: Northstar interchange



1996p71
05-08-10, 07:53 PM
I wanted to know what years and make of car with the northstar is a direct replacement for my 2000 dts thanks

1996p71
05-09-10, 10:30 AM
A guy in my town has a 2004 northstar vin 9 is it a direct bolt in I wanted this one because as it seems it's the better engine I have a 2000 dts

1996p71
05-09-10, 10:32 AM
A guy in my town has a 2004 northstar vin 9 is it a direct bolt in I wanted this one because as it seems it's the better engine I have a 2000 dts

Submariner409
05-09-10, 12:24 PM
This is close to your identical post of a short time ago..............

Submariner409
05-09-10, 12:26 PM
Is this the same car as referenced in your other engine swap post ??

Try to get in touch with either Jake at www.northstarperformance.com or locate ajxtcman in one of his threads.

Submariner409
05-09-10, 12:28 PM
This is the same post as the other two up in Deville. :thepan:

The 2004 engine should have the larger/coarser head bolt threads, but little else in the way of "better". Maybe a different piston skirt coating process.

1996p71
05-09-10, 12:45 PM
Yes I went to see the 02 engine and it was involved in a accident and the valve covers where all cracked up and for 900 and no warranty I passed but I found a 04 for a grand with a 90 day warranty

Ranger
05-09-10, 12:48 PM
Multiple threads are confusing. Threads merged.

97EldoCoupe
05-09-10, 02:49 PM
OK. 2004 changes.

1) M11x2.0 head bolts (better thread engagement in the block), no effect on interchange
2) oil filter mount is different, uses a one piece gasket instead of 2 O-rings. 3 bolts instead of two. You will need the filter mount from the '04 engine.
3) individual coil-on-plug ignition in lieu of the coil cassettes as used from '00 - '04.
4) upgraded pistons to help eliminate the cold carbon knock (and very effective too)
5) different camshaft covers that do not have the holes in the center between the 4,6 plugs and the 3,5 plugs for the coil cassette grounds
6) threaded bosses in the one corner of each head to accept the new ground strap to ground the cam covers to the engine
7) dual knock sensors, different style

I think that's it.

You will need to use your '00's camshaft covers with the holes between plugs 3&5 and 4&6. You will not need the ground straps from the heads to the cam covers. You will need the oil filter mount from the '04 (as I mentioned above). You can remove and discard the left bank knock sensor, and you will have to install the knock sensor from your '00 on the right bank. Of course use the coil cassettes from your '00 engine- you cannot convert to individual coil-on-plug ignition without doing a lot of re-wiring (the cassette setup has a control module in each bank).

It's pretty simple really to make this engine fit in your '00. While you're in there you should replace the head gaskets as preventative maintenance (I've seen '04's rusted / flaked up pretty bad) but I doubt you'll want to go through the trouble.

Ranger if you don't mind, I would like to compile a list of differences between the different years and interchangeability and then make a sticky of it- at least from '93-'05- if that's alright with you-

97EldoCoupe
05-09-10, 02:55 PM
Oh yeah and 2004 did receive the anti-scuff coating on the piston skirts. The pistons they used stock in '04 for all Northstars is the same as the service part upgrade for 00-03 engines. They are raised in the middle and lowered around the outside circumference- this allows for a bit of carbon build-up without the build-up slapping the cylinder head. The piston weight is the same as the '00-'03 stock pistons so you can replace these without throwing the rotating assembly out of balance.

Rocket88
05-09-10, 05:11 PM
Do the 04's you have seen seem as likely to have head gasket issues as the earlier ones?

97EldoCoupe
05-09-10, 06:01 PM
Yes but the thread problem isn't so bad. The bolts I took out of my (what is now your) 04 Bonneville still held torque. There's still not a lot of thread grabbing but the threads are a bit coarser. I still don't trust the M11x2.0 head bolts which is why I installed studs in that car. The gaskets were pretty much toast. No guarantees how much longer they would have held. Knowing the condition of those gaskets, I would not have trusted taking that car on a road trip without replacing them first.

1996p71
05-09-10, 09:02 PM
O well I guess I will stick with the 2000 motor then thanks and that sticky would be a great idea

Ranger
05-09-10, 10:12 PM
Ranger if you don't mind, I would like to compile a list of differences between the different years and interchangeability and then make a sticky of it- at least from '93-'05- if that's alright with you-

Sounds like a good idea to me.

1996p71
05-10-10, 01:11 PM
I meant do eldos and sts engines the same and will they fit the deville

tateos
05-10-10, 05:52 PM
Very interesting stuff, Jake, about the 2004 vs 2000-2003 engines; thank you for that. I do not have any current need to know, but since it is not on a 'need to know" basis, it's very entertaining to read about - just in case.

A sticky would be a great idea - we see questions almost daily about: "Will and engine from xxxx year XXX car fit into my xxxx year XXXX car?"