: Water pump & crossover gasket - $$$$



carseller
08-05-09, 12:33 PM
Had a couple of small drips of coolant on the garage floor, so I put in the GM sealant tabs. it was good for a day, then came out to go to work and there was a 5 foot by 3 foot puddle of coolant under the car. The Cadillac dealership that I work at is telling me $200 for the water pump and $600 for the crossover gasket (5.5 hours labor for that alone). Is that resonable? Also, when I put the sealant tabs in, and started the car, it started and ran rough, which it never has before. After letting it Idle for a half hour with no leaks, I went to test drive it. When I pulled away I had a lot of white smoke come out the exhaust. But it smelled like oil, not sweet like coolant. And then it ran fine with no white coming out the exhaust. Any Ideas? Thanks.

Submariner409
08-05-09, 02:12 PM
The water pump and crossover are labor intensive, especially the crossover which is an unholy bitch.

Maybe you left an air intake duct or hose loose when you removed the bottom hose to insert the crushed tablets.

If it's running fine and not leaking coolant, cross your fingers. With an A/C function ON the temp gauge should not move a needle's width from 12:00, but maybe go up a half division with the A/C OFF.

00 Deville
08-05-09, 03:08 PM
The Cadillac dealership that I work at is telling me $200 for the water pump and $600 for the crossover gasket (5.5 hours labor for that alone). Is that resonable?

You are killing me.... even the stealership's own employee's are thinking they are getting shafted. Actually those are real good prices for getting done at the stealership they must be cutting you a deal.

That's a big difference in the leaks sounds like you may have left something loose when you put the seal tabs in.... you put them in the hose and not the recovery tank... right?

carseller
08-05-09, 06:17 PM
I crushed them up and put them in the overflow tank. I know they say to put them in the lower radiator hose, but a couple of good Cadillac techs told me if I crush them up it is ok to put them in the overflow tank. Of course with these repairs, I will have the mechanic put them in the lower hose!

Ranger
08-05-09, 09:10 PM
They will just sit in the bottom of the tank like a pile of muck and may restrict the flow. That's why they didn't do the job. They're sitting in the bottom of the tank. As Sub said the crossover is a real PITA. I think I'd gladly give them the $600.

ewill3rd
08-06-09, 08:19 AM
real good prices for getting done at the stealership

Maybe if you'd quit insulting them they might start giving you a better deal?

I said it the other day, I wish I knew where a lot of people on this forum worked so I could insult them off the cuff like they do me.
Intentional or not....

Depending on the labor rate in your market, those labor times seem fair.
If you want a crappy job take it to an independent shop and let them screw 5 other things up for you while they are at it.
Or you could let factory trained people with experience fix it for a little more than you would pay at the aforementioned shop.

Granted, there are skilled and unskilled people in both places, but at the dealership we are taken aside and given special training on how to rip people off.
(apparently)

carseller
08-06-09, 11:35 AM
Hey ewill3rd. I hope you are not saying I insulted them, because I have a lot of respect for you factory trained techs! I sell Cadillacs for a living and I see how hard you guys work every day. As a matter of fact, I have most of my work done here at the dealership, and although I am no mechanic, I am a gearhead and I love Cadillacs. By the way, The extended warranty I bought with the car at 134k miles is going to pay $300 for the water pump and $75 for the tow charge. I thought I would have to fight for it but the warranty company was easy to deal with. So all I have to pay is $500 for the crossover gaskets, coolant and shop fees. I am very happy.

ewill3rd
08-06-09, 02:05 PM
I was referring to the "stealership" comment, not you.

Sorry for the implication. Seemed obvious to me at the time but I can see how it can be misread.

carseller
08-06-09, 05:18 PM
No problem, I thought the same thing about the "stealership" comment. Also, I forgot to mention that I asked two independent shops for an estimate. One of the shops manager is someone I have known for a long time. Neither one of them even called me back, and this was yesterday! I would rather pay a little more and have it done right at the Cadillac shop by a factory trained tech. One other thing. A few months ago my battery died. I called around to a couple of auto parts stores, but I bought an A/C Delco battery at our parts counter because my employee price was less then one at Autozone etc. But even at regular price it would of only been a few bucks more and i still would rather have the A/C Delco and know the fit is perfect and the quality is top notch!

Ranger
08-06-09, 06:19 PM
Who do you work for?

John Wicz
08-06-09, 06:54 PM
Ranger, I read through the whole thread and I still didn't realize he was from our neck of the woods until you asked, must be age related :bigroll:

99bluedville
08-06-09, 07:08 PM
I had a water pump that I guessed was leaking. I took it to a Firestone tire shop for service as I had a 1000 mile trip to take two days later. First they could not find the leak, they said that they had let it run for 45 minutes. When they finally called they said that all was OK. I told them that they needed to shut the car off and check again, there reply was where is the water pump, I promptly told them and they confirmed the leak and said they could do it tomorrow for $450. I declined, called my parts store they had an AC Delco water pump for $50 and the special socket for $30. The replacement takes a little time but not difficult.

Ranger
08-06-09, 07:17 PM
Hehe. I know what you mean John. I tend to look at peoples locations and know who is close by for some reason.

Ranger, I read through the whole thread and I still didn't realize he was from our neck of the woods until you asked, must be age related :bigroll:

00 Deville
08-06-09, 08:08 PM
Maybe if you'd quit insulting them they might start giving you a better deal?

I didn't mean to insult anyone... if I did... I apologize. I found some humor in a Salesman at a Cadillac Dealer wanting to know if his own service department was trying to rip him off. You may not think that's funny but I did and still do.


I said it the other day, I wish I knew where a lot of people on this forum worked so I could insult them off the cuff like they do me.
Intentional or not....

Hmmmm. Why is it that you seem to take things personally when they obviously weren't directed at you.... and insulting people off the cuff would make you feel better about yourself? I think that would make you no better than them or maybe me.



Depending on the labor rate in your market, those labor times seem fair. If you want a crappy job take it to an independent shop and let them screw 5 other things up for you while they are at it.
Or you could let factory trained people with experience fix it for a little more than you would pay at the aforementioned shop.

Wait a minute... it's not OK for me to say the term "Stealership" directed at no one in particular but its OK for EWill3rd to say "If you want a crappy job take it to an independent shop and let them screw 5 other things up for you while they are at it." I think we all know there are both good and not so good mechanics that work at both dealerships and independent shops. For you to say that ALL independent shops are just going to screw up your car is not true. I know of a lot of excellent mechanics that run or work in independent shops.


Granted, there are skilled and unskilled people in both places, Doesn't this contradict what you just said about all independent shops?


but at the dealership we are taken aside and given special training on how to rip people off.
(apparently) Now that's funny...

But seriously Ewill3rd I know that you are a valuable contributor to this forum and if you took it personal when I threw out the "off the cuff remark" "Stealership" ... I apologize and will try to refrain from using that term again. According to Google the term "Stealership" has been used 262 times in CadillacForums.com before me... so, I guess I can't claim to have coined that term.

I hope you don't take my comments above too seriously I was just trying to make a point about picking apart someones comments.

ewill3rd
08-06-09, 10:37 PM
:lol:
No it's okay.

I am a little on edge lately.
I took it a little harder than you meant it, I know it was just a joke but I do get crabby when people use that term.
Lots of story behind there.

Thanks for the kind words.
Sorry for blowing a gasket.

carseller
08-07-09, 10:33 AM
For those who want to know, I work at Napleton Cadillac in Rockford IL. We have some great techs here. Now, what do you guys think about putting the sealant pellets in or not. Most of my techs say don't bother, since I am getting fresh coolant with all this other work. On that subject, I had my coolant changed about two months ago at the Dealership (Murphy's Law) and he didn't use pellets then. Also, I think I should have him mix the Dexcool with distilled water, is that best? Any other advice on what I should have him do since it is apart? Thanks!

Ranger
08-07-09, 10:52 AM
Ah, I've heard of Napleton. Use distilled water. Forget the sealant tabs. All they do is clog the radiator, heater core and purge line. Even GM quit using them. That tech did not use them for a reason.

ewill3rd
08-07-09, 01:26 PM
They were essential on 4.9's and 4.5's but I don't use them on N* engines.
I use tap water but it is surface water and low in mineral content. If your area uses ground water then you are better off using distilled.
Most ground water will be packed with lime and other minerals which can make a mess.

carseller
08-08-09, 10:25 AM
Repairs are done! We went with distilled water and no sealant pellets. I tipped the tech $20.00 for doing a good job. I would have given him more, but being a car salesman, I'm poor.

tateos
08-12-09, 07:14 PM
I crushed them up and put them in the overflow tank. I know they say to put them in the lower radiator hose, but a couple of good Cadillac techs told me if I crush them up it is ok to put them in the overflow tank. Of course with these repairs, I will have the mechanic put them in the lower hose!

I have always done exactly that with no problems.

tateos
08-12-09, 07:16 PM
Maybe if you'd quit insulting them they might start giving you a better deal?

I said it the other day, I wish I knew where a lot of people on this forum worked so I could insult them off the cuff like they do me.
Intentional or not....

Depending on the labor rate in your market, those labor times seem fair.
If you want a crappy job take it to an independent shop and let them screw 5 other things up for you while they are at it.
Or you could let factory trained people with experience fix it for a little more than you would pay at the aforementioned shop.

Granted, there are skilled and unskilled people in both places, but at the dealership we are taken aside and given special training on how to rip people off.
(apparently)

I agree with this - the dealerships are often a gyp, but you get what you pay for - people that are trained and very familiar with your car.

ewill3rd
08-13-09, 08:33 AM
To clarify on my earlier comments... what I meant to say was that I have worked in the aftermarket and a few dealers, and I can assure you there are talented people in both realms... and some real morons in each as well.
If you get the smartest guy at an independent and the worst guy in the dealership, you most certainly will prefer the indy shop over the dealer.

Theoretically with more factory training you should see more talent in the dealership but as with all things your experience may vary.