: Battery being drained/ fan still ON (runs) after car is powered off



hijiliak
03-06-11, 02:07 PM
Hey folks: Please assist. :)

Two days ago, my car wouldnt start-- the battery was dead.
I can jump-start the car; however after running the car 20-30 minutes--
I can turn off the car, but the (1) fan between the motor and the radiator--
slowly powers-down.

There are two other fans on the out-board side of the radiator--
away from the motor-- the right works the left isnt.

I swapped-out old battery for a fully charged battery--
And the same thing happens - the battery will drain to the point I have no power-- not even basic lights.

Also noticed the lower-right A/C on the belt drive system making a skreeking sound-- could it be this A/C motor is shot and drawing power causing the fan to excessively run, draining the battery, even when the car is powered off?

Please assist. TY

hijiliak
03-06-11, 02:55 PM
or could it be a fuse? I dont know

RetiredAssassin
03-07-11, 09:35 AM
Check the battery fuses and all of them while you are at it also see if you can drive it to the auto parts store and have them check the alternator check fuses and connectors make sure they are tight and clean, about that little pipe you might have to post a couple of pics so we can help you better.

RetiredAssassin
03-07-11, 09:47 AM
Also note that in these cars if the car is running a little hot the fan will keep on running even if the car is turned off but only for 45 seconds to a minute or so after you turn the car off.

catera00
03-07-11, 07:41 PM
My fans were staying on at one point and it was due to one of the relays under the hood sticking. I tapped on it to make it stop.

hijiliak
03-08-11, 01:01 PM
Thank you: Under the hood, in the triangle fusebox next to the battery-- I checked to make sure all the fuses and relays are seated and/or visibly good. I also found a schematic of the triangle fusebox; there are 4 Fan Control Relays: I pulled FCR (K26) and the fan between the motor and the radiator stopped.

Now: With FCR (K26) removed and the battery hooked-up as normal, I returned 4 hours later and the car started (the battery was not drained). However, as I said, with the FCR (K26) seated or pluged-in, the fan powered ON and constantly ran eventhough the car was powered off. Im in Wisconsin and it 30F outside-- the car sat about 4 hours-- the fan shouldnt be turning ON-- likewise, the AC/heater controls inside the car are OFF.

As of the "little pipe" you speak of -- I dont know what your talking about.

hijiliak
03-08-11, 01:10 PM
Check the battery fuses and all of them while you are at it also see if you can drive it to the auto parts store and have them check the alternator check fuses and connectors make sure they are tight and clean, about that little pipe you might have to post a couple of pics so we can help you better.

Thank you: Under the hood, in the triangle fusebox next to the battery-- I checked to make sure all the fuses and relays are seated and/or visibly good. I also found a schematic of the triangle fusebox; there are 4 Fan Control Relays: I pulled FCR (K26) and the fan between the motor and the radiator stopped.

Now: With FCR (K26) removed and the battery hooked-up as normal, I returned 4 hours later and the car started (the battery was not drained). However, as I said, with the FCR (K26) seated or pluged-in, the fan powered ON and constantly ran eventhough the car was powered off. Im in Wisconsin and it 30F outside-- the car sat about 4 hours-- the fan shouldnt be turning ON-- likewise, the AC/heater controls inside the car are OFF.

As of the "little pipe" you speak of -- I dont know what your talking about.

hijiliak
03-08-11, 01:18 PM
Also note that in these cars if the car is running a little hot the fan will keep on running even if the car is turned off but only for 45 seconds to a minute or so after you turn the car off.

yes I understand these cars and the fan can run even if the car is powered off. However, in my case, with the hood up so I can see & listen; I power off the car, walk to the front o the car and see/hear that the fan is "slowly powering down"-- not running at normal speed -- its running at a slow speed and never turns off; thus I presume its draining the battery.

catera00
03-09-11, 07:20 PM
Thank you: Under the hood, in the triangle fusebox next to the battery-- I checked to make sure all the fuses and relays are seated and/or visibly good. I also found a schematic of the triangle fusebox; there are 4 Fan Control Relays: I pulled FCR (K26) and the fan between the motor and the radiator stopped.

Now: With FCR (K26) removed and the battery hooked-up as normal, I returned 4 hours later and the car started (the battery was not drained). However, as I said, with the FCR (K26) seated or pluged-in, the fan powered ON and constantly ran eventhough the car was powered off. Im in Wisconsin and it 30F outside-- the car sat about 4 hours-- the fan shouldnt be turning ON-- likewise, the AC/heater controls inside the car are OFF.

As of the "little pipe" you speak of -- I dont know what your talking about.


Thats how mine was exactly. You can open the relay up by carefully prying the top cover off from the bottom. Inside youll see a metal arm with a disc on the end. When it touches the metal on the relay the fans turn on. On mine it was always touching. It should only be touching when the circuit is energized. I took some fine sand paper and filed the disc a little so the it wasnt constantly touching. That fixed mine.

http://hmdclothing.com/catera/relay.jpg
Similar to this pic

RetiredAssassin
03-12-11, 12:52 PM
Nice reply Catera00 awesome information to have and to Hijiliak about that little pipe, sorry dude I don't know what I'm talking about either LOL I hope everything works out for you I really do!!

hijiliak
03-19-11, 04:36 PM
Thank you for the picture. Unfortunately, my issue still isnt solved. I bought a new fan sensor relay (K26/gray); disconnected the battery, installed the relay, connected the battery, started the car, but the fan didnt come on. With car running, I turned on the AC and waited for the fan to come on-- then tried the heater and the fan still didnt come on. **The main fan between the engine and the radiator including the 2 auxillary will not turn ON** I started with (K26) because when I wiggled it, the (main) fan intermittently worked~ then wouldnt; even with the new relay-- it still doesnt work! :( Could it be the female-block K26 plugs into-- one of those wire connectors is bad???/not making a connection-- and therefore doesnt work?

The car runs/performs HOWEVER I dont think its a good idea to run it with the fan(s) not working... AND I still need to replace the Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor & the Eng. Coolant Temp. {Gauge} Senor, to read the dashboard temp. gauge to see if the car is running too HOT.

Any additional assistance with the relay fan(s) issues would be helpful-- Thank you.


Thats how mine was exactly. You can open the relay up by carefully prying the top cover off from the bottom. Inside youll see a metal arm with a disc on the end. When it touches the metal on the relay the fans turn on. On mine it was always touching. It should only be touching when the circuit is energized. I took some fine sand paper and filed the disc a little so the it wasnt constantly touching. That fixed mine.

http://hmdclothing.com/catera/relay.jpg
Similar to this pic

catera00
03-23-11, 06:35 PM
This post has alot of info regarding the relays and which ones controll the fans:
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-catera-cimarron-forum/203875-need-help-locating-fuse-panel-diagram.html

Have you tried removing the fan switch connector mounted on the top drivers side of the radiator and bridging it to make sure the fan will turn on at this point? This switch controls the fan between the motor and radiator. There are 3 connection holes inside the plug and if you put a wire in the outside two, the fan should come on. If it doesnt then its a relay prob. If it does come on then its a prob with a sensor or possibly wiring. Also the purple plug with the pins in the triangle relay box is for doing the same thing. It will allow you to test whether or not the fan relays work via bridging with a wire. Im looking for a link to which pins to use. I used this while troubleshooting my fan issue.

An excerpt from a post on another site gives more info on that test port:

I find that German and Italian cars are exceptionally
complex.
> For instance, there are three radiator fans, three water pumps,
four
> thermostatic switches and seven relays for the engine cooling
> system.
>
> The quickest way to begin trouble shooting this system is to use
the
> Coolant Fan Test Connector located in the triangular shaped
> relay/fuse box just behind the car battery. This test connector
is
> located in the second row of components from the back of the fuse
> box (nearer the car windshield). In this second row of components
> you will find a 10 amp fuse then a relay and then the Fan Test
> Connector. It is under the fat bundle of wires going to the
Engine
> Control Module. Just slide the engine control module straight up
> and out of the fuse box so you can move the wire bundle and get
> access to the Fan Test Connector.
>
> The Fan Test Connector has six bare connectors in it. These are
> arranged in two rows of three connectors. The numbering of these
> six connectors is this: #1 is in the rear row (nearest the
> windshield) and is in the position farthest to the right side of
the
> car (passenger side). #2 is in the middle of this back row of
> connectors. #3 is in this same back row and nearest to the left
> side of the car. #4 is in the front row and to the left side of
> car. #5 is in the center of this front row of connectors. #6 is
> the farthest to the right side of this front row.

catera00
03-23-11, 06:47 PM
This explains what all the relays are in that triangle box:
http://diychamber.com/2010/03/2001-cadillac-catera-engine-compartment-relayfuse-guide/

http://diychamber.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/cadillac-catera-fuse-guide.png

1. Secondary air injection
2. Fan control relay
3. Auxiliary water pump
4. Windshield wiper motor
5. A/C compressor relay
6. Fan control relay
7. Fan control relay
8. Fuse 50
9. Fan control relay
10. Engine controls power relay
15. Fuse 40 (A), Fuse 52(B)
17. Coolant fan test connector fan control
18. Fuse 42 (A). Fuse 49 (B)
19. Fan control relay
20. Fuel pump relay
29. Fuse 43

catera00
03-23-11, 06:48 PM
and finally, heres the info on how to test the fan relays:

http://autos.dir.groups.yahoo.com/group/CateraOwners/message/9364?threaded=1

Now for the testing:

Ground one side of your jumper wire, I like to use the negative
battery terminal, it is the terminal towards the front of the car.
Don't use the positive terminal which is nearest the relay box.

WITH THE IGNITION KEY OFF:
Ground terminal 1. All three fans should come on low.
Ground terminal 2. All three fans should come on low.
Do not ground terminal 3. This is positive 12 volts with the key on.
Ground terminal 4. Main fan will be on high, other fans off.
Ground terminal 5. Auxiliary 2 will come on high. Other fans off.

WITH THE IGNITION KEY ON, BUT ENGINE NOT RUNNING:
Ground terminal 2. Both auxiliary fans will be on high. Main fan
on low.

Terminal 6 is a ground so just ignore it.
Do not ground terminal 3, it is positive 12 volts with the ignition
key on.

These tests should tell you if your relays and fans work or not.

hijiliak
03-30-11, 02:59 PM
Great thank you for all this information! I just fixed fixed/replaced the engine coolant temperature sensor and the sender, and now my dashboard temp needle works again-- so now, I can get back to this fan issue... Aaagain.