: Doing the studs and head gaskets , would like suggestions for locking cams & crank



jimsbox
08-18-10, 03:23 PM
Doing the studs and head gaskets , would like suggestions for locking cams & crank shafts so they will remain as they were at cyl 1 TDC when I replace the heads.

97EldoCoupe
08-18-10, 03:45 PM
My advice Jim, would be to not worry about keeping it all locked in place. It's pretty easy to set the timing (although getting it perfect is incredibly important) by following the directions/images in the FSM.

I have seen someone (and this is a pretty good idea if you need to lock the cams) remove a camshaft cap and place a piece of thin scrap paper in there and tighten it back down. That will hold the cams and keep them from rotating.

Your 2000 will have roller cams and they will snap to the most tension-free positon as soon as you remove the timing chains.

There are also steel brackets you can use to place over the hexagonal portion of the camshaft casting- exhaust and intake with one bracket.

zonie77
08-18-10, 09:11 PM
My advice Jim, would be to not worry about keeping it all locked in place. It's pretty easy to set the timing (although getting it perfect is incredibly important) by following the directions/images in the FSM.




Yeah, that!

bigtone
08-19-10, 05:40 PM
I was one who used the paper to lock the cams. With the starter off I fab'd a piece of aluminum with a few threaded holes to put pressure on the flywheel to keep the engine from turning. What I did was stop the engine at top dead center of number 1 cylinder, then lock the crank and cams. This makes the timing nearly idiotproof after you reassemble. It just makes good sense to me and removes guesswork if you are not totally familiar with Nstars like I was.

zonie77
08-19-10, 10:58 PM
Doing the studs and head gaskets , would like suggestions for locking cams & crank shafts so they will remain as they were at cyl 1 TDC when I replace the heads.

Are you doing this in or out of the car? Do you have a factory service manual?

If you are doing it out of the car it is easy to turn it over to set and check cam timing. If you are doing it in the car it might be worth locking it.

IXSLR8
08-20-10, 02:42 AM
When I did the N* heads for the first time, I made a tool to lock the crankshaft in TDC position. I basically cut off a section of an old flexplate with the teeth. Then I welded the teeth to a bracket that i fabbed to mount where the starter goes. Works nice but probably overkill now that I have some N* experience with doing heads a few times. I still like the idea of having it locked in place though.

tateos
08-20-10, 03:03 PM
Looking at that picture, I can't help but think it looks like a nightmare to do in the car!

jimsbox
08-20-10, 09:43 PM
Zonie,

I am doing an 02 yard engine with 68k on it. My 00 has 280k + and a blown head gasket. I have the engine on a stand. I also need to lock the crank to torque the harmonic balancer. I have a factory manual but all it says is figure out a way to lock the crank if on a stand. I am thinking of using coat hanger wire to tie through the flex plate holes and to the engine stand mounting arms. Any ideas are welcome. The balancer came right off with 625 ftlb impact wrench but will be tougher when torquing it.

IXSLR8
08-20-10, 11:58 PM
Here's a Kent Moore locking tool for the N*: Part number EN-46326.

There's one on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/EN-46326-Flywheel-Holding-Tool-4-6L-Northstar-Cadillac-/300449439479

-dave

zonie77
08-21-10, 02:35 AM
Zonie,

I am doing an 02 yard engine with 68k on it. My 00 has 280k + and a blown head gasket. I have the engine on a stand. I also need to lock the crank to torque the harmonic balancer. I have a factory manual but all it says is figure out a way to lock the crank if on a stand. I am thinking of using coat hanger wire to tie through the flex plate holes and to the engine stand mounting arms. Any ideas are welcome. The balancer came right off with 625 ftlb impact wrench but will be tougher when torquing it.

I did it on the cradle and it was easy to get a prybar in the balancer to lock it. On a stand...hmmmmmmmmmmmm

I think coathanger wire is too soft, but if you have lots of them..........

A piece of chain would probably work better. You might even get it through the balancer and bolt it to some bolt hole on the engine.

bigtone
08-21-10, 08:04 AM
Looking at that picture, I can't help but think it looks like a nightmare to do in the car!

Like I've said before, it was not really all that bad. Alot of work, no doubt, but more 'intricate' work than dropping the cradle would be. 20000+ miles later, it is still running strong.

KHE
08-22-10, 10:21 AM
I've done two Northstar engines - I pulled both through the top. I planned to repair the first one with the engine block in the car but after spending half a day removing the water pump crossover, I decided to remove the block from the car. It only took an additional 30 minutes to remove the block from the car. The brace that goes from the trans. to the rear head through the rear exhaust manifold is an absolute SOB to assemble. If I ever need to do the job again, I would try dropping the entire powertrain by lifting the body off the car and then separate the engine and trans. if I needed to do any work on the lower end of the engine.

jimsbox
08-24-10, 01:25 PM
I am using the paper under one of the cam shaft bearing caps to secure the shafts and plastic tie wraps to keep the chain mesh intact on the cam and secondary pulleys so retention of correct timing will be assured. If anyone is interested, let me know and I will try to post pics to clarify. IXSLR8, thanks, I bought one of those and I will offer it here when I am done, I only found 2 on Google for less than $100.00.

When I pulled the rear head I noticed 2 unexpected things, there was orange dexcool flocculated deposits on the gasket and several of the bolts came out with what looked like some kind of resin or silicon (sealer?) on the lower shaft of the bolts at top of the threads about 1/4" long. Any ideas whats going on? This is an 02 donor engine, no aluminum came out on the threads.

Ranger
08-24-10, 04:00 PM
The bolts come from the factory with a thread locker on them. Maybe that's what you are seeing. DO NOT reuse the head bolts. :tisk:

jimsbox
08-24-10, 05:13 PM
Hey Ranger,

I am installing Jakes studs. Am having a heck of a time getting the dowels out. I have tried spot welding a 1/2" allthread in the dowel with layers of aluminum foil protecting the deck but my little mig welder is having a lot of trouble getting a weld to hold. I had to cut off one weld from the all thread so it can do it, just technique I suppose. Will try again after I cool down (frustrating)

zonie77
08-24-10, 07:10 PM
I just bent mine inward, not as easy as it sounds. It helps to cut and weaken them first.

jimsbox
08-24-10, 08:32 PM
Success at last! I tried drilling a 1/8th" hole through the other dowel and 1/2" all thread, cut off an old dull !/8" bit to make a pin then pulled it using a deep 1/2" drive socket to pull against (with old head gasket and 4 washers around the dowel to protect the deck) using a nut, it came right out. Tried that on the mangled one and it just cut slots in it (probably weakened by the welding). Reinserted the all thread and welded along the slots and it came right out too. When I do the left side, I am going to skip the welder and just use the drill technique. Man that was the most frustrating 4 or 5 hours!

Stay tuned...

KHE
08-25-10, 12:55 PM
I used a flat piece of aluminum and placed that on top of the old headgasket against the dowel. I then struk the aluminum with a hammer and that deformed the dowel. I repeated the process in one or two additional locations and the dowel came out. One was so stubborn, I needed to use a ball cutter in a Dremel tool to cut a slot in the dowel to weaken it. Sometines, they are really in there.

jimsbox
08-31-10, 04:23 AM
I am cleaning the deck and head surfaces and have some serious problems cleaning the small black gasket patterns from the surfaces, they are symmetric and are obviously from the gasket. I also have read not to disturb the carbon ridge at the top of the cylinders but I have been scrubbing with clean shop rags and acetone, will there be any problem that I need to worry about? I am not using any metal scrapers or abrasives, just plastic putty knives and acetone. Any ideas on how to clean the rest of the surfaces more effectively? I spent 45 minutes so far on just one of the deck surfaces and still am less than 25% finished for what I would consider clean.