: Changing Sway Bar Bushings?



PGA2B
04-29-10, 12:47 PM
Just checking to see if anyone had ever changed out their front and/or rear sway bar bushings with Poly? I was under the car looking at my exhaust project and took a look at the rear sway bar. They appear to be dry and cracking:mad:. The Rear Bushing will be a very easy swap. Haven't looked at the front yet to see what would be involved. I will be removing the rear bracket tonight to put my Calipers on it to get the correct replacement size and check the front while I am at it.

I will report my findings tomorrow once I have the Energy Suspension part numbers.:thumbsup:

cad08stsv
04-29-10, 09:48 PM
Thanks PGA,
I like the way you think. Since my car has so few miles on it. Right now there is no sign of ware. I do know, however that Poly Graph bushing are far superior to
rubber bushing. I have exchanged them on several of my other cars with a real change in handling. So please Let us know what your finddings are, and thanks
Russell

PGA2B
04-30-10, 09:13 AM
The rear bushing is Energy Suspension part number 9.5161 and either R for red or G for Black (Graphite). The end links are similar to the Corvette link and I am going to research and see if the Vette end links will fit us.

cad08stsv
04-30-10, 10:59 AM
PGA You are the man,
As soon as you have information for the Black Graphite, as to fit, I will be on it. I don't see a lot of posts on this subject, I must assume that some are not informed concerning this matter. The reason I mention this is it would be good to get a group purchase going. Thanks again for your insights on this project and for the work you are doing.
Russell

PGA2B
04-30-10, 11:50 PM
I installed them tonight. Fit perfect and took about 10 minutes (with grease time included) start to finish. They are much beefier than the stock ones. I will drive it tomorrow and see if there is any difference. Not sure if there will be. I will tackle the front next week.

cad08stsv
05-01-10, 03:05 AM
PGA, Good morning,
I think you will see some difference in handling with just the rear bushing installed but the true measure of this test will be when you install the front bushing. The difference I have experenced is that there is no lag time (or give) in
relations to any steering input. In other words there is instanst action on the part that is being used (ie Left or right input) and of course the rear sway bar. Things will be a lot quicker, firmer, and much better handling. I have used these bushing in my 96 Impala SS, my 68AMX, and 70 Olds 442. The soft steering is gone, There is iinstant response
Thanks you so much for this testing you are doing. I know when you have completed the install you will see. Of course you will need to push the car a little harder than just stop and go driving. I would say in a road course
or auto cross you will see a world of difference. Best to all there
Russell :highfive:

timinfla2
05-01-10, 03:39 PM
Very cool - hopefully somebody posts a tutorial. I'd be interested in a group buy.

PGA2B
05-01-10, 10:05 PM
Its very easy and they retail for around $15 for the pair. Just get under the car and unbolt the sway bar by removing the 2 15mm bolts holding it on each side at the bushing mounts. Then grease up the new bushings and reinstall them. It literally takes less than 15 minutes.

It may be a placebo effect but I swear I can feel the rear of the car better now. I can now feel the rear tires need to be balanced because I felt them in my seat and yesterday before I changed the bushings I didn't feel it.

I really don't care about the balancing because I am replacing all 4 in the next few weeks with the Hankook Ventus V12 Evo K110 tires. I sell Falken and Toyo and can get them at cost but have choosen to pay retail for the Hankook. Not because of price but because I have heard nothing but good things about these from others that have put them on larger cars and they love them. They are also getting a good reputation from the Vette crowd.

LITTLEELVISDAN
05-02-10, 12:30 AM
Its very easy and they retail for around $15 for the pair. Just get under the car and unbolt the sway bar by removing the 2 15mm bolts holding it on each side at the bushing mounts. Then grease up the new bushings and reinstall them. It literally takes less than 15 minutes.

It may be a placebo effect but I swear I can feel the rear of the car better now. I can now feel the rear tires need to be balanced because I felt them in my seat and yesterday before I changed the bushings I didn't feel it.

I really don't care about the balancing because I am replacing all 4 in the next few weeks with the Hankook Ventus V12 Evo K110 tires. I sell Falken and Toyo and can get them at cost but have choosen to pay retail for the Hankook. Not because of price but because I have heard nothing but good things about these from others that have put them on larger cars and they love them. They are also getting a good reputation from the Vette crowd.Toyo T1-R's at cost and you go with he Hankooks??? You do know Tayo's come is our stock sizes right?

PGA2B
05-02-10, 09:13 PM
Toyo T1-R's at cost and you go with he Hankooks??? You do know Tayo's come is our stock sizes right?

I know Dan. I am the one who posted the Toyo part numbers.:thumbsup: I have a friend that has had both the Toyo's and Hankook's on his STS-V and liked the Hankooks better. They were quieter and lasted longer so I am going to give them a go. Anything is better than the Factory's:mad:.

P.S. They are costing me 592.40 to my door for the set and I have a Hunter GPS9700 Road Force balancer at work.:cool:

pj96ss
05-03-10, 09:41 AM
Please let us know what you find out about the end links. How about the fronts?
I agree with Russell on the handeling after changing the bushings/end links on a larger car. My 96 Impala SS was night/day after swamping them out all the way around. Russell, let's try and get numbers together for front/rear bushings and endlinks. Once we do this, we'll try to get a group purchase or call some of the Cobra vendors I know to get 'package' pricing.

P.J.

cad08stsv
05-03-10, 10:16 AM
Good Morning PJ,
Thank you for writing.
Great Idea, If there is any way I can assist you please feel free ask.
Russell

coati
05-21-10, 12:19 PM
Its very easy and they retail for around $15 for the pair. Just get under the car and unbolt the sway bar by removing the 2 15mm bolts holding it on each side at the bushing mounts. Then grease up the new bushings and reinstall them. It literally takes less than 15 minutes.

It may be a placebo effect but I swear I can feel the rear of the car better now. I can now feel the rear tires need to be balanced because I felt them in my seat and yesterday before I changed the bushings I didn't feel it.

I really don't care about the balancing because I am replacing all 4 in the next few weeks with the Hankook Ventus V12 Evo K110 tires. I sell Falken and Toyo and can get them at cost but have choosen to pay retail for the Hankook. Not because of price but because I have heard nothing but good things about these from others that have put them on larger cars and they love them. They are also getting a good reputation from the Vette crowd.

Have you done the fronts yet?
Did it eliminate some body lean?
Is the ride harder or still smooth enough?
Please keep up posted on any updates.
I'm interested in possibly doing this to my STS (1SG) w/V sway bars front & back as well.
Thanks!!!:)

PGA2B
05-21-10, 10:10 PM
Sorry, I have been working on the paint and will post photos tomorrow night for that. But as for the bushings.... I will be working on the front in the next few weeks and post results.

hd750
05-23-10, 01:13 PM
I installed the rears last night, a very nice mod. The car feels a lot better.

PGA2B
05-23-10, 11:24 PM
I installed the rears last night, a very nice mod. The car feels a lot better.

I am glad someone else has seen an inprovement. Strengthens my feeling of better response from the rear.

pj96ss
05-24-10, 11:47 AM
Energy Suspension said that the front sway bar is 1.44 inches (just a hair larger than 36mm) and they don't have a generic one that size. They said to look thru the catalog to see if there is one that size for a specific vehicle. I just scanned their catalog and didn't see anything larger than 36mm. I don't know if they'll make them for us or not.

P.J.

cad08stsv
05-24-10, 05:20 PM
Damn!

pj96ss
05-25-10, 10:54 AM
I just found an article in the GM archives stating that our front sway bar is 36mm. I'll find the proper bushing on Energy Suspensions website.

pj96ss
05-25-10, 11:41 AM
Digging down in the GM archives says that the STS-V has 36mm hollow front bar and 24mm hollow rear (at least 2008/2009). The Energy Suspension parts listed above are 25mm. I'm going to try and stop at Jeg's tonight and pickup 9.5160G (24mm universal) to install this weekend. As for the rear, they don't make a universal 36mm set. I'm going to try and match up a vehicle specific front set. I'll let everyone know what I find.

P.J.

coati
05-25-10, 12:22 PM
Digging down in the GM archives says that the STS-V has 36mm hollow front bar and 24mm hollow rear (at least 2008/2009). The Energy Suspension parts listed above are 25mm. I'm going to try and stop at Jeg's tonight and pickup 9.5160G (24mm universal) to install this weekend. As for the rear, they don't make a universal 36mm set. I'm going to try and match up a vehicle specific front set. I'll let everyone know what I find.

P.J.

Keep us posted on who has 36mm polyurethane bushings that will work for the STS V front swaybar.
Thanks!:)

pj96ss
05-25-10, 01:25 PM
I'm going to be picking up 3.5213 Thursday morning at Jeg's. It's a 36mm front bushing for GM trucks. ES makes a 36mm for Ford, but I figured that I'd get the GM # (not sure if it makes a licks worth of difference). I'll try and find the time this weekend to get them all installed. I'll also make note of any other diameters while the car is on the lift.

P.J.

PGA2B
05-25-10, 04:18 PM
I'm going to try and stop at Jeg's tonight and pickup 9.5160G (24mm universal) to install this weekend. P.J.
PJ,
Not telling you your business but the 9.5160 is too small and you will have to clamp it down too tight and the sway bar will not move at all. Get the 9.5161 as they are a direct fit;).

Been there.....Done that.............Have the empty ES container to proove it.

cad08stsv
05-26-10, 05:04 AM
Good Morning PJ and Jamie,
Sounds like you have this issue well in hand. I will be very interested in your outcome once the work is done, and your
seat of the pants feelings are. This is such a cool Mod. I can hardly wait to see what happens. Thanks guys.
Russell

coati
05-28-10, 02:17 AM
Good Morning PJ and Jamie,
Sounds like you have this issue well in hand. I will be very interested in your outcome once the work is done, and your
seat of the pants feelings are. This is such a cool Mod. I can hardly wait to see what happens. Thanks guys.
Russell

Me too!:eye:

cad08stsv
05-29-10, 04:19 AM
Me Three

pj96ss
05-29-10, 03:44 PM
Just put on the rear ES bushings. Piece of cake. Jamie is correct on the proper set of bushings (9.5161). I compared the OEM to the 9.5160 and the OEM was ever so slightly bigger. I looked at the fronts and they will not be easy by any means. The drivers side will be a pain with all the lines on the front side. I just put a caliper on the front bar and it measured 34.94 mm. The GM 36mm front truck bushing should fit. The OEM bushing bracket is a monster that wraps around the sides of the OEM bushing as well. I would almost be temped to order a bushing and send it to a shop that custom makes poly bushings. I'd rather use the OEM bracket up front if possible. When I spoke to ES the other day, they like to re-use factory brackets when they make vehicle specific stuff. If there would be enough interest in the fronts, I'll call next week to some shops that do custom stuff.

P.J.

cad08stsv
05-30-10, 12:38 AM
PJ, Good afternoon,
You know I am interested LMK what we need to do next.
Thanks buddy.
Russell

PGA2B
05-30-10, 01:26 AM
Count me in as I really would feel better about a bushing made for the mount instead of trying to use something else in the factory mount. I was not very excited when I saw that mount and the lines on the driver side.

That, coupled with the rears installed and the new tires should make her handle like a dream.

cad08stsv
05-30-10, 08:46 AM
Thanks PJ.
I am looking forward to this mod.
Russell

cad08stsv
06-04-10, 01:42 PM
Good Morning,
Any news on the front bushings? I know the last time we talked you going to contact another vendor concerning the Manufactureing of a bushing that would provide a better fit fro The STSV than what energy suspension could provide.
Please let me know if I can be of any help.
Russell

pj96ss
06-04-10, 05:36 PM
I haven't had time over the past couple of days to do anything with this. Monday I'll order a front bushing and have it sent to a company that makes custom bushings to get a quote.

P.J.

pj96ss
06-09-10, 10:18 AM
I'm picking up a front bar bushing after work today to send to a custom polyurethane shop to get a quote on: cost to make the mold and then cost per part.

Should be interesting if the mold is reasonable. If so, I'll own the mold.

P.J.

PGA2B
06-09-10, 11:59 AM
Thank you for your effort PJ. Let us know what the cost is going to be and maybe they can do a run of them for us.

cad08stsv
06-09-10, 05:28 PM
Ditto on that Jamie. PJ is doing a fine job on this project. It's to bad not more people are interested in these bushing. Do you think that that was what George W. was doing in the White House those eight years?
Russell

cadillac94pimpin
06-11-10, 11:57 AM
There is a nice oppertunity for you to make some money here.
It would be a ton of work but make a mold of all the bushings and sell a kit of ploys. :)

pj96ss
06-11-10, 03:50 PM
I picked the front sway bar bushing the other day. I'm going to be sending it off tomorrow along with a generic Engery Suspension bar bushing as the example poly material to make it out of. Should know basic costs by end of next week. Anyone want to get the end link bushing or see if there is a ES set that will work on ours?

P.J.

cad08stsv
06-11-10, 05:40 PM
PJ,
I need not tell you how interested I am in this project. I want to personally thank you for all the time and effart you have put into this. Please keep me in the loop. I know Jamie and
I are only the first to want this mod. I think as soon as word gets out that this mod is available and what it does and cost. you may be have a large following. Best of luck with the
new vendor I hope he will do us right.
Your Friend
Russell :thumbsup:

PGA2B
06-11-10, 06:00 PM
PJ- The problem with the end links are that they are similar to the Corvette design with a shaft on opposite sides of the link. It is going to be difficult to replicate.

VforVictory
06-11-10, 11:27 PM
Hey Guys,
As everyone has said great mod, if you guys want to make a group order count me in. Also would be interested to hear how the front bushing effect the handling.

coach123
06-15-10, 12:08 AM
Very curious about the improved handling.. count me in if it works great. My big fat sedan could use some better handling.

pj96ss
06-16-10, 09:47 AM
I sent a stock front bushing and an Engery Suspension front poly bushing (as a sample of the proper type of polyurethane to use) out Monday morning. The package should be there today/tomorrow. Hope to speak with the gentleman by Friday on rough costs. The mold cost will be the most expensive as he only told me that it could be as low as $50 up to $10,000 for a mold and until he sees the part, he can't quote. I'll own the mold if this goes forward which means anyone wanting these are at my mercy :lildevil:!!!

Doesn't sound so bad as the 2 little kittens at my office are sleeping on my desk as I type.

I'll post again as soon as I know pricing.

P.J.

550HP STSV
06-16-10, 10:35 AM
P.J.,

Count me in. I'd like to get a set as well.

What was the part# and place you ordered the rear bushings from again?

pj96ss
06-16-10, 02:49 PM
The ES # for the rear is 9.5161

You can pick these up almost anywhere (Advance Auto/Napa/Jegs/etc). I drive by Jegs to/from work so I just stopped in one day.

P.J.

pj96ss
06-21-10, 10:56 AM
Well everyone, I spoke with the molder this morning. He had a question as to a little nubbin thingy on the center bottom of the front bushing. He mentioned that he could make the mold to include it but the cost would be higher. I told him to price the mold/piece without the nubbin thingy as it looks to me that the nubbin was used to hold the front bar w/bushings onto the frame as it rolled thru the assembly line awaiting the bracket (being that the bar sits on top of the frame instead of under it (rear bar is bolts up into the frame and the front bolts down into the frame for those that haven't looked)). If anyone thinks/knows different about that little nubbin thingy on the center bottom of the bushing, please let us know.

He'll have the prices worked out for the mold and per piece by tomorrow. If you're interested (and this is a zero profit deal for me, I just want poly bushings and this is the only way at the moment to do so - the cost will be split among all those wanting them is the mold isn't too pricey - I don't want to upset/break any forum rules) let me know and I'll try to play the 'We have x number of bushing needed' to try to lower the price. He did tell me that the more needed, additional molds would be required unless we want to wait. I'm all for doing this as inexpensively as possible. So far (with myself included), there are 4 of us wanting these. Chime in if interested.

P.J.

PGA2B
06-21-10, 01:07 PM
Thanks for the update PJ. Let us know and as for the Nubbie. You theory sounds correct as I cant think of why they needed to hold the bushing in place after it was bolted down. But you might try to call Luke @ Lindsay and see if he might have some better insight.

pj96ss
06-22-10, 06:01 PM
Well, I got the prices this morning for the mold and per bushing. The mold would be $1850.00 (one time fee) and $47.50 per bushing. Thinking that maybe 10 people are interested and this is a non-profit deal, all costs would be split among everyone buying. Everyone would be looking at $185 share of the mold and $95 per set of bushings plus applicable shipping charges (for 10 people). The more wanting the parts, the cheaper the mold price per person.

I'm a little bummed at the price of the mold but we would own it and every time after that, it'd just be the price per piece.

Everyone chime in...

P.J.

coati
06-22-10, 10:28 PM
I just spoke with Johnny Spiva of PolyBushings.com of Coos Bay, Oregon regarding 36mm front sway bar bushings for 2005+ Cadillac STS V-series.
He said he doesn't make them for that model but if there was enough interest in a forum such as this & if someone sent him a sample bushing he could/might make them.
Don't know what the cost would be.
Very friendly man.
Just another possiblility.....

http://www.polybushings.com/index.html

pj96ss
06-23-10, 09:39 AM
I'll give them a call today between meetings. The biggest thing is going to be the mold cost and how he wants to pass that price on down to us per bushing. The current place has my spare bushing so it can be forwarded on to the other guy. I'm already into this for $34 for a bushing and shipping. Not that that is breaking the bank but I don't want to end up shelling out a bunch of money if there isn't enough interest beyond the 5 or guys that have expressed interest. I would imagine that the other place would need a bunch in order to justify the mold cost.

P.J.

PGA2B
06-23-10, 11:27 AM
P.J. Lets see if Polybushing is willing to play. If not I am also a Prothane Bushing dealer and maybe they would be willing to help us out.

pj96ss
06-23-10, 01:01 PM
I just spoke with Johnny at PolyBushings.com and it sounds very encouraging!!!! The mold cost wouldn't be nearly as high as the other place and the cost per part would be a lot less as well.

We talked about end link bushings as well. I'll be sending him pics of our front and rear end links for him to review.

I'm going to start a new thread about this (don't want to tick off the forum gods). This WILL improve handling!!!!!

P.J.