: Engine Swap 2000 STS into a 1998 STS



ferchja
02-02-10, 04:58 PM
Can it be done if I have the entire donor car? Can it be done as a cradle swap and ECU with some modification to wiring. If it is possible with some patience, then I am game. I have the tools and mechanical knowledge to do it, just need to know what I am in for if I try it.

Thanks,

Jeremy

Submariner409
02-02-10, 05:09 PM
Essentially two different cars, mechanically, electrically, and electronically.

It could probably be done with time, money, and patience, but the end result would be the same as if you did a complete overhaul and detail job on the existing 1998 drivetrain assembly.

97EldoCoupe
02-02-10, 05:54 PM
What Sub said. You're talking swapping crankshafts and re positioning the position sensors- which probably would involve machining the engine block. Then swapping cylinder heads unless you want to convert to coil on plug ignition. I know how to do this but there's a fair bit involved and it would still be a waste spark setup.

This question gets asked a lot (I was once, a long time ago, the person asking this exact question....) but we're here to help in any way we can. You can actually make the roller heads work from a 2000+ on a 98 or older, but not without some extensive modifications and a drop in C.R. I guess the power difference would be minimal because the roller cams should free up the HP you lose in the .3 compression drop (10.3:1 to 10:1).

Intake valves and ports are slightly larger on the 2000+ heads but the exhaust valves and ports are smaller. The combustion chamber is larger with a bit less valve shrouding. All in all I think the 2000+ is a slightly better design, but each has their good qualities.

ferchja
02-03-10, 12:47 AM
Thanks Sub and Jake, I spent time reading the forum, but wondering if someone may have found it possible.

Jake tried calling you back in December to work on deal for the studs, would you still be game? PM or call me if you are available to discuss.

Thanks

Jeremy
920-644-3361

PS How in the hell do you get access to send PMs? I've been a member since Oct '08. I have been members on all my other cars' forums, and have never had so much trouble with the forum rules. Tring to get a hold of some guys on here to help with my 98. Thanks

97EldoCoupe
02-03-10, 01:33 AM
Jeremy - I must apologize to you. I've been looking for your contact info everywhere. I was told by my director of operations / receptionist Charity that she gave you the polite brush-off and I asked her if she had your number and she did not.

The reason she did that is because there are about three people that I know of right now who have wanted to move in on my business and pull the carpet right from under me. I'm not going to let that happen- so I told her when people call about reviews, business deals, shooting videos, and soforth, to politely send them on their way. She wasn't supposed to do this to you.

Send me an email - jwiebe@northstarperformance.com

-Jake

To go into more detail, I have people calling me saying they want to market my business and that it has a lot of potential. I know this, and if anyone's going to be doing marketing it'll be either myself or Taylor (eyekandyboats), or someone I call up.

I'd be more than happy to go ahead and do that write-up with you. I just wish we could wait until I have the advancements done on the installation system. What's your time-frame? How soon did you want this done? And what sort of stuff do you do over at the Milwaukee tool co.? If you guys can supply drive motors for drilling systems, I may be in contact with you about that.

97EldoCoupe
02-03-10, 01:42 AM
98 vs. 00. My dad has a 2000 STS. I have a '98. His takes off in 1st with T/C off, mine doesn't. Mine, when traction control kicks in, if the torque is limited at all, it's very little. His, even with T/C off, if it senses wheel slip, the damn thing just cuts out until I let off the gas. Not all of them do this but I find it incredibly annoying. My 04 Bonneville? That thing will roast the tires with T/C off. I was at a coffee shop in town when a Mustang comes flying around the corner burning rubber. I was checking my lug nut torque and when I finished I thought I'd give them something to look at. 1st, 2nd, and 3rd, with the park brake on, smoke just pouring out. That thing stops on a dime. I think Cadillacs needed to be tuned more like the Bonneville GXP- and include those massive dual piston calipers in the front.

If your '98 is set up like mine is, Z-rated, very little torque management, be happy you have a '98- they're in some ways, set up better.

ferchja
02-03-10, 01:06 PM
No worries, she did a wonderful job, even faked the "hold on, let me talk to him...oh he is busy and said he cannot work on that right now" :rofl:

I have the car on my lift just about ready to drop the cradle. My thought on the write up is a full video and tips/findings from a guy who is mechanically able but does not do this every day. You would have the video/write up at your site and for your use. I have no business interest or desire to knock your design off. I have worked on dozens of cars (kinda like the UK "Wheeler Dealers" show) Hate to see them get crushed when they are still good and fun to drive. I lean on forums quite a lot since this is a hobby, and having the DIY writeups are key to do the work, just want to give back to the forums that I use to help with my current projects. If this turns out to be a fun and satisfying project I might take on helping local DIYers with the installation of your kit. If not, have the ability to get my kids cheap cars ;) Tons of Northstars in Southeastern Wisconsin.

I have enough pull to work on prototypes for installation rigs with our drill/drivers. Send me some guide rigs that you use to set the bore and I can have the R&D group look at modifying it to accept a drill attachment.

Sent you some emails, hit me back when you are avail. I am always up late (midnight) send me an email, and I can respond or call.

Cheers,

Jeremy

ferchja
02-03-10, 01:19 PM
We also run the accessories business and could work with getting premium drill bits for the boring.

ryannel2003
02-03-10, 02:48 PM
98 vs. 00. My dad has a 2000 STS. I have a '98. His takes off in 1st with T/C off, mine doesn't. Mine, when traction control kicks in, if the torque is limited at all, it's very little. His, even with T/C off, if it senses wheel slip, the damn thing just cuts out until I let off the gas. Not all of them do this but I find it incredibly annoying. My 04 Bonneville? That thing will roast the tires with T/C off. I was at a coffee shop in town when a Mustang comes flying around the corner burning rubber. I was checking my lug nut torque and when I finished I thought I'd give them something to look at. 1st, 2nd, and 3rd, with the park brake on, smoke just pouring out. That thing stops on a dime. I think Cadillacs needed to be tuned more like the Bonneville GXP- and include those massive dual piston calipers in the front.

If your '98 is set up like mine is, Z-rated, very little torque management, be happy you have a '98- they're in some ways, set up better.

Man I'm glad somebody cleared that up for me. My car always annoyingly cut out when you had the T/C off and you have to let off the gas to get any power or it will just bog down. I drove two '99's and it never did this. The '98 and '99's feel quicker than the the '00+ models do. I think the reason for the 2000's cut out is because Cadillac upgraded Stabilitrak to 2.0 that year and the CVRSS was also updated somehow. From what I've read the '98's have a bad tendency to crash over bumps, while the 2000's aren't too bad in this regard. I can't really tell you, it's been about 2 years since I've driven a '99 model.

97EldoCoupe
02-04-10, 12:42 AM
It's that cutting out / bogging out that I can't stand. Hence the need for someone who could reprogram the PCM. Anyone - come on ; anyone with a great electronic knowledge - you could make SERIOUS money in re-tuning Caddy PCMs. I think CodeWise and AJ's torque management removal switch setup may eliminate this bogging out.

ferchja- Charity is there to make sure I have time to work on deals, improvements, upgrades, of course, Northstars. I've had people come up to me wanting to become "partners" and sign a percentage of my business over to them- so please understand my nervousness / skeptism when I get approached with any type of offer. I once partnered with a guy in a lumber venture - he owned a wood lot full of precious hardwoods, so we made a deal that I would provide all of the labor to turn those trees into kiln-dried hardwood lumber and I'd collect 25% of the profit from the sales. He provides the equipment, supplies, and trees. It was worth a half mil. I worked hard aquiring drying equipment, even purchased some things myself. Well he wanted to run the whole show, and cheap out on certain things we needed to make it all work. You can't use old rotton wood to separate fresh cut lumber - it will stain the lumber and make it worthless. Anyhow, he would not listen to anything I had to say and it resulted in not being able to work together, I was out a lot of time and over a grand of my own $$. And I lost my equipment that was stored at his place. I swore I'd never have a business partner again. I've met crooked people and scam artists. I've had people snoop around my shop like they were looking for something in particular. So I am very cautious. I've instructed Charity to consider you a business contact- she will let me know when you call, and while I don't always have time to talk I will certainly do my very best to make time. I think we can definitely work together on some things. For now let's just keep most of this in emails, please. Make it public when the time comes.