: Enginge doesn't crank



94CaddyConcours
06-26-09, 01:21 AM
My engine doesn't crank at. No starter click or sound. Only sound I hear is the fuel pump humming for a few seconds when the key is on the on position. So far I know of is:
*Haven't start the car for couple of month. Started when last started
*New battery were install
*Fuse is all working
*When using OBD on the instrument cluster nothing come on. Just blank,
even the climate control became blank after the OBD test until exit
*Fuel read "E" when I know I had a full tank. Does engine still crank with fuel
reading "E"

Could this be an ignition problem?
Thanks,:worship:
BILL SONG

Ranger
06-26-09, 11:40 AM
The engine will crank as long as it has power to the starter. Fuel is only important if you want it to start. If it hasn't been run in a couple of months, check the battery and be sure it has a charge.

Submariner409
06-26-09, 02:34 PM
Battery is dead. These cars will kill even a fully charged brand new battery if not run for 2 weeks or so.

Google "smart battery charger" or "guest battery maintainer" and see if a plug-it-and-forget-it battery maintainer is in your future.......

94CaddyConcours
06-26-09, 03:47 PM
I checked the battery and very sure it has a full charge. First I thought it was, but after "jumping" the battery, there is not a single click at all. Even a half dead battery would make a click.
Also when I preform the self diagnostic nothing showed up? I'm thinking more of ignition switch? I was planning to ship this car to Texas.

Submariner409
06-26-09, 04:26 PM
Hmmmmmmmmm......Ignition switch or something has gone wrong with the theft system.

Battery cables all clean and tight ?? Both ends.......

94CaddyConcours
06-26-09, 04:29 PM
Hmmmmmmmmm......Ignition switch or something has gone wrong with the theft system.

Battery cables all clean and tight ?? Both ends.......

Yes sir.
Should the security light on the instrument panel cluster still blink when the ignition in on the "on" position?

94CaddyConcours
06-27-09, 06:59 AM
Could it be that my key chip bad? Maybe I should find my spare and try with it?

Krashed989
06-27-09, 10:28 PM
You tried to jumpstart the car and still had the same problem?... Did you leave the other car connected for 5 to 10 minutes just running to recharge your battery? If you didn't it could still be a bad battery. Otherwise I would lean more towards the starter.

94CaddyConcours
06-28-09, 12:10 AM
You tried to jumpstart the car and still had the same problem?... Did you leave the other car connected for 5 to 10 minutes just running to recharge your battery? If you didn't it could still be a bad battery. Otherwise I would lean more towards the starter.

Yes sir. I tried jump starting the battery, no click or clack. I tried all the basic thing that I know of before coming here for help.
Thanks,
BILLSONG

94CaddyConcours
06-28-09, 05:31 PM
I tried with the spare key and nothing. I think its my ignition switch or could it be my PCM. Does anyone know how to hot wire start it with the key in?:hmm:

94CaddyConcours
06-29-09, 03:42 AM
How do I test the starter?

Krashed989
06-29-09, 07:19 AM
Normally, I would tell you to whack it with a hammer, but that's not possible on a northstar engine. There's no real way to test the starter with it in the car. The starter is located underneath the intake manifold in the valley of the engine. It's kind of a pain in the butt to remove the intake manifold the first time you do it.

Tools needed to remove the intake manifold:
Pliers
flat head screwdriver
fuel line disconnect tools
10mm wrench/socket and ratchet
Male torx socket for the throttle cable bracket

94CaddyConcours
06-29-09, 04:21 PM
Normally, I would tell you to whack it with a hammer, but that's not possible on a northstar engine. There's no real way to test the starter with it in the car. The starter is located underneath the intake manifold in the valley of the engine. It's kind of a pain in the butt to remove the intake manifold the first time you do it.

Tools needed to remove the intake manifold:
Pliers
flat head screwdriver
fuel line disconnect tools
10mm wrench/socket and ratchet
Male torx socket for the throttle cable bracket

It was easy removing the intake manifold. Did it once before. Could I still jump the starter while it is in the car? With the ignition off of course.
Thanks,
BILLSONG

Krashed989
06-29-09, 04:40 PM
It was easy removing the intake manifold. Did it once before. Could I still jump the starter while it is in the car? With the ignition off of course.
Thanks,
BILLSONG

Actually now that I think about it, you may be able to with just a simple test lead. If you look behind the power steering pump there should be 1 wire coming out from underneath the intake manifold. That goes to the ignition switch and to the starter solenoid. Just unplug it and take a wire from the positive battery terminal to the terminal in the plug (starter side) and the engine should turn over if the starter is working.

94CaddyConcours
06-29-09, 05:52 PM
Actually now that I think about it, you may be able to with just a simple test lead. If you look behind the power steering pump there should be 1 wire coming out from underneath the intake manifold. That goes to the ignition switch and to the starter solenoid. Just unplug it and take a wire from the positive battery terminal to the terminal in the plug (starter side) and the engine should turn over if the starter is working.
OK, I'm not quite sure which wire is it:
This one run under the intake manifold and connect to the positive terminal
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/CADILLAC004.jpg
This one here run behind the power steering pump but it is connect to another harness:
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/CADILLAC003.jpg
Thank you for bearing with me,
BILLSONG

Krashed989
06-30-09, 01:25 AM
The first picture is of the main power to the starter motor, it goes straight to the battery + terminal. The second picture is the one I was talking about, it goes to the ignition switch and then to battery +. You want to unplug it from the main wiring harness and then use a test lead to wire the starter solenoid directly to the battery positive terminal. By doing this you are bypassing the ignition switch, so it should turn over as soon as you connect the wire. That is, if the starter is working.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 02:08 AM
Good news. It crank. Bad news ignition switch must be defect. And worse? After bypasing for 3 to 5 seconds the starter start to grind.:banghead: darnit, crap, !@#$$, Ouch
One lead to another.
thanks for the tip. Now I nailed one problem and got another:bomb:. I don't think I remember seeing the engine turn. Could be because it have not been running for a while. Anyway I can turn the engine?
BILLSONG
I will stay tune for new answer/tip

Krashed989
06-30-09, 02:45 AM
...Bad news ignition switch must be defect...

Before condemning the ignition switch try putting the shifter into neutral, then use the key to try starting it. Then if it doesn't start, it's probably a bad ignition switch.


The grinding was the battery loosing power, so the teeth weren't fully engaging the flywheel.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 02:50 PM
Battery have full power. I'm sure its the starter grinding. While I was cranking the engine, it turn very little, maybe a quarter turn. So while bypassing the ignition switch with one hand, my other hand is spinning the power steering pump wheel. So the engine turn a little more but not a full revolution.
I think the engine is froze due to the fact that it has not been started in a while. So is there anyway to turn the engine manually to break it free and loosen it a bit? Turning the crankshaft with a wrench?
Thanks,
BILLSONG

Krashed989
06-30-09, 04:48 PM
You really need to take the battery out and have it tested. I've seen a lot of batteries that were putting out a full 12 volts but they were not putting out enough amperage to really do much.

You should be able to spin the engine with a breaker bar on the 19mm bolt of the crankshaft pulley. I doubt that the engine froze. I've seen cars sit outside in the rain for years, and then start right up after some new gas and a jump start.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 05:18 PM
You really need to take the battery out and have it tested. I've seen a lot of batteries that were putting out a full 12 volts but they were not putting out enough amperage to really do much.

You should be able to spin the engine with a breaker bar on the 19mm bolt of the crankshaft pulley. I doubt that the engine froze. I've seen cars sit outside in the rain for years, and then start right up after some new gas and a jump start.
You're giving me alot of hope here. Got to run an find a 19mm socket and breaker bar.
Thanks,
BILLSONG

Ranger
06-30-09, 06:37 PM
Turn the headlights on. Do they go real dim when you crank it? If so the battery is toast. Put a DVM between the battery cable and the terminal and get a reading. Does it drop low, like 9v or so when you crank it? If so, battery is toast.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 07:24 PM
Turn the headlights on. Do they go real dim when you crank it? If so the battery is toast. Put a DVM between the battery cable and the terminal and get a reading. Does it drop low, like 9v or so when you crank it? If so, battery is toast.
It dim somewhat. Can't really tell under the bright sunlight. Wish I could turn the engine by spinning the tires while the car is raise and and on drive. I know I sound stupid, but that how we start an old car when the starter did by pushing it fast enough.

Thanks,
BILLSONG

Ranger
06-30-09, 08:25 PM
If it was a standard transmission you could do that.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 08:42 PM
If it was a standard transmission you could do that.
So I guess my question wasn't stupid after all. Why can't I turn the engine by the wheel on a front wheel drive as oppose to a rear wheel drive?:hmm:

Ranger
06-30-09, 08:53 PM
Because a standard transmission is a direct lock up to the flywheel. An Automatic is hydraulically operated. I think you might still be able to do it, but you have to push it at 30 MPH or better. Doesn't matter if it is FWD or RWD. It's the trans.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 09:11 PM
Because a standard transmission is a direct lock up to the flywheel. An Automatic is hydraulically operated. I think you might still be able to do it, but you have to push it at 30 MPH or better. Doesn't matter if it is FWD or RWD. It's the trans.
I told you it was a stupid question. Doesn't hurt to try?:thepan:

STSS
06-30-09, 09:14 PM
I've seen automatics push started.

It would never be my car.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 09:18 PM
I've seen automatics push started.

It would never be my car.
Why wouldn't you?:confused:

Ranger
06-30-09, 09:32 PM
Probably because there is no REAL bumper to push it with without doing damage.

STSS
06-30-09, 09:53 PM
:yeah:

Plus.... It's my Caddy.

94CaddyConcours
06-30-09, 11:38 PM
Because a standard transmission is a direct lock up to the flywheel. An Automatic is hydraulically operated. I think you might still be able to do it, but you have to push it at 30 MPH or better. Doesn't matter if it is FWD or RWD. It's the trans.
Ok you prove me wrong here.:thepan:



You should be able to spin the engine with a breaker bar on the 19mm bolt of the crankshaft pulley. I doubt that the engine froze. I've seen cars sit outside in the rain for years, and then start right up after some new gas and a jump start.

Not 19MM, 24MM to be exact. And you could actually access the crankshaft pulley through the right passenger wheel well, without using the breaker bar. Wish me luck. hope it turn

94CaddyConcours
07-01-09, 12:04 AM
Its tight like !@#$%. Now I need some extension bar to have clearance and more leverage. Turning the first or second revolution was easy then it was really tight. Anyone have an extra hand? You're than welcome to come by. Maybe a case of beer will do? J/K
BILLSONG

Ranger
07-01-09, 12:12 AM
Don't forget you are turning against compression. Pull the plugs and it will turn very easily.

94CaddyConcours
07-01-09, 12:20 AM
Don't forget you are turning against compression. Pull the plugs and it will turn very easily.
:worship:Oh thank you, something I could thought of. Will do first thing in the morning.
BILLSONG

Krashed989
07-01-09, 06:42 AM
Wow, 24mm..... Guess I never really checked on my 94. I just remembered that my dads 99 eldo had a 19mm bolt there and I thought they were the same.

94CaddyConcours
07-01-09, 07:36 PM
Got the engine to turn with the starter with all spark plugs off. Also while cranking starter still has the grinding sound. Looking in to it now.

BILLSONG

Krashed989
07-01-09, 11:51 PM
I really think that it's just not getting enough juice.

94CaddyConcours
07-02-09, 04:00 AM
I will jump start it tomorrow and see if I can get the starter to turn the engine. I'm not convince about the starter. It just make an awful noise worst than grinding. So today I tried to check the starter and got a little stuck. Unlike later model or LD37(not sure) the intake are a little different.
Spark plug wires runs along the left side of the engine as oppose under the beauty cover. 4 bolts holding the intake and 12 bolts holding the beauty cover to the intake manifold:
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/CADILLAC007-1.jpg

Okay so after taking all 16 bolts off and the intake hose from the air filter to the throttle bottle. Next step: unbolt the throttle body from the air intake. This part I'm stuck on, I got 3 torx screw out and the last one is hard to reach and can't really see it:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/CADILLAC006-1.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/CADILLAC005-1.jpgI don't think it was necessary to remove the beauty cover. But I might be wrong. What else do I need to Disconnect?

BILLSONG

Krashed989
07-02-09, 05:47 AM
You don't remove the throttle body from the intake (I guess technically you could, but it's not necessary). You remove the bracket with the throttle cables/cruise control servo/ and whatnot. Let me get back to you on that after looking at my 94 tomorrow morning.

You didn't have to take off the beauty cover/plenum. The four 10mm bolts that are visible from the top are all that hold the whole intake manifold down. You might need to disconnect the small air purge line from the top of the surge tank. there are a couple coolant tubes attached to the bottom of the TB as a TB heater. There's a big fat gray plug that you will need to disconnect under the TB. You need a fuel line disconnect tool for the fuel lines.

Krashed989
07-02-09, 06:18 AM
Okay, so the cruise control servo come off (Big thing with the diaphragm)... There should be 3 bolts (10mm i think) on the bracket to detach it from the TB. To disconnect the end of the cables, you need to prop the throttle open with something and then use a flat head screw driver to push the ball (on the end of the throttle cable) out through the back of the throttle lever. Once that's disconnected there is a square notch in the bracket that the throttle cable is in. You have to pull the tab away from the bracket to get the cable loose so you can move it to the side. Unplug the TPS, the ISC motor, the coolant lines, vacuum hoses, fuel lines, and that big fat gray plug. After that it should just pull straight up and out.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c296/Krashed989/ISC%20motor/100_1459.jpg

A 94 sts before I completely dismantled it. This is what you'll see though. The starter is held in place by two 10mm bolts.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c296/Krashed989/100_0934.jpg

94CaddyConcours
07-02-09, 06:19 AM
What is a fuel line disconnection tool?

Krashed989
07-02-09, 06:38 AM
What is a fuel line disconnection tool?

The better ones look like this:
http://www.mytoolstore.com/astro/7881.jpg

The cheaper ones look like this:
http://acpartsguys.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/images/Air_Conditioning_Fuel_Line_Disconnect_Tool_Set_LIS LE_37000.84223317_std.jpg


You can get them at napa or pretty much any auto parts store.

94CaddyConcours
07-03-09, 02:01 AM
Didn't have time to work on it today and maybe the rest of the week. Still a little confuse about removing the cruise control servo. What is the easiest way to take the intake manifold without the use of fuel disconnector? A 2hours jobs shouldn't take me all day. Yet I'm a novice.

Krashed989
07-03-09, 09:03 AM
Without the fuel line disconnecting tool you're looking at adding at least 3 hours of intense labor to it. Probably more because I'm not sure how you would manage it.... The tool costs less than $10 for the whole set of plastic ones.

Edit: actually I have heard of people just propping up the passenger side of the intake manifold to change the starter. I dunno, I just think it's easier to take the manifold off completely, but that's just my personal preference.

94CaddyConcours
09-16-09, 01:54 PM
Hey guys,
Just got back from Texas, yeeha. Well decided to pull the starter out and found the culprit. Picture will explain. The housing broke into 2 pieces, i found the large piece but can't find the small piece. Its about the size of eraser from a pencil. Look:
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/2009-09-16092713.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/2009-09-16092720.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/THAMAUP/MY%20CAR/2009-09-16092738.jpgSo? How could I fish the other piece? I just hope it fall out somewhere. I don't know if it a good idea to replace the starter without finding that piece, which can cause further damage. But at the same time its is small and might be at the bottom and will never make it back up.

Sorry for the long post and large picture, got lazy to resize it. You guys been a big help.

Ranger
09-16-09, 03:55 PM
Wow! That's rather unusual. Not sure where it could have gone without looking at the underside of the manifold. It'll probably just lie where it is forever.

Krashed989
09-16-09, 07:51 PM
Dang... I wasn't expecting that!

Since the piece that broke off was over the torque converter, I would guess that it is in the bottom of the bellhousing of the tranny. I don't see how it could do any real damage down there but If you want to you can take off the bracket and splash guard from underneath and fish around for it.

94CaddyConcours
09-17-09, 09:53 AM
Dang... I wasn't expecting that!

Since the piece that broke off was over the torque converter, I would guess that it is in the bottom of the bellhousing of the tranny. I don't see how it could do any real damage down there but If you want to you can take off the bracket and splash guard from underneath and fish around for it.

Ok then, I guess I'm to lazy to fish for it. But hey we solve one problem. Lets work on the next one while the starter are coming in.
How would I troubleshoot the ignition switch? In detail step by step please. Can't wait to get her running before I run off to Texas again. Hehehe:ride:

Krashed989
09-18-09, 07:50 PM
Why do you think the ignition switch is bad?

94CaddyConcours
09-19-09, 12:08 AM
Why do you think the ignition switch is bad?
Remember we we're discussing about it during the first 10 or 15 or so post. How I ask you if it possible to bypass the ignition switch to crank the starter and I did?
Well I bypass the ignition switch and got the starter to crank, but unable to start the starter with the key.

kjhansen
09-19-09, 09:58 PM
Ignition switches do go bad... just not often. It might be a number of things though. For example, it might be the neutral safety switch. I had that happen on my 1994 Pontiac Bonneville SSEi. I ended up having a shop replace it, as it was pretty hard to get to. Not cheap.
Another issue could be a fusible link. This happened in my 1990 Dodge Dakota. A fusible link is a length of wire that has a relatively low melting point and acts as a fuse... but it's a lot harder to find and replace. I don't know if our Cadillacs have any fusible links or not--might just be a Chrysler thing. It went from the battery positive through the firewall to the vehicle power bus bars under the dash--providing power to everything in the cab. Only way I found it was to check voltages. I ended up splicing in another one to fix the problem. But Chrysler does weird electronics on their cars anyway. Who else has a "ballast resistor" mounted on the firewall? Hardly anybody knows what it does, but if it's bad the car won't start... I've never had a similar problem with a GM product with fusible links or ballast resistors. But you might be able to check voltages in and out of the ignition switch, although it is difficult. But how else will you know if the switch is bad?
A friend of mine actually had the ignition switch die on his 1985 VW Beetle (stick shift). He installed a push-button ignition switch, bypassing the factory switch. He had power going through the ignition to keep the car running but no power to the starter when the key was pushed over against the return spring to the "start" position. Also, if there is no power going to the engine with the key in the "run" (not "start") position, then the car won't keep running even if you do get it started, so you need to check power flow through the switch. In any case, my VW friend still has to have the key inserted to put the ignition switch to "run," then he pushes the start button and it cranks. Not hard to do electronically, and it's all the rage in high-end European cars now, although I don't know why.
I guess I just wanted to say that it's more complicated than it appears. Get a multimeter and start checking voltages flowing in and out if the ignition and check the neutral safety switch (voltage in and out with the key held over in the "start" position--2 man job). That requires pulling the console if you have a floor shift. I'm not sure where it is on column-shifted cars. Not a lot of fun in either case.
It would be interesting to hook a temporary starter switch to the new starter, re-assemble the intake manifold etc., put the ignition key in the "run" position, then push the starter switch button and see if the car starts. Make sure you have the transmission in park or neutral though. You don't want to start in drive or reverse (I've done that). If it works you could extend the wires through the firewall and mount the starter button under the dash where it's easy to reach and have a European-style starting system.... I think we paid about $6 for the starter switch at O'Reilly or Autozone.
Keith

tateos
09-22-09, 08:29 PM
I thought our NSS is on the linkage under the hood - at least on my '97

ponyboyt
09-22-09, 09:21 PM
i think i just read this whole thread... if i missed this sorry but umm...

when you turn the key to RUN or ON without cranking, is there ANYTHING on the dash lighting up? Any chime? I thought you said there was no lights when you go to pull codes and nothing came up. You cannot pull codes if there is no juice at all. As in NOTHING comes on. But if you dash lights up with the key on and when you pull codes nothing comes up, well thats 2 totaly different situations.

94CaddyConcours
09-22-09, 10:35 PM
He installed a push-button ignition switch, bypassing the factory switch. He had power going through the ignition to keep the car running but no power to the starter when the key was pushed over against the return spring to the "start" position. Also, if there is no power going to the engine with the key in the "run" (not "start") position, then the car won't keep running even if you do get it started, so you need to check power flow through the switch. In any case, my VW friend still has to have the key inserted to put the ignition switch to "run," then he pushes the start button and it cranks. Not hard to do electronically, and it's all the rage in high-end European cars now, although I don't know why.
Keith
That was what my thought of doing since I'm not good at electrical and don't tackle a job that I'm not familiar with. Yeah I use a multimeter before and its a PITA.


I thought our NSS is on the linkage under the hood - at least on my '97
I'm sorry but what is NSS? NorthStar X?


i think i just read this whole thread... if i missed this sorry but umm...
when you turn the key to RUN or ON without cranking, is there ANYTHING on the dash lighting up? Any chime? I thought you said there was no lights when you go to pull codes and nothing came up. You cannot pull codes if there is no juice at all. As in NOTHING comes on. But if you dash lights up with the key on and when you pull codes nothing comes up, well thats 2 totaly different situations.

I'm sorry let me clarify myself. When I pull the code nothing pop up but I am able to access the OBD(no saved code appear).

Well as of now I got the starter in and it does crank by bypassing the ignition switch(thanks Krashed989). But it doesn't start. I have the key on the start position while I'm cranking it. Does it has to be on run also?

Here the thing I know:
Gas read empty but last time I drove it it had a full tank or 1 gallon less than full.
The full pump work, I heard it pressurize
Then coolant temperature read -40* and No I'm not in Antarctica.
The battery volt read 0.0, not sure if it suppose to read 0.0 or only read a charge when its charging(sound stupid)

One thing I'm not sure if I get any spark or not.
Thanks

Krashed989
09-22-09, 11:26 PM
NSS = Neutral Saftey Switch = Transmission Range Switch = PRND21 Switch... All are the same thing, and the position did not change throughout the years on the N*.

If the voltage is reading 0 then that's where your problem is. Either the battery cables or the battery is bad. Low voltage/amperage causes the computers to do a lot of funky things, and would also cause a weak/no spark situation when starting.

94CaddyConcours
09-22-09, 11:31 PM
NSS = Neutral Saftey Switch = Transmission Range Switch = PRND21 Switch... All are the same thing, and the position did not change throughout the years on the N*.

If the voltage is reading 0 then that's where your problem is. Either the battery cables or the battery is bad. Low voltage/amperage causes the computers to do a lot of funky things, and would also cause a weak/no spark situation when starting.

Even if it crank the motor? I think that if it has enough juice to crank for a while its good to go:hmm:. And its being charge also.

Krashed989
09-22-09, 11:35 PM
Is a weak crank? or is it good and fast?

Krashed989
09-22-09, 11:49 PM
Take off the panel over the fuse block (1 plastic snap rivet and it lifts straight up). Then check how many ohms are in between the battery side of the positive cable and where it bolts up to the fuse block.

If it reads less than 1 ohm, you're definitely sure that the battery is good and you've tried starting it in Neutral to no avail, I would condemn the ignition switch.

ponyboyt
09-23-09, 12:18 AM
what happens when you pull PCM codes in an OBDi car? Remember this happening to mine and i got "No PCM Data". NOT "No PCM Codes". My PCM was not grounded. The engine would crank VERY slowly, or enough to kcik the solenoid. But no PCM = no start.

Was a bad ground.

94CaddyConcours
09-23-09, 02:57 AM
Is a weak crank? or is it good and fast?
Good and fast

Take off the panel over the fuse block (1 plastic snap rivet and it lifts straight up). Then check how many ohms are in between the battery side of the positive cable and where it bolts up to the fuse block.
If it reads less than 1 ohm, you're definitely sure that the battery is good and you've tried starting it in Neutral to no avail, I would condemn the ignition switch.
Will check the resistance tomorrow.
Forgot to start in in neutral, bummer

what happens when you pull PCM codes in an OBDi car? Remember this happening to mine and i got "No PCM Data". NOT "No PCM Codes". My PCM was not grounded. The engine would crank VERY slowly, or enough to kcik the solenoid. But no PCM = no start.
Was a bad ground.
When I depress the "off" and "warmer" button to access the OBD it blink/blank. So no data/code pop up. But when I depress the "lo" button it would should: PCM, IPC, ACP, etc.

Krashed989
09-23-09, 04:27 AM
Take off the panel over the fuse block (1 plastic snap rivet and it lifts straight up). Then check how many ohms are in between the battery side of the positive cable and where it bolts up to the fuse block.

If it reads less than 1 ohm, you're definitely sure that the battery is good and you've tried starting it in Neutral to no avail, I would condemn the ignition switch.

If it reads less than 1 ohm, All the fuses are good, you're definitely sure that the battery is good and you've tried starting it in Neutral to no avail, I would condemn the ignition switch.

Needed to edit that sentence. :)

ponyboyt
09-24-09, 01:52 AM
When I depress the "off" and "warmer" button to access the OBD it blink/blank. So no data/code pop up. But when I depress the "lo" button it would should: PCM, IPC, ACP, etc.

Im having trouble reading what you mean there. The screen is blank when you activate the OBD but you can hit "lo" to see PCM? Or you cannot see PCM?

If you cannot see PCM... well it seems to me the NSS as a place to hunt would be way out in left field, likely in the next city....

Make sure you have a PCM (i dont mean physicaly, i mean make sure its coming on and working). I had this issue, no PCM. But i had all lights and was able to go into OBD. the PCM simply was not there. I also got the Theft System" message. It turned out to be that we had no engine ground on the car.

94CaddyConcours
09-24-09, 09:06 PM
:banana::nanaparty:GOT IT STARTED!!!!!:dance:
Beside having a bad starter and what I thought was ignition switch(which wasn't) I took a look at the ING1 fuse(50AMP, the 1x1inch) and it was burn out. Although I did check all the other fuses except the large one under the fuse panel cover.
Well after I replaced it............. she start right up. Did the OBD and store code pop up. Temp was reading correct. No long have E for gas. Battery read 13.X volts.
Temp stayed at 216/217* F while idling. Should be lower when cruising on highway. Both fan was kicking at low speed until it got to 219* F with AC on. Oh ans it still blow cold air but fell like she need a refill.
Fuel consumption seem high. Read 0.02 gallon used in less than 10 minutes. I'm having a felling its either the injector or FPR. Also at start up there where smoke near the cat converter, could be too much fuel being dump there?
Would not have check the fuse had Krashed989 suggest measuring the resistance between the battery and fuse buss. Big thank to him :highfive:

Krashed989
09-24-09, 11:22 PM
Wow, I'm very happy to hear that! I'm glad you figured it out and got it fixed!

Don't you just hate that; you struggle and struggle for days on end to fix something just to find out it was something as simple as a blown fuse! :duh:

PeTe1
11-03-09, 02:07 AM
Fuel consumption seem high. Read 0.02 gallon used in less than 10 minutes. I'm having a felling its either the injector or FPR. Also at start up there where smoke near the cat converter, could be too much fuel being dump there?




i think the smoke at the cat would be old oil or oil residue that dropped with replacing the starter and if it was the fuel pressure regulator it would have a long crank you can check your "fpr" by pulling the vacuum hose and if there is fuel in there its the "fpr" you should try changing the fuel filter and make shure you use premium gas that should clean the injectors and one bottle of injector cleaner wouldn't hurt once i personally don't like them but it will help clean them out