: Need guidance buying a STS



GREGB1954
11-25-10, 08:16 PM
I am looking to spend up to $20k or so and would like a blk/blk STS with NAV and wood trim. I am flexible on everything else but of course would prefer the perf and lux pkgs. I live in Indianapolis so we get some snow, but I do not think I would want to go with AWD since it seems to impact the mpg and power.

What can advice can you give me?

V6 or V8? Are they both reliable? Does the 6 get much better actual mpg?

Thx.

EChas3
11-25-10, 09:35 PM
I spent 20 years in central Illinois (10 each in Champaign and Mattoon/Charleston) so I'm familiar with your climate. In my opinion, you should look for a 2007 or 2008 1SG RWD coming off a three year-lease. Buy from a Cadillac dealer so you can negotiate for coverage under the Certified Pre-Owned (CPO) program.

Until the right car shows up, test drive some representative cars to make sure. Different trim levels can be very different. The 2007 (& prior) V6 doesn't have the power of the V8 but some members claim the handling is better. The 2008 V6 may be a good choice for you but all the best options (IMHO) are only available on V8 STS's.

Not once have either my wife or I regretted buying V8's. The mileage difference is minimal in RWD models. Most V8's run fine on most 87 octane gas. Most 2007 & prior V6 models also run fine on most 87 octane gas. I think the higher performance 2008 & later V6's require Premium Gas. Opinions differ widely but most members agree 'Top Tier' gas is worth seeking out since its additive package is approved by GM. 25 MPG highway doesn't require legal speeds but YMMV. Tires do matter.

Reliability of either powerplant is good but not great when considering everything under the hood. V6's are a bit prone to oil useage and timing chain problems. V8's don't have those issues. I think V8's may have a bit more water pump trouble and both encounter more power steering pump trouble than one would expect.

Some form of warranty should be considered mandatory. These are sophistcated cars with a lot of features and most owners are the sort that want everything to work. A good independent shop or handy owner using auto-recycler parts can save a lot of expense but few (if any) STS's never need a dealer. In order of my personal preference:

Factory Warranty
CPO
GMPP
Dealer-sold aftermarket warranties (exclusions specified rather than inclusions specified - wife's is Zurich)
Warranty-Direct & similar
Self insurance via an automatic savings plan
Heavily promoted (TV/Internet) 'inclusion' plans - Essentially Useless or fraudulent - Caveat Emptor



OK members! Help?

GREGB1954
11-25-10, 10:34 PM
Chas, very thorough reply!! I have been trying to understand the pkg's. Can you explain the 1SG? Also, I have noticed a 1SC and 1SZ. I think the SG is a performance option with transaction control and positraction? The SZ is a luxury option? Not sure about the SC.

EChas3
11-25-10, 11:18 PM
I hope someone corrects any errors. I'm sure there are more than a few.

1SA - Base V6
1SB - V6 Luxury
1SC - V6 Luxury Performance (staggered tires & wheels 17")
1SE - Base V8
1SF - V8 Luxury
1SG - V8 Luxury Performance (staggered tires on matched 18" wheels)

I think they all have the rain sense wipers, remote start, heated seats and steering wheel; leather seating surfaces, too. The base models could have the Navigation but i don't think they will. Nav also gets you the Bluetooth phone connection, AV inputs, 15 speaker Bose, six CD/DVD changer with MP3.

I think all but the base models get the wood trim or can have the wood trim but I'm not sure.


Options only available on V8
Magnetic Ride Control
JE5 Performance Brakes & 18" wheels


Options only available on 1SG
High Intensity Discharge headlights
Adaptive Cruise Control (includes HUD)
Heated/cooled Full-Leather Seats
Automatic Dimming High Beams
Performance Cooling Package
Spoiler & Premium ZF Steering

GREGB1954
11-26-10, 09:42 AM
Thx Chas. I have also noticed the 1SC option combined with the 1SZ. When I look at the RPO (feature) details it lists "soft ride", 3.42 rear axle ratio, and posi traction. It seems like the 1SZ is a softened version of the performance group???

I have narrowed my search to either the 1SC or 1SG, so I am getting close. The V8 is preferable and not much mpg is lost (just 1). When buying used you have to compromise on features, miles, car location, etc. But sure seems like a lot of car for a reasonable $$.

Thx for your help. Everyone else must be sleeping? That's OK, you have given me what I need.

Cheers

CTBB
11-26-10, 10:19 AM
Hold on a sec Greg! Some of we sleeping ones might have a little to add. First off, my first Caddy, and first ever American car, at 60 yo, lots of discoveries in first year+ of ownership with my first V8!

My car is a 1SF, 1SZ, with staggered 17" wheels (Q13), and tires P235/50R17 FRT & P255/45R17 RR(Q11), heated and cooled front seats, heated steering wheel (N31), MRC suspension (F55) with Sport susp (FE3), rear air susp 23,000lb (G45), limited slip rear (G80), Intelligent Hi-beams (TQ5), HID lamps (TT6), and JE5 brakes, etc etc. A dealer can print out the entire list by car via the vin for you.

I would buy the V8 again. This car with anything else doesn't cut it. Maybe the new Direct Injected V6 disproves that, but the previous mill works too hard to move this tub around, especially if you have any sporting pretensions. That said, if you drive it "spiritedly" you won't see those epa mileage numbers. My STS has 3.55 rear gears, a mild performance option, and will pull 13-15mpg around town, and about 23mpg at 75+ on the interstate. I bought her to travel, and she does that with style!!

Good luck with your purchase!! :yup:

Glenn

EChas3
11-26-10, 10:40 AM
Greg - I also advise you move with some caution. You can find the exact car you want and get a smokin' deal with a little patience. My wife had to move fast (her '98 STS had HG issues) and really missed a few things she could have had. Some are things that wouldn't matter to me (or maybe anyone) but the fact remains. For example; 2008 & up have Cruise Control Cancel on the steering wheel. Others are a bigger deal: Interior/exterior color & cooled seat.

There are a lot of smart members on this forum and many know more than I about the various options and characteristics of these cars. I know 2 cars, both V8's, and am honestly biased towards the Northstar. I've posted lengthy monologues on the advantages of engines that have reached the end of their design-life-cycle.

By the way, 1SZ is "PREFERRED EQUIPMENT SAVINGS"; an option bundle, not a trim level. I especially like this one that I didn't have to pay on my 1SG AWD:

R8E - GAS GUZZLER TAX

Have fun!

chubbyranger
11-26-10, 01:15 PM
No threadjacking intended here but I was just about to start a thread with the same question so I figured I'd jump on this one and keep it all in the same place. Going to look at a 2008 STS4 w/32,000 miles and the LLT HO V6 to replace the Mrs. 10-year old Concorde. She is definitely not what I would consider a spirited driver and her biggest concern is being able to get around in the New England snow and ice so I think I'm locked into AWD just for the comfort factor. I've got a 99 (Seville) STS and I've already paid my $4K of N* HG dues to keep it so I guess I must really like it. Just not sure how big a difference the AWD STS is going to be from my torque steering sidewinder N*. From the great posts here I know what to expect and it is at a Caddy dealer and I'm pretty sure its CPO. What was the factory warranty in 2008 and shouldn't that transfer?

GREGB1954
11-26-10, 08:41 PM
Hi ChubbyRanger. I am struggling with buying an AWD which solves the snow driving problem in Indy, which only accounts for a few days/yr. I would rather not have AWD the other days so I will probably go 2WD and buy some sand bags for the trunk. I think AWD for the wife is wise. I drove a 2007 AWD 6cyl STS and it had plenty of power but was not impressive. But for the Mrs. it would be more than adequate. I did not notice any torque steer. I also drove a 2008 CTS 6cy DI and had the same reaction: no torque steer but not what I would expect with 302 hp.

I will likely buy a 2006 N* tomorrow with 2WD.

EChas3
11-26-10, 11:30 PM
Torque steer is a product of FWD. I've read no reports of it in the 2005 & up STS.

GREGB1954
11-27-10, 08:55 PM
Well I pulled the trigger on a '06 STS with the Northstar (or as I learned on this forum, N*). It is the 1SG pkg and is black on black. Has 46k miles and paid $20k plus tax etc. Bad news is I have not driven it and won't get it for almost 2 weeks - downside of buying a car out of state from Carmax. But I can skip out on it if I don't like it. I did drive a STS N* and loved it. Next question: should I buy a warranty??? They want $1500 for another 25k miles or 5 yrs. Seems like it might make sense from the above comments.

turnne
11-27-10, 09:07 PM
Torque steer is a product of FWD. I've read no reports of it in the 2005 & up STS.

It can be a product of FWD...though there are several well engineered cars that seem to do quite well and are not particularly affected by it

You should test drive an Audi A6( non Quattro)

interesting on all these HG issues I am seeing here from pre 2000 Northstars

When I had the 02 I used to read all those stories in the Seville/Eldorado forum

so it seems this was VERY common


Warren

KRSTS
11-28-10, 09:31 AM
Even in outstanding condition, a five year old loaded N* with under 50K miles shouldn't be more than $18K

malatu
11-28-10, 10:06 AM
Well I pulled the trigger on a '06 STS with the Northstar (or as I learned on this forum, N*). It is the 1SG pkg and is black on black. Has 46k miles and paid $20k plus tax etc. Bad news is I have not driven it and won't get it for almost 2 weeks - downside of buying a car out of state from Carmax. But I can skip out on it if I don't like it. I did drive a STS N* and loved it. Next question: should I buy a warranty??? They want $1500 for another 25k miles or 5 yrs. Seems like it might make sense from the above comments.


25k miles or five years is a joke. That comes to 5k miles per year.

EChas3
11-28-10, 02:49 PM
Our situations were different & around two years ago but depending on the details that might not be too bad. The OEM warranty takes you to 4 years from the in-service date & 50,000 miles. If they are adding 25,000 miles and one year of coverage equivilent of the OEM warranty, that's comparable to the fair market value of Cadillac's CPO that add's 2 years & 50K. (I figure CPO is really worth about $3,000; it's that good.)

If it is written differently and/or has deductables and big exclusions, look into GMPP or all the other options. I urge you to take some action before the OEM warranty expires.

dchun81
11-30-10, 05:25 PM
im selling my sts. please check out the classified section.

Saila22
12-01-10, 10:21 PM
I recently obtained an extended warranty from US Auto Protection on an 05 STS 6cyl., coverage at 4yrs, 100k (total odometer), car had 48K, Exclusionary coverage for $2K. Did ALOT of research and was satisfied with the coverage, term, and cost.

GREGB1954
12-02-10, 09:38 PM
I bought the warranty that covers me to 75k, so effectively 25k miles. I went over what is covered and what is not with the service mgr and the main sales mgr. I was most concerned with the magneto shocks not being covered. I was assured the only items not covered are what they refer to as "maintenance" items, like brake pads, rotors, belts, oil, tires, etc. They said the electronic aspect of the shocks would be covered since it is not an item that is supposed to wear out.

I am a bit nervous on the costs to keep the car's systems all working. But if it has a lot of problems before I hit 75k I will sell it.

I know this: it is a beautiful, well-engineered, and well-built car that drives lilke a dream. So far I am happy.

But 1 thing bothers me and I noticed this in another one I test drove: sometimes the driver seats feels like it has a loose spring or something on the seat. What's that?

EChas3
12-02-10, 10:18 PM
There's a TSB on the seats... I think it is also in the 'sticky' FAQ's. The warranty covers it.

txbest1980
12-02-10, 11:22 PM
By the way, 1SZ is "PREFERRED EQUIPMENT SAVINGS"; an option bundle, not a trim level.

could you explain this a little better...i just like the OP just bought a new to me STS. i wasnt really looking for a STS, but an EXT and just couldnt pass up the deal on the STS. the STS i purchased is an 05 with 65K on the clock, got warranty until 107K with the extended warranty tacked onto the warranty the guy had left on it. it has the 3.6L engine, which is okay with me, but really wanted the V8. i got the car for 12k in a private sell. when i look up the vin #, it says i have the 1SZ, but that gets a bit confusing to me with what is listed in a few earlier post in this thread

EChas3
12-03-10, 04:31 PM
Manufacturers 'bundle' sets of options together to standardize production runs. These bundles are in addition to the 6 US trim levels. An example might be on a 1SB or 1SE, Navigation is an option but when selected, they add wood trim & full leather seats. I don't know the specifics and all the options' RPO codes are still listed on the car.

Heck, there's RPO 'DL5' for 'DECAL - ROADSIDE SERVICE INFO'! 1SZ just means there was a bundle of options. I've got it on my loaded 1SG, too.

Enjoy the ride!

txbest1980
12-03-10, 10:35 PM
Echas3...okay i gotcha, it is similar to the CTS then, that was just the first time i ever seen somebody call it a bundle thats why i asked...

turnne
12-04-10, 07:40 AM
Even in outstanding condition, a five year old loaded N* with under 50K miles shouldn't be more than $18K

I am thinking $15-16K tops

I paid $18,750 from a Cadillac dealer for a 4 year old 1SG car with 54K about 14 months ago


Warren

Greg00coupe
12-04-10, 10:38 AM
I bought my 05 in 08 a V8 with 32K on the clock..........1SG for $22K. Seems a little stiff for an 06. Just my opinion.

torogt
12-05-10, 09:24 AM
I am thinking $15-16K tops

I paid $18,750 from a Cadillac dealer for a 4 year old 1SG car with 54K about 14 months ago


Warren

I paid $16.400 for my 06 1SG AWD a little over a month ago with 87K I searched all over the internet and it was the best price I found, do you think I paid to much?

EChas3
12-05-10, 12:13 PM
I think that's about where the market is right now. Friends & relatives in the used car business agree that prices are up from two years ago when they bottomed-out. 'Cash for Clunkers' reduced the supply of used cars.