: HELP!!! 1994 Fleetwood idle and driving issue



mojazz1231
04-24-11, 07:00 PM
My 94 Fleetwood has another problem. Sometines but getting more frequently it begins to drive sluggish (sputters and putts), like it's not getting gas or the fuel fitler is pluged up or something. After it warms up it begins to do this. Sometimes I can smell gas after I start it up cold or warm.

It has even done this sputtering and putting at idel and seems like it is going to cut off.

When it begins to sputter and putt it will not accept more gas when I press down on the pedel but it seems like it wants to die out. Sometimes it does die out and other times it will accept more gas but only sputter and putt more.

Sometimes once I can get it to start without sputtering and all it will drive and behave normal. I don't get it.

At this time I do not have any codes to give you, will get them soon. Could this issue be related to bad fuel filter (I installed a new one about 2 yrs. ago) or PCV vavle or EGR valve? Please help.

outsider
04-24-11, 10:34 PM
could it be the opti cap? A full tune up might help solve this.

drmenard
04-24-11, 10:44 PM
I will bet all you need is sparkplugs, sparkplug wires, distrubtor cap and rotor.... And a smart thing to do is change the waterpump because you have to take it off to change the cap...This is a bit of a job... If you can do it yourself than you can do it for $200 in parts, $300 with a waterpump... You can pay a lot more than that if you don't shop around... I only use plugs that came stock in the car AC 41-906... As for the cap ..I found a place on the web that had accel distrubtor cap and rotor for $62 shipped ... you won't find a better price and it's a great cap... As for wires I use stock type replacements... A month ago I put on a set of advance Xzat brand and was real happy with the performance...If you have to pay someone to do all the work, your in for a big bill..If I was paying for the work I'd be looking for someone that don't charge too much...

mojazz1231
04-24-11, 11:23 PM
Opti spark and rotor was replaced 2 yrs. ago when I replaced the fuel filter. Spark plugs are not that old either. I noticed the the gas smell some months ago when I would start from cold or warm but car ran fine. I had an issue some years ago and replaced those parts plus fuel pump, water pump and ingnition coil.

mojazz1231
04-24-11, 11:24 PM
Full tune up was done some 2 years ago plus the opti spark and rotor.

sven914
04-24-11, 11:29 PM
Have you pulled DTC's? Do you know how to pull DTC's?

The smell of gas indicates a rich running condition. Your O2 sensor may be malfunctioning.

mojazz1231
04-24-11, 11:57 PM
I will pull the codes tommorrow. Would a faulty O2 sensor make it run as I described?

sven914
04-25-11, 12:06 AM
If the O2 is telling the computer that it's running lean, it will flood the engine with fuel. When it does this, it can drown out the spark and cause the engine to stall, so it can feel like the fuel is being cut. A rich mixture will cause the engine to be sluggish and slow to respond.

mojazz1231
04-25-11, 12:55 AM
This sounds like it might just be the problem. I'll get those codes tomorrow somehow. I have some instruction on how to get them. Thanks

N0DIH
04-25-11, 10:11 AM
We ALL seals replaced? I ask because only the dealer has those seals... A local shop likely will reuse some of those seals.


Full tune up was done some 2 years ago plus the opti spark and rotor.

Are cats plugged? With the age, could be too. When a cat is plugged, the O2 sees it as rich condition, and then leans it out to where it thinks it should be. In the presence of high exhaust pressure, O2 sensors (WB and NB) are skewed lean. The charts I have seen even as high as 1.2 or 1.3 lambda (17.64 to 19.11:1 AFR!)

mojazz1231
04-25-11, 10:42 PM
Ok, here are the codes I got from this car today. I don't know if it has ever been cleared before because there are a lot of codes, so here we go.

Number Code

00 64 and 44

01 44

02 111

03 00

04 23

05 169 ( I thought for sure I got 117 the first time I went though but 117 didn't show the second time around)

06 60

07 00

08 76

09 00

10 00

11 00

12 00

13 66

14 00

15 00

16 128

17 128

18 -117

19 -127

20 03

21 00

22 -101

23 54

24 17

25 00

26 56

27 00

28 145

29 17

30 107

31 107

32 00

33 00

34 128

35 128

36 69

37 50

38 04


Where can I find what these codes mean or if you know please explain if it's not to much trouble.

Thanks

mojazz1231
04-25-11, 11:25 PM
Not sure if cats are plugged or not. I can feel exshuast air at end of pipe. If cats where plugged I would feel nothing right?

sven914
04-26-11, 12:44 AM
I just responded to your PM regarding those codes.

bradmo
05-21-11, 02:54 PM
My '96 fwb is doing the exact same thing.
It has been raining here now for 2 days and just now when I started it, it started fine and ran fine, accepted the gas pedal as normal, but then as it warmed up about 2 minutes, it ran worse, until it only idles again - I can give it NO gas at all, it will die.
If I star it with the pedal down, it will run fine at about 2500 where it seems to run fine.
Could this be an egr problem?

N0DIH
05-21-11, 03:39 PM
EGR unlikely. But O2 maybe. O2 sensor will NOT cause a cold start problem, but it will be seen around 2-3 min after cold start. Unplug the O2 and see if the problem goes away. Not saying that O2 should be replaced blindly, I would datalog it and see what is going on.

A plugged cat will cause fuel mixtures to appear rich and the car in open loop (cold, first 2-3 min of start) is off data tables and fueling will be correct, even if cats plugged, but when in closed loop the PCM sees the "rich" mix and the PCM will lean it out and it will have driveability problems.

You can have an exhaust system shop check for excessive back pressure, they pull the O2 out and put in a pressure sensor. Not sure how much for them to do it though.



My '96 fwb is doing the exact same thing.
It has been raining here now for 2 days and just now when I started it, it started fine and ran fine, accepted the gas pedal as normal, but then as it warmed up about 2 minutes, it ran worse, until it only idles again - I can give it NO gas at all, it will die.
If I star it with the pedal down, it will run fine at about 2500 where it seems to run fine.
Could this be an egr problem?

bradmo
05-23-11, 10:03 AM
The car sits every winter for about 5 months, the mice could have filled the cats...
I drove it home 30+ miles 2 weeks ago - ran great, parked it for 10 minutes and then the problem started - would not start unless I held the pedal on the floor, would only run above 2500...
Just tried it again, still raining... Started good, ran great, but as soon as it started warmiong up, it ran worse and worse, until it will take NO pedal, under about 2500.
I'll try unplugging an O2 (I replaced both front O2s - #15703 Bosch new 3 years + 6000 miles ago) today and see what happens. I'll get the codes today also.
It has occasionally shown lean codes (both sides) the last 10,000 miles...
Fuel filter is new...
Coil is new...
Control module tested bad at low speed so that is also new...
Thanks!

N0DIH
05-23-11, 10:23 AM
Doubtful a mouse could go in that far. That would be a tall order to find an open intake and exhaust valve to go in. And complete darkness too. Even night vision won't help in there!

Sounds like a big vacuum leak, got a stuck PCV or leaking intake (has it been messed with?)

If cats are plugged bad enough it will backfire thru the intake.