: 98 Deville HG failure



92Deville
03-17-11, 07:04 PM
Hey all,

I don't know if I am posting this in the right place or not but here it goes. My Dad's 98 Deville started exhibiting the head gasket symptoms a few days ago. He is done with the car and has already replaced it. He will give me the car if I want to mess with it. I have spent the last few days pouring over the forum researching the do-it-yourself HG repair. It looks kind of scary if you don't have shop equipment (hoists, air tools, pallet jacks, etc). I have two questions. First, is the car worth repairing? It has 175,000 Mi on it and the body and interior are in good condition. Second, How difficult is it to pull the motor from the top? I would almost have to pull from the top so I could still move the car around with engine out (lack of space). Any thoughts and opinions are greatly appreciated!

97EldoCoupe
03-17-11, 07:14 PM
Mileage is of no concern with these cars. The only thing I suggest with higher mileage Northstars is to check the exhaust valves and grind/replace if necessary. And of course the usual, check the lower timing chain tensioner, intermediate sprocket. Other than that these engines last forever (HG's being the exception of course, HG failure is quite common but repairable with elbow grease and a bit of skill/willingness to learn-as-you-go...

Is it worth repairing? Check the body and interior. Both still look good? Do you like the car? Only you can determine the answer unless you post photos-

Hopefully you fix the car, there are plenty of people here on the forums who have either been through the whole process and have posted photos and documented the procedure, or can offer advice along the way if you encounter problems.

Best of luck!

-Jake

EDIT: check the exhaust cams and lifters. Mileage isn't an issue here, proper lubrication is- if you catch the wear in time, if there is any, you can get away with replacing just the lifters, if there is a lot of wear, you're looking at new lifters and reground cams. Many cars require these parts replaced, many do not.....

92Deville
03-18-11, 12:24 AM
Thanks for the tips Jake. I wish I was closer to your shop so I could have you do it. I will try to post pics of the car this weekend. Any pointers on how the motor comes out the top?

92Deville
03-19-11, 12:21 AM
Does the hood have to be removed if the engine comes out the top? There doesn't seem to be any info on here about pulling from the top.

vincentm
03-19-11, 12:46 AM
Yes the hood needs to be removed if your yanking out the top

stoveguyy
03-19-11, 11:15 AM
what tools do you have? you need a engine hoist. good floor jack. jack stands. good tool set. someone asked if changing a front hub bearing was hard for a rookie. answer was maybe. pulling a motor and studding the block is much harder. car is probably only worth 1000 with bad motor. fixed it could be worth 3000? maybe more. would you keep it or sell it?

92Deville
03-19-11, 05:01 PM
I have jacks and jack stands and access to an engine hoist. I have a plentiful selection of hand tools but no air tools so this would all be done the old school way. I have pulled engines before but nothing of this magnitude, just 4 cyl stuff. I have pics of the car but I am not sure how to post them on here. If I can't even post pics on a forum should I be pulling and tearing down a motor?:suspense:

92Deville
03-19-11, 05:14 PM
....

92Deville
03-23-11, 12:32 AM
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/4774/p1080519.jpg

92Deville
03-23-11, 12:51 AM
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/633/p1080520a.jpg

jimsbox
03-23-11, 01:11 AM
If you have a shop crane type hoist, you can pull out the bottom, the consensus is it is easier. I used a $125.00 motorcycle jack and some doubled up 2x4's to pull mine. see the pics:

this shows the motorcycle jack

http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h480/jimsbox/SDC10150.jpg

this shows the crane lifting the car

http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h480/jimsbox/SDC10147.jpg

92Deville
03-23-11, 12:26 PM
I finally figured out how to post pics.
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/4774/p1080519.jpg
http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/225/p1080521c.jpg
http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/6547/p1080522m.jpg
I am 80% sure I am going to tackle this job I just haven't decided top or bottom yet. I think its in good shape for it's age and mileage.

jimsbox
03-23-11, 02:09 PM
Nice looking ride

92Deville
03-23-11, 03:13 PM
Thanks. I think it's definately too nice for the scrap yard.

92Deville
11-06-11, 03:44 PM
So I finally started this project. Due to space limitations and weather I decided to pull the engine out the top. I am hung up on a brace that goes from the right side of the trans up to the head in between exhaust manifold runners. I cannot figure out how to get to that bolt on the head side. I only have that brace, bell housing bolts, motor mounts, and exhaust left to disconnect. Anybody willing to share the secret to getting to that brace bolt?

ternstes
11-07-11, 04:25 PM
Can you see/access with a socket the other end of the brace that connects to the trans? Don't forget the engine block to trans brace also if you haven't disconnected that yet.

92Deville
11-07-11, 04:34 PM
I got the trans end nut off but now I need to get the bolt off at the other end up by the exhaust manifold so I can slip the brace off of the stud on the trans end. I cant even see the bolt head. Once this brace is off all braces/brackets will be off.

89falcon
11-07-11, 10:03 PM
I got the trans end nut off but now I need to get the bolt off at the other end up by the exhaust manifold so I can slip the brace off of the stud on the trans end. I cant even see the bolt head. Once this brace is off all braces/brackets will be off.

Have you tried tilting the motor? If you loosen the back cradle bolts a little...then the front ones a couple inches (while supporting the cradle with a floor jack), you can then lower the front of the cradle a couple inches, possibly exposing the bolt.

ternstes
11-08-11, 08:13 AM
I remember this bolt now... can you put a 15mm or 17mm (forget the bolt size) socket on a swivel or universal on the ratchet and get to it that way? The coolant pipes that run behind the engine might be in the way, I can't recall for sure, do you have those removed?

92Deville
11-08-11, 10:23 AM
I got a socket on the bolt last night with an extension and universal joint but it wouldn't budge. It puts the universal at an extreme angle and the socket slips off. The coolant tubes are still on the motor. I was going to leave them on. We will see what tonight brings :suspense:

tateos
11-14-11, 09:37 PM
I sayL It's not too late to drop the entire cradle - it is so much easier - everything is right there in front of you, with easy, easy access!

92Deville
11-15-11, 10:42 AM
I haven't worked on the car for a few days now, life has been a little busy. I plan on cutting that brace to get it out of the way. If I was going to drop the cradle I would have to wait until spring because I would have to do that outdoors. The only things left to unhook are the motor mounts, bell housing bolts, and that brace.

Destroyer
11-15-11, 07:25 PM
Hey all,

I don't know if I am posting this in the right place or not but here it goes. My Dad's 98 Deville started exhibiting the head gasket symptoms a few days ago. He is done with the car and has already replaced it. He will give me the car if I want to mess with it. I have spent the last few days pouring over the forum researching the do-it-yourself HG repair. It looks kind of scary if you don't have shop equipment (hoists, air tools, pallet jacks, etc). I have two questions. First, is the car worth repairing? Nope. :)

maeng9981
11-16-11, 01:04 AM
Hey all,

I don't know if I am posting this in the right place or not but here it goes. My Dad's 98 Deville started exhibiting the head gasket symptoms a few days ago. He is done with the car and has already replaced it. He will give me the car if I want to mess with it. I have spent the last few days pouring over the forum researching the do-it-yourself HG repair. It looks kind of scary if you don't have shop equipment (hoists, air tools, pallet jacks, etc). I have two questions. First, is the car worth repairing?

Yep. :)

92Deville
11-16-11, 12:13 PM
Worth it or not the repair is in process and short of a cracked block the car will be burning gas again. The job is a real PITA. Nobody has ever accused me of being sane though :cookoo:

Ranger
11-16-11, 03:28 PM
Whether or not it is "worth it" is strictly up to you. It IS a big job though. Best of luck to you.

vincentm
11-16-11, 09:07 PM
Yep. :)

:yeah:

92Deville
11-17-11, 03:46 PM
Cut the brace in half last night with a hack saw. I thought my arm was going to fall off. A few more connectors to unplug and motor mounts and bell housing bolts and it should be ready to yank.

92Deville
12-04-11, 02:39 PM
I finally got the motor out the top yesterday. On the Deville there is enough room to get the engine out without taking the hood off :thumbsup: I hope Jake will have stud kits available soon.

92Deville
07-31-12, 02:04 PM
This project is coming along very slowly. I dont have a whole lot of extra time to spend but I sneak in some time here and there. Last night I was going to reseal the oil pan and replace the oil manifold when this happened..954919549295493

Two of the lower block bolts snapped when I was breaking them loose.

CadillacLuke24
07-31-12, 02:50 PM
At least bolts are relatively expensive. Good luck dude, you definitely have a nice car on your hands, and what you are encountering has been done before. You can do it, and from it appears, you will. Keep it up. :thumbsup:

Food for thougt: There's a guy in the Northstar section that has a 98 DeVille with 540,000 miles and counting. When you get your car fixed, you'll have a champ that will go for a long, long time. :yup:

Ranger
07-31-12, 03:04 PM
There's a guy in the Northstar section that has a 98 DeVille with 540,000 miles and counting. When you get your car fixed, you'll have a champ that will go for a long, long time.
And a goal to shoot for.

CadillacLuke24
08-01-12, 06:18 PM
Exactly. Make that 548,271 :D I hope to reach that one day. With Alexandra :D

maeng9981
08-02-12, 08:56 AM
This project is coming along very slowly. I dont have a whole lot of extra time to spend but I sneak in some time here and there. Last night I was going to reseal the oil pan and replace the oil manifold when this happened..954919549295493

Two of the lower block bolts snapped when I was breaking them loose.

Well, at least that will be easy to remove with a set of easy outs. These bolts are indeed too low of a quality.

92Deville
08-07-12, 06:20 PM
I am going to take the block to a machine shop on Sat and see how that goes. :ill:

Submariner409
08-07-12, 07:18 PM
That may be the wisest course of action: The shop will have all the necessary large drill presses, holding jigs, and proper metal cutting drills.