: Cadillac ATS-V On the Way, Will Get Twin-Turbocharged V-6



Lord Cadillac
05-04-11, 04:24 PM
So says Car and Driver...

With the CTS-V and its awesome, supercharged V-8, GM's finest brand has a vehicle on par with offerings from Audi's Quattro, BMWs M, and Mercedes-Benzs AMG. And when the next-generation CTS rolls out, it will share its Alpha platform with a softtop convertible and a smaller sedan, the ATS. Given the success of the CTS-V, Cadillac insiders tell us an ATS-V also is a sure thing.

Theoretically, the CTS-Vs LSA V-8 would fit into an ATS-V, but that could cannibalize sales from the CTS-V. Rather, the ATS-V will be aimed directly at the next-generation BMW M3, which is expected to have a turbocharged inline-six. That, our sources tell us, is why the ATS-V will be powered by a twin-turbocharged 3.0-liter V-6 that should make around 380 hp.

Read more... (http://www.caranddriver.com/news/car/11q2/cadillac_ats-v_on_the_way_will_get_twin-turbocharged_v-6-car_news)

Lord Cadillac
05-04-11, 04:28 PM
380 horsepower out of a twin turbo 3.0 liter V6 is certainly possible. The thing is, BMW is getting 0-60 times of 4.8 seconds with their (purposely ECU weakened) 330 horsepower twin turbo 3.0 liter 335i. So 0-60 times had BETTER be "below 5 seconds" for a car with 50 more horsepower. Unless it's going to be heavy as hell.. If it weighs anywhere near the current BMW 335i, it'll be doing 0-60 in about 4.4 seconds and hitting the quarter mile in about 12.8...

bruff1977
05-05-11, 12:00 AM
Thanks for posting LC. First, I REALLY like the C/D rendering. Even the little separation from the trunk line and the CHMSL/spoiler. And the double crimps from the vents to the door handles... but hey, its a RENDERING. Second, if the powertrain available in the ATS-V is indeed a TTV6, numbers should be well over 400 horses/400 ft-lbs. Everyone knows the benchmark is the M3. Why not surpass it? GM's specialty is the small block V8. In my opinion, all Cadillacs with the V-series designation should have a V8. And CAFE shouldn't be a problem. It's not like this and the new CTS-V will be produced in surplus... The whole C/D article may be a diversion on what really will power the ATS-V. We all know how C/D is BMW's loudest cheerleader.

Lord Cadillac
05-05-11, 02:03 PM
I prefer to see a V8 as well - at LEAST as an option.. I'm sure most people into the V-Series Cadillacs feel the same..

0AT E03
05-06-11, 10:58 AM
I laugh at C&D. So funny.

jrosevear
05-06-11, 12:16 PM
So C&D thinks GM is going to spend big bucks developing a new high-po TTV6 that offers less power and no significant weight or MPG advantage over the GenV smallblock that's already funded and mostly developed, that will fit in the car without trouble, and that's likely to be preferred by most buyers?

I'm not seeing it.

A 450-ish hp NA V8 is the right drivetrain here -- performance-wise and cost-wise. Be very skeptical of rumors suggesting anything else.

Lord Cadillac
05-06-11, 07:50 PM
So we're almost definitely going to see a V8? :)


I laugh at C&D. So funny.

JimmyH
05-15-11, 06:54 PM
I am interested in the ATS-V. If it's a NA V8. No V6, no FI, and it better have three pedals. Hear me Cadillac?

Stingroo
05-15-11, 07:18 PM
^ Listen to this guy, Cadillac. But offer an auto first, then a manual. He'll purchase two. :lol:

JimmyH
05-15-11, 08:13 PM
edit:

I am interested in the ATS-V. If it's a NA V8. No V6, no FI, and it better weigh under 3600 lbs and have three pedals. Hear me Cadillac?

rand49er
05-15-11, 11:23 PM
I'd take a TTV6 BUT it has to have (available) three pedals, and anything over about 3,500-3,600 lbs would be a wasted effort ... 3,200-3,300 with something approaching 400 hp would be fantastic. AWD would be a BIG plus around these parts, too. Five-lug wheels and a proper E-brake for God's sake, also.

JimmyH
05-16-11, 12:46 PM
3200 lbs would be the cat's pajamas (<-WtH does that mean?) but I don't know if that's possible. 3600 would be acceptable. At that weight, 430hp from the current LS3 would be perfect. I don't think they will repeat the 6-lug fiasco, and a handbrake just takes up console space. Electronic brake would be awesome.

I know FI is the future, but at this point, I'd pass on it. sure, the ATS-v will compete with the twin turbo M3, but if I wanted an M3, I'd buy an M3. I don't want an M3. I want an American sport sedan.

The Tony Show
05-16-11, 01:56 PM
The ATS is sharing a platform with the next gen Camaro. Anyone who thinks they're not going to at least offer a V8 in it at some point is mental.

Lord Cadillac
05-16-11, 02:00 PM
Most insiders are claiming a V8 is definite (at this point in time). So I wouldn't be too worried.. The 3600 pound thing is probably not going to happen, though..

JimmyH
05-16-11, 02:17 PM
I am with you there. I can confirm, that my Camaro SS is currently getting me 25-26 mpg, so there is no reason not to offer a NA V8. I doubt a TT V6 will do much, if any better. the problem is, what will most consumers want? I don't see them offering both a V8 and TTV6.

They really need to start getting these weights down though. And I am not just talking the ATS. All manufacturers, across the board. With recent innovations in hydroforming and hi-strength steel, there is no reason these smallish mid-size cars should be weighing 4000 lbs. cut down on the sound deadening, make the windows thinner. more hi-strength (which is naturally thinner) steel. I think if the consumer has to choose between a sub-14, 25 mpg car that is noisy, and a sub-15, 22 mpg car that is quiet, most will choose the former.

The Tony Show
05-16-11, 02:23 PM
That's what logic says- Motor Trend or Consumer Reports saying that it's noisier than X competitor says otherwise, and no manufacturer wants to be the first one to blink and be labeled a rattletrap by the car rags.

Lord Cadillac
05-16-11, 02:24 PM
When it comes to sports cars, a loud interior is probably fine. It's just when they start making them for luxury companies that this becomes a problem. Maybe they could offer two versions. Maybe more sound deadening on a version that costs more.. I don't know.. But weight does need to come down across the board. Everyone is complaining about the 3-Series lately.. So Cadillac is not alone..

In regards to fuel usage - the 335i gets 30 miles per gallon as an average. I can't say if that's happening for every 335i owner but those that I'm familiar with do...

JimmyH
05-16-11, 04:53 PM
Something has to give. The federal government says 35mpg. No one, not consumers, not dealers, not manufacturers can ignore it. One way or another it WILL happen. You are only going to get so many Watts/Horsepower per gallon of gasoline. So, either a new energy source has to be implemented, or weight has to go down. I am for the latter. Improves efficiency and even more important to me, handling. Sound deadening is only a small part of the weight of a car, but all those little parts add up. My Camaro is an overweight pig. It's as quiet as my Enclave, and it doesn't need to be. They could trim some weight by removing the dynamat and making the glass thinner. Just my random thoughts for the day.

0AT E03
05-16-11, 06:22 PM
I am interested in the ATS-V. If it's a NA V8. No V6, no FI, and it better have three pedals. Hear me Cadillac?

I'd wager you'd be interested based on your criteria.

0AT E03
05-16-11, 06:26 PM
When it comes to sports cars, a loud interior is probably fine. It's just when they start making them for luxury companies that this becomes a problem. Maybe they could offer two versions. Maybe more sound deadening on a version that costs more.. I don't know.. But weight does need to come down across the board. Everyone is complaining about the 3-Series lately.. So Cadillac is not alone..

In regards to fuel usage - the 335i gets 30 miles per gallon as an average. I can't say if that's happening for every 335i owner but those that I'm familiar with do...

It isn't noise that drives up cost. It's features. The ATS has tons and tons of features, each with their own ECU and wiring, etc... Plus you've got things GM is working on for fuel economy (these are generic technologies and not ATS specific), like Aero Shutters, Electronic Assisted (instead of vacuum assisted) Brakes, Electronic Power Steering, etc...

These things add weight and complexity. The car is over-packaged (in my opinion) as is, and I think they are STILL adding features to it. Obviously some of those features won't be here for MY1, but for MY2 or even MY3.

JimmyH
05-16-11, 09:30 PM
I'd wager you'd be interested based on your criteria.

As long as it's not too expensive. ATS will probably hit the market in late 2012 they say. It would be reasonable to assume the ATS-V a year later. By early 2015, I should be able to pick up a nice low mileage ATS-V for 70% or so.