: 200r4 power



shrike77
11-09-10, 10:54 AM
I have been trrying to find the answer for the last two days without any success

Can the 200r4 on our cars take 270 HP and 285 lbsxft of torque from a 4.8 Vortec without changing anything inside?
I know the 200r4's on the Grand National could but they had different internals.
My car is a 1987 Brougham with the 307

Thanks

csbuckn
11-09-10, 12:44 PM
Probably not, your adding 100 horsepower. How many miles does yours have on it already?

jayoldschool
11-09-10, 01:29 PM
The answer is "maybe". I think if you babied it, it might survive for awhile. No full throttle starts, no big downshifts to pass people, etc. Kind of ruins the whole idea of sticking in a new engine, though.

If it were me, I would buy the parts to upgrade the trans and do it myself. You only need a couple of specialized tools. Once you have a trans apart, it is not hard to understand how they work. There are great how-to videos out there that will walk you through it.

Or, just use the 4L60E that goes with the 4.8.

shrike77
11-09-10, 03:27 PM
Guys thanks for the replies first of all, I forgot to tell you that I am on a tight budget since it's been 1 week already I am unemployed.

The actual transmission on the car has 75k miles and was very well maintained.

The reason I would rather use this transmission instead of the 4l60e is that the 4l60e is for a 4wd, has 150k miles and black oil came out at the rear of the transmission (there is no transfer box on it) on the way home.

To make it work with a tail housing I have to change the output shaft and it will probably require a rebuilt anyways if I look at the black oil.

Also to make it work with my speedo there is an extra 400 dollars at least that I would have to spend on other gizmos.
The advantage is that it is easier to change the shift points.

You guys are right that if I change the engine sometimes it would be fun to use the extra power.

I'll check what it takes to do a few upgrades to the 200r4 in order to take the extra power. I don't know it I can post links but here's an excerpt from http://www.gnttype.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9724

"There are a few weaknesses that must be addressed. If you are below the 350HP/TQ level, a near stock 200-4R with a Grand National Servo, upgraded 2nd band, hardened sun shell and pump stator shaft, valve body recalibration kit, and boost valves will serve you very well."

I'll check what it takes to do these modifications and probably stick with them on the 200r4.

sven914
11-09-10, 04:39 PM
^To add most of those parts, you need to completely disassemble the transmission.

jayoldschool
11-09-10, 07:17 PM
I am on a tight budget since it's been 1 week already I am unemployed.


Don't do an engine swap right now.

shrike77
11-09-10, 08:37 PM
^To add most of those parts, you need to completely disassemble the transmission.

I was afraid somebody would say that.

shrike77
11-09-10, 08:39 PM
Don't do an engine swap right now.

Wise advice. That's why I am pondering it right now, to see if with all the parts I have I can go ahead keeping costs minimal. If I could borrow the special tools from a friend it wouldn't be so bad. But I know there are always unknowns. Of course the "positive" thing about being unemployed is that I got lots of time on my hands.
I\ll think more about it!

turbojimmy
11-09-10, 09:12 PM
"There are a few weaknesses that must be addressed. If you are below the 350HP/TQ level, a near stock 200-4R with a Grand National Servo, upgraded 2nd band, hardened sun shell and pump stator shaft, valve body recalibration kit, and boost valves will serve you very well."

I'll check what it takes to do these modifications and probably stick with them on the 200r4.

If you search on Grand National Transmissions there's a handful of guys that know how to build them. Most GN guys making a lot of power move to TH400s. Mine put up with about 500 crank HP before I started to have a lot of trouble with it.

shrike77
11-09-10, 10:27 PM
If you search on Grand National Transmissions there's a handful of guys that know how to build them. Most GN guys making a lot of power move to TH400s. Mine put up with about 500 crank HP before I started to have a lot of trouble with it.

I don't want to make that crazy power. I think the stock 4.8 offers me enough for my needs, MPG is important also for me. The idea of the swap was to have more power but to keep the MPG the same as the 307. From what I read if I could get a 200R4 from a GN it would be enough for me. But I am pretty sure those will be as expensive as getting another 4L60E that is set for 2WD

outsider
11-10-10, 07:26 AM
I wanna go with an LT1 in my 87. more power than you know what to do with and better fuel econ! :)

shrike77
11-10-10, 08:36 AM
Why LT1 and not LS1 or if you're on a budget a 5.3 Vortec engine from a truck (which is the same design as the LS1 but has an iron block)?
They are newer and pretty sure better fuel economy. Also more power in stock form than a LT1 and if you're willing to throw money at it they can make crazy amounts of power.

I am just curious why you set your mind on the LT1.

outsider
11-10-10, 08:54 AM
have an LT1 in my 95 and I love it. never tried an LS1 or a vortec. I usually like to go with what I know :)

Plus, LT1 is probably cheaper than LS1.

shrike77
11-10-10, 06:43 PM
lt1 will be cheaper than LS1 for sure. Though I am not certain it is much cheaper than a 5.3.
But both LT1 and 5.3 should be good choices.

chp350
11-11-10, 12:14 AM
I have been trrying to find the answer for the last two days without any success

Can the 200r4 on our cars take 270 HP and 285 lbsxft of torque from a 4.8 Vortec without changing anything inside?
I know the 200r4's on the Grand National could but they had different internals.
My car is a 1987 Brougham with the 307

Thanks

I'm not quite following this, 2004r use a tcv to shift, and is a different bolt pattern than a 4.8, the 4l60E is an electronic transmission and uses a computer to shift. also most 4.8 used a 4l65E

shrike77
11-11-10, 09:46 AM
I'm not quite following this, 2004r use a tcv to shift, and is a different bolt pattern than a 4.8, the 4l60E is an electronic transmission and uses a computer to shift. also most 4.8 used a 4l65E

Yes, but for the TCv cable you may buy an adapter to install it on the throttle body of the engine. I tried to find the link again but I wasn't able. You should also be able to find adapters to fit the transmission to the engine. But the more I talk to you guys and the more I think of it and I am leaning towards rebuilding the 4L60E and put an electronic speedometer.

But for now I should read more about it, buy a manual or a CD and start making the tools with the info that I can find on the net

shrike77
11-11-10, 09:46 AM
I'm not quite following this, 2004r use a tcv to shift, and is a different bolt pattern than a 4.8, the 4l60E is an electronic transmission and uses a computer to shift. also most 4.8 used a 4l65E

Yes, but for the TCv cable you may buy an adapter to install it on the throttle body of the engine. I tried to find the link again but I wasn't able. You should also be able to find adapters to fit the transmission to the engine. But the more I talk to you guys and the more I think of it and I am leaning towards rebuilding the 4L60E and put an electronic speedometer.

But for now I should read more about it, buy a manual or a CD and start making the tools with the info that I can find on the net