Hey. I forgot what the difference was. Would somebody please remind me?

Thanks...

Boy am I glad to be in the market for one of these cars...

I've done a lot of reading, and the link below should answer ALL of your questions.

I think the main differences are the vinyl top and that in the '95 and '96 models the final drive ratio is different between the std. Fleetwood and the Brougham. It may have something to do with a towing package, but I'm not sure.

'93 and '94 have the same look, but the '93 doesn't have the LT1, and the '94 is missing a few extras like this "quiet cam" feature they added in '95 plus some extra sound deadening. Also, '95 was the first year they went with R-134a refrigerant in the A/C.

http://209.145.176.7/~090/awh/cfb.html#spec

Get the Brougham just because it has rear seat vanity mirrors!

There's other differences that I don't remember, but Kat will.

He will tell you to get the Brougham because they are less likely to be abused fleet cars.

All true. The difference between the base Fleetwood and Fleetwood Brougham are:
1. Unique trim style (seats, moldings, etc)
2. Driver memory seat
3. Heated front seats
4. Power lumbar adj.
5. Articulationg front headrests
6. Rear seat armrest w/dual cupholder
7. Rear compartment overhead illuminated vanity mirrors (except with astroroof)
8. New design fully padded vinyl roof
9. Unique cast aluminum wheels
10. Rear axle ratio

Thank you. All good points.. I like the fact that the Brougham will less-likely have been a fleet car. And, if the sound-deadening is true - that too. Of course, I like the idea of the quiter cam as well... I guess the vanity mirrors would be cool, too.. :)

Hmm... I want the moonroof... I guess I'll lose those rear vanity mirrors if I go that route.. IS there more sound-deadening? And IS the quieter cam actually noticable?

Personally, I would try and find one with the tow package..... It includes extra cooling fans, and an external tranny cooler (CRUCIAL to long lasting trannys)

And if your gonna do it, you might as well go all the way..... You wont be dissapointed......

You may not loose the rear vanity mirrors if you have a sunroof put in aftermarket......

Actually, the Brougham has all the towing package stuff except the HD cooling (radiator, mechanical fan, and waterpump)

Yes, Brougham gives you the 2.93 gear. That does not mean that the Fleetwood doesn't have 2.93 though. Mine does, but then mine is a shamefull R1P Commercial Chassis...

Actually, the Brougham has all the towing package stuff except the HD cooling (radiator, mechanical fan, and waterpump)
I didnt know that...... So its standard on the brougham but an option on the base.....

I always learn something new from you!!!! :thumbsup:

If I want the special cooling features - could I add them in later if the model I buy doesn't have them? Or would it be impossible to find or just not possible to do for one reason or another?

...AND... IS there more sound-deadening on the '95 Brougham than say a '94 Brougham or plain Fleetwood? And IS the quieter cam actually noticable?

There's two cooling system options actually. RPO codes VO3 and VO8. VO3 is "extra capacity" cooling and VO8 is heavy duty cooling. If you get the HD cooling option, you end up with a "mechanical" belt-driven fan and I believe waterpump too (don't quote me on the waterpump). The extra capacity system is (IMO) the better system since the electric fans will keep the engine cool even if sitting in traffic whereas the mechanical fan is just like older cars and depends on engine RPM to have full cooling.
And Dean, your car is an R1P "Livery Option" not a "Commercial Chassis". The V4U Coachbuilder delete package is generally considered the "Commercial Chassis".

There's two cooling system options actually. RPO codes VO3 and VO8. VO3 is "extra capacity" cooling and VO8 is heavy duty cooling. If you get the HD cooling option, you end up with a "mechanical" belt-driven fan and I believe waterpump too (don't quote me on the waterpump). The extra capacity system is (IMO) the better system since the electric fans will keep the engine cool even if sitting in traffic whereas the mechanical fan is just like older cars and depends on engine RPM to have full cooling.
And Dean, your car is an R1P "Livery Option" not a "Commercial Chassis". The V4U Coachbuilder delete package is generally considered the "Commercial Chassis".


What comes on the VO3? A higher capacity radiator and water pump? Are the electric fans the same? Is this all that would be needed to make a Brougham into a good towing package?

On that topic, is the towing package just a 'towing harness' plugged in-line to the standard wiring harness, or is it completey different harness front to back?

There is only one water pump but on the VO8 you get a belt-driven clutch fan, different radiator, and fan shrouds. It's a big goofy looking rig.
On the VO3 system, you get dual electric cooling fans, a small primary one and a larger secondary one.
As for the towing harness, as I recall, it's a different harness but a call to the local Caddy dealer could confirm it.

I got my info on the sound deadening and "quiet cam" from this book:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0873419251/qid=1060870727/sr=1-9/ref=sr_1_9/104-3249011-7851123?v=glance&s=books

I don't know if it's really noticeable, but it would make sense. The way I see it, the '93 model had the L05 engine, which wasn't a real powerhouse. In '94 they went with the LT1, and probably got some complaints, so in '95 they started refining.

To me, '95 or '96 would be the preferred way to go. But If I find a cherry '93 or '94 I'll jump on it. I'm more interested in the size, comfort, and look than I am the performance.

I got my info on the sound deadening and "quiet cam" from this book:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0873419251/qid=1060870727/sr=1-9/ref=sr_1_9/104-3249011-7851123?v=glance&s=books

I don't know if it's really noticeable, but it would make sense. The way I see it, the '93 model had the L05 engine, which wasn't a real powerhouse. In '94 they went with the LT1, and probably got some complaints, so in '95 they started refining.

To me, '95 or '96 would be the preferred way to go. But If I find a cherry '93 or '94 I'll jump on it. I'm more interested in the size, comfort, and look than I am the performance.

But if saving weight is your concern, then a base '94 would seem to be the option to seek.

To me, '95 or '96 would be the preferred way to go. But If I find a cherry '93 or '94 I'll jump on it. I'm more interested in the size, comfort, and look than I am the performance.
I feel the same...

If the one in the link below was a little less expensive, I'd take it...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2427404464&category=6149

I like that one, too.

You might consider doing an "advanced search" and looking through eBay's "completed items" listings.

It seems to me that most cars sold on eBay don't reach the reserve price. I know a guy who bought a '71 Delta 88 convertible AFTER the auction ended. The seller was discouraged because he had failed twice to get his reserve price. My buddy said it took him a couple of weeks, but he eventually just talked the guy into selling.

I may try that approach on the black Fleetwood I found here in Memphis.

You might consider doing an "advanced search" and looking through eBay's "completed items" listings.

Would that be "going, going, gone"? I only see one Fleetwood in there. A '75...

Sal,
Here are some completed auctions.....

1993 (http://search-completed.ebay.com/search/search.dll?MfcISAPICommand=GetResult&cgiurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2Fws %2F&siteid=100&ht=1&from=R7&ebaytag1=ebayreg&query=1993+Cadillac+Fleetwood&query2=1993+Cadillac+Fleetwood&search_option=1&exclude=&category0=6000&categorymap=6000&category1=6000&minPrice=&maxPrice=&ebaytag1code=0&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&status=completed)

1994 (http://search-completed.ebay.com/search/search.dll?MfcISAPICommand=GetResult&cgiurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2Fws %2F&siteid=100&ht=1&from=R7&ebaytag1=ebayreg&query=1994+Cadillac+Fleetwood&query2=1994+Cadillac+Fleetwood&search_option=1&exclude=&category0=6000&categorymap=6000&category1=6000&minPrice=&maxPrice=&ebaytag1code=0&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&status=completed)

1995 (http://search-completed.ebay.com/search/search.dll?MfcISAPICommand=GetResult&cgiurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2Fws %2F&siteid=100&ht=1&from=R7&ebaytag1=ebayreg&query=1995+Cadillac+Fleetwood&query2=1995+Cadillac+Fleetwood&search_option=1&exclude=&category0=6000&categorymap=6000&category1=6000&minPrice=&maxPrice=&ebaytag1code=0&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&status=completed)

1996 (http://search-completed.ebay.com/search/search.dll?MfcISAPICommand=GetResult&cgiurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2Fws %2F&siteid=100&ht=1&from=R7&ebaytag1=ebayreg&query=1996+Cadillac+Fleetwood&query2=1996+Cadillac+Fleetwood&search_option=1&exclude=&category0=6000&categorymap=6000&category1=6000&minPrice=&maxPrice=&ebaytag1code=0&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&status=completed)

Thank you. Maybe I should bid on this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2427422467&category=6149#lg

This one would have been okay - but sold.

http://www.autotrader.com/findacar/vdetail.jtmpl?car_id=111261487&dealer_id=21389244&car_year=1993&search_type=used&make=CAD&model=FLEE&transmission=&distance=50&address=11757&advanced=y&certified=n&max_mileage=&max_price=10000&min_price=&end_year=1996&start_year=1993&drive=&engine=&body_style=&advcd_on=y&doors=&fuel=&color=&cardist=27

Thank you. Maybe I should bid on this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2427422467&category=6149#lg




Better hurry Sal....only 2 hrs left.

I can't get in touch with the seller with the phone number listed - it just keeps ringing. Odd for a Toyota/Hyundai dealer. I checked out the feedback and I'm not liking what I see. I think I'm going to pass...

I just noticed on the feedback that its for cars sold across the country. You're right. Best to avoid it.

Here's a shortcut, Sal. This sometimes runs back as far as three months. You can't sort this by year, so you'll have to scan through all of it to find the 1993-1996 cars.

http://search-completed.ebay.com/search/search.dll?MfcISAPICommand=GetResult&cgiurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2Fws %2F&siteid=100&ht=1&from=R7&ebaytag1=ebayreg&query=fleetwood&query2=fleetwood&search_option=1&exclude=&category0=&categorymap=6001&category1=6001&minPrice=&maxPrice=&ebaytag1code=0&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&status=completed

The heavy duty cooling package has the tranny cooler, right???

I think so, but the towing package gets it and the Brougham package includes it too.

So its safe to say that the trannys (with good maintenace) can last the life of the car.....

Sal,
Have you tried listing your Vette in any Car Trader Publications for your price or Trade for a 95'-96' Fleetwood ? The Old Car Trader would be a good one to try.

http://www.cartrader.com

So its safe to say that the trannys (with good maintenace) can last the life of the car.....

I would have to say it's doubtful. Even with good maintenance, a tranny won't usually outlast an engine (unless we're talking a Cadillac engine ;)) and engines generally don't last the life of the car.

Define "life of the car."

Hell, when I was growing up, when one of the headlights burned out it was time to trade!

Define "life of the car."

Hell, when I was growing up, when one of the headlights burned out it was time to trade!


It might take a while, but you can find that "diamond in the rough" like we did after some dicouraging searching. The first three black '93 we looked at ranged from dented to needing work to being torn apart. Then, the next morning after calling on an ad that wasn't very descriptive, and talking to the owner who was very honest about not knowing much about the actual shape of the car (it was in his driveway, but very dirty, and always cared for by other people)--we had a weird feeling. While the first three tarted their nasty Caddy's up to be some of the best when they actually were awful, this guy who knew little had the best Fleetwood of the lot.

Not to mention, WE ONLY PAID $4,500 for this flawless gem! It's gorgeous, and now the best cared for car out of our three. I used to keep the new black Avalanche spotless day in and day out, but now the all white Caddy has me spoiled and in love.

You'll find one somewhere, sometime--I guarantee it!

Katshot-- maybe the tow package Wes was referring to was the optional V4P Tow Pkg? IIRC that included the V08 and shorter gears, sort of like supersizing a Big Mac value meal...?

Thanks,
Morgan

What are articulating front headrests? I guess I need to know the definition of "articulating"? :D

What are articulating front headrests? I guess I need to know the definition of "articulating"? :D

Hard to explain. They sit upright normally, or can be rotated/tilted forward to be closer to your head. No big deal really.

It means their bendy...... You can swivel them on the Y axis...... So heres a demo of what it means.........

Here is what they are normally

|

then you move them so that they look like this

\

Its really not a big deal......

It may sound wierd to you but to me - that's important.. My ETC had articulating headrests then.. WITH that feature - I was able to rest my head on the headrest comfortably while driving. Otherwise, I'd be looking at the upper part of the windshield...

Thanks for the explanation! :D

My car has that also, and without having the old lady "have the seat tilted so far foreward that your licking the steering wheel" I wouldnt be able to use the headrests without the articulation feature also!! :D

One more difference I just discovered last night. The Fleetwood Sedan doesn't have nearly as soft seats as the Fleetwood Brougham.. They're much like the seats in the DeVille - which I thought were a bit hard...