: 454 and turbo 400 into 88 hearse???



CADDYDADDY13
12-21-10, 02:45 AM
So locally i found an 87 2wd GMC suburban for sale, with a jasper 454 engine w/ 60k on it and a freshly rebuilt turbo 400 tranny with 30k on it and new dual flowmaster exhaust. Truck is in really good shape but the rear end is bad on it. It is a cool truck, but i was thinking about buying it and throwing the engine tranny and exhaust on the 88 Caddy hearse.

Guy is asking $1700 for the truck and i think i could recoupe alot of my money back if i parted her out after taking the drivetrain. as she has new tires and rims and a really clean body(very nice compared to almost all of the others i see up here) and lift kit. maybe if i got him down to 1400 or 1500.

Would this be an easy and worth while swap? i would have to have someone do it, as i dont know much about it. but in my mind seems like it would be sweet! Of course reality could be otherwise. I was thinking about an Olds 350, but this 454 set up is already together and of course i could say it has a 454 in it.:)
i figure i would need a better rear end of course though.

Does it sound worth it, or should i stick with a rebuilt Olds 350?
My hearse is in desparate need of POWER with her puny 307 under the hood! She is only my weekend car so fuel economy isnt the biggest worry, as she will probably just go to shows and back, and halloween use of course.

But back to the engines, i know the Olds is a direct fit, but there is also the expense of rebuilding one and a tranny and so on.... so what do you guys think?
WHich route would you go?

albymangled
12-21-10, 02:54 AM
Cant you use a proper Caddy engine? (why settle for only 454 inches when Caddy makes larger?)

If you are going to pay someone to do all that work for you it's going to cost a bomb....

sven914
12-21-10, 03:09 AM
I would say it isn't worth it... $1,700 for a truck you'll never use, $1,500 to have someone swap an engine, and probably another $2,000 tied up in chassis modification (new brakes, shocks, differential, and engine mount fabrication). That's over $5,000 and two nice cars destroyed.

Just for a weekend driver/show car, I would say the 350 swap isn't worth it either. If it were my car, I would swap in the heads and intake from an Olds 350 (same block as the 307), plum the exhaust for true duels, and top it off with a carburettor from an Olds 403. If you know where to look, and aren't afraid of getting dirty, you could do that upgrade for $500-1000, and it should give you a nice power boost.

cadillac_al
12-21-10, 08:04 AM
I would fix the rear in the truck. If it really doesn't have much rust then it is still fairly valuable. It would be too bad to strip it. People do that sort of thing all the time but it will get expensive. Too bad you couldn't find a good deal on a Olds 403. That would be an easy drop in; same for the 455 Olds.

csbuckn
12-21-10, 11:34 AM
I'm gonna have to say it not worth it either. Figuring motor mounts, finding a driveshaft, redoing exhaust, no overdrive and a weaker rear axle would cost some money to get to where you want it. I also say swap in an Olds and build your current tranny to handle the power and you will have a bolt in motor.

cadillac kevin
12-21-10, 01:32 PM
I'm gonna say no. either drop in a 350 olds or put the top off a 68-72 olds 350 on it (heads, intake, cam, etc) on the 307. but if you pay someone to swap the engines, it would not be worth it. pulling an engine and putting another one in (+ cost of doing a stock rebuild on the engine) will easily put you over 2 grand.
btw, roughly how much power would be gained from putting 350 heads, intake, camshaft, 403 carb, and dual exhaust on a 307?

sven914
12-21-10, 03:26 PM
btw, roughly how much power would be gained from putting 350 heads, intake, camshaft, 403 carb, and dual exhaust on a 307?

I don't know exactly... I'm hoping that the power output would be a little over that of the VIN 9 307 (180 HP), this way I don't have to mess with the transmission or differential. The stock 307 makes around 148 HP and adding these performance parts during a mild rebuild should bring the horsepower up to around 185-200hp.

cadillac_al
12-21-10, 10:17 PM
The 307 has no potential for power; let's not stat an urban myth here lol. I was checking Ebay a few months ago and there were some pretty nice 350's for $4-500. I see 403's once in a while but I'm not in the market so I don't even look that often. On one of the Olds sites I frequent, a guy got two 455's for a few hundred bucks. The deals are out there.

cadillac kevin
12-21-10, 10:37 PM
350s are relatively cheap. a guy locally had 2 complete from carb to oil pan with 350 turbo trannys attached for $150 each. I would have gotten them, but I had nowhere to put them at the time. most 350 olds go from 150 (non running/ not able to test) to 400 (in a car where you can drive before you buy the motor.) get a stock gold 350 and a buddy with an engine hoist who will work for beer, and you're set.
I dont think I've ever seen a 403 for sale locally. they're just not that common
455s are out there, but the guys usually want $400 for one with no intake or accessories, and sometimes no heads. a bit pricey for half an engine IMO

sven914
12-21-10, 10:37 PM
The 307 has no potential for power; let's not stat an urban myth here lol. I was checking Ebay a few months ago and there were some pretty nice 350's for $4-500. I see 403's once in a while but I'm not in the market so I don't even look that often. On one of the Olds sites I frequent, a guy got two 455's for a few hundred bucks. The deals are out there.


The VIN 9 is real. It has a 30 to 40 horsepower increase over the stock 307. The power gain is mainly do to richer secondaries in the carb and a performance cam. Opening up the intake and giving it a higher output carburettor should do more to increase that power. So it's no myth that a 307 can be built for power; just not earth shattering amounts of it.

CADDYDADDY13
12-22-10, 12:57 AM
well i didnt even think about the drive shaft! Yeah i guess the 454 swap would be rather extensive. So iguess the way to go is the Olds 350... i have never seen a 403 for sale around me, and occasionally i see the 455's but i really don't know what to look for if they are not already in a car and running..? I have picked up from reading posts on here that the best engines are the late 60's early 70's Olds motors and the ones to get. I dont see how modding my motor would be worth it, it has low miles but just chugs along... and seems imo to need a rebuild. so why not just go for the larger motor??? I want a new exhaust too, and figure i would also need a better tranny. I want it to look presentable when i pop the hood. I'm embarassed by her her engine now. Even though she only has 53K on her she looks dirty and old!

AM i right in thinking of replacing the 307? Everyone i have ever talked to about this engine says they have no chance of real power. they are dependable but not for moving these large cars.
I mean i dont expect to do 0-60 in under 10 seconds, but i'd like to be able to do over 25mph up a hill!

greencadillacmatt
12-22-10, 01:14 AM
I thought even though the hearses had the small engine and trans they used the heavy-duty rear axel in them. I know the Broughams from '88 used the 7.5 in axel. I thought the hearses used the 8.5 because of all the extra weight of the car/casket. Is there any way to check the size of the rear end?

My_favorite_Brougham
12-23-10, 04:54 AM
There's always the option of getting a 90-92 hearse with the Chevy 350 TBI motor -- if you're willing to part with yours.

sven914
12-23-10, 03:25 PM
^But it would be ugly and European and shit...

He could find a '90ed Brougham with the 350 TBI, tear it into tiny pieces (kill it with fire) and then steal the drive line for his own uses. But that still wouldn't be as nice as having an Oldsmobile under the hood. But that still wouldn't be as nice as having a Cadillac under the hood.

jayoldschool
12-23-10, 04:48 PM
You can find the 403 in late 70s full size, and in Trans Ams.

csbuckn
12-23-10, 08:14 PM
The vin Y 307 has an aluminum intake with small runners and the heads have small runners also. The vin 9 has an iron intake with bigger runners along with the better heads. The compression is better in the vin Y but the ports are just too small. If you get an Olds motor that is apart, you wont know if its good intil the machine shop checks for cracks between the frost plugs. You could get the top end off an Olds 350 and put it on but putting a freshly rebuilt top on a motor with many miles will probably take out a main bearing or something, plus you would have to find the right heads to make sure the compression ratio stays right.
Fun stuff here:
http://www.442.com/oldsfaq/ofbsb.htm#Picking the Best Small Block