: Tell me about this, please



lincolncadillac
05-29-11, 11:49 PM
Wife found this car for sale, "sedan deville presidential edition?" She attempted to contact the owner but got no answer. What so special about this version if any and how much do you think i sould pay for this. Wife says its in real good shape exterior / interior. iam new to older cadillacs so please inform me.

cadillac kevin
05-30-11, 12:12 AM
that appears to be a custom coachbuilder car. the coachbuilders alterations dont add anything to the value. if the car is super clean and rust free is can be worth up to 3k depending on how bad someone wants it. however, this particular car looks to have the 4100 (based on the side badges) which is a junky motor. (If its a 4100, the side badges will say HT 4100 digital fuel injection) If it has the 4100 and has low miles and service record, I would pay 1500-2000 (essentially you are paying for the body).
the 4100 was an awful underpowered motor that were often replaced only a couple years after the cars were built (replacement motors were much more reliable but still horribly underpowered). however, some original 4100s stil remain in use. the 4100 is an anemic motor that barely has enough power to get down the road. essentially, if it still has a 4100 under the hood (check and see- some have been replaced with chevy or olds motors by now), I'd go over it with a super fine toothed comb and probably still walk away. If you decide to buy it, plan on replacing the motor (with a chevy or oldsmobile motor) sometime in the future.
then again- those could be V8-6-4 badges, which also has issues related to cylinder deactivation (but they can be remedied forever by snipping one wire that controls the cylinder deactivation- making the engine run on 8 cylinders all the time). the V8-6-4 is a very reliable engine once the cylinder deactivation feature is disabled.

sven914
05-30-11, 12:20 AM
There is no difference between that and a normal de Ville. Cadillac dealerships offered special "Edition" packages (they were not factory installed) that mostly consisted of special emblems and a different vinyl top design, which were tacked onto a car sitting on the lot. I don't believe any of the added features changed the interior; everything was to alter the car's outward appearances.

The coach-builders never did anything with de Vills or Fleetwoods, unless it was a Hearse/Limo conversion. They mostly worked with Seville and Eldorado bodies and would put a lot more useless shit on the car. So that is definitely a dealer added package.

DouglasJRizzo
05-30-11, 08:12 AM
I'd venture a guess that car is a 1982 or 83 DeVille that has a dealer installed trim package. Judging from the badges, it's not V8-6-4 but probably 4100 powered. In the 80s a lot of dealers were gussying up cars with gold emblems, "whites n wires", canvas tops, extra badging, etc to try and regain ground being lost to Lincoln and imports, mostly imports. Problem was, Cadillac was too busy shooting themselves in the foot with 120 horsepower 4100 V-8s while M-B had a gas guzzler tax on nearly every model and was selling everything they could import. People with serious cash to spend don't care about gas guzzler taxes.

It looks in decent shape. If the price was right it wouldn't be a bad buy. Be prepared to do engine work on the 4100 if it hasn't been done already. Many have been converted to Chev, Olds, and even Caddy 425 power, so don't be surprised if you find a different engine. For $1k-$2k it would be "ok".

jayoldschool
05-30-11, 11:02 AM
Many have been converted to Chev, Olds, and even Caddy 425 power, so don't be surprised if you find a different engine. For $1k-$2k it would be "ok".

I agree with the price assessment, but I disagree that many have been converted to Chev/Olds/425. 4100s that went bad got replaced with 4100s. Sure, a few enterprising owners have made swaps, buy not "many".

Bro-Ham
05-30-11, 06:03 PM
If it's a 1982 it has the HT4100, the V8-6-4 engine was only available in Cadillacs in 1981 with the exception of Cadillac factory produced limousines which had the V8-6-4 from 1981 through 1984.

There were special edition cars made by Cadillac, this does not appear to be one of them.

I agree with what Jay says above about engine conversions. I think it's sad that so many attractive Cadillac models were made with the HT4100 engines from 82-85. On this forum there are plenty of ambitious threads about converting the HT4100 cars to more robust engines but it seems these projects are monumentally time consuming and expensive for those who attempt to make it happen. I wish there was a simple engine swap kit for those who want to rescue HT4100 cars - it's a noble thing to keep these beautifully majestic cars rolling. :)

DouglasJRizzo
05-30-11, 10:27 PM
I agree with the price assessment, but I disagree that many have been converted to Chev/Olds/425. 4100s that went bad got replaced with 4100s. Sure, a few enterprising owners have made swaps, buy not "many".

I guess it's a subjective term. I've seen about half a dozen of them with engine swaps. The 4100 could work if maintained, but most owners never bothered and cooling problem plagued that engine. The later 4.5 and 4.9 engines addressed the lack of power, though..

outsider
05-30-11, 10:57 PM
probably depends on the area as to whether or not someone would have swapped the engine.

brougham
05-30-11, 11:08 PM
It's not even a coach builder car just different emblems. The 2 tone color probably isn't original either. It looks perfect for oversized rims. Maybe i even had them and someone got creative and took them back off for a better chance of selling it.

lincolncadillac
05-30-11, 11:40 PM
It's not even a coach builder car just different emblems. The 2 tone color probably isn't original either. It looks perfect for oversized rims. Maybe i even had them and someone got creative and took them back off for a better chance of selling it.

Probably right about the paint and big rims, This car is being sold by a local custom car shop. I tried to get by to inquire about it but they were closed and had locked the car in their storage area. will try again tomorrow.

cadillac kevin
05-31-11, 12:08 AM
I'd say the top was added at one point (because it has no B-pillar opera lights.) the C pillar opera lights look kinda like the ones on the coupes. the C pillar scripts appear to say cadillac (double tall letters near the end of the word) which was not factory.
it looks to be a stripped down car (lack of rocker chrome molding, aftermarket vinyl top) that was customized somewhat at one point in the past. I'd say it was done quite a while ago (in the 80's most likely).
the paint looks like it could be factory firemist paint.

lincolncadillac
05-31-11, 09:21 PM
Well contacted shop/vehicle owner he wanted $4500.00 for it :cookoo:

I asked him why 4500.00 he stated

1. because he paid 1800.00
2. he put a 2000.00 paint job on it
3. it has 67k on it
4. it has a nice stereo system
5. it runs really nice

He says it has the original engine in it ( but he didnt know which one and handed me the keys to go look at the car) i assumed a 4100 but after he told me 4500.00 i sort of lost interest. And the a/c didnt work

I think i pissed him off when i told him about the engine and how he may need to replace it soon.

He asked me how much i wanted to pay for it and i told him 1800.00. He sort of shut down after that.:D

cadillac kevin
05-31-11, 09:44 PM
thats a bummer. its a decent looking car but theres no way I would even think about paying half even half that for a caddy with a 4100.

csbuckn
05-31-11, 10:55 PM
I gotta admit, it looks nice to me. He might be able to 35 from somebody that doesn't know much about that motor.