped at a stop sign at the end of a highway exit ramp that dead ended at the street my wife was driving on, to her left and across the opposite travel lane from her. He wanted to get out into traffic. He hit the gas, cut across the other travel lane to get into her travel lane, and t-boned her. The other driver's insurance company determined my wife was at fault!!!!

How? Beats the XXXX out of me. The photos of the damaged vehicles, the actual physics and layout, and the particulars of traffic law tell the whole story. The only way my wife had any liability in this accident is if her car fell from the sky.

What does this mean? The negligent driver beats his own insurance carrier out of paying his deductible and comes out smalling like a rose with his carrier. Dangerous or negligent driving goes unpunished. No accountability. And my carrier picks up my tab on my car for the other driver's negligence. If you ask your carrier if the matter is being pursued with the other carrier and their driver, you might get a smile. Nope!

I suspect that in this automobile warranty discussion over the bad gas, the same is true. The true cost of right and wrong, and culpability, accountability, and fairness, goes right out the window. With that attitude we all pay for the resulting increase in what we pay for (extended) warranties. Or out of pocket on an incident basis. The carriers will argue it is cheaper in the long run doing it their way versus doing it right.

But if no one is held accountable, the auto and warranty carriers still make a ton of money on my back, my premiums go up, and with that increase in my premiums I am now subsidizing someone elses' negligence, accidental or on purpose.

PJ

sube5186
09-30-11, 02:02 PM
Amen! :yup:

Caddy SRX Owner
09-30-11, 05:08 PM
Hi folks. Here are some more facts that might be able to clarify the situation from reading everyone's post.

- The dealer supposedly took a gas sample from our vehicle, their vehicle, and another customer's vehicle. Ours supposedlt contaminated and was orange.
- Unfortunately we already paid the bill in full where our insurance is reimbursing us the total minus our deductible.

Would it be wise for me to send the customer representative that I dealt with this thread so that he can sweat it out a little? =)

Delta
09-30-11, 05:23 PM
I doubt the dealer could have performed the fuel analysis that quickly. Personally I'm not sure I would have a very high level of trust with them going forward.

It only takes a few seconds to find fuel contamination. Take a sample, observe color, smell and see if it has any water floating on top of it. Then you put it into an analyzer and take a hertz reading with a DVOM to test for alcohol in the fuel.

If it was orange then that's some serious contamination. Wish they would have shown you a sample of the fuel. That sounds like gross negligence from the fuel station you got the fuel from. I would doubt it if they haven't already had someone else with a broken car come talk to them if it was that contaminated. You didn't add any octane booster or anything did you?

Caddy SRX Owner
09-30-11, 05:56 PM
It only takes a few seconds to find fuel contamination. Take a sample, observe color, smell and see if it has any water floating on top of it. Then you put it into an analyzer and take a hertz reading with a DVOM to test for alcohol in the fuel.

If it was orange then that's some serious contamination. Wish they would have shown you a sample of the fuel. That sounds like gross negligence from the fuel station you got the fuel from. I would doubt it if they haven't already had someone else with a broken car come talk to them if it was that contaminated. You didn't add any octane booster or anything did you?

no booster sir.

Caddy SRX Owner
09-30-11, 06:17 PM
Here is the work order receipt with the explanation of the issue from the dealership.

81095

dctex99
09-30-11, 07:48 PM
Very interesting....I think NO MORE Von's or costco gas for me, and watch Conoco-Phillips for a truck refilling when I do...that is outrageous, but understandable in this economy. Back when gas went to $2 a gallon and everyone was up in arms a friends kid worked at a gas station, and he saw the owner pour 5 gallons of water in the "regular" tank late one night when closing; he said it was an extra $10 in his pocket and mixed with a fill that day, would do no harm!! Interesting scenario!!

stevec5375
09-30-11, 09:09 PM
Very interesting....I think NO MORE Von's or costco gas for me, and watch Conoco-Phillips for a truck refilling when I do...that is outrageous, but understandable in this economy. Back when gas went to $2 a gallon and everyone was up in arms a friends kid worked at a gas station, and he saw the owner pour 5 gallons of water in the "regular" tank late one night when closing; he said it was an extra $10 in his pocket and mixed with a fill that day, would do no harm!! Interesting scenario!!

The Caddy manual says to use "top tier" gas stations only. Until gas got so expensive, I was always a "premium grade" user. Now I go to Shell or Chevron and get the mid grade and my car runs great on it.

BTW, I don't hesitate for one instance to report gas stations I visit that appear to be doing illegal or shady things. There was a Shell station near my job that had great prices, but one of the pumps was constantly acting like it was on its last leg. There was kitty litter all over the place where gas was leaking out of it. I thought, Hmm.... wonder if that is happening before or after it goes through the part of the meter that charges me!

Ponyman
09-30-11, 10:25 PM
It doesn't matter where you buy your gas. Depending on where you live it probably all comes from the same place. I work at a refinery and see all different major and independent brand trucks pulling into the same racks loading the same gasoline. Believe me, we don't make special fuel for anyone, it all the same. The difference comes into play with what additive they use. Even then we only have about three different additives they can choose from, and it is injected into the gasoline as it is being loaded. I don't know it for a fact, but I have heard that Loves doesn't have any additive added to their gasoline. Again, that is just what I have been told. Also at the rack is where the 10% ethanol is metered into the gasoline. So, just because you are pulling up to a Shell or Texaco station, doesn't mean the gas came from there. If they have a refinery close by it might have, or it could have been pipelined into a storage facility, but the oil companies trade out gas all the time, else there would have to be a refinery of each brand near each major city. At one time, we had a sales and loading rack in Euless Texas. Our gas mostly came from ARCO, and the company then traded it out with them somewhere else that they needed gasoline. The gas from Costco, Sam's and Mur;hy is likely just as good as anywhere else. The gasolines just have meet a certain octane number, and that is checked very closely by our lab before it is put up for sale, and also by the buyer.

PJ1520
10-01-11, 12:48 AM
It only takes a few seconds to find fuel contamination. Take a sample, observe color, smell and see if it has any water floating on top of it. Then you put it into an analyzer and take a hertz reading with a DVOM to test for alcohol in the fuel.

If it was orange then that's some serious contamination. Wish they would have shown you a sample of the fuel. That sounds like gross negligence from the fuel station you got the fuel from. I would doubt it if they haven't already had someone else with a broken car come talk to them if it was that contaminated. You didn't add any octane booster or anything did you?

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____

Delta......I think you have that upside down. Water is heavier than gasoline and settles to the bottom. The fuel line exits the gas tank at the bottom of the tank, and that is why when you get water-contaminated gasoline, the symptoms show up sooner after fillup rather than later.

PJ