: The last year of the Town Car. In pictures...



thebigjimsho
03-18-11, 01:22 PM
Production is supposed to stop in August. Just figured I would poast some pics for those who wanted to see. If I get some nice cityscapes or otherwise picturesque shots, I'll poast em up here...



http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779234.jpg




Give credit to Ford/Lincoln for giving the TC the most stately appearance of any car on the road today. Added tint and whitewall tires FTW!
http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779232.jpg




Furnished with papers, magazines, Kleenex and water.
http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779230.jpg




http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779226.jpg




http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779222.jpg




Fit and finish has never been the big Lincoln's strong suit. Fortunately, the client who enters can't see the yellow foam of the seat cushion. I'll try to fix that...
http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779221.jpg




When I first saw these, I was disgusted. The headrests are easily 4 times the size of the old ones.But they are also 4 times more comfortable so they'll stay. Cadillac has done the same thing with the DTS...
http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779219.jpg




The price increase over my 2007 gets me such niceties as these door sills. :swank:
http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779215.jpg




$41G does not get you built-in navigation. Nor did it ever. And have fun trying to get your local parts guy what you need to get navigation that is available on every other Town Car trim and every other Lincoln, for that matter. No matter, the NJ dealer gives you many aftermarket options. This Pioneer has some negatives in the navigation but some pluses, too. The audio, however, is typical Pioneer goodness...
http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779213.jpg




She is such a baby...
http://pic90.picturetrail.com/VOL2241/2287429/23736070/395779212.jpg

thebigjimsho
03-18-11, 01:27 PM
And yes, that is Oprah's "O" magazine. I try to cater to all types of clients...

orconn
03-18-11, 01:49 PM
I am surprised rhat the seating surfaces of the leather seats are not perforated.

OffThaHorseCEO
03-18-11, 01:55 PM
what benefits does perforation allow?

thebigjimsho
03-18-11, 02:19 PM
Cooling. These Lincolns are bare-boned. Not only are they not perforated, they are a leatherette type of surface. My '07 had a weak A/C system and if I didn't wear a lightweight suit material, I'd be soaked at the end of the day. The leather in the '07 and '11 doesn't breathe as well as my '04 did...

orconn
03-18-11, 02:20 PM
Perforation of leather seating allows for better dispersion of body heat than a non-perforated surface; i.e. it is cooler in hot conditions. It also allows the seat to be heated or cooled more efficiently.

thebigjimsho
03-18-11, 02:21 PM
And, thus, I elaborated on your elaboration...

gdwriter
03-18-11, 05:48 PM
A tach in a Town Car. Color me surprised.

ga_etc
03-18-11, 05:49 PM
Good looking car Jim. Keep us posted on how she holds up vs the others.

Playdrv4me
03-18-11, 06:48 PM
This deserves a soundtrack.

SDCaddyLacky
03-18-11, 06:51 PM
How's the interior quality in those newer TC's? Does it creak and have cheap plasticky feel? Also how is the ride and overall quietness?

Because I hear many TC owners say that the older ones from the 90's are better compared to the newer models. Like less engine noise, more comfortable seats, better quality leather, and a larger interior.

Jesda
03-18-11, 07:10 PM
This deserves a soundtrack.

Gotta get down on Friday





How's the suspension?

I~LUV~Caddys8792
03-19-11, 12:22 AM
Very nice Jim. It's sad to see the Town Car name (that originally started in 1959-60, then was returned for good in 1970 as an option on the Continental and made a separate model in 1981) die. RIP Panther platform and body on frame luxury sedans. I'm also surprised to see a tach in a Town Car, but I recall FoMoCo putting them in all of the Panthers in about 2007 or so.

How'd you get leatherette? I'm surprised that's even offered in an LTC.

Playdrv4me
03-19-11, 02:08 AM
Very nice Jim. It's sad to see the Town Car name (that originally started in 1959-60, then was returned for good in 1970 as an option on the Continental and made a separate model in 1981) die. RIP Panther platform and body on frame luxury sedans. I'm also surprised to see a tach in a Town Car, but I recall FoMoCo putting them in all of the Panthers in about 2007 or so.

How'd you get leatherette? I'm surprised that's even offered in an LTC.

I was surprised to see that as well, especially in the extended length model. But I bet it lasts longer than leather.

Stingroo
03-19-11, 02:51 AM
Gotta get down on Friday

Chauffeur in the front seat, empty in the back seat.


Gotta make my mind up, WHICH SEAT CAN I TAAAAAAAAKE?!

ThumperPup
03-19-11, 03:01 AM
always loved lincolns always will love the oldies but these new Lincolns are POS i mean after the T/C uis goen there isnt another lincoln left that they could pay me to take

Aron9000
03-19-11, 03:54 AM
always loved lincolns always will love the oldies but these new Lincolns are POS i mean after the T/C uis goen there isnt another lincoln left that they could pay me to take

:werd:

I used to detail this old lady's 96ish Town Car, pain in the ass car with white leather and BBS wheels. Anyways, the leather in that thing was A LOT nicer than what they put in the newer 2003+ ones.

SDCaddyLacky
03-19-11, 06:50 AM
The newer TC's look really cheap inside for such an expensive car. Even the seats look uncomfortable, starting in the mid to late 90's is when the seats started to look flatter and less padded. Also the older 90's TC's Sig and Cartier seats had a deep lush color to them, especially in red or green, the overall quality just looked much better than anything produced today. IDK but I really never cared for the bubbly TC's, they truly lost there character after 97 even though I love TC's.

DouglasJRizzo
03-19-11, 10:28 AM
Ford just didn't know what to do with this vehicle anymore. The livery/funeral business kept it alive, but they didn't know how to maintain it as a flagship. It appears that they're trying to redefine what upscale luxury is with the current crop of Lincolns. They're nice, but nothing to really get me going. I'm still inclined to prefer RWD and body-on-frame construction. It seems that both Cadillac and Lincoln are trying to out-Acura each other. Yuk.

ThumperPup
03-19-11, 01:09 PM
those who really know the passion i have for Lincolns
if really more then the passion i have for Cadillac and if you know the passion i have for my Seville with all iv gone threw with it to keep her alive
then it might make you sick to find out what i used to go threw with my love for my Lincolns i used to have
the one thing that made me go with the Seville
was i could not find a Lincoln that was Exceptionable for me that passed my inspections of looks and qulity when i was getting a new car that was in my price rang
was not going to spend more that 10k 2 years ago when i boought the seville

and i was willing to go up to 10k on a 11 year old Lincoln if i found it in the shape i would except it in
with in 2 weeks of driving in and out of town going up to as far as TN to look at a Lincoln 98 Mark VIII LSC and Continentals i drove to buffalo drove to Downers Grove IL
KY TN Dayton ohio NYC NY LI Gettysburg PA
not one passed my thought so how a Lincoln should look and drive
no one took care of them
so i went with the Seville

thebigjimsho
03-19-11, 03:28 PM
A tach in a Town Car. Color me surprised.
Yeah, my '04 didn't have one. I believe they added it in '06. Still, it doesn't have a redline and I'm really not sure where it is...

drewsdeville
03-19-11, 03:39 PM
An even 5,500 for the 16 valve in the panthers, I believe. The torque converter is the limitation, not the engine.

thebigjimsho
03-19-11, 03:55 PM
How's the interior quality in those newer TC's? Does it creak and have cheap plasticky feel? Also how is the ride and overall quietness?

Because I hear many TC owners say that the older ones from the 90's are better compared to the newer models. Like less engine noise, more comfortable seats, better quality leather, and a larger interior.
Well, I can't argue that the leather is better since I hate its lack of breathability. But it certainly is more durable. As for seat comfort, the older cars may have been cushy but I live in these cars and the new ones are 24 hour comfortable(if need be). The engine noise seems comparable and the exhaust is slightly audible in the new ones. In '98 they really rounded the TC out. Interior space was less and being rounded gave a somewhat claustrophobic feel inside. The '03 remodel is an in-between of the 2 previous designs and a great compromise. The newer cars don't have the warehouse feel of the original but you certainly get more rear interior space in the L version like mine.

The Chrysler 300 pre-2011 has a cheap, plasticky feel. The TC isn't uber-luxurious but everything is soft to the touch and comfy and fitting of our line of work. Not opulent, but pleasant looking and comfortable.

The ride and handling of any Town Car from '98 onward DESTROYS pre '98 models. There are those who don't understand refinement and argue the opposite, but they put float above anything else. Pre '98 TCs floated so badly that you could feel the recirculating ball steering shiver on large wallows as the front end scrambled for control. On I-93N leaving Boston there was one bridge crossing over Montvale Ave. I always used to count how many bobs the old TCs would make. Seriously, the car would bob up and down up to 5 times. I finally was able to figure out brake applications to limit that to 2 or 3. But to apply brakes to modulate body pitch? Awful. The '98 car would bob 2-3 times, max. The newer ones are even better. I don't even think of that bridge anymore as I cross it. To me, the post '98 cars are much more a driver's car(relatively speaking) with better damping and less roll for better cornering. Ultimately, you can feel slightly more in road imperfections than the older ones but it's still one of the smoothest cars on the road. Now, my '04 is still my favorite riding TC ever. That extra wheelbase really adds to the serenity. But, in '07 they changed the air springs. They went with a more durable limo spec spring that gave my '07 the impact harshness of a truck. Awful. It still would wallow over long dips but frost heaves and bridge joints made the TC buck and shock the chassis like an old truck. Honestly, my CTS-V took those bad surfaces better. Within a couple years, Ford got their heads out of their asses and starting fixing the ride. My '11 is much, much better than the '07, although not quite as serene as my '04 was. But, overall, I'm very happy.

thebigjimsho
03-19-11, 04:03 PM
The newer TC's look really cheap inside for such an expensive car. Even the seats look uncomfortable, starting in the mid to late 90's is when the seats started to look flatter and less padded. Also the older 90's TC's Sig and Cartier seats had a deep lush color to them, especially in red or green, the overall quality just looked much better than anything produced today. IDK but I really never cared for the bubbly TC's, they truly lost there character after 97 even though I love TC's.

I thought the '98-'02 TCs were atrocious looking. I called them the Batmobiles. But I love, love, love the '03- look. That brick shape of the -'97 got killed off just in time. For the time, though, they looked apropos.

Again, the seats in newer TCs are more comfortable than the older ones. The single center console that flips up for seat #6 is much more comfortable than the captain's chair style of the -'98 models.

Playdrv4me
03-19-11, 04:16 PM
Yea, I don't get all the post-'03 TC hate either. It is really laughable to me that anyone would consider the '90s cars a better overall car than the height of the later redesign which was 2003-2004 (Cartier and Ultimate). Sure it was still a land yacht, but what I noticed about the 2003 and up cars is that they had more of a GLIDE than a FLOAT, a reassuring road feel.

Also the 2003 and up cars (in the higher trims) have one of the best and fattest wood and leather steering wheels I have EVER put my hands on. In 2003 I had just bought my first '01 STS and went to California on a business trip on which my co-worker somehow figured out how to rent us a then new 2003 TC with the wood and leather wheel. I remember thinking how that wheel absolutely blew away the tiny little sliver of rim on my STS. They also had Xenon lights available starting in 2003, heated and cooled seats, a reasonable Alpine sound system, Nav finally became an option, they got that trick power trunk, and while the seats may not have felt like barca loungers anymore, but they were firm enough for comfort over long distances. The 2003+ also had a generous amount of power considering the slow evolution of that engine.

I'll agree the square '95+ cars looked stately, but then, I wouldn't take one of THOSE over a Fleetwood either. The 2003+ ones are just a night and day difference where it counts.

thebigjimsho
03-19-11, 04:24 PM
:werd:

ThumperPup
03-19-11, 05:12 PM
when was it 98-02 i did not like but was it 03 they changed the trunk made it a little lower and little longer gave the look a hole new feel

in 97 Ford Lincoln started to realize they made a mistake with front airbags and front air suspensions they switched i think first year they stopped using them was in 97 but not in the Lincoln T/C for some reason they waited till 98 to do that if im correct but maybe im wrong
i know in 97 the Continental got a new front Suspension switching from air and electronic to just electronic
they decided not to mess with the Mark Viii since it was its last year in 98 and they decided that in 97
they tested the new fron suspension in the Continental as there mule and they liked it i believe they then swapped the front for more of a passive i think no front bladder in 98 from what i have heard i never owned a town car
never really wanted a town car they where not my thing
but i belive the last straw i had with Lincoln was when i heard ford was dropping the panther but that was a rumore back about 2 and 3 years ago was the first time i heard that they finally decided to make it true
the first screw up was the Mark III dropping that sorry but just plain old dumb
then i was in shock in 01 when they announced no more Continentals after 02 then when they said the LS would be History i was like at my last straw then i finaly hit my last nerve when they said panther would be retired also that was in awee like dammmmmm WTF are they thinking

drewsdeville
03-19-11, 05:57 PM
in 97 Ford Lincoln started to realize they made a mistake with front airbags and front air suspensions they switched i think first year they stopped using them was in 97 but not in the Lincoln T/C for some reason they waited till 98 to do that if im correct but maybe im wrong


No panther vehicle ever got any type of air suspension in the front. All were regular coil springs and shocks.

thebigjimsho
03-19-11, 06:49 PM
No panther vehicle ever got any type of air suspension in the front. All were regular coil springs and shocks.
Incorrect.

























http://auto.indiamart.com/bus/panther-bs-II/

drewsdeville
03-19-11, 07:24 PM
lulz. I stand corrected

XD

Stingroo
03-19-11, 07:30 PM
I c wut u did ther.

thebigjimsho
03-20-11, 12:06 AM
hmm...

ThumperPup
03-20-11, 12:50 AM
deleted

I~LUV~Caddys8792
03-20-11, 02:31 AM
To be honest, I never paid much attention to the 98+ Town Cars, especially the 1998-02's. I thought those were just downright ugly, and the 03-11's, while still on the same basic body, with the same basic whalish profile, looked a lot better overall. Still though, I think the 1990-97, especially the 1995-97, was the better looking Town Car, and such I put such an emphasis on a vehicle's looks when I purchase, I'd always go for a 1995-97 model over the newer ones, no matter how nicer the newer ones drove.

In 2006 or 2007, my Cadillac got hit and was in the body shop, and my insurance company gave us a brand new Town Car loaner. Because I was only 19-20 at the time, I didn't get to drive it, but I remember that my Cadillac's seats were better IMO...softer, deeper and more plush, but the Town Car was a lot quieter, especially in terms of engine noise. My dad had told me that the Lincoln wasn't as quick as my Cadillac, nor was it as sharp on it's feet. I rode in it a few times and I do remember it having a much more controlled ride than all of the 1990-97's I'd previously driven. Those things, especially the 1990-94's, were SO soft and SO floaty that a friend of mine got seasick when he rode along on a test drive in a '94 Executive Series in '05 or '06. I've driven a few '80s era Town Cars as well, and even those don't float as much as a '90-97 Town Car.

Destroyer
03-20-11, 02:43 AM
Lincoln stayed true to it's roots, Cadillac did not. I respect Ford for that. I was always a GM/Cadillac man but now I'm more of a Ford/Lincoln man. Damn you GM for making me switch to the dark side. I own 2 Fords and an '03 Jag that was technically owned by Ford at the time. All 3 vehicles have been stellar as far as reliability is concerned.

ThumperPup
03-20-11, 02:44 AM
To be honest, I never paid much attention to the 98+ Town Cars, especially the 1998-02's. I thought those were just downright ugly, and the 03-11's, while still on the same basic body, with the same basic whalish profile, looked a lot better overall. Still though, I think the 1990-97, especially the 1995-97, was the better looking Town Car, and such I put such an emphasis on a vehicle's looks when I purchase, I'd always go for a 1995-97 model over the newer ones, no matter how nicer the newer ones drove.

In 2006 or 2007, my Cadillac got hit and was in the body shop, and my insurance company gave us a brand new Town Car loaner. Because I was only 19-20 at the time, I didn't get to drive it, but I remember that my Cadillac's seats were better IMO...softer, deeper and more plush, but the Town Car was a lot quieter, especially in terms of engine noise. My dad had told me that the Lincoln wasn't as quick as my Cadillac, nor was it as sharp on it's feet. I rode in it a few times and I do remember it having a much more controlled ride than all of the 1990-97's I'd previously driven. Those things, especially the 1990-94's, were SO soft and SO floaty that a friend of mine got seasick when he rode along on a test drive in a '94 Executive Series in '05 or '06. I've driven a few '80s era Town Cars as well, and even those don't float as much as a '90-97 Town Car.

why where you not allowed to drive the loaner ?
when its insruance paying for a rental car atleast in every state i ever had a policy in who ever is on the insruance policy gets to drive the car well atleast who ever had there name on the claim
during the time of loss

atleast it never used to be that under 25 didnt get to drive without an extra amount each day

96Fleetwood
03-20-11, 08:08 AM
I thought the 2003 Cartier version was the last of the quality Town Cars. My parents sold theirs last year and it was in excellent shape with only 78K miles on it. I have rented quite a few Town Cars in the last couple of years and none of them had the nice leather and options the Cartier did. They replaced it with a 2006 DTS Performance. Goodbye TC, you will be missed.. just like the B/D bodies.

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g3/cadillaclover/towncar/P6190392.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g3/cadillaclover/towncar/P6190373.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g3/cadillaclover/towncar/P6190379.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g3/cadillaclover/towncar/P6190375.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g3/cadillaclover/towncar/P6190394.jpg

I~LUV~Caddys8792
03-20-11, 09:58 AM
I've often heard that the '03 Cartier was the last truly good Town Car, what did it have over the other models in it's time that was so nice? I know in the '90s era Town Cars, the Cartier had super soft "cartier exclusive" leather, rear vanity mirrors, and other options as standard..

Stingroo
03-20-11, 11:03 AM
I wonder what the difference is between the Cartier and Sandy's "The Limited".

96Fleetwood
03-20-11, 11:39 AM
I've often heard that the '03 Cartier was the last truly good Town Car, what did it have over the other models in it's time that was so nice? I know in the '90s era Town Cars, the Cartier had super soft "cartier exclusive" leather, rear vanity mirrors, and other options as standard..

It had Xenon headlights, fog lights, power trunk closer, rear vanity mirrors, upgraded leather, dual exhaust, different grill... and everything was standard except Navigation.... so it had the moonroof, heated seats, alpine stereo, chrome wheels, parking sensors, etc. Some of these options went away after 2004 :(

orconn
03-20-11, 03:23 PM
Just curious, are the center seating panels in the "Cartier Edition" perforated? I can't tell from the photos. The seat cover design on the seat appears to be the same as the new TC that Jim just took delivery of up i Boston. Although I would think the leather would be of a softer variety.

ThumperPup
03-20-11, 03:59 PM
Cartier (1981 to 2003): Cream-of-the-crop version of the Town Car. Special Cartier embrodering on the seats and trunk lid, as well as most of the optional signature series options standard. Standard includes heated seats, audio and climate steering-wheel controls. Only options available on this model are a cargo organizer, power moonroof, and trunk-mounted CD changer. Alpine/THX audio is standard. This series would be replaced by the Ultimate in 2004, and would be replaced by the Designer in 2005 and 2006 until its demise at the end of the 2006 model year.

Ultimate (2004 only): Rename of the Cartier model. All features carried over to this model

I~LUV~Caddys8792
03-20-11, 05:09 PM
Oh that's right, Sandy says his is an '04 Signature Ultimate. I wonder why they didn't carry the Cartier name on a year longer? Maybe Cartier didn't want anything to do with Lincoln/FoMoCo anymore.

ThumperPup
03-20-11, 05:13 PM
back in the 80s i think it was 88 or 89 might have even been 87 but im not sure i know its one of those years i think 88
the town car had a Gucci addition i kid you now
just not sure wich year for sure
i know someone who used to have one will have to look him up and shoot a email to find out what year it was

I~LUV~Caddys8792
03-20-11, 05:32 PM
Starting in 1976 and ending in 1983 or 84 Lincoln had four designer editions: Bill Blass, Cartier, Emilio Pucci and Versace were some of them, and they'd rotate them out from year to year, but by the end, the only one left was Cartier. The Bill Blass ones were always the best looking IMO, and they lasted most of the way through '83. They were applied mainly to the Mark Series, but the Town Car had a Cartier as well from 1980 on.

ThumperPup
03-20-11, 05:50 PM
Starting in 1976 and ending in 1983 or 84 Lincoln had four designer editions: Bill Blass, Cartier, Emilio Pucci and Versace were some of them, and they'd rotate them out from year to year, but by the end, the only one left was Cartier. The Bill Blass ones were always the best looking IMO, and they lasted most of the way through '83. They were applied mainly to the Mark Series, but the Town Car had a Cartier as well from 1980 on.

I drove a bill blass Mark a few years back at a lincoln meet up that sucker was awesome

Playdrv4me
03-20-11, 06:44 PM
It had Xenon headlights, fog lights, power trunk closer, rear vanity mirrors, upgraded leather, dual exhaust, different grill... and everything was standard except Navigation.... so it had the moonroof, heated seats, alpine stereo, chrome wheels, parking sensors, etc. Some of these options went away after 2004 :(

Yep, 03 and 04 were the last great years, and I only include 04 there because that was the first year for Nav with the least decontenting.

thebigjimsho
03-20-11, 11:26 PM
It had Xenon headlights, fog lights, power trunk closer, rear vanity mirrors, upgraded leather, dual exhaust, different grill... and everything was standard except Navigation.... so it had the moonroof, heated seats, alpine stereo, chrome wheels, parking sensors, etc. Some of these options went away after 2004 :(
I'm pretty sure all those option were available on the Ultimate edition in '04...

ThumperPup
03-21-11, 12:12 AM
the one thing i wasnt shure about was why they needed a longer wheel base and a shorter wheel base for the t/c if most of them where probably going to be fleet or livery vehicles just make them all L give room thats what the T/C was for in the first place it was a car you spend money on make a statment say im for american cars and its got to be top of the line

SDCaddyLacky
03-21-11, 07:44 AM
I just remembered. My dad owns a beautiful 2001 Town Car Cartier L edition, and that baby is clean. He's never had a problem with it, and barely drives it, only short distances.

It's fully loaded, with a phantom soft cloth top.

The extended wheelbase makes a HUGE difference especially in the rear, there is so much leg room that it's almost useless!

At the time I had my 93 Town Car, and I remember my 93 made much less engine noise, but my dads TC, you can hear the engine more, almost like it's straining. The car as of today only has around 70,000 something miles on it, so it's not because the engine is tired.

The L version are the Town Cars to get personally, if I ever decided to buy an 03 and up Townie, I would strongly look for the L's because of the extra leg room obviously, and they have to ride better with the added inches.

Aron9000
03-21-11, 10:29 AM
they have to ride better with the added inches.

That's what she said. Sorry, couldn't resist.

Stingroo
03-21-11, 10:40 AM
That's what she said. Sorry, couldn't resist.

:histeric: Thank you sir. Somebody HAD to do it....

thebigjimsho
03-21-11, 12:44 PM
Besides teh ladies, the extra inches do, indeed, contribute to a more composed ride. And it's also noticeably better in the snow with the extra wheelbase. Straight line stability is great. And it makes me look like a professional drifter in the snow. Here's a clip I took this winter in my old '07...




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMX3CWcmcFk

drewsdeville
03-21-11, 01:29 PM
lolz pro drifter