: Now this is real driving.



Night Wolf
12-08-09, 10:54 PM
e30 M3, just listen to the S14 (NA 4cyl)!

NE-V3TaNGss

This stuff just grabs my attention like crazy.... I can't get into Formula 1 and especially Nascar.

Stingroo
12-08-09, 10:58 PM
That's pretty cool. It made me giggle at like 1:09 when he said "schedule".

I personally can't get into F1 at all. It's on at stupidly odd time for the U.S. (I know, I know, it's a "world" sport, blahblahblah, still a reason I can't watch it), and my biggest pet peeve about it is that the commentators don't ever explain anything. I know nothing of F1, so how am I supposed to get into it when they're just rattling off technical shit and talking about drivers this-one and that-one. Not my thing. EVERY OTHER SPORT IN THE GOD DAMN WORLD explains their crap so new viewers can get into it, but not F1.

[/rant]

GizmoQ
12-09-09, 01:10 AM
I agree that is real driving and looks like a whole lotta fun. Unfortunately, no side by side, driver vs driver racing there. Tried it a little last time I was in Europe (a brand new Z3 had to be broken in right), but its sad so many feels as you do about F1.

I took my little brother to the Indy 500 and then back to the F1 race at Indy the last year they were there. He is a Die Hard Drag racing fan and admitted enjoying the F1 race much more than the Indy cars. Just imagine the above video at 3-4 times the speed and the cars stuck to the road like an AF/X set! TV is O.K., but live... nothing beats Formula 1. Just my opinion.

Stingroo
12-09-09, 01:20 AM
I've never been able to see a F1 or IndyCar race live, so I can't really judge.

For the record, I am an avid NASCAR fan, and have been essentially all of my life, and I've seen the races live. I personally love it, but I don't bother explaining most times because you always get those people who are like "l0l0l0l dey drivez in t3h c1rcl35!!#$@!!" I also happen to really enjoy drag racing (I used to go to the Gatornationals every year with my grandfather, until we both moved), and I LOVE dirt track racing (good times, up in Maine).

I~LUV~Caddys8792
12-09-09, 11:35 AM
Never been a huge competitive racing fan, but I like Formula One racing the most.

EcSTSatic
12-09-09, 11:48 AM
I love it. That's real driving ! :burn:

concorso
12-09-09, 12:56 PM
I agree that is real driving and looks like a whole lotta fun. Unfortunately, no side by side, driver vs driver racing there. Tried it a little last time I was in Europe (a brand new Z3 had to be broken in right), but its sad so many feels as you do about F1.

I took my little brother to the Indy 500 and then back to the F1 race at Indy the last year they were there. He is a Die Hard Drag racing fan and admitted enjoying the F1 race much more than the Indy cars. Just imagine the above video at 3-4 times the speed and the cars stuck to the road like an AF/X set! TV is O.K., but live... nothing beats Formula 1. Just my opinion.I can agree thats F1 is a better version of Indy. But F1 has a major problem. The spectator involvement just isnt there. Ive talked to NASCAR drivers, Ive had pictures taken with them, Ive sat in the cars. All for realatively little money. Ive seen 2 F1 races, both across the pond, and neither allowed the spectator involvement you get with NASCAR. Its hit and miss depending on the race you go to apparently. I even had the 3 day pit pass, and it still wasnt the same as NASCAR. And while F1 screaming engines sound good (I still think the older V10's sound better then the newer V8's), the NASCAR roar is nothing to ignore either.

Stingroo
12-09-09, 01:15 PM
I absolutely love the sound of the Sprint Cup cars. It's awesome. Ear plugs are almost a necessity, but even so it's totally worth it.

I can definitely testify to the fan involvement at NASCAR events; I've been to several. My grandmother used to run a concession stand at Daytona International Spedway, and during the week of the Daytona 500, my mom and I would always go to help her out. Well, in 2000 I was roaming around behind the pits before the race started, because I was trying to find some drivers to get some signatures. I actually bumped into Richard Petty, and was totally freaked out, but he was like "Slow down there son." and shook my hand.

Well, I didn't really run into anyone else, so I went to leave and go back to my concession duties, but the gate was locked. So I went up to a security guard, and asked him how I got out of here. He asked to see my pass, which wasn't a pit pass, and I was afraid I'd get thrown out or something, but he goes "Well... I don't know how you get out, but you're definitely not gonna make it back to the stand before the race starts. Just blend in around here, you'll be fine." I ended up walking around pit road and got to watch the race sitting on Mike Skinner's pit wall for most of the green flag action. I also ventured down to Gordon's pit, and got the entire pit crew to sign my hat. It was awesome, until the race ended and I had to look for my mom, who promptly smacked the living hell out of me for 'ditching them'. But it was totally worth it!

I also remember being at the 500 in 2001, walking down to the wall to see the race a little closer when Earnhardt wrecked. It was really crazy, because I was no further than 10 feet away from the impact site. We didn't think much of it then -- especially when Tony Stewart had gone for a wild ride not too long before that, but when they announced that he was dead, I was pretty freaked out....

Bottom line though, I don't think any sport would ever allow as much fan involvement as described above, even if it was completely accidental. lol

concorso
12-09-09, 02:12 PM
Thats one of the benefits of NASCAR. Im not a huge fan of NASCAR like alot of people are. I just like watching good racing. And theres more action in 1 lap in NASCAR then there is in an entire race of F1....

The only racing I want to go see now in person would be Pikes Peak or an WRC stage...preferably Kenya.

Stingroo
12-09-09, 02:14 PM
I would LOVE to visit Pikes Peak. That would be awesome.

hardrockcamaro@mac.c
12-09-09, 02:58 PM
Is rally driving not popular in the US?

It's very popular over here, I used to go and watch the RAC rally stages in N Wales where I grew up.
You stand right at the end of the track and the car flies past at anything up to 140mph on dirt roads.
A whistle blows from a marshal to signal the car approaching, you hear it coming the anti-lag firing as it slows down, it slides sideways around the corner and the driver nails the throttle and it accelerates away doing o-60 in like 2 seconds with flames shooting out of the exhaust on every gear change. Its awesome!

If they crash you run out and help roll the car back onto its wheels and push it back onto the road etc.



Cars that performed well in the rallying got good reputations on the street, the Lancia Delta HF Integrale, the Ford Sierra and Escort RS Cosworths (the Ford Escort RS2000 and Mexico before them), the Peugeot 205 GTI, the Audi Quattro etc.

Here's an old in-car video:
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Gula1SZ9HYs&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Gula1SZ9HYs&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>s

Notice how he catches it after clipping the wall and gets it through the 7 foot wide gate...

Stingroo
12-09-09, 03:02 PM
No, Rally racing isn't very popular here. The SPEED Channel used to broadcast WRC events, but they stopped due to low ratings. I liked watching them though. :(

gary88
12-09-09, 03:03 PM
I went to the USGP in 2004, one of the best experiences ever. I'm real glad I got to see Michael Schumacher race at least once, and that I went before the tire fiasco of 2005. There is NOTHING like hearing the whole pack of F1 cars take off at the start, or hearing one blast by you at 200mph.

heh I actually have some pics I took there way back when

Michael Schumacher before the race
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03721.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03761.jpg

Kimi Raikkonen pit stop
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03749.jpg

Ralph Schumacher after hitting the turn 13 wall at 180mph
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03745.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03744.jpg

The Ferrari team waiting for Schumacher on the last lap
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03754.jpg

Schumacher pulling into the pits after winning
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03763.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03757.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03765.jpg

Schumacher, Rubens Barrichello (finished 2.9 seconds behind Schumacher), and Takuma Sato (finished 22 seconds behind Barrichello)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/gheb88/DSC03772.jpg

Man I really hope F1 comes back to the US, because I'd gladly go every year.

hardrockcamaro@mac.c
12-09-09, 03:15 PM
But there is no margin for error so when it goes wrong it does so in a big way:
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/kDypfF7jKE4&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/kDypfF7jKE4&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Night Wolf
12-09-09, 08:50 PM
No rally racing here in the US, and thats a shame because IMO it's one of the neatest types of racing.... I guess it's like combining the BMW and Jeep, then going all out :)

Stingroo
12-09-09, 08:55 PM
But I think if a BMW and a Jeep mated you would get a more attractive car than a WRX. :p

Night Wolf
12-09-09, 08:58 PM
LOL! And I've always liked Subaru, but yeah their styling is a bit out there. Both the STi and EVO grab my attention.... seem like they'd be pretty fun to throw around the turns.

Stingroo
12-09-09, 09:05 PM
Never had the opportunity to drive an STi, but a friend of mine in high school had a regular WRX that he modded the living hell out of (his dad was a dentist, and his mom was a lawyer... he had serious coin). It was an '03, so it didn't have the fail B9 Tribeca face. Never got to drive it, but that car was a blast just to even ride in. lol Off ramps at like 90-100 were NO PROBLEM for that car. I'd have loved to take it around a track, but some drunken douchebag t-boned it on his way home from school one day. He replaced it with a Lexus LS, and that's just nowhere near as cool. :(

GizmoQ
12-09-09, 10:26 PM
I went to the USGP in 2004, one of the best experiences ever. I'm real glad I got to see Michael Schumacher race at least once, and that I went before the tire fiasco of 2005. There is NOTHING like hearing the whole pack of F1 cars take off at the start, or hearing one blast by you at 200mph.
Man I really hope F1 comes back to the US, because I'd gladly go every year.

I was there too. From the angle of your photos, I was almost right behind you (I like staying on the top row cause there's more sun). That was a pretty good race day.

And I will admit I've done the NASCAR thing too. And you guys are absolutely right - someone once gave me a pitpass and I talked to the drivers, talked shop with the crews, hung out in the pit areas between pit stops, and then had a lawn chair on top of the RV in the infield with a case of beer and surrounded by thousands of roudy fans.

So yeah, nothing compares with the NASCAR experience for the fans, but I'm into the "bleeding" -edge of technology and for me for automotive tech: F1 is the schnizzel! No other racing comes close. Drag racing is brute strength/torque, NASCAR is legalized driving for bootleggers, SCCA is about finesse, Indy is a US wannabe, USGP is a lesser wannabe than Indy, Drifting is an infant in a beauty contest - thats not a race, and US rallys aren't side by side racing.

F1 is the closest to engineering excellence (like designing an aircraft that has to stick to the road) that I've ever seen. The tech that goes into turning corners at 100MPH with almost no body roll, 200+MPH down the straights, the numerous monitoring systems, the fuel/engine/trans mgmt systems - cars for pilots!

concorso
12-10-09, 10:21 AM
No rally racing here in the US, and thats a shame because IMO it's one of the neatest types of racing.... I guess it's like combining the BMW and Jeep, then going all out :)There is alot of rally racing in the US. Im still surprised everytime I hear someone say this. There are rallies in every state that I know of. Road rallies are the original form of rally racing. There are road rallies in every state, in most cities even. Stage rallies are less common, but Pikes Peak runs the same vehicles that most rallies run. Baha racing has the same feel, and if youre willing to cross the border there is a 6 race rally schedule in Canada, the Canadian Rally Championships.

Night Wolf
12-10-09, 10:58 PM
There is alot of rally racing in the US. Im still surprised everytime I hear someone say this. There are rallies in every state that I know of. Road rallies are the original form of rally racing. There are road rallies in every state, in most cities even. Stage rallies are less common, but Pikes Peak runs the same vehicles that most rallies run. Baha racing has the same feel, and if youre willing to cross the border there is a 6 race rally schedule in Canada, the Canadian Rally Championships.

Interested in more information...

These types of racing just spark my interest like crazy - rally and baja. It pretty much combines the two types of automotive sports I already really enjoy a whole lot. I like it because it is much more realistic to the real world we liv in, in the case of the original video I posted, it was a lightly race modified (cage etc...) BMW M3, on city streets and roads etc... I like the situations where the next part of the race isn't so easily predictable. Racing against the clock used to be boring to me, but not any more. I have done the drag racing thing, and while it is fun, as in just something to do and see how fast your car is, I just have no further interest in it.

Stuff like this is just flat out really frickin cool!

CcL-LeuIYJo

If I lived some place near sand dunes, I'd build a 2wd Toyota Tacoma as a prerunner

1rzmEnaXZnw

Heck, this isn't really racing, but sorta the same stuff.... pretty neat, but needs a way better song. e30! (awd)

2d-8OReliXg

I think what I really like in automotive sports is freedom. Such as with the rally races, there are all types of terrain and conditions to deal with, and different skills needed when driving. I like to push the car to its limit, and beyond, while still maintaining control.

Actually the above is some of the things I like about off-roading so much, very odd, as it is usually 3-10mph, but there is just so much freedom to do what you want, go as fast as you want, drive where you want etc... Tho the off-roading I do isn't a race, but more of a sport/hobby, still it trickles down.

Tonight I did some *very* spirited driving in the BMW, just such a close connection between driving and car, even with just stock suspension and nothing fancy, the fun factor was off the charts, of course my favorite electronic/techno type music that gets the blood pumpin really helped. At one point on an empty road, there is an S-turn, very sharp, as each turn is 90*, long story short, the stock suspension offers a good bit of weight transfer and hitting the gas caused just enough oversteer to get the right tires in the dirt, which spun the car around. The e30 is the best car to control in these types of situations that I've driven, at the edge, you can feel when it is going to give, and once it has, you can still control it. I was able to do a 180* right in the road, and got the car rolling backwards in the oppisite lane, but facing correctly. Came to a stop and then accelerated forward - the oppisite direction I was going 5-seconds prior. It was a rural, empty, and open road.

But it got me thinking, were can one - legally - do this? I know of track days, and thats the only thing I know of. I'm not talking about auto-x either, I am talking about moderate speed driving, testing the edge and pushing the edge of the car. To me, ever since I started driving I wanted to know how my vehicles felt like at the edge, so I knew what to expect if the time came that I really had to avoid something or drive evasively. Which is why I took all my cars into an empty snow covered parking lot and learned how they each behaved in the snow - had alot of fun doing it too. Just a huge flat open paved area would be perfect, like the airport Top Gear uses.

gary88
12-10-09, 11:09 PM
But it got me thinking, were can one - legally - do this? I know of track days, and thats the only thing I know of. I'm not talking about auto-x either, I am talking about moderate speed driving, testing the edge and pushing the edge of the car. To me, ever since I started driving I wanted to know how my vehicles felt like at the edge, so I knew what to expect if the time came that I really had to avoid something or drive evasively. Which is why I took all my cars into an empty snow covered parking lot and learned how they each behaved in the snow - had alot of fun doing it too. Just a huge flat open paved area would be perfect, like the airport Top Gear uses.

http://bmwcca.org/

I'm getting a membership soon. Find a chapter closeby and enjoy.

Night Wolf
12-10-09, 11:43 PM
http://bmwcca.org/

I'm getting a membership soon. Find a chapter closeby and enjoy.

Hmmm, saw this, it's near Atlanta, which is only 90mins from me.... may have to check into it a bit. May not be exactly what I was looking for, but darn it's probably the closest I'll reasonably get.

http://www.peachtreebmwcca.org/

hardrockcamaro@mac.c
12-11-09, 02:25 PM
I'm only interested in motorsports that use road going cars that are either stock or if modified retain the original engine block (and to an extent heads), the original transmission casing and original style suspension.

So when rallying was about group N (showrom stock) and Group A (homologated cars) I followd it, when it went to WRC with kit" type cars that bear virtually no relation to the road going ones (eg the ford Focus is not available with 4x4 or until a couple of years ago a turbo, unlike the WRC cars) I lost interest.

The same goes with Touring Cars (saloon car circuit racing) and even drag racing or Nascar. When they're space frame cars with a lookalike body draped over I have no interest.

Technically impressive yes, but I need that link to a car I can drive myself to really care.

I did like Formula 1, but once they added so many rules by banning the high tech gadgetry (which used to trickle it's way down into showroom cars) I again lost interest.

Night Wolf
12-11-09, 08:05 PM
I'm only interested in motorsports that use road going cars that are either stock or if modified retain the original engine block (and to an extent heads), the original transmission casing and original style suspension.

So when rallying was about group N (showrom stock) and Group A (homologated cars) I followd it, when it went to WRC with kit" type cars that bear virtually no relation to the road going ones (eg the ford Focus is not available with 4x4 or until a couple of years ago a turbo, unlike the WRC cars) I lost interest.

The same goes with Touring Cars (saloon car circuit racing) and even drag racing or Nascar. When they're space frame cars with a lookalike body draped over I have no interest.

Technically impressive yes, but I need that link to a car I can drive myself to really care.

I did like Formula 1, but once they added so many rules by banning the high tech gadgetry (which used to trickle it's way down into showroom cars) I again lost interest.

I agree!

Thats one of the really neat things with that rally video - thats a real BMW e30M3, that for the most part is stock, tearin up the streets. Very, very cool.

I can get into autosports with "actual" cars much more then I can with specialty built race cars.