: Question about the '09 auto trans shifting patterns



OldRoadDawg
09-11-10, 02:50 PM
For the guys with 2009 Vs with auto trans....

When you flick the shift lever into Sport mode, does your car start off in 1st or 2nd from a standing start, for example - stop signs or signal lights?

My reason for asking is that when attending the Cadillac Event at Monticello and driving the 2011 V sedan w/auto in Sport mode (not manually shifting) that it would always start in 1st, as indicated in the DIC, something my '09 doesn't display, except when in the Manual function.

I asked the instructor about this and he confirmed that they always start in 1st.

The only way my '09 starts in 1st is when I manually select it, which of course keeps the trans in Manual mode. But the next time I come to a complete stop the trans never drops below 2nd. I thought that was "normal" until I drove the 2011 V.

Now I'm not sure if that is a difference in programming after the 2009 model or if mine is just not downshifting correctly.

So . . . normal for the '09 V or did I finally find something that's not working correctly on mine?

Gary Wells
09-11-10, 03:11 PM
I would swear that I read on here that in sport mode it always starts in 2nd.

dqw1
09-11-10, 03:20 PM
Mine starts in 2nd.

mik2718
09-11-10, 03:38 PM
Here's what the 2009 V manual says:

"While in D (Drive), the CTS-V vehicle’s first forward
gear automatic shift after starting the vehicle will be from
1 (First). Afterwards, the CTS-V vehicles will always
start in 2 (Second) gear. While in M (Manual Mode),
for increased performance, the vehicle will start in
1 (First) gear."

M (Manual Mode) includes both Sport Mode (automatic shifting while in M) and Driver Shift Control (manual shifting while in M).

Gary Wells
09-11-10, 03:44 PM
Oops, my bad, and thanks for the correction.

OldRoadDawg
09-11-10, 05:26 PM
Mine starts in 2nd.
Ditto


Here's what the 2009 V manual says:

While in M (Manual Mode), for increased performance, the vehicle will start in
1 (First) gear."

M (Manual Mode) includes both Sport Mode (automatic shifting while in M) and Driver Shift Control (manual shifting while in M).
Well :confused:... I guess I'll ask ewill at Lindsay on my next service visit.

Caderac
09-11-10, 05:59 PM
In manual mode (Sport) my V starts off in 2nd

baabootoo
09-12-10, 12:23 AM
In Sport, mine always starts in 2nd too, unless I pull it back to 1st, changing it to Manual mode. Another thing I noticed today while in Manual too. If I'm cruising in 3rd, when I stop, I pull it back once and it goes to 1st, skipping 2nd.

Jack B
09-12-10, 01:05 AM
My 09 will always go to 2nd. in sport mode as well.

M-1028
09-12-10, 01:25 AM
My 2010 starts in 1st in sport mode every time if I come to a complete stop. If I'm rolling it will stay in 2nd.

mik2718
09-12-10, 06:51 AM
Wouldn't be the first time an owner's manual was incorrect.

bouser
09-12-10, 08:11 AM
My 09 starts in 1st in sport mode. It only starts in 2nd in drive.

DrumStix
09-12-10, 11:43 AM
My 09 always starts out in 1st in sport mode.

IBNR
09-12-10, 01:33 PM
Here's an easy way to tell: Next time you're stopped at a stop light with your foot on the brake and the trans in the regular "D" position, move the shifter to the right to put the trans in "Sport" mode (but don't move the shifter up or down, or hit the shift buttons on the steering wheel, so you don't engage "Manual" mode). When you're stopped and you move the shifter into "Sport" mode, you should feel a little shudder as the trans shifts itself from 2nd to 1st in anticipation of a 1st-gear launch. At least that's what happens in my '10.

Mike 09 V
09-12-10, 01:34 PM
Sport mode is always 1st.

New Bee In New York
09-17-10, 02:21 PM
Now the next logical question is ...

Why do some cars start in first and others in second? Everyone that has chimed in here seem pretty adamant that they know exactly what gear their car is in when stopped and in sport mode. Now I'm more confused than the OP.

baabootoo
09-17-10, 02:29 PM
Since we can't see what gear we're in when we move it to Sport, it's hard to tell where it is other than watching the tach on take-off, which is what I'll do today then.

LFTW8S
09-17-10, 03:25 PM
Ive got a 2010 V

D = 2nd gear start
Sport D = 1st gear start
Sport M = What you choose

Either way...you should be able to tell if your starting in 1st or 2nd by the way it pulls. In mine...1st gear start pulls like hell and shifts quick!!! :burn:

wfo
09-17-10, 03:27 PM
Just my .002 worth.

I let the tranny do the thinking. If you're in a straighline effort for time, i.e. drag or some other other effort that might result in the loss of your pink slip if you, muck it up with car being as stout as the V.. Shift it back and over to the right side and hold on. Why monkey around trying to out think this car's technology.

On the other hand if your riding the Dragon's Tail in North Carolina or in the mountains of Northern Cali or wherever, then have fun with your paddles.

Again, IMHO.

New Bee In New York
09-17-10, 03:47 PM
Ive got a 2010 V

D = 2nd gear start
Sport D = 1st gear start
Sport M = What you choose
Either way...you should be able to tell if your starting in 1st or 2nd by the way it pulls. In mine...1st gear start pulls like hell and shifts quick!!! :burn:

Is that a quote from the '10 manual? I don't believe it's the same with the '09's. I believe a first gear start can only be had in Sport manual mode.

LFTW8S
09-17-10, 03:55 PM
Is that a quote from the '10 manual? I don't believe it's the same with the '09's. I believe a first gear start can only be had in Sport manual mode.

2010 Auto. WOW...The 09's start in 2nd gear while in D-Sport Auto?

New Bee In New York
09-17-10, 04:29 PM
2010 Auto. WOW...The 09's start in 2nd gear while in D-Sport Auto?

I refer you to paragraph 5 in the first post. Sounds like his '09 works the same way mine does.

Have the '10 and '11's had their transmissions programed differently or are our cars faulty?

PhxTriode
09-17-10, 05:16 PM
1st here as well

PhxTriode
09-17-10, 05:19 PM
Another question is do all the 09 starting in second (sport mode) have all the updates to their TCM

jwa999
09-17-10, 05:58 PM
Since you can start in 3rd as well, here's how you can tell if it starts in 1st or 2nd:
use manual up shift while standing still. If you end up in 3rd, well. you started in 2nd. else you started in 1st.
My 09 sport automatic starts in 1st, the manual mode defaults to 2nd.
In manual mode, it's possible to end in 1st on downshift, as you downshifted at the same time the car downshifted to 2nd.
Q: how much do I wear out the transmission when I use it as a brake by downshifting to higher revs to slow down?

CTSVeee
09-17-10, 09:21 PM
I'm 100% certain that my 09 auto starts in 1st gear when I push the shifter to the right into Sport Mode. Once you start messing with the paddles/shifter to manually shift, all bets are off.

Also, for the poster that said if you are on Dragons Tail that you should use the paddle shifters, I 100% disagree. I spoke with John Heinricy today and he told me that on the Nurburgring he left the car in Sport Auto. The car never, not once, shifted in the middle of a corner. He programmed the shifting logic himself. The tranny logic knows when you are racing on a track, it actually learns from your driving style.

I verified this today on the track at PBIR. I selected the auto and drove the piss out of it (for my lowly skill set, that is). Not once did the car upshift inappropriately. In fact, when I got to a slow section of the track, where I was instructed to drive only 15 mph, the car stayed in 1st gear the entire time, ready to pounce. When I cleared the slow area the car immediately took off. Very impressed.

Obviously the auto in sport is faster than the manual or else GM would have ran that around the Nurburgring.

OldRoadDawg
09-17-10, 11:36 PM
Now the next logical question is ...

Why do some cars start in first and others in second? Everyone that has chimed in here seem pretty adamant that they know exactly what gear their car is in when stopped and in sport mode. Now I'm more confused than the OP.
No... we're both equally confused


Have the '10 and '11's had their transmissions programed differently or are our cars faulty?
That was my original question


Since we can't see what gear we're in when we move it to Sport, it's hard to tell where it is other than watching the tach on take-off, which is what I'll do today then.

It really isn't that hard. You'll feel & hear the quick RPM rise in 1st without even looking at the tach


Another question is do all the 09 starting in second (sport mode) have all the updates to their TCM

I wasn't aware that there were any updates. My '09 hasn't seen the inside of a dealership since Oct of 2009. I had them do the 1st oil change. Nothing has ever broke, clicked or squeaked from Day 1.

Like I originally posted.... I thought they 'ALL' started in 2nd until I drove the 2011 at Monticello. But from the different responses.... I'm even more :confused: :confused:

Meh.... shoulda got one with 3 pedals :banghead:

asabase
09-18-10, 08:34 AM
I'm 100% certain that my 09 auto starts in 1st gear when I push the shifter to the right into Sport Mode. Once you start messing with the paddles/shifter to manually shift, all bets are off.

Also, for the poster that said if you are on Dragons Tail that you should use the paddle shifters, I 100% disagree. I spoke with John Heinricy today and he told me that on the Nurburgring he left the car in Sport Auto. The car never, not once, shifted in the middle of a corner. He programmed the shifting logic himself. The tranny logic knows when you are racing on a track, it actually learns from your driving style.

I verified this today on the track at PBIR. I selected the auto and drove the piss out of it (for my lowly skill set, that is). Not once did the car upshift inappropriately. In fact, when I got to a slow section of the track, where I was instructed to drive only 15 mph, the car stayed in 1st gear the entire time, ready to pounce. When I cleared the slow area the car immediately took off. Very impressed.

Obviously the auto in sport is faster than the manual or else GM would have ran that around the Nurburgring.

Mine will downshift shift in the middle of an off ramp when I'm pulling 0.9g. In sport mode and light on the gas. It is enough to knock the back end out if you aren't ready for it.

asabase
09-18-10, 04:16 PM
Same off ramp at 0.95g in with trans in auto. Didn't downshift.

Tags63
09-19-10, 01:16 AM
Hey Guys!!

I have the '10 and thought it was weird for it to start off in 2nd as well. So I just down shift it to 1st. Whats up with that though??


Paul

wait4me
09-19-10, 10:31 AM
We can change it to be what ever you want it to be. The computer is in charge, and we are in charge of the computer...

asabase
09-19-10, 10:47 AM
Hey Guys!!
I have the '10 and thought it was weird for it to start off in 2nd as well. So I just down shift it to 1st. Whats up with that though??
Paul

It saves on gas. Plus 2nd has more than enough torque for regular driving anyway.

stabie
07-21-11, 08:21 PM
A slightly different topic, but has anyone else noticed (at least on 2011 models) that the paddles work even if you never move the shift lever to the right to activate sport mode. I like it, as the paddles only override auto mode for maybe 30 seconds. Its nice because you can goose it down a gear or 2 before you need to so you are ready. It seems pretty smart about returning back to full auto mode, delaying it if you are accelerating hard, then going back to auto mode after steady throttle. I sort of stumbled on it and I did not see it described in the manual. Kudo's also to the new (at least for me, my 08 did not do this) hold it in upshift mode for a second to return to sport auto mode. My old CTS, I would have to pull the shift lever left than right to take it out of full manual mode. After a little over a month, I am loving this upgrade from my 08.

Cub Cadet
07-21-11, 08:40 PM
My manual always starts in 1st gear :)

wait4me
07-23-11, 10:52 AM
Yeah that is a bug in the 2011 transmission calibration that it allows you to have the manual mode while in normal mode. Im sure eventually the calibrators will see the error and correct it in a future update. It is a single setting change they need to make for it to no longer happen..


LOL True on the manual always starting in 1st.. SOMETIMES though in the snow, i have had to use 3rd gear start... ;)

stabie
07-23-11, 11:40 AM
Please say it isn't so. After using it on the caddy, I wish my vette had the same option. I write software for a living and have to say, sometimes bugs turn out to be the best features. This may be one firmware fix I will not let the dealer apply.

Wannago
07-23-11, 04:01 PM
Here's an easy way to tell: Next time you're stopped at a stop light with your foot on the brake and the trans in the regular "D" position, move the shifter to the right to put the trans in "Sport" mode (but don't move the shifter up or down, or hit the shift buttons on the steering wheel, so you don't engage "Manual" mode). When you're stopped and you move the shifter into "Sport" mode, you should feel a little shudder as the trans shifts itself from 2nd to 1st in anticipation of a 1st-gear launch. At least that's what happens in my '10.

Exaclty what my 09 does. You can feel it surge when you move it into sport mode, as the tranny shifts from 2nd to 1st.