: To be honest, why we need to buy the XTS..Look at this Chrysler



nguyennhatquang
07-05-11, 10:30 PM
the XTS rumor we think it will be more than 45.000$ and still FWD. V6 Engine.
so..Beside of the Cadillac Badge..why we need to buy it ?
To be honest..i think that Chrysler is much much better..
http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g228/quangty/10-2012-chrysler-300c-executive-ny.jpg
http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g228/quangty/13-2012-chrysler-300c-executive-ny.jpg
http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g228/quangty/15-2012-chrysler-300c-executive-ny.jpg
http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g228/quangty/14-2012-chrysler-300c-executive-ny.jpg
it is a traditional Luxury.

Jesda
07-05-11, 10:40 PM
Its quite nice, but check out the interior of the XTS:

http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive/2010/01/cadillac-xts-platinum-concept/Cadillac-XTS-Platinum-Concept-Interior-2.jpg

That's obviously the concept, but spy photos reveal that the same layout is going to make it into production.




[On looks alone, I'd still buy the Chrysler.]

Night Wolf
07-05-11, 10:46 PM
Why does FWD matter?

That Chrysler looks really good inside.

nguyennhatquang
07-05-11, 10:52 PM
why it not a metter ?
when u drive in traffic..the RWD will get better U-Turn.
second : it much better balance when u ride in HW..
better steering respond..
and Of course cost lot of money to manufacturer it.

This XTS is just the concept. Who know the production will be same ?

and the most important is XTS don't offer V8..that suck..
so that mean we pay a lot for the CADILLAC NAMES..not for the machines we want.

and Plus about Chrysler. The new 300 will have Adaptive Air ride Suspension from Benz...
i think the ride quality..at least the same as Cadillac. It can not be lower.

Jesda
07-05-11, 11:12 PM
I'll definitely concede, with FWD Cadillacs the turning radius can be annoying when parking in the city or in tight garages. In the suburbs its a non-issue.
My guess is that the lack of a wide V8 under the hood may offer more clearance for steering. But that's just a guess.

I didn't know about the air suspension. That's interesting.

nguyennhatquang
07-05-11, 11:22 PM
http://www.0-60mag.com/news/2011/04/cars-chrysler-300-gets-the-srt8-treatment-too/
New for 2012 is an Adaptive Damping Suspension (ADS) system that is tuned specifically for the Chrysler 300 SRT8 to offer a compliant and comfortable ride. The ADS system also uses a wide range of on-road and driver inputs – such as vehicle speed, steering angle, steering speed, brake torque, throttle position and lateral and vertical accelerations – to automatically tune the suspension for specific conditions when necessary.

In addition, drivers can manually choose between “Auto” and “Sport” settings that quickly change the shock damping and harshness characteristics from everyday commuting to more spirited driving situations.




Cadillac have Unique Adaptive Suspension Also. It is Called Magnetic Ride Control.
But the older 300 don't have Adaptive Suspension. now it will fully equip

in 2000 or Older..Cadillac is Leader in Technology because the DTS is the first car have Adaptive Suspension.
and plus night vision also.
But now is 2011...they must prove to custommer see : they dont steal the money from custommer pocket. They sell the real Cadillac.

don't repeat the Cimaron..please Cadillac

Jesda
07-05-11, 11:24 PM
I'm sure the XTS will be much, much nicer than the Cimarron. :)

My reason for disliking it is the appearance. Its too tall and awkward with overhangs that are too long for a car from this era. There's a lack of sleekness.

Stingroo
07-05-11, 11:25 PM
If the 300C's system is an air-ride setup, I highly doubt it will be anywhere near as good as GM's MagneRide.

ben.gators
07-05-11, 11:38 PM
Cadillac have Unique Adaptive Suspension Also. It is Called Magnetic Ride Control.
But the older 300 don't have Adaptive Suspension. now it will fully equip

in 2000 or Older..Cadillac is Leader in Technology because the DTS is the first car have Adaptive Suspension.
and plus night vision also.
But now is 2011...they must prove to custommer see : they dont steal the money from custommer pocket. They sell the real Cadillac.

don't repeat the Cimaron..please Cadillac

No, daptive suspension system first introduced to Seville STS and ETC in 1997 (CVRSS) and then in 2002.5 STS got the magnetic ride..

However I should add that although Cadillac was pioneer during those years, they stopped there and let the other companies catch up.... These days majority of luxury and high performance car makers are equipping their cars with similar technologies. Cadillac needs to put something new on the table, and I am eagerly waiting to see will XTS do it or not?

By the way, I can see tons of improvements in Chrysler, but still No... I don't like it... Give me a nice Cadillac!

thebigjimsho
07-05-11, 11:46 PM
I hate that circle encompassing the vents and nav screen on the 300. Ugly...

cadillac kevin
07-06-11, 01:09 AM
IMO the XTS needs a less sloping C pillar, a slightly longer front end (maybe 2 inches) and to get rid of that stupid swoopy thing on the side. also its way too long in the rear for a fwd car. make the taillights shorter and shorten the quarters by a couple inches. overall its just a fugly car all around. IMO the trunk proportions (massive) would be ok for a large flagship, but not for the entry level car.
I'll just keep my antiquated rwd body on frame car with a powerless wonder under the hood and a slushbox sitting next to me. it suits me just fine.

Playdrv4me
07-06-11, 01:19 AM
I hate that circle encompassing the vents and nav screen on the 300. Ugly...

That is, in fact, the ONLY complaint I was about to note about that interior. Otherwise I like it a lot.

93DevilleUSMC
07-06-11, 01:25 AM
I'll definitely concede, with FWD Cadillacs the turning radius can be annoying when parking in the city or in tight garages. In the suburbs its a non-issue.
My guess is that the lack of a wide V8 under the hood may offer more clearance for steering. But that's just a guess.

I didn't know about the air suspension. That's interesting.

It all depends on how well they balance the XTS and how the steering is weighted. The C-body Cadillacs are fairly heavy, but their balance is great, and the steering makes it feel like you're parking a much smaller car. Well, that was my experience, anyway.

Rodya234
07-06-11, 01:44 AM
I've said this before, but I don't mind that the XTS won't have a V8, does anyone really want another FWD V8 Cadillac? If so you have 26 years worth of models to choose from. The XTS (concept anyway) has a gorgeous interior, and I bet that even without a V8 the car won't be a slouch. Combine that with Magnetic Ride (possibly), AWD, and the Brembo brakes fitted to the test mule and you'll have a car that will make a lot of people happy.

And I agree with Jim, people are only saying how good the 300 is now because the old model was a joke.

Jesda
07-06-11, 01:47 AM
It all depends on how well they balance the XTS and how the steering is weighted. The C-body Cadillacs are fairly heavy, but their balance is great, and the steering makes it feel like you're parking a much smaller car. Well, that was my experience, anyway.

It probably helps too that those cars had low beltlines and tall glass for decent visibility. These cars today... like trying to park with a blindfold on.

Playdrv4me
07-06-11, 01:51 AM
I've said this before, but I don't mind that the XTS won't have a V8, does anyone really want another FWD V8 Cadillac? If so you have 26 years worth of models to choose from. The XTS (concept anyway) has a gorgeous interior, and I bet that even without a V8 the car won't be a slouch. Combine that with Magnetic Ride (possibly), AWD, and the Brembo brakes fitted to the test mule and you'll have a car that will make a lot of people happy.

And I agree with Jim, people are only saying how good the 300 is now because the old model was a joke.

The 300 as a whole was never a joke... That was the horrible interior.

As for the XTS... I can already buy 90% of that, it's called a Lincoln MKS. Blah.

nguyennhatquang
07-06-11, 02:21 AM
The 300 as a whole was never a joke... That was the horrible interior.

As for the XTS... I can already buy 90% of that, it's called a Lincoln MKS. Blah.

yes the Lincoln MKS is much cheaper plus automatic parking..
very nice feature...

so still the quession mark ?

why we need XTS without RWD, V8 and Hi-tech.....? except the Cadillac Badge

Jesda
07-06-11, 02:31 AM
I think this model will have a lifespan similar to the Chevy Cobalt. It'll plug a hole in the lineup for one generation and eventually get replaced by something much better.


That's me being optimistic though.

93DevilleUSMC
07-06-11, 03:08 AM
It probably helps too that those cars had low beltlines and tall glass for decent visibility. These cars today... like trying to park with a blindfold on.

Yeah, the XTS looks like it is going to have a high beltline indeed. Cadillac, if you're reading this, the need to see out of the car you're driving hasn't gone away lately.

brandondeleo
07-06-11, 04:22 AM
My girlfriend used to have an '87 Jeep Cherokee, and it was like driving a glass box. You could see EVERYTHING. Then I try to back up in tight quarters with my DeVille, and I am slightly jealous...

SDCaddyLacky
07-06-11, 06:23 AM
The new 300 interiors do look like a great improvement over the previous years crappola plastic wrapped interiors. I remember driving a an 08 300 my cousin had as a business car, it was nice in all, but the interior was a joke, very low quality all around, nothing soft to touch, and the never ending cheap plastic was enough to make you just wanna get out, and into a Mercedes already.

I do miss the boldness of the older models though, the new redesign has grown on me a bit, but the front end doesn't have that commanding presence anymore, nor does it look classic. The 300 still is the only and last real Large luxury American car being made IMO. It still offers a V8, is RWD, large and impressive, makes a statement, while everything else on the road today doesn't. Cadillac probably will never come out with anything competitive to the 300, but I am sure if they at least tried, the car would be a hit.

I really love that XTS interior, way more luxurious than the current 300.

brandondeleo
07-06-11, 06:25 AM
I want another full size Cadillac... With the death of the DTS comes the death of the American full size luxury car.

brandondeleo
07-06-11, 06:28 AM
And by full size, I mean DeVille/ Fleetwood status, not the 203in XTS... I want another behemoth Caddy. Give us a 225in RWD monster that rides like a cloud, not another generic CTS/STS style commuter.

SDCaddyLacky
07-06-11, 07:12 AM
Believe me, I wish Cadillac would build another Fleetwood monster Cadillac, but we all know it ain't gonna happen. Someone in that damn company needs to have the guts to take a chance at looking to bringing back a true full sizer at least.

The DTS isn't even a real big Cadillac, the real Biggys were the Fleetwoods and Broughams at 221 and 225 inches long respectably. Now Caddy is ridding the DTS with something even smaller, this will drive away business for sure from older American buyers that are looking for comfort and a soft ride that DTS stood for. These people are usually much more well off than young buyers, and seniors most likely pay cash for the car, so it's better for the dealer.

Imagine if any of us walked into a Cadillac dealership next year, and ask the salesman, "Hey I want the biggest most softest riding Caddy you got", the salesman will probably look at you with sweat dripping down his forehead in anxiety knowing that he doesn't have answer for you. lol."Ughhh....well we got this new XTS over here, it ain't as big or soft riding as the outgoing DTS, but it's still a nice car". Then we reply, "That ain't a real Caddy, look how small and tiny it is!" Times are going to get much tougher for salesman all across America at Cadillac dealers next year. I can see many potential Caddy buyers walking out of the Cad dealers and heading straight over to Lexus dealerships in a hurry.

brandondeleo
07-06-11, 07:31 AM
Very true. The Fleetwoods are awesome. Their size alone is imposing. My DeVille is a big car, and it is 209". The DTS was reduced to 207". I can only imagine driving a '96 Fleetwood around downtown Seattle... Haha. That would be fun to park. It would help Cadillac to make it known that these big Caddies aren't as bad on gas as you would imagine. That would alleviate some of the buyer reluctance in the full size realm...

Speaking of Lexus, one car that impressed me immensely was the Toyota Avalon. My grandma has a 2008 Avalon, and I was shocked by the luxury in that thing. The contoured dash wrapped in wood and leather, the touchscreen/ joystick NAV/DVD tastefully placed in the dash, the plush seating... The back seats reclined! It had everything AND the kitchen sink... Lol. And with the high output V6, it picked up and went while still getting mileage in the high twenties. Bland car from the outside, but once you get inside... Wow. It is a re-badged LS400, but respectable in any case.

brandondeleo
07-06-11, 07:35 AM
"that ain't a real caddy, look how small and tiny it is!" My opinion of every Cadillac spare DeVille. :histeric:

brandondeleo
07-06-11, 07:42 AM
On a side note, the V6 that is slated to be put in the XTS packs 350hp. I think it will move just fine.

vincentm
07-06-11, 11:03 AM
I hate that circle encompassing the vents and nav screen on the 300. Ugly...


I dont like Chrysler 300's period. i just think they're a wannabe Bently

vincentm
07-06-11, 11:06 AM
I can see many potential Caddy buyers walking out of the Cad dealers and heading straight over to Lexus dealerships in a hurry.


The Horror!, no seriously. The Horror!. To me Lexus is just an expensive Toyota pokemonmobile

OffThaHorseCEO
07-06-11, 11:35 AM
1) The whole of Americas Cadillac market does not reside on Cadillacforums.com. Therefore, the statement about Cadillac facing tough times ahead due to killing off a full size vehicle are speculative at best. Take a look at the CTS forums. Compare the activity to all the fullsize forums put together.

2) The lexus cars arent any bigger than the new "smaller" Cadillac cars.

thebigjimsho
07-06-11, 12:15 PM
Believe me, I wish Cadillac would build another Fleetwood monster Cadillac, but we all know it ain't gonna happen. Someone in that damn company needs to have the guts to take a chance at looking to bringing back a true full sizer at least.The DTS isn't even a real big Cadillac, the real Biggys were the Fleetwoods and Broughams at 221 and 225 inches long respectably. Now Caddy is ridding the DTS with something even smaller, this will drive away business for sure from older American buyers that are looking for comfort and a soft ride that DTS stood for. These people are usually much more well off than young buyers, and seniors most likely pay cash for the car, so it's better for the dealer.Imagine if any of us walked into a Cadillac dealership next year, and ask the salesman, "Hey I want the biggest most softest riding Caddy you got", the salesman will probably look at you with sweat dripping down his forehead in anxiety knowing that he doesn't have answer for you. lol."Ughhh....well we got this new XTS over here, it ain't as big or soft riding as the outgoing DTS, but it's still a nice car". Then we reply, "That ain't a real Caddy, look how small and tiny it is!" Times are going to get much tougher for salesman all across America at Cadillac dealers next year. I can see many potential Caddy buyers walking out of the Cad dealers and heading straight over to Lexus dealerships in a hurry.What a joke of a statement! Give me the biggest, softest Caddy you got? Sorry but this isn't 1992. Maybe a handful of you on this forum and a few thousand in this country want that. It's not for lack of guts that Cadillac doesn't have the Fleetwood anymore. Guts created the CTS-V. Making a car to sell a couple thousand models a year doesn't work. You are out of touch. The elderly who used to buy those big barges are dead of have had their licenses taken away from them. Baby boomers want better driving cars. They want youthful cars. Heck, when my father retires and gives up his company car, he's taking the Subaru Legacy and getting my mother a Mini. Cadillac is doing just fine. Now, I hope they come out with a larger car since that would be good for my line of work. But the Town Car was killed off because of lack of interest from the public. It doesn't matter how many they sell to fleets, which is a sizable number. So how are a few thousand of you old school goobers going to make a big Cadillac profitable? Answer: you aren't...

Jesda
07-06-11, 03:20 PM
The biggest, softest Cadillac is currently made by Lexus.


Lexus sells a lot of them.

nguyennhatquang
07-06-11, 03:28 PM
All we need is the Cadillac have the Ultimate interior like the LS460L. V8, RWD. 5 speed is ok. I hate 8 speed or 7G benz. IT think alot. Wrong gear.
thats all....
Lexus sell a lot of them. This car make lexus famous.

brandondeleo
07-06-11, 03:31 PM
I know that it is not feasible for Cadillac to release another behemoth car, but one can hope. With the current market for all of these sporty little cars like the CTS-V, a new Fleetwood would bomb like Celine Dion at a rave.

cadillac kevin
07-06-11, 09:32 PM
why would it be so hard to mass produce a large rwd car with a V8? chrysler has proven it can be done at the 40k price point, so would it be so hard to make an all out luxury cruiser at 80k? something just a bit bigger than a 300.
IMO the town car is a great example of how NOT to make a mass produced rwd car (in 2011). its sat on the same frame for 33 years and handles just as bad as the late 70s cars (at least it seems like it). The inside (IMO) has some fitment/ quality issues that should not be there on a car of their cost. Plus they're sedate in every way (can we say generic) and downright geriatric.
If cadillac were to make a rwd full size car, it would need to be something in the vain of the impala ss (take a full size luxury car, soup it up, and make it handle) just with alot more luxury features. .

SDCaddyLacky
07-06-11, 10:22 PM
What a joke of a statement! Give me the biggest, softest Caddy you got? Sorry but this isn't 1992. Maybe a handful of you on this forum and a few thousand in this country want that. It's not for lack of guts that Cadillac doesn't have the Fleetwood anymore. Guts created the CTS-V. Making a car to sell a couple thousand models a year doesn't work. You are out of touch. The elderly who used to buy those big barges are dead of have had their licenses taken away from them. Baby boomers want better driving cars. They want youthful cars. Heck, when my father retires and gives up his company car, he's taking the Subaru Legacy and getting my mother a Mini. Cadillac is doing just fine. Now, I hope they come out with a larger car since that would be good for my line of work. But the Town Car was killed off because of lack of interest from the public. It doesn't matter how many they sell to fleets, which is a sizable number. So how are a few thousand of you old school goobers going to make a big Cadillac profitable? Answer: you aren't...

I was being sarcastic you jackass! We all know Cadillac will never build large cars again, (especially Fleetwood in size) but considering that Europeans are still building biggies, I can't see why Caddy is suddenly giving up on the big car segment. The point is, Cadillac isn't giving people the option to purchase something in line of the DTS anymore once it disappears for good, zero follow up. They're many Americans out their that would love something from Cadillac that's on par with a 7 series, but Cadillac isn't building it! The DTS is outdated and the company hasn't put any more money into it, but lets say they did? Or came out with a completely different car from the DTS, but with the same exact dimensions with awesome styling? Drop in a V6 as an option, make it more modern with cool styling which will attract more younger buyers, and let's see how well those Cads sell.

My dad is pretty old fashioned, he drives a 01 Town Car Cartier L, and he loves it, it's soft riding, and smooth, and that's what he likes. Plus he knows he will never find another car that's as big as his Town Car, so that is why he told me he probably never pick up something new ever again, he does like the 300's though, but still, he says they feel kinda cramped for him.

Now shoppers can never dream about buying a big Caddy, and that is very disappointing, no matter how you look at it.

Lexus is calling that's for sure.

Stingroo
07-06-11, 10:28 PM
You guys are all forgetting... the whole product line is being revamped.

Wait and see.

thebigjimsho
07-06-11, 11:04 PM
Yep, the foreign makes come close to losing money on their big sedans. And it ain't as easy as grabbing a big chassis and slapping some tech in there and rolling it out the door. So instead of sinking money at a crucial time into a product with limited returns, revamp the lineup, continue to improve what is selling well and THEN get the large flagship when everything is good and ready...

Aron9000
07-06-11, 11:19 PM
You guys are all forgetting... the whole product line is being revamped.

Wait and see.

If managment didn't have their heads up their arses, we could have a full size v8, rwd Cadillac with a massive back seat and all the luxury toys right now. I don't see why GM cannot sell the Holden Statesmen here as a Cadillac. Revamp the interior/exterior to make it look like a Cadillac, sell for 50-70k. They have extra capacity in that Australian factory, or they could build it at the same plant as the new Camaro, which is also based on the Holden Zeta chassis.

As for making another Fleetwood, that'll never happen. Those were cars that baby boomer's parents drove, who are all dead or too old to drive now. Baby boomers(my parents) don't want something that big, floaty, and isolated. Quite frankly if my 95 were about a 5-6" shorter and 1-2" narrower, it would be a lot more manuverable and fun to drive.

Stingroo
07-06-11, 11:52 PM
If they just imported over the Holden, people would bitch. It would be expensive. It would be low tech. Zeta is an OLD platform, and that's NOT what you want underpinning your "flagship".

Jesda
07-07-11, 12:02 AM
Yep, the foreign makes come close to losing money on their big sedans. And it ain't as easy as grabbing a big chassis and slapping some tech in there and rolling it out the door. So instead of sinking money at a crucial time into a product with limited returns, revamp the lineup, continue to improve what is selling well and THEN get the large flagship when everything is good and ready...

Or, do it the Cadillac way:

Don't build a flagship no matter what the economic conditions are.

gary88
07-07-11, 12:05 AM
Or, do it the Cadillac way:

Don't build a flagship no matter what the economic conditions are.

"Cadillac: Deal With It!"

ben.gators
07-07-11, 12:08 AM
If they just imported over the Holden, people would bitch. It would be expensive. It would be low tech. Zeta is an OLD platform, and that's NOT what you want underpinning your "flagship".

That is true.... Importing another car and rebadging and selling it as Cadillac's flagship! hum, no. I will be the first in the line to bitch about it!

Rodya234
07-07-11, 12:10 AM
"Cadillac: Deal With It!"

http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/395/n132630dealwithitdogrep.jpg

Aron9000
07-07-11, 12:34 AM
Or make it a Buick, I don't care. I'd take it over a STS or a DTS any day of the week, even without the wreath and crest on it. Just saying that Cadillac could've brought this "new" car over here in 2006 instead of giving us a warmed over 1994 Deville that was a pos to start with.

Destroyer
07-07-11, 12:37 AM
We all know Cadillac will never build large cars again, (especially Fleetwood in size) but considering that Europeans are still building biggies, I can't see why Caddy is suddenly giving up on the big car segment. Eventually Cadillac will either build a "biggie" or it will no longer exist. Cadillac is never Cadillac unless it's got the biggest and best out there. Cadillac hasn't been Cadillac in quite some time. :

brandondeleo
07-07-11, 05:22 AM
There is the practicality issues of a large car in this market, and it is not feasible to release one because it would sell in small numbers... On the other hand, if Cadillac does not release another true Cadillac, it will fade into the sea of other sporty sedans, BMWs and Mercs. The flagship sedan MADE Cadillac for almost 100 years. The times, they are a'changin.

Lord Cadillac
07-07-11, 12:44 PM
I've said this before, but I don't mind that the XTS won't have a V8, does anyone really want another FWD V8 Cadillac? If so you have 26 years worth of models to choose from. The XTS (concept anyway) has a gorgeous interior, and I bet that even without a V8 the car won't be a slouch. Combine that with Magnetic Ride (possibly), AWD, and the Brembo brakes fitted to the test mule and you'll have a car that will make a lot of people happy.

And I agree with Jim, people are only saying how good the 300 is now because the old model was a joke.

The XTS will be underpowered for it's first year. If the CTS can bearly make 60 mph in low/mid 6 seconds, the much heavier XTS is going to be a pig. However, a twin turbo 3.0 liter V6 will be available in its second year - which should be great.

As mentioned below, the 300 was never a joke. I owned a 2007 300C and while the interior was almost as bad as a first generation CTS, the rest was excellent. The car rode like and had the proportions of a full-size Cadillac.


The 300 as a whole was never a joke... That was the horrible interior.

As for the XTS... I can already buy 90% of that, it's called a Lincoln MKS. Blah.

Right and right - but Cadillac will have the MKS on the interior...


I think this model will have a lifespan similar to the Chevy Cobalt. It'll plug a hole in the lineup for one generation and eventually get replaced by something much better.

That's me being optimistic though.

You're right. The XTS is supposed to be a stop gap car. Many executives at Cadillac already don't like it. However, I have a feeling Cadillac is going to surprise us in the end. I think the XTS is going to sell quite well. And if we don't see a new full-size RWD V8, it just may stick around.


I do miss the boldness of the older models though, the new redesign has grown on me a bit, but the front end doesn't have that commanding presence anymore, nor does it look classic. The 300 still is the only and last real Large luxury American car being made IMO. It still offers a V8, is RWD, large and impressive, makes a statement, while everything else on the road today doesn't. Cadillac probably will never come out with anything competitive to the 300, but I am sure if they at least tried, the car would be a hit.

I really love that XTS interior, way more luxurious than the current 300.

I'm not crazy about the front-end either. The grille/front fascia is boring compared to the first generation 300. I think a nice mid-cycle refresh will help immensely. The interior of the new 300 is very nice. I can only hope the XTS at least one-ups it...


Speaking of Lexus, one car that impressed me immensely was the Toyota Avalon. My grandma has a 2008 Avalon, and I was shocked by the luxury in that thing. The contoured dash wrapped in wood and leather, the touchscreen/ joystick NAV/DVD tastefully placed in the dash, the plush seating... The back seats reclined! It had everything AND the kitchen sink... Lol. And with the high output V6, it picked up and went while still getting mileage in the high twenties. Bland car from the outside, but once you get inside... Wow. It is a re-badged LS400, but respectable in any case.

I've been impressed by the Avalon for a long time now. It's not a "Cadillac" but it's a very comfortable, fairly luxurious sedan for a great price. The 2012 really upped the ante on the interior. And I even like the exterior. It's a nice, understated luxury car. Everything on the inside feels Lexus-like to me.


On a side note, the V6 that is slated to be put in the XTS packs 350hp. I think it will move just fine.

As mentioned earlier, the first year will only have the naturally aspirated 3.6 liter V6 found in the CTS. It's going to be slow. The following year will see a twin turbo 3.0 liter V6 that could see around 400 horsepower.


To me Lexus is just an expensive Toyota pokemonmobile

Not to me. I'd be very proud of a Toyota pokemonmobile that is the Lexus LS460L with a Cadillac badge on it. It amazes me that Cadillac can't have a pokemonmobile like that.




The Lexus LS is larger than any Cadillac car. That's what some of the people in this discussion (including me) are wanting.

[QUOTE=thebigjimsho;2645881]What a joke of a statement! Give me the biggest, softest Caddy you got? Sorry but this isn't 1992. Maybe a handful of you on this forum and a few thousand in this country want that. It's not for lack of guts that Cadillac doesn't have the Fleetwood anymore. Guts created the CTS-V. Making a car to sell a couple thousand models a year doesn't work. You are out of touch. The elderly who used to buy those big barges are dead of have had their licenses taken away from them. Baby boomers want better driving cars. They want youthful cars. Heck, when my father retires and gives up his company car, he's taking the Subaru Legacy and getting my mother a Mini. Cadillac is doing just fine. Now, I hope they come out with a larger car since that would be good for my line of work. But the Town Car was killed off because of lack of interest from the public. It doesn't matter how many they sell to fleets, which is a sizable number. So how are a few thousand of you old school goobers going to make a big Cadillac profitable? Answer: you aren't...

See the quote below. Nobody wants to admit it but Lexus came in and stole many Cadillac customers while Cadillac was too busy building wannabe BMWs. Cadillac should have just stuck with what it did best and it could be where Lexus is today.


The biggest, softest Cadillac is currently made by Lexus.

Lexus sells a lot of them.

Yup...


I know that it is not feasible for Cadillac to release another behemoth car, but one can hope. With the current market for all of these sporty little cars like the CTS-V, a new Fleetwood would bomb like Celine Dion at a rave.

No it wouldn't. That's like saying the Lexus LS460, BMW 750i, Mercedes S550, Jaguar XJ, Audi A8 are all bombs. And the Hyundai Equus is doing pretty good considering it has no luxury badge or cache.


Yep, the foreign makes come close to losing money on their big sedans. And it ain't as easy as grabbing a big chassis and slapping some tech in there and rolling it out the door. So instead of sinking money at a crucial time into a product with limited returns, revamp the lineup, continue to improve what is selling well and THEN get the large flagship when everything is good and ready...

That's true. They do come "close" to losing money on their big sedan. However, they're MAKING money - and not only that, providing their customers with a place to go after they're finished with their mid-size sedans...

Your plan makes sense. Let's see if Cadillac ever makes that big premium luxury sedan...

nguyennhatquang
07-08-11, 12:50 AM
See the quote below. Nobody wants to admit it but Lexus came in and stole many Cadillac customers while Cadillac was too busy building wannabe BMWs. Cadillac should have just stuck with what it did best and it could be where Lexus is today.


Building an Cadillac which ride like BMW is perfect. Why not ?
But why they waste a lot of time to build the Huyndai...

thebigjimsho
07-08-11, 08:41 AM
Jim has big plans. And pants to match.

cadillac kevin
07-08-11, 12:54 PM
Building an Cadillac which ride like BMW is perfect. Why not ?
But why they waste a lot of time to build the Huyndai...
because a cadillac cant be like a bmw. bmw owners wont take a second look at a cadillac, even if it rode just like a beemer. besides, most cadillac owners want a cadilac for a softer ride. a harsher ride (like in a BMW) doesnt belong in a normal cadillac. (V's arent normal)

Jesda
07-08-11, 01:21 PM
Smaller Cadillacs can focus on performance, but there ought to be big, comfortable ones for older buyers with more money.

thebigjimsho
07-08-11, 01:47 PM
meh.

nguyennhatquang
07-08-11, 07:52 PM
because a cadillac cant be like a bmw. bmw owners wont take a second look at a cadillac, even if it rode just like a beemer. besides, most cadillac owners want a cadilac for a softer ride. a harsher ride (like in a BMW) doesnt belong in a normal cadillac. (V's arent normal)

i have both V and Normal lac..
the V is harsher...but when i put it in comfort mode. it run normal again.

about the BMW 7..and Benz S..they're very comford ride. Thank to Air suspension.

to be honest..i want the Lac same as 7 and S..so comfortable..soft ride..

billc83
07-08-11, 08:13 PM
A BMW driver won't cross-shop against a Cadillac? Maybe in the late 80s...

concorso
07-09-11, 12:46 AM
because a cadillac cant be like a bmw. bmw owners wont take a second look at a cadillac, even if it rode just like a beemer. besides, most cadillac owners want a cadilac for a softer ride. a harsher ride (like in a BMW) doesnt belong in a normal cadillac. (V's arent normal)I lol'd alot... You are obviously not basing your opinion on reality...

Lord Cadillac
07-09-11, 06:17 PM
Smaller Cadillacs can focus on performance, but there ought to be big, comfortable ones for older buyers with more money.

For sure... Worst case scenario, offer an adjustable suspension for a full-size Cadillac to get both types of buyers interested in the product.


A BMW driver won't cross-shop against a Cadillac? Maybe in the late 80s...

There are certainly more BMW owners cross shopping Cadillacs these days - but I do agree that most people interested in buying a BMW won't buy a Cadillac that's "just like a BMW" unless it's better. The CTS-V is a good example of a Cadillac that BMW owners will consider - as it "is" better in some ways (power, interior aesthetics). The STS is/was just the opposite.

thebigjimsho
07-10-11, 07:41 PM
i have both V and Normal lac..
the V is harsher...but when i put it in comfort mode. it run normal again.

about the BMW 7..and Benz S..they're very comford ride. Thank to Air suspension.

to be honest..i want the Lac same as 7 and S..so comfortable..soft ride..Do you have a couple of Vs? Or are you and your wife a V couple?

concorso
07-10-11, 10:23 PM
There are certainly more BMW owners cross shopping Cadillacs these days - but I do agree that most people interested in buying a BMW won't buy a Cadillac that's "just like a BMW" unless it's better. The CTS-V is a good example of a Cadillac that BMW owners will consider - as it "is" better in some ways (power, interior aesthetics). The STS is/was just the opposite.Cadillac is a disjointed mess right now, its kinda hard to make the point you are making while they offer a lineup with multiple personalities. Tho, I suppose that is kinda your point. The Cadillacs that are competitive in their classes are getting cross-shoppers.
Once you focus on the luxury brands only, a major % of their customers will be repeat customers. Most Audi buyers will never look at BMW's, and the same goes for Mercedes, or Lexus, and multiple-vice-versas. )The major caveat being the performance cars. These buyers will switch brands constantly if neccessary.) AFAIK, the customer retention is much higher in luxury brands then in economy brands, and it makes sense. A car has to be segment-massacring to steal more then a few customers from the established leaders.

Jesda
07-10-11, 10:48 PM
MB seems to have no trouble offering both sporty and plush cars. The standard S-class is as far removed from the AMG Black series as you can get.

nguyennhatquang
07-10-11, 11:34 PM
Do you have a couple of Vs? Or are you and your wife a V couple?

no i don't have wife at that time..i'm still young..
i have CTS-V couple and DHS Deville.
and my father have 2004 S500 Benz.

i usually exchange my car with my friend. so that is the reason i can drive many car. The V have the button in the DASH. u can click in that and it switch the suspension mode. I prefer Touring mode. it nices but..i love the DHS better.

thebigjimsho
07-11-11, 10:59 AM
couple. lulz.

thebigjimsho
07-11-11, 10:59 AM
Sorry, don't mean to be mean. It should be coupe. Drop the L...