: **Borla Sport True Cat-Back Exhaust Video/Dyno/Sound Clips...6 RWHP/8RWTQ INCREASE**



GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 01:29 AM
As promised, here it is! A good amount of time and work went into the 2009 and up Borla CTS-V Sport Cat-Back exhaust system. This exhaust is a true bolt-on cat-back exhaust system. It replaced all the factory piping from the front cats on back. It replaces the left side flat pipe with some nice high quality mandrel bent T6-6061 aluminum piping.

This new exhaust from Borla is going to be called the sport and DOES REPLACE the rear cats. I have put about a couple hundred miles on the car since Borla installed the full exhaust system and there have been no codes thrown or any other issues or problems. There are NO 02 sensors before OR after the rear cats.

As you can clearly see from the pictures and the video clips, the Borla exhaust system is night and day from the stock exhaust. The stock exhaust system is much heavier than the Borla. You can immediately notice that the car has lost weight after the Borla system is installed.

The dyno gains shown were 6 RWHP and 8 RWTQ on a heat soaked car, so we were easily able to duplicate the run conditions. The car showed higher gains when the car was cold and the oil temps were low. The gains I am posting are realistic of what you will see on a dyno once the exhaust is swapped and the car is at operating temps. The dyno gains are modest, but HONEST.

I was present when the car was run on the dyno when the car was stock and when the Borla sport exhaust was installed, so there were no tricks of any kind. I would have seen them first hand and the gains would have been higher as we are used to seeing some manufacturers claim. There is no real way to guage how much power the car really gained from the Borla sport exhaust because there is no real way to show the power increase if you factor in the dyno results and the weight loss, but I can tell you from driving the car before and after the car pulls MUCH harder. I can't wait to get the car dyno tuned to really extract more power with this free flowing exhaust.

I chose to go with the sport exhaust system because it really allows the car to breathe much easier and it allows the car to effortlessly accelerate as opposed to the restrictive feeling of the stock exhaust. I don't have any information on the touring exhaust, but it will most likely be just an axle back rear section.

I would really like to thank David Borla of Borla Performance Industries and the rest of the Borla staff for allowing me to participate in their latest CTS-V R&D project. I really had a blast and I was treated like family.

We will be carrying the Borla exhaust when it is released. David Borla stated that it should be on the market in about a month and we will be offering forum member discounts on both the touring and sport exhaust systems.

Here are pictures of the undercarriage of the car so you can really see what Borla did here. ENJOY!

Thanks!

Shawn

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03028.jpg

This is a picture of the stock exhaust's front section. As you can see, the left side pipe is flat and you can see the rear cats that DO NOT HAVE 02 sensors positioned before or after the rear cats.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03051.jpg

A view of the exhaust after the front cats. As you can see, the left side flat pipe located just after the left side front cat has been replaced. The rear cats have also been replaced with a performance x-pipe.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03059.jpg

A closer view of the left side flat pipe that Borla replaced with a normal size pipe.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03053.jpg

A slightly zoomed out view

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03052.jpg

A view of the mid to rear section

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03045.jpg

Another view of the front to the mid-section

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03055.jpg

Mid-section piping where rear cats used to be.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03054.jpg

A view of the piping going to the rear

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03043.jpg

A picture of inside of the sport exhaust muffler

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03050.jpg

A shot of the underside of the right side muffler

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03049.jpg

A shot of the underside of the left side muffler

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03057.jpg

Rear View of the new sport exhaust with the 4" signature rolled Borla tips

Here is a link to our youtube video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o538R7RhjzI

dvandentop
03-17-10, 01:44 AM
damn sounds nice and deep.

i like it, will probably end up dropping the $ on one

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 01:50 AM
damn sounds nice and deep.

i like it, will probably end up dropping the $ on one

In person, it sounds awesome! It is nice because you can also hear a nice exhaust tone inside the car so both the driver, passengers and everyone on the street can enjoy the sound instead of just people you blow by.

Borla has always made a nice deep exhaust no matter what car they go on.

Shawn

dvandentop
03-17-10, 01:52 AM
how does it sound when you row up to redline??

i dont like the stock how once you get above certain rpm it all sounds the same. it doesnt seem to increase in volume.

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 02:01 AM
how does it sound when you row up to redline??

i dont like the stock how once you get above certain rpm it all sounds the same. it doesnt seem to increase in volume.

My car is an auto by the way just in case anyone reading this was wondering, but the sound is really deep and sounds just like the Corvette Borla exhaust inside and out which as everyone knows truly kicks ass. You hear every gear and it makes you want to roll down the windows so you can hear the exterior exhaust tone. Either way, you will really enjoy the soundtrack the CTS-V has with the Borla. Borla has never disappointed me in the past and I have had their exhaust systems on almost every GM car, truck or SUV I have ever had.

Shawn

Q8 6.2
03-17-10, 05:57 AM
wow thats exactly what i wanted borla to do,what was the dyno results???

haha saw the smoke all the borla catbacks did that when new scared me to death one time....

Hawkeye2
03-17-10, 07:22 AM
Any drone when cruising at speed?

I have a Borla system on my Camaro and love it!

dqw1
03-17-10, 08:15 AM
Borla has a site in Johnson City, TN. I wouldn't mind making a road trip to get it installed. Can't wait to see the price.

chrswk
03-17-10, 08:45 AM
Sorry for the rookie question, but how much does the removal of the secondary catalytic converters affect the emissions?

Ross L
03-17-10, 09:01 AM
Sounds Great! Did I miss the price or is it undetermined at this point? I guess I won't be eliminating the secondary cats if thats all the hp I'm losing. Nice write up!:thumbsup:

neuronbob
03-17-10, 10:44 AM
Sounds beautiful. Thanks so much for sharing! It's good to have another option. I also second chrswk's question about the effect of removal of the secondary cats on emissions. I live in an area where we have to test emissions every two years.

GMX322V S/C
03-17-10, 11:02 AM
Very nice looking system Shawn--the quality looks excellent! Congratulations.

wait4me
03-17-10, 11:36 AM
Looks good, hopefully it is as cheap as mine as it looks identical. Except im 3 inch tubing using a Stamped Truflow stainless x pipe system instead of using 2 welded u bends to make the x as there kit is....

If they will be the same price as mine, then i can quit making mine..

Is there kit 3 inch or 2.5?

A 3 inch is for sure needed on our higher horsepower modded ones. As it is 18 horsepower to gain.

dvandentop
03-17-10, 11:44 AM
Jesse yours doesnt have any mufflers though does it?

dqw1
03-17-10, 11:53 AM
Looks good, hopefully it is as cheap as mine as it looks identical. Except im 3 inch tubing using a Stamped Truflow stainless x pipe system instead of using 2 welded u bends to make the x as there kit is....

If they will be the same price as mine, then i can quit making mine..

Is there kit 3 inch or 2.5?

A 3 inch is for sure needed on our higher horsepower modded ones. As it is 18 horsepower to gain.
Jesse how much is yours? I'm also thinking about road trip to your place.
(Just found the price)

demorgan59
03-17-10, 12:10 PM
Sorry, I can't tell from the pictures (great pics BTW), but what part of the piping is 6061-T6 aluminum? What is the muffler material? Looks great!

Jpjr
03-17-10, 12:15 PM
Looks great as all Borla pipes do...

If it is 50 state certified then I am definitely buying. Need it to pass in CA...

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 01:36 PM
Q8 6.2,

Borla is going to email me the dyno sheet and I will post the before and after graph once I get it uploaded. I should have it shortly. Borla put the car on the dyno right after they installed the full system, so everything seemed to burn off after the first dyno run that you saw.

Hawkeye2,

There is a bit of drone in the very low RPM range, but nothing at highway cruising speeds. It isn't heavy drone and is very liveable. It sounds the way the car should have from the factory.

dqw1,

All Borla systems are now manufactured right by you in Tennessee, but anything can be built in their Oxnard, CA facility. My system was built here in Cali. I don't know if you can get it installed there, but I am sure you can purchase the system from us when they are available and then we can will call it for you or have Borla install it there if they are equipped to do so. I haven't asked David Borla if Tennessee is able to do installs.

chrswk,

I haven't had the car tested for emissions compliance, but it seems that the front cats are doing a fine job as I don't smell a thing on cold or warm startup. I am very familiar with the smell when all cats are removed. I hate that smell and would never get rid of the front cats. I can't imagine I wouldn't pass CA smog. I could always take it to a smog shop to have it tested, but I really don't want to pay $75.00 to confirm what I pretty much already know. If anyone wants to cover my smog check to confirm, I will gladly do it at a local smog shop.

Ross L,

Price has not been determined. David Borla will let us know when pricing is finalized. The dyno gains I posted were before and after on a highly heat soaked vehicle. When Borla dyno tested my car with the system cold with lower oil temps, the car did 455 RWHP and stock (heat soaked) was 440 RWHP, so the power gains and weight loss gains will result in higher power gains. Trust me, removing the rear cats makes the car truly come alive when driving it. The car is a beast on the highway at WOT. I haven't done anything else to the car either. Stock intake, stock engine and no custom dyno tune as of yet.

anonfrank,

I have no doubts that my car will pass the CA emissions sniffer test and there is no way for them to do a visual inspection of the entire exhaust system. I know they don't do full exhaust system visual inspections here in CA, but it may vary in other states. What states do a full exhaust system visual inspection and who is to say that those inspection stations that do inspections would even know that the car has rear cats? Those inspection states are most likely looking for exhaust leaks or missing cats entirely. As long as you have the front main cats, you should be ok, but again, it depends on how strict and thorough your state's inspection stations are. Here in CA, you would think they would be the Gestapo of inspections, but in CA, all new cars don't have to be smogged for the first 7 years. Who keeps their cars that long anymore?

GMX322V S/C,

Thank you! I love the new system! Having the only CTS-V with a Borla exhaust makes me feel really special! Borla hit a home run with the CTS-V sport exhaust.

wait4me,

I didn't ask Borla, but I am sure it is a 2.5" system. If you want them to build a 3" race system, I am sure they can build it in a heartbeat. Their facility is amazing. I took a lot more pictures of other cars that were there when they were installing the system. They had 2 new Camaro SS vehicles there for exhaust systems, a new C6, a new 911, a new WRX and of course my CTS-V.

demorgan59,

The entire cat-back system is T6-6061 aluminum including the mufflers. All Borla exhaust system are T6-6061.

Jpjr,

It should pass Cali emissions, but then again will you have the car in 7 years? That is the next time you will have to smog it and I can always do the smog check test verification for you guys to really confirm that removing the rear cats still passes CA emissions, especially on a car that is hot when they put it on the smog dyno. The hotter the engine, the less it emits and when have you ever heard of a smog check that was done on a cold car? I mean, you have to drive it there and that in itself gets the car to operating temp.

I hope this helps answer all your questions.

Shawn

Gary Wells
03-17-10, 03:04 PM
Shawn:
I'm thinking that all new Kali cars need smog on the 6th year. Thereafter every 2 years. Is that no longer current?

demorgan59
03-17-10, 03:07 PM
Are you sure about that material? All the high end exhaust systems, including Borla, that I have ever seen are 304 Stainless Steel or titanium. Not trying to start anything, but it does make a big difference.

Jpjr
03-17-10, 03:16 PM
Yes I always thought they used T-304.

Regarding smog, I would buy the Borla exhaust if someone, anyone, did the check verification with the kit first. If one car passes, I would be comfortable that mine would pass since its still stock.

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 03:27 PM
Are you sure about that material? All the high end exhaust systems, including Borla, that I have ever seen are 304 Stainless Steel or titanium. Not trying to start anything, but it does make a big difference.

I am so so so sorry. I got Borla's materials confused with some of our CNC aluminum components. You are very correct. Borla used full T-304 Stainless Steel on the exhaust. I am so sorry again.

Gary Wells,

Last I checked, it was on the 7th year with the first 6 years being exempt for new cars.

Shawn

Gary Wells
03-17-10, 03:40 PM
Shawn:
Ok, thanks for the correction.

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 03:50 PM
Shawn:
Ok, thanks for the correction.

No problem at all. I bought a 2001 C5 back in November of 2000 and the DMV system showed that the first time the car would have to be smogged was November of 2007. That's how I knew for sure. I am sure it hasn't changed. DMV just charges us a hefty smog abatement fee on our registrations every year in place of the smog check. I am glad to pay it!

Shawn

RemoWilliams
03-17-10, 03:53 PM
Sounds great. The idle sound is perfect. Not too loud and truck like. On rev it's smooth and deep with great volume.

Depending on price this might be the one for me!

Razorecko
03-17-10, 04:03 PM
yea Jesse, does yours have mufflers ? I heard it was ridiculously loud. If it could be really tamed down and have the same performance it might be worthwhile.

Gary Wells
03-17-10, 04:08 PM
No problem at all. I bought a 2001 C5 back in November of 2000 and the DMV system showed that the first time the car would have to be smogged was November of 2007. That's how I knew for sure. I am sure it hasn't changed. DMV just charges us a hefty smog abatement fee on our registrations every year in place of the smog check. I am glad to pay it!

Shawn
I bought a C5ZO6 in July of '02 and I was thinking that my 1st smog was in '08. Is that info listed on the DMV system somewhere?

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 04:25 PM
I bought a C5ZO6 in July of '02 and I was thinking that my 1st smog was in '08. Is that info listed on the DMV system somewhere?

I called the DMV and they told me when it was due. I don't know if they will now. This was back in like 2002 or 2003.

Shawn

Gary Wells
03-17-10, 05:36 PM
OK, Thanks. Shawn

qictrk
03-17-10, 06:04 PM
For all you guys worried about the smog test. Hold onto the stock system and in 6 or 7 years, if you have the car, swap the stock one in for the test. Also, in Ca., whenever you sell a car, it has to be smoged no longer then 90 days prior to the sale. The seller is responsible for the car passing smog and it doesn't make any difference if the car is only a year old. When its sold, its smoged, period. Cecil............

Gary Wells
03-17-10, 06:29 PM
For all you guys worried about the smog test. Hold onto the stock system and in 6 or 7 years, if you have the car, swap the stock one in for the test. Also, in Ca., whenever you sell a car, it has to be smoged no longer then 90 days prior to the sale. The seller is responsible for the car passing smog and it doesn't make any difference if the car is only a year old. When its sold, its smoged, period. Cecil............
Tis sad but true. If you turn around and sell the car right now, it still requires a smog test. It is always a good idea to keep all of the original equipment anyway. Good info, Cecil.

Razorecko
03-17-10, 06:55 PM
Hey V, are the 1st cat pipes a 3" or is the factory 2.5" ?? Also how accessible are the 1st set of cats. I really wonder what type of power would be gained if the 1st set of cats were replaced with high flow's like random tech's and than the borla catless sport system was thrown on....

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 07:22 PM
For all you guys worried about the smog test. Hold onto the stock system and in 6 or 7 years, if you have the car, swap the stock one in for the test. Also, in Ca., whenever you sell a car, it has to be smoged no longer then 90 days prior to the sale. The seller is responsible for the car passing smog and it doesn't make any difference if the car is only a year old. When its sold, its smoged, period. Cecil............

Not true. In Cali, you are exempt from smog on a new car sold within the first four model years. If it's 5 or more years old, you then have to get it smogged before it is sold.

Shawn

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 07:24 PM
Hey V, are the 1st cat pipes a 3" or is the factory 2.5" ?? Also how accessible are the 1st set of cats. I really wonder what type of power would be gained if the 1st set of cats were replaced with high flow's like random tech's and than the borla catless sport system was thrown on....

The factory system should be a 2.5" system all the way back. The first set of cats are accessible and aren't too difficult to get to and are located right after each exhaust manifold. You may want to call Random and see if they make a set of high flow cats that would physically clear the CTS-V. You can go with those and the Borla sport system and call it a day.

Shawn

Gary Wells
03-17-10, 07:52 PM
Not true. In Cali, you are exempt from smog on a new car sold within the first four model years. If it's 5 or more years old, you then have to get it smogged before it is sold.

Shawn

Thanks for the correction on that also, Shawn. I had not heard about the 4 year exemption. Thanks for clarifying.

Q8 6.2
03-17-10, 08:12 PM
As promised, here it is! A good amount of time and work went into the 2009 and up Borla CTS-V Sport Cat-Back exhaust system. This exhaust is a true bolt-on cat-back exhaust system. It replaced all the factory piping from the front cats on back. It replaces the left side flat pipe with some nice high quality mandrel bent T6-6061 aluminum piping.

This new exhaust from Borla is going to be called the sport and DOES REPLACE the rear cats. I have put about a couple hundred miles on the car since Borla installed the full exhaust system and there have been no codes thrown or any other issues or problems. There are NO 02 sensors before OR after the rear cats.

As you can clearly see from the pictures and the video clips, the Borla exhaust system is night and day from the stock exhaust. The stock exhaust system is much heavier than the Borla. You can immediately notice that the car has lost weight after the Borla system is installed.

The dyno gains shown were 6 RWHP and 8 RWTQ on a heat soaked car, so we were easily able to duplicate the run conditions. The car showed higher gains when the car was cold and the oil temps were low. The gains I am posting are realistic of what you will see on a dyno once the exhaust is swapped and the car is at operating temps. The dyno gains are modest, but HONEST.

I was present when the car was run on the dyno when the car was stock and when the Borla sport exhaust was installed, so there were no tricks of any kind. I would have seen them first hand and the gains would have been higher as we are used to seeing some manufacturers claim. There is no real way to guage how much power the car really gained from the Borla sport exhaust because there is no real way to show the power increase if you factor in the dyno results and the weight loss, but I can tell you from driving the car before and after the car pulls MUCH harder. I can't wait to get the car dyno tuned to really extract more power with this free flowing exhaust.

I chose to go with the sport exhaust system because it really allows the car to breathe much easier and it allows the car to effortlessly accelerate as opposed to the restrictive feeling of the stock exhaust. I don't have any information on the touring exhaust, but it will most likely be just an axle back rear section.

I would really like to thank David Borla of Borla Performance Industries and the rest of the Borla staff for allowing me to participate in their latest CTS-V R&D project. I really had a blast and I was treated like family.

We will be carrying the Borla exhaust when it is released. David Borla stated that it should be on the market in about a month and we will be offering forum member discounts on both the touring and sport exhaust systems.

Here are pictures of the undercarriage of the car so you can really see what Borla did here. ENJOY!

Thanks!

Shawn

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03028.jpg

This is a picture of the stock exhaust's front section. As you can see, the left side pipe is flat and you can see the rear cats that DO NOT HAVE 02 sensors positioned before or after the rear cats.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03051.jpg

A view of the exhaust after the front cats. As you can see, the left side flat pipe located just after the left side front cat has been replaced. The rear cats have also been replaced with a performance x-pipe.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03059.jpg

A closer view of the left side flat pipe that Borla replaced with a normal size pipe.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03053.jpg

A slightly zoomed out view

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03052.jpg

A view of the mid to rear section

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03045.jpg

Another view of the front to the mid-section

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03055.jpg

Mid-section piping where rear cats used to be.

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03054.jpg

A view of the piping going to the rear

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03043.jpg

A picture of inside of the sport exhaust muffler

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03050.jpg

A shot of the underside of the right side muffler

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03049.jpg

A shot of the underside of the left side muffler

http://i541.photobucket.com/albums/gg388/DRVTWIN/DSC03057.jpg

Rear View of the new sport exhaust with the 4" signature rolled Borla tips

Here is a link to our youtube video:

YouTube- 2009+ Cadillac CTS-V Borla Sport Exhaust Video Clips (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o538R7RhjzI)



absolutely FANTASTIC BRO..your car looks and sounds killer :thumbsup:

GM-4-LIFE
03-17-10, 08:25 PM
Thank you so much! Appreciate the comments!

Shawn

mighty_quad4
03-17-10, 09:37 PM
those mufflers look to be have some restriction with those tubes just sitting right in the middle of the exhaust flow. i would opt for a different muffler imo.

readyact
03-17-10, 09:52 PM
The Borla sounds very nice. If the price is right I'm ALL IN!!!!!!!!!

qictrk
03-17-10, 10:12 PM
Not true. In Cali, you are exempt from smog on a new car sold within the first four model years. If it's 5 or more years old, you then have to get it smogged before it is sold.

Shawn
I'm glad that you corrected me. I was always told that no matter how old the car, it had to be smoged when sold by a non-dealer. Cecil..........

cbloveday
03-18-10, 09:24 AM
I'd be interested to know if you get any pipe clanging over time. I was under my car and 3" pipeing is very tight front cat and the heat shields in the middle of the car.

demorgan59
03-18-10, 12:32 PM
Curtis - Does yours make any noise from pipe to underbody clearance. I'm having Jesse do mine (ARH with catted X pipe and stock mufflers) in a few weeks and if he needs to tweek something it would be good to know. Thanks. Sorry for the hijack.

GM-4-LIFE
03-18-10, 09:05 PM
No clearance issues or ratting or anything like that on my V. 2.5" piping should have enough clearance under the car. I don't see why there would be any issues with stock sized piping. Now with 3", that may be a whole different animal.

Shawn

Razorecko
03-18-10, 09:38 PM
So V, we have the scoop on the sport system. Whats going on with the 'touring' system ?

cbloveday
03-19-10, 12:02 AM
Curtis - Does yours make any noise from pipe to underbody clearance. I'm having Jesse do mine (ARH with catted X pipe and stock mufflers) in a few weeks and if he needs to tweek something it would be good to know. Thanks. Sorry for the hijack.

Nope. It was tight though

GM-4-LIFE
03-19-10, 01:28 AM
those mufflers look to be have some restriction with those tubes just sitting right in the middle of the exhaust flow. i would opt for a different muffler imo.

If Borla put in a different muffler, the car would most likely be way too loud inside and out. Borla used this muffler for a reason for power gains without being way too loud. After all, this is a Caddy, not a Corvette.

Shawn

GM-4-LIFE
03-19-10, 01:31 AM
So V, we have the scoop on the sport system. Whats going on with the 'touring' system ?

I haven't heard anything on the touring system or seen it. I am sure Borla will have something on their site as soon as it is released.

It shouldn't be too long.

I don't think anyone would really benefit from the touring system. If you are going to spend that much money, why not go all out for the most amount of power and sound?

Shawn

CTSV4now
03-19-10, 11:33 AM
Has anyone tried just removing the secondary cats on on otherwise stock exhaust setup? While we don't have pricing, it seems like a lot of money to dump in a catback just to pick up 6RWHP/8RWTQ. I assume the cost is at least $1,000.

Jpjr
03-19-10, 11:57 AM
Has anyone tried just removing the secondary cats on on otherwise stock exhaust setup? While we don't have pricing, it seems like a lot of money to dump in a catback just to pick up 6RWHP/8RWTQ. I assume the cost is at least $1,000.

Well here is how I justify it...

1. Cost of T-304 has gone up over the years, good stuff isn't cheap so no way to avoid pricing it in.. that said they have to be careful not to make the price completely ridiculous.

2. The 6RWHP gain doesn't measure the gains you could acheive through blower upgrades/pulley swaps, etc. because the reduced backpressure and increased flow allow for much bigger gains on the induction side.

3. It might sound superficial, but I buy Borla's foremost for the sound and the quality. I get to hear that perfect rumble every time I drive the car and for some reason it is extremely satisfying. I also know that because the Borla will never rust, I never have to worry about changing the exhaust again ever.

GM-4-LIFE
03-19-10, 01:20 PM
FWIW, this is what I posted earlier, but everyone seems to keep harping on the heat soaked dyno power gains. Borla doesn't use a high CFM fan in front of the car during dyno runs to simulate real world conditions or to even attempt to keep the car running a bit cooler, so the power gains may be more.

The dyno gains I posted were before and after on a highly heat soaked vehicle. When Borla dyno tested my car with the system cold with lower oil temps, the car did 455 RWHP and stock (heat soaked) was 440 RWHP, so the power gains and weight loss gains will result in higher power gains. Trust me, removing the rear cats makes the car truly come alive when driving it. The car is a beast on the highway at WOT. I haven't done anything else to the car either. Stock intake, stock engine and no custom dyno tune as of yet.

Thanks!

Shawn

CTSV4now
03-19-10, 01:33 PM
Trust me, removing the rear cats makes the car truly come alive when driving it. The car is a beast on the highway at WOT. I haven't done anything else to the car either. Stock intake, stock engine and no custom dyno tune as of yet.

Thanks!

Shawn

Which makes me think I should just remove the rear cats with straight pipes and see what happens to the sound. I am surprised no one has tried that yet. If they have, please chime in.

GMX322V S/C
03-19-10, 02:29 PM
^^^
Removing the primary cats made a big difference in sound, but only cost me 1.2 HP after a re-tune after I had them put back in. With them out, my Corsa Touring mufflers were too loud. Back in, just right (just my opinion of course).

GM-4-LIFE
03-19-10, 04:00 PM
Which makes me think I should just remove the rear cats with straight pipes and see what happens to the sound. I am surprised no one has tried that yet. If they have, please chime in.

It will be way too loud on the inside of the car. I wouldn't care about outside sound, but what happens without mufflers when you go straight pipes is head pounding drone inside the cabin. That is why I wouldn't do it.

Shawn

CTSV4now
03-19-10, 09:16 PM
I must not be making myself clear. Stock exhaust manifold thru primary cats eliminate reat cats only and dump thru stock mufflers. Not necessarily looking for HP or TQ gains, simply a slightly deeper bass sound without drone.

GM-4-LIFE
03-20-10, 02:11 AM
I must not be making myself clear. Stock exhaust manifold thru primary cats eliminate reat cats only and dump thru stock mufflers. Not necessarily looking for HP or TQ gains, simply a slightly deeper bass sound without drone.

Understood. It may not give you much more sound as the stock mufflers are pretty large and do a great job of supressing volume.

Shawn

Q8 6.2
03-20-10, 06:05 AM
the touring exhaust should come the same complete bolt-on just like the sport but should come with small center mufflers to cancel resonance and slightly larger oval rear mufflers to give it
that warm Borla sound..

GM-4-LIFE
03-20-10, 01:03 PM
the touring exhaust should come the same complete bolt-on just like the sport but should come with small center mufflers to cancel resonance and slightly larger oval rear mufflers to give it
that warm Borla sound..

According to what Borla told me, the touring version will be an axle back system with larger mufflers to keep the sound and resonance to a minimum while boosting power output.

Shawn

Q8 6.2
03-21-10, 12:09 PM
cool, i wanted the sport anyway... haha it has the perfect midlife crisis looks and sound...let me know when you have the sport ready for order..

thanks Shawn :thumbsup:

Razorecko
03-21-10, 12:21 PM
They should just put the larger mufflers on the "sport system" to drop the tone down and call it the "touring"

GM-4-LIFE
03-21-10, 02:13 PM
Q8 6.2,

Will do! I will keep everyone up to date on Borla's progress and release of their CTS-V system. You are most welcome!

Razorecko,

The touring system is going to be for those that don't want to remove their rear cats. Borla may actually go a bit larger on their mufflers on the sport system to reduce interior resonance, but keep the nice rumble on the outside. I will be going back up to Borla for larger muffler fitment this week hopefully. I will keep everyone up to date on any changes made with new sound clips if necessary.

Shawn

Razorecko
03-21-10, 03:01 PM
Q8 6.2,

Will do! I will keep everyone up to date on Borla's progress and release of their CTS-V system. You are most welcome!

Razorecko,

The touring system is going to be for those that don't want to remove their rear cats. Borla may actually go a bit larger on their mufflers on the sport system to reduce interior resonance, but keep the nice rumble on the outside. I will be going back up to Borla for larger muffler fitment this week hopefully. I will keep everyone up to date on any changes made with new sound clips if necessary.

Shawn

Yea def mention to borla about adding larger mufflers to the sport system. Right now it sounds a little high pitch to me. Not only that but with a deeper note it will be practically oem at low rpm's until you give it some gas. I think this would hit a larger portion of the market.....you know the guys with sound sensitive females :thumbsup:

GM-4-LIFE
03-21-10, 10:01 PM
Yea def mention to borla about adding larger mufflers to the sport system. Right now it sounds a little high pitch to me. Not only that but with a deeper note it will be practically oem at low rpm's until you give it some gas. I think this would hit a larger portion of the market.....you know the guys with sound sensitive females :thumbsup:

I am way ahead of you. I have been discussing all of this with David Borla since the system was installed on my V. I have been putting miles on it and evaluating what the system pros and cons are so that Borla can develop the perfect V system at low and high RPMs. I got you covered, brother.

Shawn

DrumStix
03-22-10, 11:51 AM
You should re-dyno that thing. Posting a 6 RWHP gain is not attractive at all unless you are just into the sound. For that money, noticeable power gains need to be documented IMO.

CoOlSlY
03-22-10, 11:57 AM
You should re-dyno that thing. Posting a 6 RWHP gain is not attractive at all unless you are just into the sound. For that money, noticeable power gains need to be documented IMO.

I'm still wondering what the price will be...

Razorecko
03-22-10, 12:19 PM
You should re-dyno that thing. Posting a 6 RWHP gain is not attractive at all unless you are just into the sound. For that money, noticeable power gains need to be documented IMO.

You have to remember that this is also a quickly done run. Alot of times the car has to be driven for a while so that the ecu can adjust itself to the exhaust. Especially if it has one cat less. I'd like to see the final version being driven for a 100+ so miles than redyno'd.

Jpjr
03-22-10, 12:43 PM
You guys need to get over the power increase. Whether it is 6RWHP or 20RWHP, neither one is seat of the pants in these cars. The key is the better breathing, which makes this a good supporting mods to your real power mods. Plus you are getting a much higher quality exhaust that will last a lifetime, which matters if you keep your car for a while because sooner or later the stock one will need replacing.

I don't work for Borla, but have bought many of their kits and they have always been some of my best mods.

Razorecko
03-22-10, 01:07 PM
you also have to remember that a good catback can't really see its full potential untill its in combination with a good air intake. Flow from both ends is when you'll see nicer #'s

DrumStix
03-22-10, 02:07 PM
You guys need to get over the power increase. Whether it is 6RWHP or 20RWHP, neither one is seat of the pants in these cars. The key is the better breathing, which makes this a good supporting mods to your real power mods. Plus you are getting a much higher quality exhaust that will last a lifetime, which matters if you keep your car for a while because sooner or later the stock one will need replacing.

I don't work for Borla, but have bought many of their kits and they have always been some of my best mods.

If you can't feel 20 rwhp, you need to get your azz recalibrated. Exhaust is not a supporting mod in most peoples opinion, it is an essential baseline mod due to factory restrictions.

DrumStix
03-22-10, 02:25 PM
you also have to remember that a good catback can't really see its full potential untill its in combination with a good air intake. Flow from both ends is when you'll see nicer #'s

....Though most people are claiming 18 HP with catback exhaust. If I were shopping, I'd wanna know is all I'm saying. Everything else being thrown into this discussion is pretty much irrelevant in terms of $/HP when choosing an exhaust. Hearing for the 500th time that you think the car takes 100 miles to relearn, or that you need to do the intake mod as well, or that this is a supporting mod are all excuses for apples to apples comparison of a before and after quantification for this mod or any other, so a consumer can make an informed decision.

Jpjr
03-22-10, 08:13 PM
If you can't feel 20 rwhp, you need to get your azz recalibrated. Exhaust is not a supporting mod in most peoples opinion, it is an essential baseline mod due to factory restrictions.

LOL, fair enough. But have you ever heard the term placebo?

People spend a lot of money on a mod and are sure they feel it. Most times you don't. Don't ask me how how much money I've spent on mods over the years to resign to this conclusion, but you can guess by my current stable (Cobra, ZO6, V2).

DrumStix
03-22-10, 11:39 PM
LOL, fair enough. But have you ever heard the term placebo?

People spend a lot of money on a mod and are sure they feel it. Most times you don't. Don't ask me how how much money I've spent on mods over the years to resign to this conclusion, but you can guess by my current stable (Cobra, ZO6, V2).

Who's placebo and does he sell car parts? That's why I interrogate numbers, claims, gains/losses, whatever you want to call it, to get to the bottom line. Like I said, some guys can tell every little difference in their cars. I suppose that's why I'm concerned with numbers. Others cruise around boards looking for 60-80 HP mods so they think they can tell if there's a gain there, only to scrutinize and pick the wrong parts whilst going to the track and still running slower than me. :D Stick with me, you'll go faster. If you want examples, I can provide them.

GM-4-LIFE
03-23-10, 01:27 AM
Like I posted earlier, the dyno gains were more like 15 RWHP on Borla's dyno, but the heat soaked stationary dyno numbers with NO AIR moving towards the front of the car to cool it off were 6 RWHP. After driving the car for now over 600 miles since the new exhaust was put on, I can say without a shadow of a doubt that the seat of the pants feel is that the car EASILY picked up AT LEAST 15-20 RWHP!

The area under the curve across the RPM band sure feels like the exhaust really woke the car up. I don't think I would notice a 6 RWHP increase. If you guys could drive my car, you would agree that the car pulls hard and is a beast with just the exhaust mod. With a good cold air intake and a quality custom dyno tune, this car could see much higher numbers.

I don't know what the cost of the Borla sport exhaust is going to be, but I can say that it is going to be worth every penny once you experience the before and after seat of the pants feeling.

Shawn

cbloveday
03-23-10, 08:19 AM
I'm waiting to see the finished product on their site with dyno graphs, sound clips, pricing, and CTS-V Twin smiling. Borla will put out a competetive product or they will scrap it. Their reputation is at risk, so testing, testing and more testing will be done, and that takes time.

DrumStix
03-23-10, 11:09 AM
Like I posted earlier, the dyno gains were more like 15 RWHP on Borla's dyno, but the heat soaked stationary dyno numbers with NO AIR moving towards the front of the car to cool it off were 6 RWHP. After driving the car for now over 600 miles since the new exhaust was put on, I can say without a shadow of a doubt that the seat of the pants feel is that the car EASILY picked up AT LEAST 15-20 RWHP!

The area under the curve across the RPM band sure feels like the exhaust really woke the car up. I don't think I would notice a 6 RWHP increase. If you guys could drive my car, you would agree that the car pulls hard and is a beast with just the exhaust mod. With a good cold air intake and a quality custom dyno tune, this car could see much higher numbers.

I don't know what the cost of the Borla sport exhaust is going to be, but I can say that it is going to be worth every penny once you experience the before and after seat of the pants feeling.

Shawn

Cool. I expect we would see 15-20 RWHP. Any plans to dyno and see where it is stands days?

Jpjr
03-23-10, 12:29 PM
Who's placebo and does he sell car parts? That's why I interrogate numbers, claims, gains/losses, whatever you want to call it, to get to the bottom line. Like I said, some guys can tell every little difference in their cars. I suppose that's why I'm concerned with numbers. Others cruise around boards looking for 60-80 HP mods so they think they can tell if there's a gain there, only to scrutinize and pick the wrong parts whilst going to the track and still running slower than me. :D Stick with me, you'll go faster. If you want examples, I can provide them.

Unless you are running faster than 10s with a street car I'll stick with my own "seat".. but I like the response.

DrumStix
03-23-10, 03:15 PM
So are you claiming 9's in your street car with DOT tires? I enjoyed the post too.

Jpjr
03-23-10, 05:16 PM
So are you claiming 9's in your street car with DOT tires? I enjoyed the post too.

I said 10s, Nitto DRs, lots of boost, built T-56. And this will be my fifth Borla exhaust :thumbsup:

DrumStix
03-24-10, 12:34 AM
"Unless you are running faster than 10s..."

That's 9's to me. I did that like 18 years ago with a stock Tremec. I lost count of all my exhausts though Borla is one my favorite's by far. Next.

GM-4-LIFE
03-24-10, 01:41 AM
I will try my best to get the car dyno tested at another location to see what the numbers will be, but from my experience with dynos, I can tell the numbers were accurate. Borla is very honest with their dyno numbers whether they be low or high gains.

Shawn

Karch
03-24-10, 03:31 AM
Shawn, I have a friend with a dyno at his shop very close to you, Oxnard, just west of Kester.
Let me know if you want me to call him and set it up, or if you want his name/number.

GM-4-LIFE
03-24-10, 12:50 PM
Shawn, I have a friend with a dyno at his shop very close to you, Oxnard, just west of Kester.
Let me know if you want me to call him and set it up, or if you want his name/number.

Yeah, for sure! Please give me his name and number so I can call and setup a time. Do you know what he charges for a 3 run dyno pull? He is literally right down the street from our shop. I hope it's a Dynojet!

Thanks!

Shawn

Karch
03-24-10, 01:24 PM
Shawn, I sent you a PM with the info, and I sent the dyno guy an email as well.

Razorecko
03-29-10, 01:31 PM
any updates on this from borla ?

Umrswimr
03-29-10, 04:19 PM
How much drone is "a little"? My C5 has a Borla exhaust and, while I love the sound, it's certainly far, far too much drone for a Cadillac. I'd be curious to see an SPL meter for a stock exhaust against this Borla exhaust.

I think the stock exhaust needs to be louder, but I'm not willing to tolerate any drone or boominess in this car.

gedupont
04-17-10, 02:30 PM
Stupid question - does Borla make the GMPP system for the 2006-07 CTS-V? Is the GMPP system the exact same kit as the one you would purchase from Borla?

GM-4-LIFE
04-17-10, 10:08 PM
Stupid question - does Borla make the GMPP system for the 2006-07 CTS-V? Is the GMPP system the exact same kit as the one you would purchase from Borla?

Yes, Borla makes the GMPP exhaust for the 2006 and 2007 CTS-V. I had the Borla/GMPP exhaust on my 2006 CTS-V. Borla used my 2006 CTS-V to test fit the system on my car.

The Borla system and GMPP systems are not identical. The GMPP exhaust is quieter than the Borla direct exhaust.

gedupont
04-21-10, 02:30 AM
Thank You!

GED

whisler151
04-21-10, 08:20 AM
Yes, Borla makes the GMPP exhaust for the 2006 and 2007 CTS-V.

Are you sure that wasn't the STS-V? I am unaware of a GMPP system for any CTS-V. I know Corsa was an "approved" exhaust for the CTS-V.

1-2-N-V
04-21-10, 05:18 PM
Anything new on the new mufflers or dyno or cost?

GM-4-LIFE
04-22-10, 12:52 AM
Still waiting on word from Borla as to the ETA of this system and cost.

No new information as of yet.

Thanks for your patience. The system is coming. Stay tuned.

Q8 6.2
04-26-10, 06:21 PM
Still waiting on word from Borla as to the ETA of this system and cost.

No new information as of yet.

Thanks for your patience. The system is coming. Stay tuned.

COME ON why taking sooo long :hmm:

i still cant believe there is NOTHING for this 4 door monster its been 2 YEARS and absolutely NOTHING from big names like Borla GMPP or Maagnaflow not even a REAL cold air system wow no support at all :histeric:

TMC CL65
04-28-10, 05:32 PM
It looks like they priced it at $1,489.99.

I can't post the link to the Borla website (Newbie limited)...but they have listed under new products.

Tom

CoOlSlY
04-28-10, 05:44 PM
Wondering if they will put a "touring" and "sport" version of the exhaust...

dvandentop
04-28-10, 06:48 PM
damn not sure if i will be in or not, hopefully they offer a nice GP price

wfo
04-28-10, 07:05 PM
Love that Borla sound..who doesn't!!

For me..it really gets down to the interior drone. Will I hate this system after a long ride?

wfo
04-28-10, 07:06 PM
Wondering if they will put a "touring" and "sport" version of the exhaust...

They noted this in the Thread.....this particular model is the Sport version.

Razorecko
04-28-10, 07:17 PM
damn not sure if i will be in or not, hopefully they offer a nice GP price

Heck ! if its only $200 more than corsa's set of metal can's than its a bargain in itself.

dvandentop
04-29-10, 01:44 AM
Heck ! if its only $200 more than corsa's set of metal can's than its a bargain in itself.
maybe i review the pic/video and it will regain my enthusiasm about the system

GM-4-LIFE
04-29-10, 02:53 AM
Guys,

I just emailed our contact at Borla to see when they will be shipping out and what the pricing is, so we can offer intro forum member pricing.

I am on it, just give me a bit of time.

Thanks!