: So how "green" are you????



Aron9000
04-13-11, 07:23 AM
Well, what do you do to be "green"?

Do you keep your house uncomfortably hot or cold?
Do you invest in the latest efficient HVAC unit?
Do you at least caulk and weatherstrip your air leaks?
Do you drive a fuel efficient vehicle?(lol at Cadillac, since most past models have been "gas guzzlers")
Do you "recycle?"
Do you have squiggly light bulbs, the compact florescent lamps?

Post up what you do to be honestly green in your lifestyle.





Honestly I have been driving the shit out of my 25mpg 93 Toyota truck when the weather calls for a slight chance of "rain/sleet/snow". Sunny days I drive the 17mpg 91 Cadillac Brougham. Damn Cadillac has never been shinier since it hasn't gone out in nasty weather since I bought the truck.

I also recycle. Plastic bottles, aluminum cans, tin cans, any type of paper, any type of plastic #1-6, oil, coolant, and batteries.

I love my gas guzzling Cadillac. But I also feel a certain responsibility to Mother Earth.

I've converted my entire house to compact florescent lamps. I also change my air filter every month. Combined with some stratigic weatherstripping/caulking, I've managed to keep my electric bill under $130 every month this winter for a 1,100 square foot house with electric heat, circa 1981. I must admit this damn house was pretty overbuilt though.

Jesda
04-13-11, 08:08 AM
Stuffwhitepeoplelike.com

Stingroo
04-13-11, 08:25 AM
^ :lol: :lol: :lol: Jesda win.

I'm uh... not. But I live on a college campus and my lack of green-ness is from their own waste and excess. So whatever.

DouglasJRizzo
04-13-11, 09:21 AM
Well, as much as I love my Cadillacs, driving an 8.2L powered 3mpg hearse is not a practical thing no matter how much you may or may not care! LOL! Seriously, I have a 30mpg Cavalier that I drive for daily use, recycling is part of the program too.

It's more a matter of practicality and economy for me.

EcSTSatic
04-13-11, 09:28 AM
I'm no tree-hugger but I do try and act responsibly. It was probably ingrained in me from my Boy Scout days, way before it became fashionable.


I recycle everything that the local centers take. I won't burn a lot of gas just for the sake of turning in some metal though, I'm usually en-route to some other place nearby.
I have a 3 story 1920 house that I have made pretty energy efficient, mainly to reduce my out of pocket fuel costs.

insulation blown in walls, and about R35 in the ceiling
proper static attic ventilation including a new solar attic fan for added boost
new windows as rooms get remodeled
trees for shade and cooling

I ride a bicycle to save gas but mostly for exercise.
My daily driver is a Ford Escort that averages 27-30MPG. We plan our errands and leave the Cadi home.
I use CFDs for lights that stay on for long periods of time, like outdoor security.
I have a drip system in my gardens and a sprinkler system with timer and rain sensor to reduce water consumption
I chip and compost all of my leaves, twigs etc. Everything goes back in the soil. No need to buy the stuff.
I sail for recreation. I can get thru the whole season on about 3 gallons of gas. I feel for other who boat in stinkpots (powerboats)

lots of other similar efforts to save money and reduce my footprint.

slowstang305
04-13-11, 09:31 AM
Do you keep your house uncomfortably hot or cold? 69 degrees LOL COLD
Do you invest in the latest efficient HVAC unit? Nope
Do you at least caulk and weatherstrip your air leaks? Nope
Do you drive a fuel efficient vehicle?(lol at Cadillac, since most past models have been "gas guzzlers") Escalade
Do you "recycle?" Nope
Do you have squiggly light bulbs, the compact florescent lamps? Nope


well that answers that.

ejguillot
04-13-11, 09:51 AM
I'm green where being green saves me money.

Temp in the house? set it warmer in the summer, with fans to compensate. In the fall, winter and spring I use window fans instead of running the AC (and chop my power bill by more than 50%)

Invest in the latest efficient HVAC unit? No, I'm renting the house i'm in. I did put up heat reflecting window film on the windows, as the cost of the tint was recovered by the lower power bills in the last 2 summers. Now I'm money ahead.

Caulk and weatherstrip? No, the house is in pretty good shape, and when it's cool outside I turn off the AC and open a few windows.

Drive a fuel efficient vehicle? A Northstar Caddy is decent for its size, but not that efficient overall. But it's paid for, which frees up $ to pay for gas.

Recycle? Nope, don't see the $ upside for me (and a lot of recycling programs are money losers overall). I do reuse and repair old stuff where I can make it cost effective for me.

Use CFL's? Where appropriate (in the garage I have a 65W CFL that's equivalent to a 300W incandescent. Artificial sunshine! With it on and warmed up it's almost as bright in the garage as daytime with the garage door open.). Haven't found a CFL that plays nice with a dimmer switch yet, however.

gdwriter
04-13-11, 12:25 PM
Living in Oregon and working on a college campus, I get plenty of exposure to that green stereotype of the tree-hugging hippie, so it's not a term I apply to myself. We do a lot of work around sustainability at OSU; fortunately most of it is practical and recognizes natural resources can be used responsibly.

That said, I believe in respecting the Earth and using resources sensibly. It's also practical for the most part.

My house was built in 2003, and it's well insulated. I have a programmable thermostat so I'm not needlessly heating or cooling the house when I'm at work, but I keep it comfortable: 69 in the winter, 77 in summer. I live in a relatively mild climate without wild extremes in either direction, which helps. My winter natural gas bill can get up to $100, and it's often less. And in the summer, my electric bill averages between $50-$60. It also helps that we have cheap hydro-power in Oregon. I had to replace my air conditioner last summer, and while it's energy efficient, it's not top-tier efficient. Spending $2,000 was bad enough.

I don't consider my Cadillac a gas guzzler with a long-term average of 21-22 MPG and high 20s in straight highway driving. Plenty of V6 powered cars do the same or worse. Even some four cylinders aren't much better.

I have a number of CFL bulbs throughout the house and specifically installed them outside for when I leave them on during the winter. Unlike Rand Paul, I don't have a problem with them.

I've always had curbside, co-mingled recycling as a homeowner, so it's no more difficult than throwing something in the trash. The only thing I have to separate out is glass, and that's mostly wine bottles :alchi: and a few items that still come in glass jars.

hueterm
04-13-11, 01:17 PM
OMG, Gary...77 in the summer? I'd die. I only turn mine up that high if I'm going out of town.

To preface -- I am a proud denier of man-made global warming. It is a colossal hoax/shakedown by the ecoleft. Classifying CO2 as a pollutant means that every tree and plant should be uprooted. See how long we last then.

THERMOSTAT
In the summer, regardless of what Maobama says that we "can't keep our thermostats at 72"...if I'm in the house, it's 72 max and sometimes down to 68. If it's just the dog, I'll turn it up to 74 or 75. In the winter, it's between 68 and 70. My peak gas and electric bills are usually $200-250 in the peak months (maybe twice a season). Probably $100/mo. the rest of the time.

A/C and FURNACE
I have a home warranty, so when mine go out, I'll replace them with the highest efficiency that it will pay for.

WEATHERPROOFING
I could probably do a little of this, but my house was built in 2002, and is pretty well insulated.

LIGHTING
CFLs are a polluting, harsh lighting menace. That said, I use them in areas that are either kept on all the time (for cost considerations, not energy usage), or are hard to get to (fear of ladders). I have halogen spots in my kitchen that I love, and are low energy usage. I use incandescents everywhere else. I'm starting to hoard them. The ecoNazis can kiss my ass.

RECYCLING
I have to pay for a recycling bin (I'd rather have a third trash bin), so I use it if I have a lot of newspapers, magazines, cardboard, etc. that would otherwise fill up my trash bins. I only recycle if it's convenient. I don't sort in my house, but if I'm out and go to throw a water bottle (YES -- I said water bottle) away, I'll use a recycle bin if it's there. Otherwise, in the trash.

COMPOSTING
:umno:

WATER CONSERVATION
I water just enough to keep my grass from dying. I don't do much landscaping. Unless you get a separate meter for outdoor water use, ours is pretty expensive. If I watered much, I'd get one installed.

VEHICLES
I own 6 cars, encompassing 48 cylinders, 1732 horsepower and 24000 lbs. My '70 GP gets about 8MPG in town. The EXT gets about 12, and 17 on the highway. The DTS gets about 15 in town and 22 on the highway. The Concours gets about the same. The wagons get anywhere from 11-14 in town and 20-24 on the highway.

I also live a half mile from my office and a mile from the grocery store I use most often -- unlike some who want to get preachy on gas mileage, yet live 30 miles from work -- one way. My mileage comes into play on road trips -- typically going to STL to see my Dad, but other places too. Those trips are more discretionary, so I can make them if I want, or if gas hits $10/gallon, then not so much. I may swap my Concours for my old Riviera S/C that my Dad currently has. That will get me up to 25/26 MPG on the highway if I were to really need it. At anything close to what we're paying now, that's all I plan on doing. If it's permanently $10/gal, then I might look at some kind of diesel for my highway use.

So basically, what am I "doing to be green"? Nothing.

EDIT: I'm willing to hunker down for $5/6/7 gas -- whatever it takes for there to be such a public uproar, that we start drilling our own damn oil and get these prices down. Hopefully it peaks right at the election. I'm all for every kind of energy...oil, nukes, coal, nat gas, wind, solar, hydro, bio (if not foodstocks) whatever. But not at the expense of oil now.

Florian
04-13-11, 01:52 PM
could care less.


F

Stingroo
04-13-11, 03:53 PM
If you could care less, how much do you currently care, Florian?

;)

gdwriter
04-13-11, 04:08 PM
OMG, Gary...77 in the summer? I'd die.Wussy. :lol: 77 is quite comfortable in my house, especially with ceiling fans.


if I'm in the house, it's 72 max and sometimes down to 68.We have an HVAC system with a mind of its own at work, and when the thermostat is set at 72, it's often freezing in my office. 68? Do you wear a jacket inside?


Classifying CO2 as a pollutant means that every tree and plant should be uprooted. See how long we last then.Don't forget, plants also absorb CO2.

hueterm
04-13-11, 04:28 PM
That's the point...if it's so bad, then we might as well get rid of our holy trees that use it. Of course, we then lose our oxygen, but that's not a big deal........

Yes I am a summer wuss. Zip it! ;-)

Bro-Ham
04-13-11, 04:48 PM
I waste everything I can afford to - I'm an American for heaven's sake! I don't buy into the religion of environmentalism, I feel sorry for those who do. I guarantee my ice cold air conditioned house and gas guzzling cars make up for 2 or three hundred libs who think they are saving the earth by depriving themselves of life's simple comforts and pleasures; I'm so happy they're leaving more resources for me to consume. :)

gary88
04-13-11, 05:32 PM
I do what little I can like recycling, not buying bottled water, turning off power strips at night, using 6th gear around town :shifty

ga_etc
04-13-11, 05:43 PM
I guess I'm not very green, but try not to be overly wasteful. No recycling, very few CFLs, and a 350 powered Roadmaster as a DD.

Playdrv4me
04-13-11, 06:13 PM
I have one full sized truck to represent each of the big three. May as well be red.

Submariner409
04-13-11, 06:21 PM
Home is 2,500 sq.ft. - 68 in winter, 80 in summer. 6 ceiling fans.
12 month electric bill average is about $110/mo.
House was built in '87, every side wall and every interior wall is fully insulated.
Carrier high efficiency heat pump with a fossil fuel kit - no standby electrical coils
Well water from a deep, clean aquifer.
Hot water heater set at 120.
Septic system, maintained and pumped every 5 years. Non-smokers, no grease.
Separate washing machine collector and drain field.
3 large compost piles and mulch all leaves.
Recycle everything including coolant. Lube oil goes to Charlie for a shop furnace
Lotsa fluorescents - 1000bulbs.com - but they're slow outside in winter.
Cut, split, and stack our own hardwood and burn about 1.5 cords a winter.

That's the green stuff............other indulgences such as car, truck, boat, bourbon, ammunition, lawn tractor, the very fact of human existence, ................ not so "green".

gdwriter
04-13-11, 06:24 PM
I waste everything I can afford to - I'm an American for heaven's sake! I don't buy into the religion of environmentalism, I feel sorry for those who do. I guarantee my ice cold air conditioned house and gas guzzling cars make up for 2 or three hundred libs who think they are saving the earth by depriving themselves of life's simple comforts and pleasures; I'm so happy they're leaving more resources for me to consume. :)I don't believe I'm sacrificing any comforts or pleasures by my modest practices.

I keep my thermostat at 77 in the summer because it's comfortable. My electric bill last August was $45. If I needed it to be set lower to be comfortable, I can certainly afford to and wouldn't hesitate to do so. When I lived in Phoenix and faced summer electric bills in the hundreds, I gave up some comfort because a lower thermostat would just make the electric meter spin a lot faster.

I'm certainly no environmental extremist, but I think being wasteful out of spite is just silly.

Florian
04-13-11, 07:10 PM
If you could care less, how much do you currently care, Florian?

;)

is it possible to care less than zero? thats how much I care. Al Gore can kiss my ass.

F

concorso
04-13-11, 07:12 PM
is it possible to care less than zero? thats how much I care. Al Gore can kiss my ass.

FThen you mean you 'couldnt care less' ;)

concorso
04-13-11, 07:15 PM
I'm certainly no environmental extremist, but I think being wasteful out of spite is just silly.I wont make my life uncomfortable, but Ill make an effort if it doesnt change my entire way of life.

Bro-Ham
04-13-11, 07:34 PM
I don't believe I'm sacrificing any comforts or pleasures by my modest practices.

I keep my thermostat at 77 in the summer because it's comfortable. My electric bill last August was $45. If I needed it to be set lower to be comfortable, I can certainly afford to and wouldn't hesitate to do so. When I lived in Phoenix and faced summer electric bills in the hundreds, I gave up some comfort because a lower thermostat would just make the electric meter spin a lot faster.

I'm certainly no environmental extremist, but I think being wasteful out of spite is just silly.

I think liberals, democrats, the ciera club - all are silly. They legislate absurdity, abuse the legal system, and simply bully the masses into caring about saving energy when it has not been proven that our consumption of natural resources is harmful. As a result we have constricted oil production, far fewer nuclear power facilities than we should have, then these nuts have the nerve to make threats to the coal industry with "cap and trade," all of which tragically reduces jobs and profits in our country - not to mention the general human condition of great Americans feeling the need to embrace a lifestyle of not being comfortable, or not being able to do or go where they want without going broke or feeling guilty, all for the sake of political correctness, which results in people feeling the need to show how much they care by raising ridiculous topics such as this one. People buying into the liberal mantra, to me, is the epitome of silly. :)

ThumperPup
04-13-11, 07:51 PM
the past several generations have already screwed up the earth and polluted us to a point where we won't ever be able to get it back to how it should be to not be polluted as bad
we who don't have children can blame our parents and there parents and also ourselves for the darn crap we have put are selves in and our kids can blame us and them selves if you have kids

i belive that it way to far past and to polluted the being green is over rated
only good thing about a fuel officiant car is just that its fuel officiant and with today's gas prices well that helps us but if gas was 2.5 a gallon
it wouldn't matter i wouldn't get a car just because it uses less gas
cause it doesn't matter we already screwed up the earth

i think all the green ppl should just stop trying to turn us green it aint going to work cause some of us know how beyond return we are
when i was 15 i use to volunteer and go around collecting donations to help support the try to clean up lake Erie but we stopped about 3 years latter realizing its to late to make a difrance

i say drill oil in every state that we can
forget about EPA rules regulations and laws and lets just do what we can to survive the economy
i think you should realize that by bringing a child into the world as bad as it is now in so many ways
your just ruining a life and for sure if they bring a child in this world well put it like this i think its going to be so bad in the next 70 years that where going to have to walk around with oxygen and gas masks just to walk outside and not be afraid of dieing

gdwriter
04-13-11, 08:06 PM
far fewer nuclear power facilities than we should haveMaybe it was a flawed design or flawed location, but what's happening in Japan with nuclear meltdowns has given me pause. We have a strong nuclear engineering program at OSU that is developing passive safety systems, but I want to know more about how such plants would withstand and earthquake, tsunami or other natural disaster.

I don't begrudge you your 425-cubic-inch Sedan de Ville and wouldn't mind owning one myself. What I recycle or where I set my thermostat is not done out of guilt, political correctness or following a political agenda. I simply do it.

hueterm
04-13-11, 08:29 PM
Didn't the Japanese reactor survive the quake just fine, and then their power supply was taken out by the tsunami, which led to the meltdown? If so, that's not the fault of the reactor -- that's the fault of whatever idiot decided to build on land that low that is that close to the shore.

If it's close enough to be leaking underground into the ocean...they're closer than they ever needed to be...

V-Eight
04-13-11, 09:28 PM
Yeah, they built it to withstand earthquakes, which it did. The problem was that water leaked into the basement and blew the generators.

Aron9000
04-14-11, 12:20 AM
Yeah, putting a nuke plant on the ocean was not the best idea. Its a shame because nuclear is one of our countries best options to help us become energy independent. Now its like three mile island all over again, nobody is going to invest in nuclear for another 10 or 20 years.

cadillac kevin
04-14-11, 12:37 AM
I do what I can, as long as it doesnt waster my time, money, or inconvenience me, etc. I don't waste that much- learned that in boy scouts as well as normal life. I drive a rwd minivan as a DD (gets over 20 mpg). I have always recycled because scrap metals=$. its usually hot in the summer and the winter at my house. I'll turn on the AC when it becomes unbearable. I use a boiler and radiators in the winter, and have a tankless water heater (both save on gas bill quite a bit). I do admit to splurging on certain things. my caddy gets 9 mpg. and I do so enjoy romping on the gas pedal when I'm next to a prius just to spite them and their slow ass car and their "I'm green because its a fashion statement" way of life. if it wasn't the "it" vehicle right now, or the "in thing" to be green, and gas wasnt $4 a gallon, no one would drive them.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-14-11, 12:48 AM
I'm GREEN with envy whenever I see somebody roll by me in a nice fullsized classic luxury sedan.

Jesda
04-14-11, 01:26 AM
I don't do anything egregiously bad like dump coolant in the yard, but otherwise I don't go out of my way for Mother Earth. When a tornado, earthquake, or hurricane hits I'm convinced she's an abusive parent.

Playdrv4me
04-14-11, 01:55 AM
If it saves me money, then I'm all for it. For example I might consider the power draw between a Plasma and LCD TV in my purchase decision, despite Plasma's obvious picture quality advantages, because as much as the TV is on (constantly), that can be a major parasitic draw on the energy bill over time. In a small room, it might heat up the room enough to require the A/C to be on more often etc. Other than practical choices like that, I don't give a flying iota.

johnny kannapo
04-14-11, 01:58 AM
I recycle. I don't waste.

The EPA can kiss my ****ing ass.

Krashed989
04-14-11, 04:24 AM
- I recycle
- I hardly ever have the lights turned on (which are CFL's and not all slots for bulbs have a bulb)
- Everything in the house is on powerstrips, and they are all switched off when not in use.
-Try to carpool with friends as often as I can

I'm a mechanical engineering student who is largely into the self sustainability scene. I have numerous designs for things that I dont have the means to put together. Most of them having to do with renewable energy and stuff like that. I am actually currently working on a mock-up of a VAWT (Vertical Axis Wind Turbine) that I designed. It's unique in the fact that it has, built into it, an overspeed mechanism that uses centrifical force to rotate the blades and close itself into a drum. As it slows down the blades will open up again. This makes it a set it and forget it sort of system. No need to worry about frying your circuits or the turbine spinning itself to pieces in a storm.

Lately I've been debating with myself over converting my car to run partially on hydrogen from doing electrolysis of water. I would buy a deep cycle battery and a small solar panel to charge the battery when the car is sitting at home. Then when driving have the battery powering electrolysis to get hydrogen to run through the engine. I tallied it up to be about $300-$400 to make it work.... Not sure how much gas it would save though.... it would be a neat experiment... If I do it right it should pay for itself in around a year (especially with todays gas prices, $4.59 for regular here), hopefully less.

hueterm
04-14-11, 07:53 AM
That will do wonders for your HGs, I'm sure...

Submariner409
04-14-11, 08:12 AM
Yeah, putting a nuke plant on the ocean was not the best idea. Its a shame because nuclear is one of our countries best options to help us become energy independent. Now its like three mile island all over again, nobody is going to invest in nuclear for another 10 or 20 years.

One inherent problem with pressurized water reactors is COOLING. An incredible amount of circulating water is needed - exactly the same as airflow through a car radiator. Lake water, river water, sea water - the temp rise through the reactor secondary water cooling system is about 1 - 3 degrees, and it's not water that has gone "through" the reactor. There's the primary system, water pressurized to about 1500 psi - that is moved through the reactor vessel by HUGE coolant pumps. The primary water heats to 450 degreesF. It is then piped to steam generators - boilers - where it is run through a tube labyrinth. Treated secondary system water is sprayed over the 450 degree tubes and it flashes to steam - that secondary steam is NOT radioactive. The steam is drawn out of the generator, dried, and sent to turbines which turn huge generators. That dry steam is then condensed by huge coolers (remember the cooling water thing ?) and the secondary water is then pumped back to surge tanks where it begins the steam cycle again. Depending on power (heat) demands, the control rods (centered in the fuel rods) are moved in and out - thus allowing more or less nuclear fission - heat. When the reactor is shut down - control rods completely inserted, there is still a LOT of residual heat from fuel decay, so several main coolant pumps idle in SLOW to keep the core "cool". When that slow speed pump cooling is lost, the core slowly overheats, the primary system ruptures, and that's what's leaking in Japan: primary coolant. Whew !

Remember, guys - as with a few other CF members, I lived on top of one of these things for about 17 years - and I have less whole body radiation than any of you. The U.S. Navy runs good reactors.

"Green"..............remember the Soviet Union ? They had several nuclear powered ice breakers. One, I forget her name, had a nuclear accident - killed most of the crew. The entire ship was (radiation) hot as a firecracker. What did they do ??? They tied two diesel tugs to it, and during the spring thaw in the Barents Sea they radio-controlled the two tugs to drag the icebreaker into the northern ice field where it sits to this day. Green.

(Googled it - she was "LENIN".)

EcSTSatic
04-14-11, 08:41 AM
It seems there are several people out there who are not green in the economical sense. Consider this sage advice: You make your money twice, when you earn it and when you spend it.

Stingroo
04-14-11, 08:51 AM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenin_%28nuclear_icebreaker%29

Interesting.

ejguillot
04-15-11, 12:12 PM
Can't be the Lenin - according to Wikipedia it's now a museum ship. I'm sure that there are other examples of the Soviets doing that (taking radioactive equipment and waste and dumping it in the Arctic)

concorso
04-17-11, 07:29 PM
I think liberals, democrats, the ciera club - all are silly. They legislate absurdity, abuse the legal system, and simply bully the masses into caring about saving energy when it has not been proven that our consumption of natural resources is harmful. As a result we have constricted oil production, far fewer nuclear power facilities than we should have, then these nuts have the nerve to make threats to the coal industry with "cap and trade," all of which tragically reduces jobs and profits in our country - not to mention the general human condition of great Americans feeling the need to embrace a lifestyle of not being comfortable, or not being able to do or go where they want without going broke or feeling guilty, all for the sake of political correctness, which results in people feeling the need to show how much they care by raising ridiculous topics such as this one. People buying into the liberal mantra, to me, is the epitome of silly. :)The problem with this is that many people who 'waste' think that anyone who 'conserves' is buying into liberal media. That works both ways, to be fair. You cant use much energy without being called a meat eating gas guzzling gun toting god loving gay hating conservative. And you cant try to use energy more wisely without being labelled a tree hugging weed smoking lazy pansy-ass unpatriotic hippie. Holyhyperpartisanism, hellcats! I dont buy into this idea that electric vehicles will save the world, but I also dont feel the need to roast through a tank of fuel just because some random said I shouldnt drive a V8.

drewsdeville
04-17-11, 07:34 PM
The problem with this is that many people who 'waste' think that anyone who 'conserves' is buying into liberal media. That works both ways, to be fair. You cant use much energy without being called a meat eating gas guzzling gun toting god loving gay hating conservative. And you cant try to use energy more wisely without being labelled a tree hugging weed smoking lazy pansy-ass unpatriotic hippie. Holyhyperpartisanism, hellcats! I dont buy into this idea that electric vehicles will save the world, but I also dont feel the need to roast through a tank of fuel just because some random said I shouldnt drive a V8.

Nice, well said.

ThumperPup
04-17-11, 08:45 PM
another non green adventure today would be radiology and x-rays at the clinic at least i think those are not green friendly

Destroyer
04-17-11, 11:44 PM
I bought an Escort ZX2 to be "green". Well, not really, it was to save some green from driving my extended E250 daily. I really dislike economy cars and this one is no exception. It's got all the power shit and all but it's gay and I feel gay driving it much like I did my '05 Suzuki Forenza. As soon as the gas prices fall, so will this car.

johnny kannapo
04-18-11, 03:18 AM
I actually own & use this ridiculous thing.

http://i826.photobucket.com/albums/zz183/billytheshoe/f04e47df.jpg?t=1303111025