: Head Alignment Dowel ???



malibuandryan
02-09-10, 11:46 PM
Hey guys, I now have the engine out!!! That Northstar is huge!!! Anyways this weekend I will be taking the heads off, but before I do, I need to get this mammoth on an engine stand(need to replace oil pan gasket)....Oh and Jake, If your out there, I will be getting the stud-kit here shortly.....Heres my question, why is it necessary to remove the head alignment dowel. If been reading other posts and several were talking about head alignment dowels??? Thanks again Ryan..................By the way, The hardest part about removing this engine was jacking the car up about 5 feet....(Scary!!!!)I couldn't use my picker yet because I have absolutely no room!!!

1997 Deville Concours

tateos
02-10-10, 02:45 PM
The head alignment dowels aren't solid pins like you've maybe seen in the past - they are hollow tubes that are partially pressed into and surround the area around the 4 outer, upper head bolt cavities in the block. Sometimes...well, most of the time, they are hard to get out. What I did is insert an old wheel stud I had around, then clamped down hard with vise grips, then turned and hit the vice grips, until the dowels came out. The outside was pretty gouged up, but I grout out the gouges until the surface surface was fairly smooth with my bench grinder. others have bought new ones. I used Norm's back in the day, but I think maybe Jakes studs make the dowels unnecessary

Does that help?

malibuandryan
02-10-10, 03:32 PM
Well, Kinda.....When I go to stud the block do I need to even touch the dowels?
I was just thinking about cleaning the surfaces, drill, tap, stud the block, install head gaskets, then head..What more do I need to do than that???? Maybe I'm missing something here..........The engine is still on the cradle and need to put it on the stand this weekend, but before I do all that I must loosen that terrific bolt on the balancer wheel....If I do it on the engine stand, I'll knock it over...... Thanks again..........Ryan

1997 Deville Concours

ejguillot
02-10-10, 03:43 PM
Well, Kinda.....When I go to stud the block do I need to even touch the dowels?
I was just thinking about cleaning the surfaces, drill, tap, stud the block, install head gaskets, then head..What more do I need to do than that???? Maybe I'm missing something here..........The engine is still on the cradle and need to put it on the stand this weekend, but before I do all that I must loosen that terrific bolt on the balancer wheel....If I do it on the engine stand, I'll knock it over...... Thanks again..........Ryan

1997 Deville Concours

Yes, the dowels HAVE to come out, then you throw them away. 4 of the 20 studs in the kit are machined to replace the dowels.

malibuandryan
02-10-10, 06:07 PM
Now I understand....so when I get these studs 4 of the 20 (2 on each side) they will be machined differently then the other 16 studs? Will I be able to notice the difference when they come?? Do the 4 dowel holes require a different drill bit????? Thanks again for all the help!!!:) Ryan

1997 Deville Concours

97EldoCoupe
02-10-10, 06:41 PM
Nope- the four pins HAVE to come out. The four shouldered studs have the alignment feature machined into it. Same process, but with these four studs, just turn them in until they stop.

tateos
02-10-10, 07:11 PM
Well, Kinda.....When I go to stud the block do I need to even touch the dowels?
I was just thinking about cleaning the surfaces, drill, tap, stud the block, install head gaskets, then head..What more do I need to do than that???? Maybe I'm missing something here..........The engine is still on the cradle and need to put it on the stand this weekend, but before I do all that I must loosen that terrific bolt on the balancer wheel....If I do it on the engine stand, I'll knock it over...... Thanks again..........Ryan

1997 Deville Concours

Most of us have found the cradle to be an excellent stand - no need to remove the block, unless you need to do half case or oil pan or rear main seals, and even if you do need to do those things, I would suggest you do the stud drilling and tapping first, on the cradle.

97EldoCoupe
02-11-10, 05:58 PM
Tateos I agree with you for the most part - as long as who ever does the work, covers all of the parts up to keep the chips out of drivetrain components. I'm a bit picky with that. But nothing beats having the engine on a stand....

stoveguyy
02-11-10, 10:24 PM
if you use an engine stand, you need about 4 big metric bolts to thread into the bellhousing. i had a bunch of standard thread bolts but no metric stuff. can't recall the size, M12-14 X 5" long? not cheap. just more parts to do the darn job.

malibuandryan
02-11-10, 11:27 PM
Well I'll make a pit stop at the local hardware store and see if they got anything.....Thanks for all the help ...Ryan
By the way, here she is.http://i934.photobucket.com/albums/ad189/pontiacandryan/DSC00376.jpg

97EldoCoupe
02-12-10, 12:03 AM
That's a familiar sight! :D

tateos
02-12-10, 01:03 PM
Yep - been there, done that, as they say :-)

malibuandryan
02-14-10, 12:55 AM
Hey guys, just an update.....When I took off the intake manifold, I couldn't help but notice that there was antifreeze, oil, and dirt all laying just under the starter. I'll have to get some pictures of this...It is freakin nasty:eek: There is at least an inch or so of this stuff. It looks like the HG really failed around cylinders 1 and 7...you can see where antifreeze and oil was seeping out around there...I'm pretty sure that there shouldn't be crap in there.....When dad and I changed the starter in his 98 Deville, it was very clean in there.....and his also has a blown HG....Thats the next project after I'm done with this current one....Thanks again....Ryan:)

1997 Devile Concours

ejguillot
02-14-10, 12:51 PM
Good luck! :thumbsup:

malibuandryan
02-15-10, 09:46 PM
Heres the picts, anybody else have this problem??http://i934.photobucket.com/albums/ad189/pontiacandryan/DSC00019.jpg http://i934.photobucket.com/albums/ad189/pontiacandryan/DSC00015.jpg What do you think about that?

Ranger
02-16-10, 11:52 AM
I'm pretty sure that there shouldn't be crap in there.
That's a safe bet. Looks like this on was leaking externally as well as internally.

tateos
02-16-10, 06:37 PM
Looks like an algae farm

malibuandryan
02-17-10, 02:58 PM
Hey everyone, I'm working on this engine in a garage that does not have heat.....Its about 30 degrees in there.....and so is the engine.....when I go to stud this block should I wait till it gets warmer?? Will the Loctite do its thing in this below freezing weather?......or should I just wait till it gets warmer? Thanks again....I know this is a silly question! but I want the best for this N*

ejguillot
02-18-10, 06:46 PM
I did mine when it was about 45-55 degrees in the garage, no issues.

Ask Jake, I don't think his garage is heated either.

stoveguyy
02-18-10, 10:02 PM
go to craigslist and buy a used shop heater. than sell it when your done. heat is nice.

jsiddall
03-10-10, 07:52 PM
Just reading this thread. I had different stuff in my block:

http://jeff.siddall.name/northstar_head_gasket/images/Northstar%20Head%20Gasket%20Repair%2024.jpg

Yes, that is dog food and maple seeds.

eyekandyboats.inc
03-10-10, 08:53 PM
you sure its dog food and not rabit terds

jsiddall
03-10-10, 09:06 PM
you sure its dog food and not rabit terds

Haha, yeah, I'm sure. I don't think a rabbit would be able to squeeze in there! I was a bit surprised even a chipmunk could.

97EldoCoupe
03-10-10, 09:55 PM
I've seen all kinds of stuff in the valley- including dead mice and birds.... If you have your Caddy in storage, you get it out and fire it up, 20 minutes down the road you smell someone cooking meat on a barbecue, chances are it's you :D

My '97 Eldo actually drove over a dead deer (long story) and the guts were hanging from the exhaust pipe. It was fresh meat and it smelled so good a mile or two down the road.... I was on a 1200 mile trip. When I got to where I was going I washed it off at the car wash and there were pieces of deer-jerky all over the concrete. LOL what an experience.

Oh- and for the last couple of months my shop has been heated. Thankfully. It's hitting 55 degrees outside this week and the furnace is pretty much off during the day now. The shop is still uninsulated, so my heating bill for the shop hit about $350 for the coldest month. Not bad for 4400 sq. ft. and about 20' tall ceilings at the tallest point. Come next autumn I'll be insulating the shop.

Submariner409
03-11-10, 10:32 AM
Post #21: Mice. One morning my wife opened the storage drawer under the stove to find a mouse had busily filled a small frying pan with dry cat food from the bowl in the other end of the kitchen........

Wait 'till you get a black snake in your serpentine belt !!!!!

Jake - did you ever install a used engine/transmission oil furnace ?? Those things are the cat's meow.